aftermarket HID co's getting cease and desist letters...
 

I think GlenNJ was right a couple days ago.. this is starting to become news.. The news to us is we are screwed.

http://hidforum.com/forum/showthread.php?threadid=613
http://hidforum.com/forum/showthread.php?threadid=596

And no, they will not be accepting Off Road Only as an excuse.
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/rules/...23112.ztv.html


then again, the opposite could happen.. See that one vendor talking about dumping stock?? *that* could bring prices down and help. Hard to say.. If there was more enforcement, perhaps bad conversion will be ticketed (which wouldnt affect 2k/1 peeps with OEM lights), that would help even more.

this really sucks, does this mean cars cant come stock with HID's anymore?

No, I'm pretty sure that OEM can still use HIDs, its just aftermarket conversion that are going to be illegal. (well they were anyways but....)

Well, OEMs can still sell HIDs.. However, on my coupe, my HIDs are aimed very low and they have tamperproof aiming screws. Feds mandate tamperproof adjustment on HIDs now.

Anyway, the only implication to this for you guys is if they will be stolen more or less.

you mean gle02nj ;)

also, what does this mean to us 02/03 owners? Will we be hit harder than usual since now there will be an even bigger illegal market for them? :confused:

Was only time before this was going to happen. As far as what it will do with the HID gray market, I believe its only going to get worse cause the illegal market will sell them for more money.

Guess time to start buying HID kits for cheap price if you are planing on installing them on your car.

Dixit

werd...

I bet hid thefts will skyrocket. On another note if you wanted to get hid on a car that doesn't come stock, a person can buy an oem kit and take out the ballast and lights. This means paying a lot more though because you are buying branded parts (ie nissan hids)

:eek: Crap I just bought the 2k2 headlights too :nervous: Oh well im still gonna get 6000K bulbs and get the phillips fog with 6K bulbs :gotme:
btw-sweet wright up on that Dixit :thumbsup:

No problem, but can I ask where you got it from? I dont remember giving it to you.

Check your PMs :D

Ok people we neen some serious signatures on this petetion
http://www.petitiononline.com/hidforum/petition.html

thats not goin to happen, its a stupid law. you might as well recall all of the couple of billion cars now and pull all the lights off.
f- this !

whats not gonna happen? They wont bust dealers/mfgs like they just did APC for altezzas? Or that local law inforcement wont give you fix it tickets for aftermarket lights?

Here's my theory:

OEM HIDs don't bother too many people...they're designed and aimed so they don't blind other drivers (at least that's what I can see when I see them approaching me). The average person sees all these aftermarket bulbs out there (mine included) and thinks they're all a bunch of HIDs that irritate the hell out of them. Cops probably have a hard time getting convictions for aftermarket blue or purple bulbs (unless they're really obnoxious) because judges realize that you can go out and buy a new car with HID headlights that are similar in appearance to aftermarket bulbs. It's sort of a judgement call, if you will. If they outlaw ALL aftermarket HIDs, then pretty much ALL aftermarket bulbs will be outlawed in time too. It takes the discretion out of the picture and pretty soon law enforcement will start cracking down because the judges will have some clearer guidlines and thus more convictions.

People need to be careful of what bulbs they choose (or aftermarket HIDs for that matter) and how they're aimed. It's no different than loud stereos, loud exhast, etc. As soon as enough people complain the lawmakers will outlaw the source. I can see both sides of the story. Even though I don't like it, I could see it coming!

Tony

The way I read the letter it seems like they're going to outlaw the sale of Euro-spec (aka e-code) headlamps also...? This is bad news for Ange and anyone wanting those Cefiro lights...

Your right, but the thing is almost ALL aftermarket bulbs are already outlawed. You can still legally buy them but legally your not supposed to use them for anything but show purposes only. Its not gonna stop us from using them. Same with the HIDs, the wont be doing the $5000 fine, thats stupid, but they can make them illegal to be used on the road for vehicles that are not equipped with them stock. As for as im concerned I dont know whats gonna happen to my setup, I even got the HID for my fogs and it should all be in this weekend but im gonna aim them all correctly so that should not be a problem.
Even if all this does go through, cops most probably wont pull you over for having HIDs but if you are caught speeding, then they will ticket you for those as well...

I think in time, they will stop car manufacturers from installing them as well. Unless they start making them better. There are some OEM xenon lights (BMW, Cadillac for instance) that are rather blinding at certain angles.

Especially with consumer reports now doing tests on headlamps. The recent one they did involved something like 11 cars with xenon and 30 or 40 with halogen. I believe most of the top ten performing headlamps were halogen, not xenon.

I have xenon, and while they are certainly brighter, I cannot honestly say they improve my ability to see at night.

have to disagree with this... my wife's car has halogen and mine has HID and when I drive her car I'm forever looking for the light switch because I think they're off. My HIDs are definitely brighter.

I actually think this will blow over in a year or two. What we're seeing now is exactly what halogen went through when it was new. It's different, different 'color', and bright and people tend to look at them for those three reasons. Once they become more common as OEM, people will forget about them and the aftermarket will come back.

Well, Xenon is brighter than Halogen and does produce more lumens/light. Those are facts. What the major difference are between the headlight assemblies is the way the actual projection of the light is accomplished. You can have a sh!tty pattern with xenon or halogen bulbs due to the projector/lens assembly.

i think its almost about that time...to focus my HIDS :)

sign, sign, and more of you sign:( We got this news last week.

what I got out of the consumer reports test is that xenon typically have a wider pattern, (which is why I like mine, better view of the sides of the road) and halogen have a longer pattern. I am sure the government is more interested in a longer pattern, seeing farther. And most halogen lights illuminate objects farther down the road than most xenon lights do, according to the report.

I bring this up because that is what nhtsa is going to focus on when they analyze this topic. You would be surprised how few parameters there are regarding headlamp regulations. I think we are at the point where you are going to start seeing alot more.

It won't affect any of the OEM HIDs, other than a higher theft rate, higher pricing, and an overall pain in the a$$ for having HID headlights.

Looks like the market for anniversary edition headlights just got better...

The reason halogens have a longer pattern is because they are not aimed at the ground in front of the car. OEM HIDs are aimed downward to avoid glare. If you point yours a "little" higher you will find that the pattern will not only be wider but longer too.

!!!!!THANK GOD!!!!!

About damn time, however I doubt it's going to help any. You can still order them ONLINE or mail-order from Canada or Europe. They'll NEVER be able to stop that.

Anyways, I can't stand ricer bulbs and crappy retrofit kits, THAT is what people are complaining about NOT OEM HID's and those will NEVER be outlawed.

Disagree...

HID's are brighter in ALL areas, however the human eye is prone to focus on the closer area of light from HID's giving the "appearance" that they don't cast light as far as halogen. However, I've truely tested this with before/after OEM and it's night/day driving difference. I'm VERY very night-blind and the HIDs make a DRAMATIC difference in my visability.

I actually have a hard time driving with halogen headlamps at night even with H4 housings. My second car uses the same H4 style headlamps and I keep checking the headlamps to see if they are even on.:mad:

I agree with this 100% If my local law starts hassling me I am going to be very :mad: I NEED these for night driving. I dont have fancy purple or anything else. I have the stock bulbs because they have the most lumens. I think if you go 5K there is a "tad" more lumens. But once you start going above 5200K, you actually LOOSE lumens.

I also have them aimed properly and in the FACTORY bucket. I hope Nissan can prove them other than that stupid "fillament" crap.

Jon
 

It will NEVER affect OEM systems, ONLY aftermarket retrofit guys that do not have DOT approved housing/burners.

They are cracking down on the guys that are selling the crappy kits that produce GLARE and blind oncoming traffic, because they don't care what harm their kits cause.

Anyways, NO COP will be hassling 2K+ owners with OEM headlamps/burners, since they are factory made/produced. Yes, the 2K-2K1 guys didn't come as original equipment, however the housings/burners did and the cars are IDENTICAL. No cop will be able to tell the difference and the odds of a cop knowing your 2K-2K1 didn't come with those headlamps is slim-to-none.

I for one, would LOVE to burn some prepaid legal time in court on validating why my 2K1 can leagally sport 2K2-2K3 HIDs.

It only affects retrofit lights NOW. Just wait a couple months or years. The US Senate sub-committee on highways (or whatever they call themselves) are RIGHT NOW investigating complaints on xenon headlamps that are installed by car manufacturers. Completely different than the NHTSA letter that started this thread. I listened to the report on the radio. They specifically referred to Toyota and Honda (probably meaning Lexus and Acura).

I am with you guys, I prefer xenon lights. That is why I bought and installed them in my 2000. I am just giving you views you are going to hear from others.

Regarding night-blindness, most people dont care that xenon helps you see better at night. It isnt their problem, it's yours. The overwhelming majority of people out there DO NOT like xenon. Whether it is OEM lights or aftermarket is of no regard. People who have been in my car at night dont like my headlights, from the inside of the car. They hate them from the outside.

And I hate to be the one to say it, but majority rules. Will we see the end of xenon? I doubt it. But some manufacturers are already toning them down. It will get worse. Trust me.

For anyone interested, I found the report I was referring to from consumer reports:

http://www.consumerreports.org/main/...=1059685309893

And note, they are referring to OEM lights, not aftermarket.

I agree that an SUV should not have HIDs simply because the high-mounted position puts them right in a passenger car's eyes.

Re: aftermarket HID co's getting cease and desist letters...
 

On a general note...

Obviously, there's a lot people against HID's altogether. But personally, I'm not at all worried about the future of HID's. For OEM at least. They certainly have room for improvement, and will inevitably. But they are simply too good of a product to be 86'ed. I could go over all the benefits, but most of us are already fully aware of them.

Also, keep in mind that many of the same people that are complaining, are gonna be shopping for new wheels soon. I personally don't think too many salesman are going to be hearing: "I'm sorry these lights do light up the road well, but they've gotta go!" Nah...

The problem will take care of itself.

Just my .02

Re: Jon
 

I sure as heck hope so. But this did 86 my idea of putting HID in my motorcycle :( I dont want to be a contributing factor.

Yes, maybe future HID lighting systems will be affected, but not ones already sold.

Agreed, however it'll be their problem when I can't see and hit them.;) Yet, I pass the DMV test with flying colors and they're usually the ones at fault making a stupid move.

Agree...but the US headlamp standards are YEARS behind E-code headlamps and they are more widely used in Europe still, so I doubt it will change much. I agree they can be improved still to be less offensive, but I think the REAL reason is that they're just jealous.:)

VERY very interesting reading.:thumbsup:

However,
Blue hue is more offensive.:rolleyes:
50+yrs. olds.:rolleyes:
SUV's.:rolleyes:

I believe the true problem is the noticeable color and the light/dark transition ESPECIALLY over bumps. I don't think glare is the MAIN issue on most HIDs, it's that they're more noticeable and therefore they are going to attract more attention whether good/bad.

SAE backs up the benefits of HID especially with European regulations and I'll take that over CR so called lighting tests anyday. Hopefully, this leads to the US NHTSA or whatever waking up and updating US vehicle lighting regulations. No matter what, I'll NEVER own another non-HID vehicle, so maybe I'll just keep Maxine forEVER!:D

I still think its because they are more noticable then normal halogens and like stated above therefore its gonna attract more attention. I FINALLY hooked up my 2k2 headlights today and havnt gotten a chance to drive in the dark yet but I can tell you this much, Im already waiting for my upgrades to get in. The color of the stock HID looks nice but the purple should look :drool1:

Make sure you get a side-by-side pic. :cool:

I shall try, if not Ill just do two diff pics. My photoshop program is all jacked up, man my comp is all jacked up im never gonna upgrade again :banghead: back on subjet... Im hoping the rest get in by tomorrow, I ordered it last sunday but the place is located at Rhode Island so its not exactly close. It took appx 4 day for the harness ect.. to get in from Daveb in Austin, and RI is about 2x the distance so im placing my bet on next tuesday.

One tip that will save you some