How not to boom a block under boost
09-16-2016, 02:22 PM
#1
How not to boom a block under boost
Knowledge. That's what I am bringing.
Wanna throw a turbo on your 3.0?
Want to make that granny car hurt feelings?
Yeah, you do, don't lie about it.
but you are on the other side of this post going "But litch, there is no write up on how to turbo your car, and if I am gonna throw that much money at my car, I want it to be reliable, I want it to run for more than 3 months."
I hear you.
So lets go through this step by step.
Step 1. Is your car a 95-96 or a 97 - 99? If it is the former, and you have the engine out of the car (if you are going to turbo your car this will happen which is why I am bringing it up)... you can replace your 2 piece upper coolant hose with the newer 1 piece from the 97-99. You want to do this, it is held together by some plastic bullcrap that is old and brittle. You want coolant leaks? This is how you get coolant leaks. Swap it and never worry about that leak again.
That top black hose, its a few screws and boom you are good 2 go.
Step 2. Do a head gasket job. Wait, hold on, he didn't just say what I think he did? Yeah you heard me. Head. Gasket. Job. Stay with me baby birds, I'll feed you.
If you take your engine down to the head, you can replace the gasket with a cometic one, which is awesome... and you can do a headstud upgrade, which is super easy on a vq30de.
Which headstuds? Well ARP is a well known, and expensive choice, or you could go with the Juke headstuds which are just as good... but 1/3 the price... and on a 3.0... they fit without having to retap the block. I repeat. THEY FIT WITH NO MODIFICATION TO THE BLOCK (on a 3.5 you have to tap the block... +1 for old school)
take it down to this, the block, clean everything, put new gaskets on everything. The last thing you want is your precious engine that you have poured your soul into, grenading because you were too cheap to buy a 2 dollar part.
Since you have broken the engine down to the block and you have made the heads happy (no head lift is awesome) Lets go look at what is hiding under that crazy timing cover.
Easy peasy to put in the Rev Up oil pump now, if you don't know about it, it is the best oil pump you can get other than dry sump. Put it on and keep your engine lubed even at high rpms and boost.
Who is a pretty girl? You are... its the shiny thing at the bottom for you who don't know what you are looking at.
Next, lets button this bastard back up, use grey rtv because black is oil soluble and oil leaks are lame. USE GREY RTV.
Lightly and gently clean mating surfaces with a drill and a wire brush, or one of those green pads, whichever. Don't be an idiot and score the surface, get it clean, but don't be a ham fisted oaf.
If you do all of the above, your engine will be able to withstand boost over a long period of time. Also, congrats, you just did all the maintenance that you will have to do on your engine... for a while... so cool.
Added bonus, while it is all apart, powdercoat and paint and polish till you have a gem on an engine.
Black and gold are my favorite...
Hope you get something out of this... even if it is just the engine ****.
Wanna throw a turbo on your 3.0?
Want to make that granny car hurt feelings?
Yeah, you do, don't lie about it.
but you are on the other side of this post going "But litch, there is no write up on how to turbo your car, and if I am gonna throw that much money at my car, I want it to be reliable, I want it to run for more than 3 months."
I hear you.
So lets go through this step by step.
Step 1. Is your car a 95-96 or a 97 - 99? If it is the former, and you have the engine out of the car (if you are going to turbo your car this will happen which is why I am bringing it up)... you can replace your 2 piece upper coolant hose with the newer 1 piece from the 97-99. You want to do this, it is held together by some plastic bullcrap that is old and brittle. You want coolant leaks? This is how you get coolant leaks. Swap it and never worry about that leak again.
That top black hose, its a few screws and boom you are good 2 go.
Step 2. Do a head gasket job. Wait, hold on, he didn't just say what I think he did? Yeah you heard me. Head. Gasket. Job. Stay with me baby birds, I'll feed you.
If you take your engine down to the head, you can replace the gasket with a cometic one, which is awesome... and you can do a headstud upgrade, which is super easy on a vq30de.
Which headstuds? Well ARP is a well known, and expensive choice, or you could go with the Juke headstuds which are just as good... but 1/3 the price... and on a 3.0... they fit without having to retap the block. I repeat. THEY FIT WITH NO MODIFICATION TO THE BLOCK (on a 3.5 you have to tap the block... +1 for old school)
take it down to this, the block, clean everything, put new gaskets on everything. The last thing you want is your precious engine that you have poured your soul into, grenading because you were too cheap to buy a 2 dollar part.
Since you have broken the engine down to the block and you have made the heads happy (no head lift is awesome) Lets go look at what is hiding under that crazy timing cover.
Easy peasy to put in the Rev Up oil pump now, if you don't know about it, it is the best oil pump you can get other than dry sump. Put it on and keep your engine lubed even at high rpms and boost.
Who is a pretty girl? You are... its the shiny thing at the bottom for you who don't know what you are looking at.
Next, lets button this bastard back up, use grey rtv because black is oil soluble and oil leaks are lame. USE GREY RTV.
Lightly and gently clean mating surfaces with a drill and a wire brush, or one of those green pads, whichever. Don't be an idiot and score the surface, get it clean, but don't be a ham fisted oaf.
If you do all of the above, your engine will be able to withstand boost over a long period of time. Also, congrats, you just did all the maintenance that you will have to do on your engine... for a while... so cool.
Added bonus, while it is all apart, powdercoat and paint and polish till you have a gem on an engine.
Black and gold are my favorite...
Hope you get something out of this... even if it is just the engine ****.
09-21-2016, 06:44 PM
#5
I agree, if youre adding boost you should take precautions from blowing up your engine. I did a complete build on my 3.5 engine swap in my 97
Manely Hbeam Rods, Cosworth 11:1 pistons all forged, uprev oil pump, cams, head gasket, ARP bolts kit, 3 angle valve job etc. Im Scharged though not turbo but should be able to handle 450 plus HP easy.
09-24-2016, 10:04 AM
#7
Any decent engine shop can do that. Its nothing special besides the cool paint and having it look nice and pretty ( good job btw )
I agree, if youre adding boost you should take precautions from blowing up your engine. I did a complete build on my 3.5 engine swap in my 97
Manely Hbeam Rods, Cosworth 11:1 pistons all forged, uprev oil pump, cams, head gasket, ARP bolts kit, 3 angle valve job etc. Im Scharged though not turbo but should be able to handle 450 plus HP easy.
I agree, if youre adding boost you should take precautions from blowing up your engine. I did a complete build on my 3.5 engine swap in my 97
Manely Hbeam Rods, Cosworth 11:1 pistons all forged, uprev oil pump, cams, head gasket, ARP bolts kit, 3 angle valve job etc. Im Scharged though not turbo but should be able to handle 450 plus HP easy.
Hit me on fb or pm here and I can explain more of what I am doing.
Thanks amigo. Labor of love, and to be clear, some is powdercoat, some is vht engine paint.
09-26-2016, 03:44 PM
#8
Litch was waiting to see something on the org 👍💯
09-26-2016, 07:01 PM
#11
Right when i thought.....
09-26-2016, 07:52 PM
#14
That's the 3.5 or DE?
Nice work though indeed anyone that takes the time to get their engine to you, I'm sure they would be happy. Btw do balance the crank? You need special machines for that if im not mistaken.
Nice work though indeed anyone that takes the time to get their engine to you, I'm sure they would be happy. Btw do balance the crank? You need special machines for that if im not mistaken.
09-26-2016, 08:57 PM
#15
Luke speaks true. Tbh, he is the mechanical master, I just clean and pretty stuff up. But this will be one for the ages when it's done.
09-26-2016, 08:58 PM
#16
09-27-2016, 12:53 AM
#17
No the thing is you guys stop posting information that is wrong then acting like it is right:
The headstud thread size and depth on the VQ30 and VQ35 is the exact same.
The VQ35 short block is basically a bored out VQ30 block. The head bolt size is likely the same on the GTRs and VQ37. Its why i was question why you were going through all the extra effort for head studs when you could have just bought HR studs which are probably the exact same strength as the ones you have now. so if you have to drill and tap the 3.5 to fit head studs then you have to drill and tap the 3.0 as well. Search my friends, Search:
https://maxima.org/forums/all-motor/...hangeable.html
I'll say it once again the true way to build a VQ30 for boost is too swap the internals. Either buy aftermarket rods and pistons or swap in the VQ30DET internals, that is how it has always been and continue to be done because the rods and pistons are weak points in NA VQs, not the head or what have you. The only part that is beneficial that you installed for boost is head studs. But essentially what you are doing litchy is refreshing your motor for boosting, NOT building it for boost. Taking out old parts and replacing them with new ones to insure the old ones do not fail due to their age and wear. That is very different. Your build so have fun but don't tell people information that is wrong.
Aside from that proceed.
The headstud thread size and depth on the VQ30 and VQ35 is the exact same.
The VQ35 short block is basically a bored out VQ30 block. The head bolt size is likely the same on the GTRs and VQ37. Its why i was question why you were going through all the extra effort for head studs when you could have just bought HR studs which are probably the exact same strength as the ones you have now. so if you have to drill and tap the 3.5 to fit head studs then you have to drill and tap the 3.0 as well. Search my friends, Search:
https://maxima.org/forums/all-motor/...hangeable.html
I'll say it once again the true way to build a VQ30 for boost is too swap the internals. Either buy aftermarket rods and pistons or swap in the VQ30DET internals, that is how it has always been and continue to be done because the rods and pistons are weak points in NA VQs, not the head or what have you. The only part that is beneficial that you installed for boost is head studs. But essentially what you are doing litchy is refreshing your motor for boosting, NOT building it for boost. Taking out old parts and replacing them with new ones to insure the old ones do not fail due to their age and wear. That is very different. Your build so have fun but don't tell people information that is wrong.
Aside from that proceed.
Last edited by Crusher103; 09-27-2016 at 01:09 AM.
09-27-2016, 04:53 AM
#18
No the thing is you guys stop posting information that is wrong then acting like it is right:
The headstud thread size and depth on the VQ30 and VQ35 is the exact same.
The VQ35 short block is basically a bored out VQ30 block. The head bolt size is likely the same on the GTRs and VQ37. Its why i was question why you were going through all the extra effort for head studs when you could have just bought HR studs which are probably the exact same strength as the ones you have now. so if you have to drill and tap the 3.5 to fit head studs then you have to drill and tap the 3.0 as well. Search my friends, Search:
https://maxima.org/forums/all-motor/...hangeable.html
I'll say it once again the true way to build a VQ30 for boost is too swap the internals. Either buy aftermarket rods and pistons or swap in the VQ30DET internals, that is how it has always been and continue to be done because the rods and pistons are weak points in NA VQs, not the head or what have you. The only part that is beneficial that you installed for boost is head studs. But essentially what you are doing litchy is refreshing your motor for boosting, NOT building it for boost. Taking out old parts and replacing them with new ones to insure the old ones do not fail due to their age and wear. That is very different. Your build so have fun but don't tell people information that is wrong.
Aside from that proceed.
The headstud thread size and depth on the VQ30 and VQ35 is the exact same.
The VQ35 short block is basically a bored out VQ30 block. The head bolt size is likely the same on the GTRs and VQ37. Its why i was question why you were going through all the extra effort for head studs when you could have just bought HR studs which are probably the exact same strength as the ones you have now. so if you have to drill and tap the 3.5 to fit head studs then you have to drill and tap the 3.0 as well. Search my friends, Search:
https://maxima.org/forums/all-motor/...hangeable.html
I'll say it once again the true way to build a VQ30 for boost is too swap the internals. Either buy aftermarket rods and pistons or swap in the VQ30DET internals, that is how it has always been and continue to be done because the rods and pistons are weak points in NA VQs, not the head or what have you. The only part that is beneficial that you installed for boost is head studs. But essentially what you are doing litchy is refreshing your motor for boosting, NOT building it for boost. Taking out old parts and replacing them with new ones to insure the old ones do not fail due to their age and wear. That is very different. Your build so have fun but don't tell people information that is wrong.
Aside from that proceed.
https://conceptzperformance.com/niss...kt_p_17301.php
09-27-2016, 07:42 AM
#19
crusher, love your face.
you're a moron.
Everything online says you need to tap a 3.5 block for the headstuds we used. I talked to darren, in person, about the headstuds and he made sure to tell me what tap I needed to use em. He would know, considering he only works on 3.5. He doesn't work on 3.0's and will tell you the same. So when we went to drop the studs and found that they worked with the oem holes, it is a huge deal because no drilling into the block. Biiiig deal.
Second. DO you understand words? At all? If you are going to turbo a car, head lift is the #1 thing you need to prevent. Upgrading the headstuds and head gasket is critical. The rev up oil pump is just a really good idea. Higher revs from cams and faster revving from an 00vi and lighter flywheel need to be supported by a pump that can handle the higher revs.
Your opinion of what we are doing < the facts of what has been done. Can't say that we are putting out wrong information when YOU are the one who is wrong, and we are the ones who have done it.
you're a moron.
Everything online says you need to tap a 3.5 block for the headstuds we used. I talked to darren, in person, about the headstuds and he made sure to tell me what tap I needed to use em. He would know, considering he only works on 3.5. He doesn't work on 3.0's and will tell you the same. So when we went to drop the studs and found that they worked with the oem holes, it is a huge deal because no drilling into the block. Biiiig deal.
Second. DO you understand words? At all? If you are going to turbo a car, head lift is the #1 thing you need to prevent. Upgrading the headstuds and head gasket is critical. The rev up oil pump is just a really good idea. Higher revs from cams and faster revving from an 00vi and lighter flywheel need to be supported by a pump that can handle the higher revs.
Your opinion of what we are doing < the facts of what has been done. Can't say that we are putting out wrong information when YOU are the one who is wrong, and we are the ones who have done it.
09-27-2016, 09:44 PM
#20
We did the juke head bolts an according to their site the 3.5 block needed to be tapped deeper because the bolts are longer we did not have to do this on the DE 3.0 it was a direct bolt in no tap needed. As far as a 3.5 block cant speak on it cause ive never bothered with them. So not gonna get into that weather they are the same or not. Can only tell you what ive experienced and read per the site it says to tap the 3.5 block for the longer bolts. Link below.
https://conceptzperformance.com/niss...kt_p_17301.php
https://conceptzperformance.com/niss...kt_p_17301.php
I've worked on both. I did the HR head stud upgrade on both a 3.0 and a 3.5. Here is my thing, did you guys check the length of the 3.0s head stud to the Juke head stud? When i pulled the head off a 3.0 i saw no difference between the 3.0 and the 3.5 studs. I would have used the washers required on the 3.5, if you must go that route. ARP would have been better.
crusher, love your face.
you're a moron.
Everything online says you need to tap a 3.5 block for the headstuds we used. I talked to darren, in person, about the headstuds and he made sure to tell me what tap I needed to use em. He would know, considering he only works on 3.5. He doesn't work on 3.0's and will tell you the same. So when we went to drop the studs and found that they worked with the oem holes, it is a huge deal because no drilling into the block. Biiiig deal.
Second. DO you understand words? At all? If you are going to turbo a car, head lift is the #1 thing you need to prevent. Upgrading the headstuds and head gasket is critical. The rev up oil pump is just a really good idea. Higher revs from cams and faster revving from an 00vi and lighter flywheel need to be supported by a pump that can handle the higher revs.
Your opinion of what we are doing < the facts of what has been done. Can't say that we are putting out wrong information when YOU are the one who is wrong, and we are the ones who have done it.
you're a moron.
Everything online says you need to tap a 3.5 block for the headstuds we used. I talked to darren, in person, about the headstuds and he made sure to tell me what tap I needed to use em. He would know, considering he only works on 3.5. He doesn't work on 3.0's and will tell you the same. So when we went to drop the studs and found that they worked with the oem holes, it is a huge deal because no drilling into the block. Biiiig deal.
Second. DO you understand words? At all? If you are going to turbo a car, head lift is the #1 thing you need to prevent. Upgrading the headstuds and head gasket is critical. The rev up oil pump is just a really good idea. Higher revs from cams and faster revving from an 00vi and lighter flywheel need to be supported by a pump that can handle the higher revs.
Your opinion of what we are doing < the facts of what has been done. Can't say that we are putting out wrong information when YOU are the one who is wrong, and we are the ones who have done it.
Those head stud holes are likely the same. I wouldn't have just dropped them in and said they worked because the studs might have started to torque down and compress the headgasket then bottomed our leading you to THINK it was torqued but in fact its not. The block is aluminum with steel sleeves, it will give way when presented with enough torque. How little torque it takes is actually surprising. i have seen a piece of my block break off using a 10mm bolt on the timing cover that was too long. Cylinder heads and Head gaskets is something i would not leave to chance. So if the 3.5 needs washers.....use them on the 3.0.
Just because you talked to Darren does not mean anything. I've gone to his shop and talked to him too, its only 30mins away from me. He does not work on 3.0s as you said. I have worked on both, you would have been better off talking to me funnily enough. Knowing Darren he probably advised you to use those washers. I hope I'm wrong and you guys are right, but VQs are like legos, there is not much variation in them from year to year. You can bolt 3.0 heads to 3.5 blocks, cranks and rod from 3.5s in 3.0s and vice versa.
09-28-2016, 04:59 AM
#21
I went With all new forged internals on my 3.5 swap ; Rods, Pistons etc. .. learned the hard way on my 3.0 boosted which eventually wound up with a blown head gasket from a ****ty tune.
Also got a better headgasket and ARP bolt kit.
Crusher, you're right about the 3.5 and 3.0 being very similar. A lot of the component from 3.0 will bolt right onto the 3.5 engine. I know some grinding down on the oil pan and ARP bolts has to be done cause the studs were a bit long other than that no other issues.
I'm not sure about the bolt kit you guys are questioning in regards retapping the block.
Also got a better headgasket and ARP bolt kit.
Crusher, you're right about the 3.5 and 3.0 being very similar. A lot of the component from 3.0 will bolt right onto the 3.5 engine. I know some grinding down on the oil pan and ARP bolts has to be done cause the studs were a bit long other than that no other issues.
I'm not sure about the bolt kit you guys are questioning in regards retapping the block.
Last edited by maxprivate; 09-28-2016 at 10:40 AM.
09-28-2016, 10:36 AM
#22
I went With all new forged internals on my 3.5 swap ; Rods, Pistons etc. .. learned the hard way on my 3.0 boosted which eventually wound up with a blown head gasket from a ****ty tune.
Also got a better headgasket and ARP bolt kit.
Crusher, you're right about the 3.5 and 3.0 being very similar. A lot of the component from 3.0 will bolt right onto the 3.5 engine. I know some grinind down on the oil pan and ARP bolts has to be done cause the studs where a bit long other than that no other issues.
I'm not sure about the bolt kit you guys are questioning in regards retapping the block.
Also got a better headgasket and ARP bolt kit.
Crusher, you're right about the 3.5 and 3.0 being very similar. A lot of the component from 3.0 will bolt right onto the 3.5 engine. I know some grinind down on the oil pan and ARP bolts has to be done cause the studs where a bit long other than that no other issues.
I'm not sure about the bolt kit you guys are questioning in regards retapping the block.
This is an interesting build. I would have went with a few aftermarket parts over sticking strictly with OEM stuff. We'll see when i get back in the country i will be getting my car dyno tuned, so then we shall see who's car will win all the marbles. I'm completely stock block just rev-up cams+62mm, I'm confident the motor is good until 500whp on boost, its just will the rest of the car hold up.....
09-28-2016, 10:47 AM
#23
What they are doing is using the head studs off the nissan juke's turbo motor. They are around the same strength as the HR head studs if not a little stronger, but the studs are slightly longer. On the DE 3.5 it is a must that you either drill the block to make the hole deeper(that what she said) or use washers.
This is an interesting build. I would have went with a few aftermarket parts over sticking strictly with OEM stuff. We'll see when i get back in the country i will be getting my car dyno tuned, so then we shall see who's car will win all the marbles. I'm completely stock block just rev-up cams+62mm, I'm confident the motor is good until 500whp on boost, its just will the rest of the car hold up.....
This is an interesting build. I would have went with a few aftermarket parts over sticking strictly with OEM stuff. We'll see when i get back in the country i will be getting my car dyno tuned, so then we shall see who's car will win all the marbles. I'm completely stock block just rev-up cams+62mm, I'm confident the motor is good until 500whp on boost, its just will the rest of the car hold up.....
09-29-2016, 06:00 AM
#24
HAHa that's what I'm a lil worried about. I'm hoping my auto tranny will last I took every precaution I could; HS torque convertor, VB mod, and a good tranny cooler plus oil and coolant temp gauges to monitor things. We'll see... I'm definitely not gonna be beating on it. After all the money I'm dropping on it I want it to last another 10- 20 years
Every thread I have read on here about longevity on a turbo build revolves around beefing up a transmission... and making sure you don't get head lift, or out rev your oil pump...
this tea tho...
09-29-2016, 06:41 AM
#25
Thats why I got a rebuilt 6spd with sentra ser spec v internals. Nisformance sells an entire package with tranny, ss lines, starter, axles, hardware, motor mounts, shifter, clutch, and flywheel. For either 3.0 or 3.5.
Every thread I have read on here about longevity on a turbo build revolves around beefing up a transmission... and making sure you don't get head lift, or out rev your oil pump...
this tea tho...
Every thread I have read on here about longevity on a turbo build revolves around beefing up a transmission... and making sure you don't get head lift, or out rev your oil pump...
this tea tho...
09-29-2016, 12:32 PM
#26
Sounds fun if the auto decides to take a crap. Idk... those guys at nwp have their auto doing insane things... and unless I'm completely wrong.. Grey max 99 also is auto... so...
09-30-2016, 10:05 AM
#28
I figure I may be around the 450 hp range. I'm using Cosworth 11:1 Pistons, rev up cams, and Manley HBeam Rods Super charged 13psi pulley. Running Nistune.
Having it tuned by Chris Miller in Long Island.
09-30-2016, 09:45 PM
#30
So if these guys aren't blowing their auto tranny then I'm not blowing mine.
I figure I may be around the 450 hp range. I'm using Cosworth 11:1 Pistons, rev up cams, and Manley HBeam Rods Super charged 13psi pulley. Running Nistune.
Having it tuned by Chris Miller in Long Island.
I figure I may be around the 450 hp range. I'm using Cosworth 11:1 Pistons, rev up cams, and Manley HBeam Rods Super charged 13psi pulley. Running Nistune.
Having it tuned by Chris Miller in Long Island.
10-01-2016, 04:19 AM
#31
But I also got a good deal on the pistons so I went with high compression. Ideally I would like to have gone with 9:1 ratio. Any thoughts?
Nah running 93 nothing crazy. It's a daily so I'm not tracking or anything like that. I want it to last so definitely not gonna be beating on it all the the time.
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