CapedCadaver

iTrader: (8)

howcome nobody suggested to fit a 6th gen 6speed? vq35 fwd tranny being put on a vq35 fwd car.... seems plausible. if nissan plans to maybe add a 6spd later, you can rip away the carpeting and see if they put a hole for a clutch pedal's top bolt. that's your true measure of whether they are thinking about it.

doublea

iTrader: (7)

That's the main reason why I want to buy a 2k3 M5, but the paddle shifting is also very funny to drive, I've tried the 335i, 2k6 M5 and my wife new Rogue and honestly they where all fun to drive but I have to admit that driving a real stick car is pretty fun.

BadBlackMaxSL

iTrader: (1)

Very interesting article on F1 cars and their transmissions. Now, I dont think anyone here would argue that the F1 isn't the king of sports cars. Guess what, they dont have a clutch either, it is electronically controlled paddle shifting and throttle and they would love to get a CVT b/c of its optimal handling of power and precise shifting but it is against the rules. So I think Nissan is moving to the future of transmissions, especially once they offer the high torque diesel engine in 2010 and the CVT will be able to put that power to the wheels with limited drivetrain loss.

Please read. http://my.opera.com/mikallen/blog/20...-formula-1-car

jcalabria

In '94 Williams-Renault introduced a CVT F1 car, which was promptly banned for being too fast - which is why they are illegal to this day.



Theoretically, a CVT would be a good match to the flat torque/limited rev range of the diesel, but it would take a serious leap in CVT torque handling capacity to handle the output expected for the Nissan/Renault diesel. Nissan/Jatco is a leader in high capacity CVTs, so anything is possible.

jcalabria

Don't know if it was here or on FreshAlloy.com, but somebody did suggest that - using the D platform Altima's VQ/6MT powertrain.

STARR

iTrader: (1)

Does the 4th Gen V6 Altima and 7th Gen Maxima have the same engine, except for HP difference, I guess Altima owners could eventually swap some stuff off a Maxima and get an increase in power

shysmax

Move on?? Tell that to Porsche, Ferrari, Aston Martin, and others who continue to offer manual transmissions. Also the GT2 & GT3 911's ONLY come in manual transmission. I dont' see that community asking for autos. You can go on about CVT, but as stated above, (even by yourself), the manual is all about fun and total control. U prefer computers to shift for you go ahead. By that same token, why make sports cars when u've got sedans that are just as fast and can handle just as well, and hold more passengers and cargo? Its all about fun, and us purists miss the fact that Nissan has stripped that fun from the Maxima. The fact that the exotics (and Nissan, Subaru, BMW), continue to offer manual transmissions states the clutch is and will continue to be very much alive.

shysmax

3 pedals, 6 gears, independent rear suspension, rwd.....bliss

seby86

sigh... nissan didnt even put a clutch in the new GTR did they? i'm surprised the maxima lasted this long with a 6spd option. omg i'm gonna miss the manuals when they finally decide to phaze them completely out. the next generation Zcar will prolly only offer paddle shifters and a CVT as well... lol

nalc

iTrader: (11)

And the Maxima IS a sedan. The Maxima HAS compromised things for comfort and convenience. You want a tiny 2-door RWD 6MT less-luxury more-sporty Maxima? It's called the 350Z. You want a comfortable, fun-to-drive, roomy car that is very quick and handles pretty well? That's what the Maxima is all about. And a paddle-shifted CVT with a mode that lets you go fast is far more in line with that than a 6MT.

shoult

iTrader: (1)

Sorry, but any car that doesn't have a manual trasmission is OFF my list to even look at. Paddle shift, CVT, SMG need not apply.

I was really hoping Nissan was serious about wanting to return the Maxima to it's heritage. But sadly they have veered away from the path AGAIN.

It didn't surprise me in 2007 that they took the 6spd off the table looking at the demographics they were pointing the 6th Gen towards. But if they want to make a sudden U-Turn away from lethargic couch potato executive types that the 6th gen was aimed at and to more squarely target the Sports Sedan crowd a CVT IS NOT going to cut it. Drivers don't want the car to drive for them, they want to control the cars themselves. Drivers aren't impressed with gimmicky paddle shifts. Give a driver a manual shifter and their a happy camper.

And please, don't site cost as a factor. The Altima with the same V6 (and same basic front end) still offers the 6spd manual. I'd even pay extra for an "optional" manual if that's the only way I could get it.

shoult

iTrader: (1)

The problem with selling MT equipped Maximas is that every generation of Max after the Gen3 has veered further and further from it's 4DSC pretensions. The Gen4 brought the dreaded beam rear axle to kill handling. The Gen5 brought even more additional weight then the Gen 4 did. The Gen6 brings even more weight and size. The end of ANY sporting pretensions commence with the introduction of the Gen6.5.

So you can partly blame the lack of MT sales on where Nissan aimed the Maxima. Now they have started to proclaim that they are returning the Maxima to the Sport Sedan segment. They have a great engine to do that with (the 3.5L can be an EXCELLENT engine with the right factory tune!), the return to a multilink rear suspension is very welcome, but that pesky CVT is going to hurt them with drivers looking for a true sports sedan.

shysmax

U MUST be kidding.....

MacGarnicle

iTrader: (1)

the "manual transmission or death" crowd keeps ignoring the important variable mentioned a few times in this thread: it's not profitable.

You can complain all you want but that's not going to make it suddenly appear. I think people lose sight of the fact that the members of this community are not really representative of the car buying market as a whole. While we all may appreciate a manual transmission, we probably comprise most of the group of people who would.

I don't think Nissan is too upset if you're not going to buy another Maxima. The "presence of a 6-speed manual transmission is the defining factor in my car purchase" crew is obviously not the demographic Nissan is targetting with the Maxima. Seems like a lot of this anger might just be bitterness that Nissan is ignoring our segment of the market - as mentioned though, I'm sure they're hoping you consider an Altima, and if not, then they probably don't care if they have your business. Go buy an Infiniti.

the new Max could be a piece of ****, but if Nissan stuck a 6-speed in there I bet a lot of you guys would forgive all the wrong things about it.. how is Nissan supposed to market a car around that kind of mentality?

shoult

iTrader: (1)

If they are proclaiming a return of the 4DSC (which their ads blatantly suggest) then they ARE targeting the exact crowd that wants a manual. If the Max is as good as it looks on paper then the Sports Sedan crowd WILL buy the MT. If you're building a car for housewifes to look cool in while they go to the shopping mall in then the MT option is not needed, but then neither is the current 4DSC, Sports Sedan pretensions that Nissan is spewing.

Pick a demographic and stick with it. Target it. But do it wholeheartedly, rather then halfheartedly.

Look, I think it's going to be a good car for Nissan with or without a MT. It just won't be a good car for me with out a MT. And can a company that was nearly bankrupt a decade ago really afford to alienate old customers that would love to be new customers again? I keep my Gen3 around because it drives great. It's old and has 160K on it, but it drives better then many vehicles I've had since then. An '09 Maxima WITH a 6spd could be a car that I could FINALLY replace that car with. The Altima wasn't. The G35 is a great car, but priced out of my range when I have it optioned the way I want.

But that's just my opinion.

MacGarnicle

iTrader: (1)

Honestly, I wouldn't assume that the "4DSC" proclamation is anything more than a marketing ploy. I doubt they consulted Oxford on what the substance of the phrase meant and designed the car around those criteria. At any rate, if you consider what a "sports car" is it has nothign to do with what kind of transmission it has and everything to do with how the car performs.

jcalabria

I really really do appreciate those fellow Nissan lovers looking for 300+HP, a manual tranny and RWD.

What I don't understand is why the lightbulbs haven't lit and more people realized that Nissan already makes the EXACT car they have been clamoring for... its called the G35.

Why would Nissan make two identical competing cars when they can skew them to attract a larger overall market? When the original 3G 4DSC was introduced, Nissan did not have the Infinit brand. Now they do, and it allows them to narrow the target market for each model yet still reach a collectively broader audience. Marketing speak aside, the "new" 4DSC is truly the G35.

Magikone69

iTrader: (2)

Thats my exact thoughts on what this thread is about...

Dont get me wrong cause im prob one of the biggest manny tranny advocates out there buit in all honesty i dont believe that is what makes a car "sporty".

Basing my opinions off the 6spd 6th gen (since i obviously havent driven a 7th gen), there is no need for the maxima to have a manual tranny. Overall the car is soft..nothing sporty about it. Yea it has a "VQ" and the power is decent but that isnt enough to warrant the cost of creating a manual tranny SE version which is understandable why they discontinued it at the 6th gens refresh. Since everyone claims the clutch pedal is the foundation of what a "purist" wants (and to some extent i will agree) i dont think a purist wants a 6th gen...or maybe even the 7th gen for the reason that it is basicly the total opposite of what the maxima used to be. Im even starting to get concerned about the altima now that it "feels" so much larger than its predecessor.

IMO a stick doesnt determine the car....is a corolla ce with a 5spd a purist's car???? When the car is built around a sporty them (great handling, stiff chasis, stout engine...) then a manual option will fit in with the rest of the car. Lets start putting manual gearboxes in the next gen lincoln town car so the purists wont complain....

toucansma

Wow, a lot of people seem to want to jump off a cliff I have driven a manual plenty as well, but with the changes in auto and CVT, I think I would be fine with either. Is a manual really that much of a necessity? I mean there is a reason many Ferrari's use paddle shifters now? How many of you can actually utilize a manual (meaning they don't live in Northeast US traffic, Atlanta, LA, etc)? Just want your thoughts?

lightonthehill

rnupetroop and shoult - I think part of the problem here is a sort of wavering by Nissan as to where the Maxima is headed.

In 2001, Nissan made a not-very-secret decision to gradually take the Maxima up to luxury level, while still keeping a hint of sports car in it. They would upgrade the Altima, and have the high-end Altima replace the Maxima as their affordable 4DSC.

So 2002 was spent designing the 6th gen Maxima, which would be larger, and accomplish the first step up the luxury ladder (and away from 4DSC). At the same time, the Altima began to grow larger and more powerful. This progression of the Altima eventually caught the Maxima in size and HP, and those who missed the 2001 decision by Nissan were left confused as to what was happening to their Maxima.

The continued availability of a manual tranny in the Altima, but not in the Maxima, was very clear proof of where Nissan was headed with each.

BUT

Evidently the outcry from confused Maxima lovers and dealers must have reached some 'high' ears, because just over a year ago, Carlos Ghosn turned the apple cart over by announcing that the Maxima would once more be Nissan's 4DSC, with ample power and superb handling, and would be a sports/luxury flagship. This came at the same time he announced that a powerful, clean quiet diesel would be optionally available in the Maxima with the 2010 model year.

So now we are in the quandry of currently having Nissan's flagship 4DSC available with only a CVT (granted, with 4 different ways of using this CVT). There is no question that the CVT will soon be a superior tranny to all shifting trannies in every way except perhaps 'fun'.

BUT

There will be a period of several decades during which many serious drivers will still (correctly or incorrectly) associate a 4DSC with a manual tranny. It may be that Nissan may well be considering the possibility of coming out with a 7th gen Maxima with a manual tranny at some point. I really don't know. If they do, I would suggest it be available only on the high performance level of the 7th gen, and have clear outside markings denoting the fact.

But then we will just have to wait and see what Nissan decides.

lightonthehill

I must agree with toucansma. When I began driving in 1949, manual trannies were the norm. Even as late as mid-1984, I was still driving a manual (Datsun 200SX). I was able to find back roads nearby where there was still fun to be had with the manual. But there is no fun driving a manual when all you are doing is following a long line of very slow traffic with no passing permitted. That is the situation almost everywhere around where I live, and there are county mounties everywhere one looks.

Yes, it sort of feels like Orwell's world (described in his book '1984'). But miserable traffic and intense enforcement are becoming reality across more and more areas of the country. I find a manual much less fun sitting as the thirtieth vehicle in a long line waiting at the traffic lights in every block, or riding at 20 MPH behind a smoke-belching semi in a no-passing zone. Most roads around where I live are no-passing, but that is meaningless, as there is never a time when there isn't traffic coming the other way anyway.

Now if I lived in west Texas, or Montana . . .

MONTE 01&97 SE

iTrader: (1)

Actually this started with the 02 which has been stated by Nissan and several publications it was intentional...... With much lower production from 02 on and added features/options as Memory seats, heated steering wheel, HID's etc. Every year since the Max has has options not avail on the Alit to seperate it

bonzelite

iTrader: (2)

hardcore fans want the 6MT.

bring the 3 pedals back.

rnupetroop

lightonthehill- Now when the 3gen came out I believe it was actually outperforming some SPORT CARS or coming real close(stock), correct me if I am wrong? I may be reaching

On most SPORTS CAR the manual is an option(and I know the maxima is not a sports car but don't mislead and use the word with no option<keyword<of the manual)! I would accept the deal much easier if the cvt was offered in the GTR as an option but I doubt that because I have driven the cvt and its geared too much toward luxury not SPORTS CAR. I just wasn't impressed!!!!

Yeah I know the cvt is somekind of f1 renault secret weapon transmission banned back in the day but come on, seriously does the 7gen come close to a 1seater f1 race car and once again why not offer it in the Nissan GTR.

I'm through finger fussing about this issue and as you mentioned earlier some (correctly or incorrectly) associate the 4dsc with the manual tranny.

I suppose I'm guilty of incorrectly associating the 4door sports car term/meaning with the manual tranny because Nissan is the Judge and the sentence is in.

In my line of work getting beat is an everywork day thing because I can't stop all the crime so I have learned to do what I do how I do and move on.

Thanks for the vocabulary lessons, lightonthehill, I have learned more words from your post than I did while attending 4yrs at Troy State University in Al. Too many frat parties.

C ya in the next thread, family!

lightonthehill

rnooptroop - Good old Troy State! I lived in Montgomery the first half of the 1960s, my wife is from Mobile, and a dear friend is from New Brocton (southwest of Troy; she has a pecan orchard). Troy is just a hop and a jump from Panama City Beach. We spent a week in Mobile just a few weeks ago, and are in Bama all the time.

Just because you have Bama ties, I will let you in on a rumor I am hearing. I just spent an hour chatting with the service manager at my dealer. We were discussing the '09 Maxima. He is getting ready to fly to a 'gathering' of Nissan folks for a meeting. He thinks the meeting is tied to the impending arrival of the new Maxima (June), and he is hearing rumors a manual tranny may actually be an option for the '09, but he isn't sure, and even if it will be available, he doesn't know if it will be available on 'day one'.

I know, just a rumor, but . . .

vball_max

iTrader: (5)

7-speed MT anyone?

With the extra power, its probably doable. But that last gear would probably be used very rarely.

FrostMaxima

iTrader: (1)

omg, I am so tired of seeing these threads of the mention of no manual! If your so damn heart broken buy a different F'in car!!! Half the people that are complaining couldnt afford one anyways!

SoonerFan

iTrader: (5)

i can afford a brand new Xterra...that has a 6MT.....

rnupetroop

[QUOTE=lightonthehill;6333377]rnooptroop - Good old Troy State! I lived in Montgomery the first half of the 1960s, my wife is from Mobile, and a dear friend is from New Brocton (southwest of Troy; she has a pecan orchard). Troy is just a hop and a jump from Panama City Beach. We spent a week in Mobile just a few weeks ago, and are in Bama all the time.

Just because you have Bama ties, I will let you in on a rumor I am hearing. I just spent an hour chatting with the service manager at my dealer. We were discussing the '09 Maxima. He is getting ready to fly to a 'gathering' of Nissan folks for a meeting. He thinks the meeting is tied to the impending arrival of the new Maxima (June), and he is hearing rumors a manual tranny may actually be an option for the '09, but he isn't sure, and even if it will be available, he doesn't know if it will be available on 'day one'.

I know, just a rumor, but . . .[/QUOTE

lightonthehill- What about dem TROJANS, that's something New Brockton, Mobile and Montgomery. I have ties in all three(Pecan Orchids, that's my country away form this city). My wife is from Goshen which is west of Troy and that is part of how we became college sweethearts-11yrs! We travel to Bama all the time and we were in PCBeach about a year ago vacationing but are going to Daytona this year, next week!

Man you have made my day, just hearing the possibility that the manual is even thought of, I guess you have figured, I'm somewhat an optimist. I understand it is only a rumor but you know Governor Perdue prayed for rain here in ga so I will pray for a manual transmission

Thanks for the sunshine on this cloudy, gloomy day outside!

It's becoming more apparent, why the name is lightonthehill.

Crusher103

iTrader: (10)

I have a question for all of U saying that paddle shifted CVT are not that bad blah blah blah

Have U ever driven a good MT car?

I use to think that it wasnt that different, it wasnt till until I actually learned how to drive an MT that i understood why, its about the driving feel, that Ur in total control of all the cars major operations

thats what this argument is about not that CVT is faster or slower, but its doing everything for U, sure thats good for luxury, but for anything sticking a sports anything to its name there has to be an MT option

a great example of that look at the M5, the benchmark for sport sedans, when it first came out it had that 7 speed paddle shifted trans which wasnt bad it was actually extremely good, but they were criticized to the point the had to make a tradition MT.

jcalabria

Oh My!!! Don't we have our panties in a wad!

(JK... guess I took the "Have you ever driven..." challenge personally, lol)

Seriously... too many people have these two totally separate issues so friggin' intertwined its disgusting.

I learned how to drive on a manual (at 11 years old)... driven a bunch of good (and bad) ones. Used to love flying around country roads in NY/NJ/PA & VT. I know what fun it can be and how satisfying it is to click off a perfect matched rev downshift to set up for the exit of the next turn... or be able to start on the steepest hill without using the e-brake OR rolling back even an inch... blah blah blah, yada yada yada.

I think it sucks that Nissan can't justify the economics of putting an MT in the Max, so... we're all in agreement on that point, right?

Now... What the frig does that have to do with whether the CVT is any good on its own merits? The CVT didn't replace the 6MT... it replaced the 5AT. Sucks that they dropped the MT, but its got nothin' to do with the CVT.

What's wrong with adding paddle shifters (or any manumatic mode) to an auto tranny? You DO occasionally need to shift them manually - mainly for holding a ratio for hills or twisties (anyone who manually shifts an automatic for daily cruising or even WOT acceleration runs is most likely a poseur). Would you rather look down, press an interlock button and move a clunky shift lever through a PRNDL gate, all the while hoping you don't hit neutral and over-rev or, worse, hit reverse and grenade something??? This is all nothing new. One of the best automatic cars I ever drove was an ex-girlfriend's '67 GTO with a Hurst dual gate shifter. Typical ultra-crisp no-clutch-overlap THM400 shifts (one of the few things GM has ever done right) and no-look up or down shifts. Manumatic gate or paddle shifters are just a new version of that, made possible by modern electronics. It costs so little to add a manumatic mode to a modern AT it would be negligent NOT to have it. Manumatic modes are not a replacement for an MT... but they can and do make a good automatic a better one.

Nissan dropped the MT in the 6.5G Max (I strongly suspect) because the the high-volume Altima simultaneously moved to a different platform and engine type and the Max could no longer piggyback on the Altima's powertrain certification. It was only coincident with, and not because of, the CVT intro.

BMW's margins allowed it to respond to the similar outcry caused when they dropped the MT in the M5. Nissan simply could not absorb (or pass on) the certification costs of an MT for only a few thousand MT Max sales. Now that the Max and Altima once again share a platform, that may no longer be an issue and we may once again see a manual transmission in the Max. I will applaud that event with you. However, I will also continue to applaud the continuing development of automatic transmission technology as well. Doing so does not detract one iota from my love of a good manual transmission.

shoult

iTrader: (1)

I think we all agree on advancing technology. CVTs may be a great way to go.

My problem has and will continue to be Nissan's banging the 4DSC drum for the Gen7 to gather the NISMO faithful only to find no manual is available. If you're going to have enthusiast leanings then you need to FIND A WAY to make a MT option profitable or suck up the cost of it. If you don't, the NEXT time you beat the drum, no one will pay any attention to Nissan's bleatings.

riceyasian86

Just get a 2007 6spd 350z :P

jcalabria

I don't disagree, but as large and as vocal a group as the MT lovers are on this forum, they do not represent an accurate reflection of the public at-large. I seriously doubt that more than 1-2% of the general population has any meaningful connection in their head between sports car and manual transmission.

SUV's are the most un-sporty vehicle there is (well, maybe not as bad as a mini-van, lol) but there's that word, buried deep in the name. I hear soooo many people say they want one because they have a "sporty" image. UGH!

Mazda sells an automatic in the freakin Miata... the closest thing to a true "classic" sports car there is these days. Offering an AT in the Miata is a bigger sacrilege than not offering an MT in the Max.

We just have to stop taking 4DSC so literally. With or without an MT, NO Maxima EVER was a true sports car. They have been fine sport sedan's however, and 4DSC is nothing more than a trademarkable equivalent to sport sedan.

Crusher103

iTrader: (10)

what U say is true but, offering an AT on a Miata isnt so bad because there is still the option, the miata has kinda been stooped down to a "girl car" well the S2000 is a "mans car" which doesnt make sense. its just so I would not say only women but mainly there preferences on what they want in a car, they still have to sell.

All we want is the choice of an MT im not saying that CVT is garbage and should fall off the face of the earth, after the 3rd gen there was not many MT cars of its size unless U wanted to spend 30k on a BMW and thats what brought alot of people to the car.

And some people do take the 4DSC to seriously somebody suggested that he Maxima should be faster than the 350Z and STi, if that were the case than what would be the point of those cars?

lightonthehill

rnupetroop - You are one who feels my 'lightonthehill' moniker is spot-on. But there are many here who feel I should have been named 'candleonthegrassyknoll'.

I have only been to Goshen AL (your wife's hometown) once, and that was years ago while taking back roads from Atlanta to Gulf Breeze FL. I only remember a very small town with little or no 'center', and a big industrial plant of some kind on the back road we took heading southwest out of town. I do remember my wife saying Goshen was probably a 'mill town'. We sort of like the sincerety of mill towns.

The Maxima may be the finest car ever built for going on backroads with a family. Plenty of room, plenty of power, a sporty suspension, great reliability; begs for lots of open road.

Back on topic; the seeming sincereness with which Ghosn proclaimed the return of the '4DSC' would seem to leave the door open to the possibility of a manual in the 7th gen, but not necessarily at the outset. I can see this going either way. I'm not sure the economics would ever work for the manual Maxima. They certainly did not add up during the last ten years it was available.

The brutal truth is that learning to properly drive all four styles offered with the '09 Maxima CVT would require much more skill and practice than learning to properly drive a manual, which came fairly easily for most of us. I am really excited about the Sport option on the '09 CVT, and how it brings engine compression heavily into the braking process; it sounds very interesting.

soundmike

iTrader: (24)

I've read all your posts regarding the economics of offering a manual (or lack thereof) as well as your other posts... interesting reading to say the least

In any case, my guess is Nissan might still offer a manual transmission with the 7th gen. I don't think it has much to do with economics, the Altima is offered in manual trim on both 4 cyl and 6 cyl, yet most of their sales are on the CVT's.

Thoughts?

lightonthehill

soundmike - I think the Altima manual tranny is tied to two things:

First, the Altima is the 'all things to all people' vehicle costing from $17K to $32K, and hopefully selling 250,000 copies. It is more profitable to have options like a manual tranny on a very high volume vehicle than on a limited production vehicle like the Maxima, of which Nissan normally expects to sell only around 80K copies.

Second, Nissan said about half a dozen years ago that the 3.5 Altima would be their 4DSC going into the future, and the Maxima would be gradually moved upscale to sports/luxury and true flagship status; I think they felt that approach made a manual in the Altima sort of mandatory.

Having said all that, I feel the sudden and unexpected announcement by Carlos Ghosn about a year ago that the Maxima would not only be Nissan's flagship, but would once again be a 4DSC, may have changed the situation. This is already evident in the fact Nissan has put FOUR different driving options on the CVT in the '09 Maxima, including a sports selection that employs engine compression as a serious braking tool. It will take some drivers quite a while to master the nuances of those four CVT driving tools. Driving the CVT at maximum effectiveness will require a learning curve many drivers will not fully attain. Of course those less-skilled drivers can use the CVT in its most simple mode, which is very efficient.

With the understanding that it may not be a money-making proposition, Nissan may at some point (hopefully in the '09 model year) make a manual tranny available in the Maxima simply to reinforce the notion that their flagship sedan is truly a 4DSC. As only the very largest Nissan dealers want any manual Maximas on their lot (less than 5% of Maxima buyers will even look at a manual), Nissan would probably get around this by making the manual version a limited edition with lots of bells and whistles, and with special markings. It would then be an 'eye-catcher' that more buyers would look for, and dealers would not mind having on their lot.

But then I am not the one making these decisions, and we will have to wait and see what comes down.

jcalabria

It's not a question of development/engineering costs - the manual powertrain was already well developed for the 6G yet it was dropped in '07 when the Max and Alti no longer shared a common platform/powertrain.

The economics surface in the annual EPA certification costs of a platform/powertrain combination. Even if the percentage of manual sales is the same for both Max and Altima, the actual numbers of manuals is grossly higher in the Altima (~5:1), providing a much larger base to amortize the certification costs over. Since the certification costs are the same regardless of sales, the cost per vehicle for certification will necessarily be 5 times higher per Max than it is per Altima.

Fortunately, at least the possibility of a shared certification once again exists.

2000KeyedMaxima

iTrader: (2)

maybe a manual diesel in the future ???