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7th Generation Maxima (2009-) Come in and talk about the newly redesigned 7th generation Maxima

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Old 08-30-2012, 11:20 PM   #1
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Question 2013 Maxima - Is there a single difference?

2013 Maxima vs. 2012 - Is there a single difference or enhancement? I'm gathering not, but I want to confirm.

I've also noticed that NissanUSA has posted a slew of videos on YouTube that all begin with "2013 Nissan Maxima". They're all clearly written for a clinical retard or 90+ year old, considering they feature topics that explain how to open the moon roof, how to consult your Navigation manual for help with Navigation, and other various completely moronic and uninformative videos.
Check them out on their YouTube here: http://www.youtube.com/user/nissanusa/feed
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Old 08-31-2012, 02:54 AM   #2
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Probably nothing visual different but a new Maxima should be coming in 2014
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Old 08-31-2012, 04:01 AM   #3
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theres a lot of tech differences.. i googled it a few months ago
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Old 08-31-2012, 06:27 AM   #4
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New SV Value Package added, featuring 9-speaker BoseŽ audio system, SiriusXM Satellite Radio (SiriusXM subscription required, sold separately), heated front seats, heated steering wheel, heated outside mirrors
BoseŽ Audio Package added, with 9-speaker BoseŽ audio system and SiriusXM Satellite Radio (SiriusXM subscription required, sold separately)
Sport Package adds Monitor Package content (7-inch color monitor, USB connectivity, iPodŽ net in center console, RearView Monitor), plus climate-controlled driver's seat and Dark Hyper Silver wheel finish (19-inch aluminum-alloy wheels)
Revised exterior color selection with Pearl White added (eight colors total)
Available August 2012
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Old 08-31-2012, 09:59 AM   #5
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nothing much.
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Old 08-31-2012, 04:44 PM   #6
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I found this a while back. there is already a topic on it.
http://nissannews.com/en-US/nissan/u...ng-the-changes
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Old 08-31-2012, 04:52 PM   #7
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its 1 year newer
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Old 08-31-2012, 05:02 PM   #8
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Nissan should send the Max out with a bang! 3+ hp increase, night vision forward cam and blindspot warning, etc. Oh and space(age) seats!
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Old 08-31-2012, 07:25 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STARR View Post
Probably nothing visual different but a new Maxima should be coming in 2014

Just in case there may be some here not totally clear on this, the new Maxima coming in 2014 will be the 8th gen Maxima arriving as the 2015 Maxima in spring of 2014.

But before that new generation Maxima arrives, we STILL have another 7th gen model year Maxima (the 2014) arriving next summer, which will be identical to the 2013, which has only minor changes from the 2012.

The reason Nissan will make no changes to the Maxima for the 2014 model year arriving next summer is because the 2014 will be a 'short run' model year, with assembly lines changing over to the 2015 8th gen Maxima in January 2014 in order to have a large supply (several thousand) on hand for the big initial shipment to dealers just prior to first sale date of the 8th gen.

I expect that 'first sale date' for the 8th gen 2015 Maxima to be within a month or so either way of May 2014.
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Old 08-31-2012, 07:38 PM   #10
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Nissan is totally re-working their line-up as we speak. It is not in the 5 new vehicles in 15 months they released the altima first, then the pathfinder, then the Sentra, then 2 more i cant remember exactly which ones. So being that maxima is the "newest" model to get a change (2009) it will also be the last, unfortunately.
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Old 09-01-2012, 08:45 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brudface View Post
Nissan is totally re-working their line-up as we speak. It is not in the 5 new vehicles in 15 months they released the altima first, then the pathfinder, then the Sentra, then 2 more i cant remember exactly which ones. So being that maxima is the "newest" model to get a change (2009) it will also be the last, unfortunately.
Those 5 are:

1)Altima
2)Pathfinder
3)Sentra
4)Rogue
5)Versa Hatchback

In that order they are/will be released. New Max and Z are still in the development stages and will be released as '15 models in '14.
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Old 09-01-2012, 11:01 PM   #12
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Monte 01&97 and Brudface have this nailed.

Decisions are being made at this time as to exactly what the 8th gen 2015 will look like, and, more importantly, what power options will be available.

In a normal situation, I would expect the engine and tranny to remain very similar to the 7th gen. But nothing is 'normal' any more. With the first fuel efficiency bump due in 2015, and the 55 MPG fleet average arriving in 2025, cars are going to change big-time during the coming decade. The 8th gen Maxima will be an important part of Nissan's fleet from spring 2014 until the 9th gen Maxima arrives, which may be in the spring of 2020 as the 2021 model.

If I was Ghosn (and his planners), I would release the 8th gen with a standard engine that would be a supercharged 4 cylinder. The supercharger would boost the power to around 310HP for situations when strong acceleration is needed, but let the 4 cylinder engine sip gas while pumping out around 240 HP the other 95% of the time. That should boost the MPG to between 35 and 40.

I would also, for the first time since the arrival of Maxima's 2nd generation in fall of 1984, offer a quiet, smokeless advanced diesel engine as an option. That should also get around 35 to 40 MPG. If not a diesel alternative, then Nissan may opt for a hybrid option instead.

The CVT is not negotiable. Manuals are now the least efficient tranny available, and every year, a smaller percentage of the driving public either knows how to operate a manual, or has an interest in buying one.

Automatics are now falling behind the CVT in efficiency, even as manufacturers are going to 7, and even 8 speed automatics. There will be automatics available for the next ten to twenty years, but eventually, basic physics will convince manufacturers that there will never be a shifting tranny more efficient that a perfected non-shifting tranny.

Of course manufacturers will include things such as paddle and stick shift overrides so those folks unable to adjust to life without shifting will have a play-pretty available for their 'pretend' shifting pleasure.

Those of us who grew up driving between 60 and 70 years ago will have to struggle to keep up. We are facing even more incredible automation in the future, as computers will more and more control our vehicles, even to the point of not allowing them to crash into each other. Work on that aspect of super-control is already pretty far along. Things will eventually reach a point where we would not be able to run over our spouse with our car, even if we wanted to.

Orwell's '1984' is a little late, but will be here shortly.
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Old 09-02-2012, 05:21 AM   #13
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If Nissan wants to bring the Maxima up to date with conventional often used technolgy they should add the following low cost features to the 2013 Maxima:
1. Day time Driving lights - Had them on every car since the early 2000's, they are mandatory in Canada and most European countries and have proven to save lives and as a bonus lower you insurance rates.
2. Oil life monitor - No more unneccessay oil changes. For most drivers 3750 miles is way too often.
3. Blind spot protection - The 2013 Altima has it
4. Lane departure protection - Very handy if you are not paying attention.
5. Automatic folding side mirrors.

Hope someone at Nissan reads this.
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Old 09-02-2012, 05:33 AM   #14
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in response to a few of those recommendations above

1. i believe DRL's are already an option? may be mistaken
2. you can pull the dipstick and look at the color, if its dark its time to change
3. this car doesn't have many blind spots, i've never had an issue
4. no offense but please pay attention while you're driving. it scares me to be on the same public roads as you that you feel like you'd need this
5. +1 that would be awesome
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Old 09-02-2012, 08:32 PM   #15
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I should have included DTRL (LEDs) also.
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Old 09-04-2012, 01:42 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lightonthehill View Post
The CVT is not negotiable. Manuals are now the least efficient tranny available, and every year, a smaller percentage of the driving public either knows how to operate a manual, or has an interest in buying one.

Automatics are now falling behind the CVT in efficiency, even as manufacturers are going to 7, and even 8 speed automatics. There will be automatics available for the next ten to twenty years, but eventually, basic physics will convince manufacturers that there will never be a shifting tranny more efficient that a perfected non-shifting tranny.

Of course manufacturers will include things such as paddle and stick shift overrides so those folks unable to adjust to life without shifting will have a play-pretty available for their 'pretend' shifting pleasure.
I think that having paddle or stick shifting overrides for the CVT is pretty important in letting the driver have more control over the vehicle's movement. Engine braking down a hill for instance. Right now in the Maxima it takes the form of a simulated 6 speed transmission. But hopefully in the future they will incorporate a way for the driver to manually adjust the gearing precisely and on the fly in a form more suited to the CVT's capabilities. Of course it is supposed to be "automatic" but as most of you probably agree too much automation has it's drawbacks. And until cars are linked to our brains while driving, or driving themselves god forbid, having more control is a good thing to have.

I believe manual transmissions still can have the ability to be more fuel efficient than automatics especially in certain situations since they do not have to deal with the complication of a torque converter. But most manuals nowadays are not made with fuel efficiency in mind. With some exceptions (I'd love to get a 1st gen insight with a manual one day) CVTs are exceptionally suited to city driving IMO. Traditional automatic, especially 7spds, are still getting better scores on average than CVTs if you are looking at just highway fuel economy.

But the CVTs are getting better and better all the time.

Last edited by Celidor; 09-04-2012 at 01:44 PM.. Reason: had to add
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Old 09-04-2012, 03:43 PM   #17
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I would also like for Nissan to simulate an extra gear in the cvt.
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Old 09-04-2012, 06:55 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Celidor View Post
I think that having paddle or stick shifting overrides for the CVT is pretty important in letting the driver have more control over the vehicle's movement. Engine braking down a hill for instance. Right now in the Maxima it takes the form of a simulated 6 speed transmission. But hopefully in the future they will incorporate a way for the driver to manually adjust the gearing precisely and on the fly in a form more suited to the CVT's capabilities. Of course it is supposed to be "automatic" but as most of you probably agree too much automation has it's drawbacks. And until cars are linked to our brains while driving, or driving themselves god forbid, having more control is a good thing to have.

I believe manual transmissions still can have the ability to be more fuel efficient than automatics especially in certain situations since they do not have to deal with the complication of a torque converter. But most manuals nowadays are not made with fuel efficiency in mind. With some exceptions (I'd love to get a 1st gen insight with a manual one day) CVTs are exceptionally suited to city driving IMO. Traditional automatic, especially 7spds, are still getting better scores on average than CVTs if you are looking at just highway fuel economy.

But the CVTs are getting better and better all the time.

Yes, CVT fuel economy is getting better. And the fuel efficiency potential for CVTs is just beginning to be tapped. So far, most of the effort has gone into making a CVT that is reliable (not that easy; CVTs are by nature very heat-prone), and developing software that makes it satisfactory for most drivers (again, not as easy as it may seem; every driver is different).

The problem with 7, 8, etc speed automatic (or manual) trannies is that, although they can deliver great MPG on the open road, the tranny still has to go through a ton of shift points to get up to speed, and every shift point is a critical instant in which the engine is running and burning fuel, but no power is reaching the drive wheels, and no acceleration is taking place. That hurts in local or city driving.

I certainly agree manufacturers must keep some kind of control or override with these CVTs for use in unusual situations, such as mountainous driving. I have a trip I make quite often that involves descending a very steep, curvy grade that extends for around five miles (Cox's Creek at Gillespie Gap in NC, for those who may be wondering), and I always drop the tranny into a lower range in order to use engine compression to limit my speed when going down that treacherous drop.

I also use the tranny override to help keep the RPMs from dropping when I let off the gas in sharp curves when going up that climb. I find that makes for a smoother, quicker climb.

Having began driving when the only trannies available were manual (late 1940s), and having driven manuals as recently as 1984 (5 speed 1978 Datsun 200SX), I do enjoy manuals in areas where traffic is not usually at a gridlock. But this CVT has grown on me, and I find there are ways in which I can sort of control some things by judicious manipulation of the throttle, careful observation of the terrain ahead, and having one eye on the tach. This CVT gets to be more fun for me every day.
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Old 09-11-2012, 01:12 AM   #19
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Having 5 maximas in our household since 1993, with the Next Generation Maxima scheduled to arrive in 2015,Give the car a larger interior, , make the CVT optional,and offer a 6 or 7 speed automatic transmission as well. Hopefully and this is just an idea may be good or bad but base it off of the current Infiniti M. When the generation from 2004 debuted the Maxima suddenly became larger, then by 2009 the Maxima got smaller it threw alot of us off. Just my opinions but if i'm wrong teach me something i'm always willing to learn from you guys.
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Old 09-11-2012, 01:46 AM   #20
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Having 5 maximas in our household since 1993, with the Next Generation Maxima scheduled to arrive in 2015,Give the car a larger interior, , make the CVT optional,and offer a 6 or 7 speed automatic transmission as well. Hopefully and this is just an idea may be good or bad but base it off of the current Infiniti M. When the generation from 2004 debuted the Maxima suddenly became larger, then by 2009 the Maxima got smaller it threw alot of us off. Just my opinions but if i'm wrong teach me something i'm always willing to learn from you guys.

Nissan decided back in late 2001 (and announced in early 2002 by Ghosn) that they would take the Maxima upscale to near-luxury, make it a roomier sedan, but keep a tinge of sportiness. Hence, we got the 6th gen 2004, which was a very fine and roomy family sedan.

But long-time Maxima fans were not very happy, as they felt the 4DSC image had been left behind. This dissatisfaction rose even further when the manual and auto trannies were dropped for 2007.

So Nissan did an about-face, and Ghosn announced in 2007 that the next generation Maxima was going to be taken back to its roots, with a sportier image, more power, etc. Hence we got the 7th gen 2009, which had slightly less interior room, but more horsepower, a much sportier exterior and sportier handling, achieved by replacing some critical suspension parts with M45 suspension parts. The turning radius (a real problem with the 6th gen) was reduced by a whopping four feet, which has really made a difference for me.

Greatly increasing fleet fuel efficiency requirements are going to change everything once more, and it will be very interesting to see how Nissan handles this in the 8th gen Maxima. I could live with a supercharged four banger, or a diesel four banger, with both getting between 35 and 40 MPG on the highway. But some folks here will not understand, and will be expecting the 3.5 to be replaced by the 3.7. They may be disappointed.
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Old 09-11-2012, 01:55 AM   #21
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As this thread is actually about changes for the 2013, I will add this: The Music Box, a part of the Premium Package since the 7th gen first year 2009, was dropped in the middle of the 2012 Maxima production run (Nissan could not renegotiate successfully with the Music Box maker), so will not be on any 2013 Maxima.

I absolutely love my Music Box, but am well aware CD technology will be on its way out in the not-too-distant future, and the CD Music Box would have disappeared anyway.
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Old 09-11-2012, 02:03 AM   #22
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lightonthehill Thanks man for your response that makes perfect sense in a nutshell. I have a 06SL and 99% of people that see me in that car approach and say gosh they're not making the Maxima's like they used too I always wanted one like yours. I either hear that or I like your Altima haha they get them mixed up often. For the Next Maxima keep it sporty but at the same time give the car more interior space it makes a big difference. The problem with the decreased dimensions car buyers of the Maxima demographic may say I like the Maxima but its too small so i'm gonna get something a little bigger.Had the 2009 to present Maxima been a little bit bigger as the prior generation which I own I probably would have bought it, and they took the power folding mirrors as an option away that kept me back to the 06 as well. It does have the turning radius of a charter bus it makes manuevering difficult in certain situations.Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 09-11-2012, 02:36 AM   #23
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Chris - I understand everything you said. My wife and I are close friends with a 6' tall young lady that sometimes rides in our back seat. She bragged at length about the room in the back of our 6th gen, but was a little disappointed in our 7th gen. Like you, I like my mirrors with power folding option in order to clear some narrow garage door openings.

The garage doors in our current home are all 10' wide (we designed the house), but we almost never see new homes built with 10' wide garage doors, unless they are double doors, which are almost all either 16, 17 or 18 feet wide, which we do not consider wide enough to be 'double' doors. We want at least a full foot clearance on both sides at the entry point of the garage, and four feet of room on both sides of each of our vehicles once they are in the garage.

The front seat area of the 7th gen Maxima is roomy enough, and much roomier than say the G35. But knee room in the rear seat area is just OK. When we move the front seats forward, the rear is fine. But the 6th gen was fine without moving the front seats at all.
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Old 09-11-2012, 09:15 AM   #24
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lightonthehill

The power folding mirror option seemed to be something the both of us and most Maxima customers really liked and preferred as an option. Hopefully Nissan will bring them back from the new Maxima in 2015

Far as the interior space of the current 2009 Maxima to present a good example to support that the Rear Seat legroom for a 2012 Maxima stands at 34.6 for the 2002 Maxima its 36.2. Real legroom in an 06 is 36.5 So the older Maximas prior to 2003 had a bit more room in the rear than the newer Maximas. We've owned a 93 Maxima, a 2002, one 2004 and two 2006s. I'm 5ft10 and very slim but the Maxima I currently drive the interior feels downright large it comes into handy when I have to take my 80 year grandmother to the grocery store or on a road trip. Or my Uncle he's 6ft5, or father 6ft4.

For having more than 3 Maximas in the household from 1993 to present,you get to the 2009 Maxima and say wait a minute small backseat i'm not used to this lol. I like the newer Maximas they look good but Nissan make the next car bigger.
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Last edited by Chris Alexander; 09-11-2012 at 09:23 AM..
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Old 09-11-2012, 12:27 PM   #25
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Chris - Your post reminded me of another thing I liked with my 6th gen - It was not quite as low as other Maximas, and thus was a tad easier to get into and out of, especially the rear seat.
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Old 09-11-2012, 12:47 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by lightonthehill View Post
Nissan decided back in late 2001 (and announced in early 2002 by Ghosn) that they would take the Maxima upscale to near-luxury, make it a roomier sedan, but keep a tinge of sportiness. Hence, we got the 6th gen 2004, which was a very fine and roomy family sedan.

But long-time Maxima fans were not very happy, as they felt the 4DSC image had been left behind. This dissatisfaction rose even further when the manual and auto trannies were dropped for 2007.
Yup, actually started the move upscale with the 02 model year per Ghosn with features standard and optional never available on Max prior (still have the internal email sent to us in 01 forwarded to my home email addy when I worked for corporate). Including HID's, memory seats, heated steering wheel etc etc. Many feel they had the sport/luxury just right that year, but as you said it grew in size to seperate it from the then new larger Altima. Funny how some features of the Max since have become optional in Packages, dropped etc to re appear again or not to. Ex. homelink (package), Hid's(package), power folding mirrors (dropped) etc etc.
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Old 09-11-2012, 12:59 PM   #27
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That makes you wonder if the next Maxima is gonna take another step up. The Altima suddenly grew in 2002, Maxima was on the backburner for a while until 2004. For 2009 The Maxima interlying with the G sedan we now have the performance and back to the 4 door sports car that Maxima buyers wanted to see but it lost a little bit of luxury touch, the decreased demensions for 2009 Make it just a little bit less competitive because people are gonna pay extra for the little bit more room in a slightly bigger car, the decreased dimensions come at a disadvantage, but its still a good car 2009 present.

Lets say Nissan Took the current Infiniti M gave it a stiffer suspension,added a sports package did some rebadging and called it the 2014 Nissan Maxima would that be a winner or is it better to stick with the Next Generation Infiniti G as the new maxima?Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size. One of these could be the Next Maxima.
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Last edited by Chris Alexander; 09-11-2012 at 01:20 PM..
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Old 09-11-2012, 01:06 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Ghozt View Post
in response to a few of those recommendations above

1. i believe DRL's are already an option? may be mistaken
2. you can pull the dipstick and look at the color, if its dark its time to change
3. this car doesn't have many blind spots, i've never had an issue
4. no offense but please pay attention while you're driving. it scares me to be on the same public roads as you that you feel like you'd need this
5. +1 that would be awesome
DRL's are not an option that is avaialble in the USA from Nissan, they are mandatory in other countries. My 2005 Buick and 2010 Honda have them

I will never change oil by the color, there are other factors such as acids, particulates, sludge and othert contaminants that affect oil life.
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Old 09-11-2012, 03:06 PM   #29
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The 13 Sports also only come with those 19" Aluminum-alloy Dark Hyper Silver finish wheels.....Not everyone likes those dark rims, the bright on the 12 Sports look better.
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Old 09-11-2012, 03:22 PM   #30
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The G wont be rebadge as a Maxima, I can assure you of that. The next maxima will be based of of the Next Gen Nissan Teana http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nissan_...009-present.29

We might see an AWD version with the AWD diverting from the rouge/murano and be price below the infiniti G series. The G series will continue to target the Lexus IS/BMW 3 series were the Maxima will go after the Avalon/Impala/Accord/TL.
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Old 09-11-2012, 05:13 PM   #31
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eljoker The Teana M45 twin now that's a nice I see, If they make a Maxima out of that its gonna need a little more sport etiquette to keep the Maxima in place. It's size is perfect.Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 09-11-2012, 06:12 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by silberma View Post
DRL's are not an option that is avaialble in the USA from Nissan, they are mandatory in other countries. My 2005 Buick and 2010 Honda have them

I will never change oil by the color, there are other factors such as acids, particulates, sludge and othert contaminants that affect oil life.
i was just giving him an option since it didnt appear he wanted to track oil by looking at his mileage when changing it. i dont use the dip stick to gauge i base it on mileage
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Old 09-11-2012, 06:20 PM   #33
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The 87 Max was very nicely equipped, near lux, 4whl disc, alloys, auto suspension, good audio control with eq, power sunroof, verbal warning system and all power feature for both front occupants.
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Old 09-11-2012, 07:19 PM   #34
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Quote:
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The 87 Max was very nicely equipped, near lux, 4whl disc, alloys, auto suspension, good audio control with eq, power sunroof, verbal warning system and all power feature for both front occupants.
It sure was the 85-88, in paticuliar GL/GXE 's packed with features. It along withe Cressida at the time by far had way more features than any other sedan from Japan. Even more than the then new 86 Acura Legend which didn't even have power seats nor offer automatic climate control, Max and Cressida did.
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Last edited by MONTE 01&97 SE; 09-11-2012 at 07:21 PM..
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Old 09-12-2012, 02:09 PM   #35
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It is essentially the same car. if you go the "Build my 2013 Maxima" site you will see that Nissan shuffled the option packages a bit.
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Old 09-12-2012, 02:15 PM   #36
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If the 2012/2013 Maxima had power folding mirrors then I probably would have bought one and put up with the decreased size. When I test drove a 12 I couldnt believe how smooth the ride was!
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Old 09-13-2012, 04:37 PM   #37
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It is essentially the same car. if you go the "Build my 2013 Maxima" site you will see that Nissan shuffled the option packages a bit.
They have done this every model year since the 3rd gen, changing the packages and its name......Can get confusing for the guy trying to learn about Maximas
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Old 09-13-2012, 06:28 PM   #38
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If the 2012/2013 Maxima had power folding mirrors then I probably would have bought one and put up with the decreased size. When I test drove a 12 I couldnt believe how smooth the ride was!
Adding more gadgets are not necessarily a good thing if they do not add substance to the car. Just ask BMW and Mercedes dealers what it cost to fix them. The price will floor you.
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Old 09-13-2012, 06:36 PM   #39
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silberma I hear you, only one problem the 6th generation 2004-2008 has power folding mirrors as an option I have it on the SL, it comes on the SE in some packages, but see when the 2009 Maxima came out they took it away as an option so it made some of us cry wolf because alot of things on the predecessor 04-08 werent included on the newer car 2009 to present. The newer car grew in some areas but also set back in some as well. It has 290HP which we all love, CVT which was standard on 2007-2008 2009 thru 12 which some of us love some of hate. There's things I have on my 06SL that I wish the newer Maximas had like, power folding,reclining rear seat,roomy rear seat. Then there are things the 2009 to present Maxima has that I wish my 06SL had like 290HP,backup camera, increased width.
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Last edited by Chris Alexander; 09-13-2012 at 06:39 PM..
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Old 03-07-2013, 02:24 PM   #40
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For 2013 the 2012 Limited Edition appearance package is available (via bits and pieces) across the entire trim line instead of just for the S trim as it was in 2012. Also, the 2013 gets the "dark" headlamp/taillights motif from the 2012 Limited Edition. I think also the dark Limited Edition wheels are available in an inch larger size than the ones in the 2012 Limited Edition.

That said, here's my wishlist for the next gen:
- Quicker, of course :P
- Better Auto setting on climate control. Current Auto behavior is silly
- A recess in forward front center column for stuff you need in quick reach but don't want to stash in the center console. This is sorely lacking in the current gen
- A V6 option. I'd hate for this car to become an all inline-4 model
- Base audio could stand some clarity improvement

Common requests I don't care much for:
- LEDs. Even Kias have these now. They're a design fad and many of them look tacky (e.g. Current E-class)
- AWD. Only helps from a marketing perspective. From a practical perspective as long as the car is FWD-biased it will always handle like a FWD car (see Acura TL SH-AWD for an example of that). AWD will only add mass. As for snow traction, I live in North Central IL and have yet to lose power traction in the snow here with my 2012

I also hope Nissan doesn't ruin the look of the car as they did with the "accented" final G37.

Last edited by jdrch; 03-07-2013 at 02:27 PM..
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Old 03-07-2013, 02:24 PM
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