t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

Nice

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

Another nice day - and evening - at the track. Some pix first:

Slicks installed:



Before and after front tires:



Some of these were after I got home. New front-tire bumpers:



Rear clearance: ( kinda bright back there, eh?)



Headers cutout pipe clearance:



Another up-the-skirt rear-tire shot, with Progress anti-sway bar and 6AN E85 fuel lines to and from the tank.

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

First, I left the engine tuning and everything else exactly the same as the last track outing two weeks ago. Even the same nitrous tanks, since they were only down 2lb each from full - 4lb total nitrous used for that evening, including purges. I made a total of four runs, all in the same right lane, with a fun burnout on the slicks.

I calculated the MPH max of each gear, using 6500RPM and 77" tire circumference for the 24.5" M&H slick. Not counting TC loss, first gear tops at 38PMH, second gear at 67MPH, third gear at 107, and fourth gear at 154MPH. On all four passes I was into fourth gear before entering the traps.

It seems that I have lost one of the timing slips, but all were remarkably close in MPH and ET - but much slower than I expected. I'll list the numbers below, but I have ETs of 13.274, 13.114, and 13.419 (last pass as I remember, where the tires broke loose in 1-2 shift, and MPH of 104.19, 104.90, and 104.22. The car launched well, shifted very well, went straight,(except last pass) and was into fourth gear before the traps. But - with open headers, car seemed to be down on power. Oh, nitrous tanks were down about 3 lbs each total, so I did not burn much fuel or nitrous for six 1/4 miles runs.

RT______.238______.114______.184
60'______1.993_____.1.950____2.074
330______5.574_____5.487____5.682
1/8 ______8.544_____8.430____8.681
MPH______83.32_____84.19____82.67
1000_____11.110____10.966___11.254
ET_______13.274 ____13.114___13.419
MPH______104.19____104.90___104.22

This is not what I hoped for, but this was an experiment using the M&H slicks instead of the M/T Street Radials. Obviously my next step is to put back the M/T tires (which I did yesterday) and get some street time on them and see how the car feels. I suspect that the shorter tire is not so good with nitrous, since I already have a 4.4 final drive gear and maybe the shorter tire is not an asset. I'll pull the plugs for a quick look, and if plugs are OK, I'll change the programming for the direct-port stage to up to 100% from the existing 75% at WOT. Some more planning is required here.

"it's always something"

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

why not shift at 7k, I would think with your heads, cam and intake setup that would make better use of your powerband

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

Because stock ECU. However, I think I'm now ready to go forward with the Megasquirt project. This newest-generation ECU will finally let me tune the engine, instead of trying to outsmart the factory ECU. My concern has been that all systems were working correctly and predictably and that nothing broke when I went out to play. I think I'm there. I can open the headers again, I can get the car on and off the trailer (for those long trips into Texas and Oklahoma), I have reliable sources for true E85, tires are kinda up in the air but 26x10 M&Hs are in the planning stage because the car seems to like that size, the nitrous controllers now work reliably, the transmission won't blow a diffy and shifts really well, and, well, I really want to turn up the nitrous level a bunch, now that I solved the flow-reversion problem. Can't do that with factory timing - been there, done that, replaced the engines.

I haven't ever dynoed this engine - yet - and think it was pointless until I can really tune it, so Megasquirt next. The engine is built for 8K (valve train to 10.5K) so there is room for improvements.

NOTE: Discovery Channel tonight - last week's show, followed by two hours of new racing for the end of the season. Don't miss anything tonight!

Fakie J Farkerton

iTrader: (51)

I should let you play with my auto JWT ECU..
Too bad it's a '96 ECU.
Don't think it will work on your harness.

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

Thanks - A nice thought, but JWT has a nasty habit of advancing ignition whenever they get a chance, and nitrous + ignition_advance = BLOOEY !!

The Megasquirt MS3-PRO needs a crank trigger wheel and sensor, a single-cam-per-rotation trigger and sensor, and a GM air temp and water temp sensor to function, along with six wires to the ignition coils and another six wires to the injectors, and can connect to my MAF. Add power and ground and you're in bid-ness... (I hope - for $1,200)

I can use my ECUtalk logs to determine injector durations and ignition timing, MAF output and other important stuff for an initial tune, and still be able to switch back to the OEM ECU easily.

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

good show last night

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

Yeah ! Two hours of previous shows and two hours of new racing, to mark the end of this season. Yellowbullet says they're presently working on the next season's action, then another season's worth of racing starts later this fall. The quality of the shows has improved a bunch, less stupid sound effects and showing the entire runs to show what really happened. Even Farm Truck got a new Brodix-headed engine (1162 dyno HP NA) from an engine builder in Kansas, who works in Salina KS, I believe. I know a guy who has mentioned a world-class engine builder that has his shop there, so I'm gonna ask about Mark Brown and see if it's the same guy. Hmmmm.. I could use a freshen-up on the 3.5 - I wonder what he would think of rebuilding my motor?

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

Yeah agree the stow getting better each season, less of the stupid FF editing. Can't wait to see them visit other parts of the country

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

Even better - at least one and maybe two of Big Chief and Shawn are going to race the Hot Rod Magazine Drag Week 2014 during six days of the first week of September. Tuesday they will be here in Topeka. (they were here two years ago) - WOW) They start in Tulsa on Monday, come here on Tuesday, (yes, I will be there) go to Great Bend KS, next to Thunder Valley just south of Oklahoma City, in Noble, then back to Tulsa on Friday. Hod Rod also said that on that Saturday there will be a very special race event celebrating 10 years of Drag Week.

The machine shop that Farm Truck went to for his new engine is Advanced Engine and Machine, in Salina KS. There are hints in Yellowbullet that several of the OKC racers get their engines there. You know, if someone can get a serious LS into a Mazda RX7 (like in Monday's shows) then can I get a World 632 with three stages in my Maxima?? You know, like Daddy Dave has in the Sonoma.....

schmellyfart

iTrader: (46)

Forgive me if its already been brought up, but have you looked into Nistune? It seems to meet your criteria. The original ECU maps are modified (on a Nistune ECU, of course) via the Nistune software through the consult port.

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

Yes, I've thought about Nistune and Haltech ECUs, and Haltech is out because there is no local support for the product within at least 200 miles, and the ECU is an Australian product, and getting answers from Haltech was a real pain. Nistune is even worse from a support viewpoint, Australian and limited production and unknown support for those nagging technical questions.

The factory ECUs also have quirks that showed up in my ECUtalk logs that were unexplained - a sudden drop in RPM when shifting also retards ignition, (which bogged my engine on 1-2 shift) probably a nice thing for a DD but I want absolute control of timing. There were others, probably carried into the Nistune, but I want the best of all worlds by leaving the OEM ECU to manage door locks and fuel gauges, but a fully tunable ECU for ignition and injector controls. Plus, if the MS3-Pro blows up, I can re-connect the OEM back to ignition and injectors and motor onwards.

The MS3-PRO is designed, built, and supported from Suwanee Georgia, and since I have no local tuners I trust, a phone call to Georgia beats a call to Australia. At least this is some of my logic about a major ECU upgrade for the Shark. Trigger wheels and another cam trigger sensor is a major pain to construct, but all real ECUs require something like that anyway. Anyway, that's my opinion today - and worth every penny you paid for it!

MS3-Pro web page: www.diyautotune.com/ms3-pro.html

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

my goal is to do a drag week, power tour, fastest street car shootout or tx2k one day

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

That sounds like a normal summer here in the Heartland... Actually, I don't get the Power Tour - mostly just driving a lot - but I know of several people in town that do it - including my exhaust builder. Not for me, but the rest of your list is good. Drag Week is coming up in a month. Oklahoma has shootouts on tracks pretty often, and Texas events are posted. I gotta get to a standing mile somehow.

Sounds like a great bucket list, for sure....

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

well the power tour out here you drive a total of four tracks in four states and race them all in a weeks time. also they have 1/2 mile events in GA and Chicago I'll try to get the name. the 1/2 mile event might be better for a maxima due to gearing

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

So that's what's a Power Tour is for, huh? Sounds kinda like the grandfather of Hod Rod's Drag week...

I've had family here from Friday until 4 hours ago, so no time to read here - but, I looked again at the last Test-n-Tune event, and saw how similar each run was and noted some earlier passes with a 104 MPH trap speed. Yesterday I made time to dissect the nitrous system a bit, moved the direct-port stage over to the Maximizer4 for later testing, since obviously that stage never engaged on the last four runs, checked the solenoid wiring and re-seated the push-together wire joints, and opened up the nitrous and fuel lines from the two 6-way distribution blocks. Guess what, the nitrous line had an in-line filter and it was mostly blocked with fine grit. I put in two new 4AN in-line filters for the nitrous and fuel inlets for the distro blocks. Think I'll get a few more for spares, and maybe the larger in-line versions.

Gonna try a little highway driving this week to see what's working now. "it's always something"

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

that sucks but atleast it wasn't a clogged fuel line

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

Yeah, nothing like melting down a few pistons to make your day.... I'm also going to remove each fuel and nitrous jet and blow them out before another use. I have a huge Aero 100-micron fuel filter installed, but just in case... now two fresh in-line filters for a "clean" start..

When running the highway and spraying the direct-port stage, I sometimes had time to look at the PLX A/F gauge and it would drop into the .7x range closer to WOT - should be .83-.84 lambda the way it's jetted. Not enough nitrous would do that.


"success is in the details"

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

Monday - I did open up the nitrous nozzles and used comp. air to blow out each jet - also eyeballed each thru a flashlight to check for a clean hole. That's hard for these old eyeballs. I checked the solenoid wires again for tight and clean connections, then decided to connect both sets of solenoids to the Max3 controller, just to see what works today. Fresh nitrous bottle - warmed up to 950psi (seems weird to warm up a bottle in the middle of August, but 80*F) and went for a drive. First time thru the racecourse and nothing triggered. Hmm..

Went back home and moved both pairs of solenoids to the Max4 controller, already programmed. This time I got a good first-stage launch and blew off the tires badly before the 1-2 shift, backed out and drove around to the return loop of my "track" and came into the lane rolling in second gear. Opened up the throttle to over 80% and the tires immediately broke loose and pulled me up to over 90 MPH, where I backed out quickly. I went back to the first loop and stopped in the lane, stalled up to 3k and jabbed the throttle and got into it, where the tires screamed thru first into second and with more throttle the direct-port stage kicked in and spun the tires harder, until I let out. I did try the throttle control and it's weird to drive a car that can spin big o' drag radials at over 90MPH on demand. ( front tires still at 20psi from last track day)

Went around again to the second loop and entered the lane about 40MPH in second and again opened it up hard and listened to the DRs complaining again, up to about 100, riding the throttle, then time to exit.

When I stopped, I had a misfire - one cylinder dead - and drove it home that way, then parked it until I could pull plugs in the daylight. Next day, bad news - cyl 4 showed the misfire and that plug was missing the entire upper half of the insulator tower. Plug 2 was fine, but plug 6 had the insulator broken off about in the middle but still held in place by the ground strap. I replaced both plugs and restarted, but the miss is still there. I'm guessing that a part of the insulator got stuck in an open valve and damaged something. I probably caused the cracked plugs when driving while spraying and varying the throttle a lot, to feel the power. You know how the stock ECU flops the timing around so much when playing with the throttle and I probably triggered detonation with 40+* of timing.

So I'm done this year while I get the engine out, repaired and freshened up (maybe bigger cams) and finally get a real race ECU installed. I think I'll try the OKC engine builder for the engine work, because he knows nitrous. It suxs, but daym the car pulled hard with both stages on. Listening to the DRs scream and spin was almost worth what this is going to cost to fix, but hey, "if you ain't breakin' sumthin', you ain't racing".

Come to think of it, I did achieve my goal of getting all systems working in the car - at the same time.... for one evening, anyway.

*** Did some more research on what to do - maybe I should pull off the front timing cover, along with all that drama, and take off the front head to see what the damage is. Maybe a bent valve ?? That would be a couple of thousand dollars cheaper than having the engine pulled for repairs, than having my shop put it back in, since I have no place at home to do that and local zoning doesn't allow that anyway.

I found a few good links here in the Org about pulling and replacing the outside cover. I've done them a few times, but that's been a while. Yeah, I think I'll try that first. Gives me a chance to get a machinist to mount and balance the 36-1 trigger wheel on the pulley, so I can do the MS3-PRO installation.

Plus I can look at cams, as well... maybe JWT C9 cams ??

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

My shop has the Shark for engine/trans removal, so I can pick everything up on a pallet. The car will be left with front wheels and steering working so I can pull it up on the trailer - I'll probably leave it there for a while until I get the engine torn down to assess damage. I've been making space in my home garage to tear down the engine - mostly by moving stuff to my storage unit. Another transmission and the previous 3.5 will be moved, along with anything large and in the way. Probably the drum of E98 will have to go - I think it's close to empty. I moved ten 5-gal containers of E85 already.

Plug for Cyl #4: the top half of the insulator is missing - reason I think it got stuck in an exhaust valve. It's pretty hard to melt an Inconel exhaust valve, I think. Fair amount of detonation going on there... Funny thing is that Cyl #2 looked fine. I wonder if the UIM has an air distribution problem ??




Plug for Cyl #6 - top half of insulator is broken off completely, but held in by the ground strap!





Driver's side M/T - tread is "grated" over complete width of contact patch.



Passenger side M/T - pretty much the same


No way to spin just one tire with this transmission....

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

this sucks, ever think about taking a step back and starting with a simple setup to get things working. then build on that, like starting with all motor passes with a eu, then add a single single of spray with a shark nozzle or etc then a 2nd stage with a nozzle and stock 3.5 intake with a ssim and bop

just a thought and also ditch the e85 for now and run race fuel

Fakie J Farkerton

iTrader: (51)

Exciting news followed by another setback.

One of these days I'll be reading your thread and you'll be talking about how running consistent high 10's isn't fast enough and nothing you do seems to break your set up.

One day.

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

Agreed - it suxs, but Oh Well.... You know I've already tried all sorts of combinations with a "simple setup", with the previous engine. Race gas didn't save that one,either (VP MS109), and I used a SSIM as well. I think that E85 is superior to most race gas for everything but the most extreme engines and cars - and the racers in Yellowbullet seem to agree. I have researched E85 with the pros and they know how to tune for it. It's not gasoline, and tunes differently, and I need control of ignition timing.

I think my one remaining weak link is using the factory ECU - logs show the timing is very erratic and not predictable depending on the RPMs throttle opening, and vehicle speed. You can only count on the WOT timing curve if you stay at WOT - otherwise you can find yourself with too much timing. A Megasquirt MS3-PRO is next, after fixing and freshening the engine.

I wish you were riding shotgun with me on the last evening out on the highways - goosing the throttle at 90MPH and spinning the M/Ts whenever you want is pretty exciting - if I hadn't backed out a bit because I was sliding around the highway, chances are the nitrous wouldn't have detonated and we wouldn't be having this conversation. ( I don't go over 100MPH on the highways because of the penalities - take the car, stupid high fines, jail time) hmmm... maybe I should move to Oklahoma - the OKC 405 racers seem to get away with a lot...

The engine is coming out and I'm taking it apart to assess the damage - I don't walk away from my mistakes, I fix 'em. Everything else in the car is now working right, except for the ECU, so that gets replaced - do you want a brand-new EU that I walked away from because I didn't trust it?

The Shark is like a kid -it's a "work in progress", and I've raised some successful daughters, so I'm keeping after it. Appreciate your comments as always.

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

I sure hope you're right - my goal is to run at least quick enough to get thrown off the track because no cage, and to have the car so reliable and predictable that Fakie could drive it and crack into the 11s - and live thru it!

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

Why not a emanage or nistune

schmellyfart

iTrader: (46)

https://maxima.org/forums/8974575-post1573.html

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

Tore down my engine last night, and found this in hole #4...




But it should buff out OK....

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

just weld it close and grind it flat, lol

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

pretty sure Harold can figure out a emanage seeing how he designed a transmission controller and what he does for a living

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

Well, yeah, I probably could figure it out, but I've already seen that it's a versatile piggyback, but it follows the quirks of the ECU it's hooked to. Maybe that's OK for most setups, but I dropped it when I saw the ECUtalk logs showing all the timing twitches in the stocker ECU. Not good..

Nitrous does not forgive timing mistakes when spraying a bunch - and I want to spray a bunch more. So, short of figuring out how to use a turbocharger, I'm going to go with a fully-controllable ECU like the MP3-PRO.

At this level, every mistake is expensive ($2-$5K) so I want to get it right. Dammit, for a short time the last evening running the on-ramps I got a taste of a whole bunch of WHP spinning the M/T DRs on demand. I want more of that.

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

Didn't say the emanage had the best timing control but it's better than a piece of tape

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

See? yet another reason to move to the MS3-PRO !! Think how much money I'll save on Gorilla tape !!

I've moved some surplus transmissions and all the stored nitrous and fuel containers to my storage unit, (somehow I have eleven 15 lb bottles and 50 gallons of E85) making some space, so I'm ready to pick up my engine this coming week. The car is on a rack already, so when the guys drop everything out of the bottom, and push the chassis outside to a parking slot, I can have the shop use a forklift and put the engine/tranny in the back of the pickup on a pallet, then winch the car up on the trailer. I'll park the trailer in the storage lot for now, and offload the engine/tranny at my house.

Then I can swap out the old busted engine on the engine stand for the new busted engine and get to work taking things apart.

ABIGBRAIN

iTrader: (1)

Harold, please refer back to our PM's regarding my build. Now would be the perfect opportunity to "up size" your order. Lol
BTW, could you refresh my memory on the combustion chamber size of those Cosworth heads. Are they 50.4cc's? Also, the pistons... flat tops or -7 cc dished? Very difficult to tell by the picture that you recently posted.
On a side note, my 99 is going to be parted out soon.... any parts you might need? I recently put some Kosei K1's and some brand new Tokico Illuminas. I just bought my wife a new Sentra and now I get to drive the 95 Corolla that just turned 61,000 miles.

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

Howdy, A.B.B... Up Size my order? what's you talkin' about? The Cosworth heads have relieved combustion chambers which measure 58cc, I think that's 2ccs over stock. The heads are relieved around the valves for better breathing and knock down the forged CP 11:1 pistons down to 10.6:1. The CP piston is domed with machined cutouts for all four valves, then coated on top with a thermal coating and slick stuff on the piston skirts. Er, the pix of a piston that I posted came from a destroyed monster nitrous engine found on Yellowbullet, as a joke. My engine is still at my shop awaiting extraction. Soon.

I'll check on those PMs soon...

Fakie J Farkerton

iTrader: (51)

I saw that watermark, but didn't know for sure.
Such tomfoolery. Lol

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

Yeah, that piston is bigger than all six of mine together. Even if I bored out the block until the pistons rubbed together...

krazy6

iTrader: (5)

I'm glad that isn't your piston! That would wreck havoc on the inside of the motor!

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

I saw that piston shot in a Yellowbullet forum and couldn't resist showing it in my thread. It was so completely wrecked that I just had to share.

grey99max

iTrader: (12)

Larry Larson on Day 2 of Drag Week 2014 at Topeka KS - 6.70 ET. Freakin Fast Dam Sonoma...