Colonel

OK,

Since my 01 has a whopping 34K miles, I guess our cheap crappy ***'d o2 sensors are not worth a diddly and decided to crap out on me.

I went to autozone and had them pull codes. I got two P0140's. I have browsed the ESM and found that the P0140 is sensor 2 in bank one. This looks to be just behind the Y pipe.

I browsed a bunch of old posts and there seems to be a part number 226A04L713 associated in one post by Luiquire to be the number for this sensor...

Does anybody know for sure? I have to get this part locally (as the car has to be driveable) and dont want the wrong one. The dip****s at the parts counter "aren't completely sure" and the electronic piece is "non-returnable"

Sigh.....34K and sensors going bad...wtf is up with that?

DanL

You had better READ THIS before doing anything and waste money on a part that may not be bad to begin with. This comes up several times a week.

Colonel

I appreciate the heads up, but I have a P0140...not a 0420. Although they both are part of the emissions system, that TSB does not apply to a 0140 code.

Although through consultation, I have received a TSB that DOES apply.
Its Classification: EC01-005B
Reference: NTB01-016B

I have been talked into taking this to the dealer as a ECM reprogram is involved. I did the testing via the TSB and ESM and it fails according to both.

Wednesdays Challenge: See if the dealer is smart enough to realize that I have done my homework and warrenty is involved as the ECU is covered in the 8/80 program. OR, will I get a classic Nissan run-around....stay tuned!

DanL

Wow, either I had too much beer, too much wine, too much of both, or I'm getting old. Read 140 and thought 420. Sorry...

Zero Deuce SE

Looks like your car falls under the same TSB I had done today. It's NTB02-051a. It lists the code P0140 in it.
http://maxima.theowensfamily.com/tsb/NTB02-051a.pdf

Colonel

Yeah, I got that one from our Texas buddy!

The car is checked in and they seemed pretty cool. We had a good chat about the BlehmCo BBK, the ugliness of the 04+s and other random performance topics.

We will see....

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Colonel

I got my estimate back from Nissan

Two o2 Senors @ 140 a pop = 280
Diag Fee of 70 bucks = 350
2 HOURS labor (?) @70 hour= 490

WTF are they thinking?

They WILL honor the warranty on the ECU, but says its NOT the primary problem. I asked how can you determine that....no response. I asked if the voltages coming off the o2 are within the ESM boundry. No response. So basically they are trying to get 70 dollars for exactly what the autozone guy did for free...read the display of a Consult II.

I was given the option to buy my own o2's, install them myself and bring it back for warranty ECU reprogramming, but I STILL have to pay 70 diag fee....? That is what is being contended right now. I DONT want to pay 70 bucks diag fee, because 1/2 of the problem is a tight tolerance ECU. He is investigating potential options for me right now.

I will say this, he is polite, NOT condecending, and truely willing to try to help me.

I wonder what would happen if I had the ECU reprogrammed and just had the codes cleared...? Wonder if the CEL would come back on again?

Zero Deuce SE

Are they willing to reprogram the ECM without replacing the O2 sensors(s)? They seem to have you over a barrel at the moment. I would geuss that the SES would come on again if it caused the problem in the first place.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

I'd just replace the 02s and clear the codes.

If it comes back, pay the $49(0.7*$70/hr), but I'd fight them on the BS $70 fee. Just tell them to perform it, no diagnosis, thanks.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Also, check that Owners' Manual. I think I saw something about they couldn't charge you for "labor" under the 80K Emissions' Warranty.

Fockers~!

What I wouldn't give to own my own Consult-II.

Colonel

I wish I could get them to program the ECU w/o changing the stupid o2's. But they are crying about "doing it by the book" and its "a stretch that we are allowing you to do the o2's by yourself"

I did fight the diag fee and got it to 35 bucks.

I am replacing the o2's (Another stupid Nissan waste of money/time) because I have to prove it before they will reprogram the ECU. I really wanted to change just the code and see what happens at that point to prove that its the ECU not the o2's. So I am basically farked. Ill be damned if I am giving my money to them though...I am getting the o2's from Dave.

I am also installing my new MAF too and will get the most recent update to include that change as well.

This pretty much solidified it...no more Nissans. Corp could give a **** and from what I hear they are auditing the crap out of the dealers...so the dealers are scared ****less to give customer service. You can only stay out of Chapter 13 by these kinds of cutbacks...eventually, it will fold.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Don't order from DAVEB....OEMs are EXXXXXPENSIVE.

Get the BOSCH "OEM style" from Autozone although...I haven't seen what they charge for Max 02s, only Sentras.

Colonel

No, I dont splice sensor wires. Just not going to do it. I understand the cost savings, but I dont want to shortcut this avenue. Because if the check engine light pops off again...god help Nissan.

Just like you wont put a BBK on from an independant...I am not going to put on "generic" (Hell, could be the EXACT ones that are put into a Nissan box for all I know) sensors. Thats my feelings at least for now.

Luquire

I am going to install my 02 sensor on friday(tomorrow). we will see how everything goes. and i bought the O2 sensor from Dave B because jerryrome tried to change the price on me and i told them to thanks but no thanks.

Colonel

They did the same thing to me too! And you were looking around the beginning of the month (like the 10th if I recall). I told them the same thing, no thanks. Plus I stated that that part number has been mislisted for over a month now.

I then got an email stating how he has no control over what is "published" and they deal with tons of parts blah blah blah and so on. Long story short, no responsibility. I understand if you DIDNT know about it...but he did and for a while now...I have two points of reference. Seemed kinda hokey to me really. He should of sold them to me at the web published price and then billed back the hosting company for the loss of revenue.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Pretty sure you don't splice them on the "OEM style"...just the "universal" somewhat cheaper version.

They're pretty much IDENTICAL to OEM on the ones I've changed.

Keep me posted though.

Zero Deuce SE

http://oxygensensors.com/index.php?ref=Google

I don't know how good the sensors are.

Colonel

Yeah I checked there first, but could not "match" up exactly what I wanted confidently. So I got the OEM.

I replaced them on Tuesday, and it was a fairly easy task. About 1.5 hours. Car goes in in about 2 hours for the ECM reprogram. So...we will see....

Colonel

On the OEM, it has a "trapazoidal" shaped connector on one end and the sensor on the other. On the sensor (Bosch) it has the Nissan Hamburger stamped on the brass/copper sleeving as well as the name Bosch. The word Nissan is NOT in the logo though.

On the cord, it is shrouded in the proper colored heat sleeve and factory connection point (where clips mount to the hanger to keep it off the engine) are in the correct positions.

Unless someone has a GOOD pic of the universal style one...not to sure how much more info I could give....

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

So is that the one you got from the dealer or Autozone?

The universal Autozone Bosch will need to be spliced, however so far any of the "OEM style" Autozone Bosch haven't, but I've never done the Max.

Colonel

I got the OEM. From what I could tell in the www.oxygensensors.com they are really not much cheaper. AND I have to splice them. From what I can tell on the old o2's, we need the 4 wire sensors and there are no good pics of the bosch ones on that site.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

OEM = dealer?

Colonel

OEM = DaveB. Not dealer...dealer sells them ABOVE list!

I got the car back and WOW Drives like a dream right now. Fuel cut is history and she be drivin smoooooooth. Power seems to be more, or maybe just its nice and responsive again. Who knows, its like a whole new car.

The SW was real nice and even gave me the pre and post ECM numbers like I asked without any grumbling. I talked to him about future mods (Timing advance) and he was ok with the idea. So I need to start a post about that to get feedback from peeps on that.

So to sum up:

1) I replaced the MAF with the updated version
2) Replaced 2 o2 sensors with OEM (Nissan) sensors
3) ECM reprogram to the latest version acceptable to the new MAF and o2's.

I will be watching my gas mileage very closely to see how this all effects it. Wish I could do it one part at a time, but that wasnt going to happen. So wont be able to determine what did what to solve what.

BTW, I have o2 sensors for sale...only 34K on them

Luquire

i have never had my ECM flashed before and i had to install a MAF. Since i have to install my new 02 sensor should i get nissan to reflash my car

Colonel

If you are throwing a o2 Sensor code (P0140) which I think I remember you said you had, you should be able to get it flashed under warranty. BUT you have to have the codes still resident inside the ECU. Meaning the CEL needs to be on so they can pull the "tape" and submit for warranty.

As what exactly changed for the new ECU code, I am utterly clueless....hell for all I know it could absolutely KILL my gas mileage. I DO think that that it does open up the o2 range to not be so picky. But the driving characteristics of the car are very nice now.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Jon,

Can you describe what has changed with how the car feels now vs. before?

Luquire

I dont think i can get warrany work done because i have a y-pipe. I wonder if I could get my ecm flashed and not replce my 02 sensor. Maybe since the flash opens up the range of the 02 sensor it would fix my problem (P0140) with out having to replace the 02 sensor even though i have a nwe one sitting in my garage.

Colonel

See, thats what I wanted to do to see if it was the o2's or the ECU, but unfortunately I was pinned into a wall. IF you think you wont get warranty and are going to pay the .7 hours to have it reprogrammed I would start there first quite honestly...a much better method of trouble shooting.

Make sure when (if) you have it programmed, that they SHOW you the pre and post ECM ID codes as they will change with the program. My shop did it w/o any question.

Also for future reference to get the ECU reprogrammed under warranty, you have to prove OEM replacement of the o2's (to get it covered under the -051A TSB). They wanted to see my receipt showing the Nissan factory part numbers.

Luquire

damn it. Well daveb might help me out with reducing the price of the flash

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

What was the final damage for two 02s?

Colonel

225 and change.

BTW Luquire, DaveB cant do anything for ya (on the ECM reprogram) unless you live in his area.....

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

DAMN~!

Guess DAVEB will have to get me a "copy" of that receipt.

NO WAY...I'm going to pay that to replace two perfectly fine 02s unless I'm over 60K miles.

Colonel

I kept mine, so I guess in theory I could change them back to the stock and see if the light kicks on...but not worth it in my book. My time is worth lots of money too. Since I have so little of it anymore...

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

I still say you got the ROYAL SHAFT on that deal.

I'd complain to NNA, but doubt it would do any good.

HitmanAngel2k3

iTrader: (3)

i know that this is kind off the subject, could anyone tell what's the P0160 is for sure, and tell me the part numbers for that problem or where could i find that information. thanks guys in advance.

Zero Deuce SE

If you look in this TSB, it will tell you the part number for bank 2 02 sensor on your 01.
http://maxima.theowensfamily.com/tsb/NTB02-051a.pdf

HitmanAngel2k3

iTrader: (3)

thank you

Zero Deuce SE

You're welcome. Glad to be of assistance.

Maxi113

iTrader: (3)

Just install it yourself not that hard, I'm going to install my sensor soon when I find time..Easy stuff