Aftermarket sway bars/tower braces for SE?
12-01-2004, 11:57 AM
#1
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Posts: 15
Aftermarket sway bars/tower braces for SE?
Took a look at Cattman and Stillen for sway bars and tower braces. I would imagine they make a notable improvement for a NON-SE Maxima.
Would I notice an improvement on my '03 SE Max? I don't drive hard all the time, but the once in a while when I do, it would be nice to not have the car flopping around like a dead fish.
What do these things do to overall cruise ride quality? Would this turn a nice plush highway ride into a something that feels like a wooden rollercoaster?
Thanks for tips.
Would I notice an improvement on my '03 SE Max? I don't drive hard all the time, but the once in a while when I do, it would be nice to not have the car flopping around like a dead fish.
What do these things do to overall cruise ride quality? Would this turn a nice plush highway ride into a something that feels like a wooden rollercoaster?
Thanks for tips.
12-01-2004, 12:07 PM
#2
Here is what Irish44J wrote in another post... I thought he summed it up well in terms of the handling aspect....
As for cruising ride quality, RSBs, FSTBs, and LTBs do not affect the car that much, or at all.... only aftermarket struts/springs would....
Originally Posted by irish44j
You see, the STOCK maxima setup gives the car some slight understeer. Slight understeer is the "safest" setup for a car, especially in emergency maneuvering because it keeps the tail in. When you add the RSB, it switches the suspension balance and makes the car oversteer. This is a less-stable condition. The FSTB will have little effect on correcting this issue, except in high speed cornering perhaps. The LTB acts as a "counterbalance" you could say....With the Stage II LTB, RSB, and FSTB the car once again has the *slight* understeer that is the ideal setup (very close to balanced).
12-01-2004, 12:12 PM
#3
Originally Posted by Preston Drake
I would imagine they make a notable improvement for a NON-SE Maxima.
FYI... check out Housecor's site for more on suspension...
http://www.innerbean.com/housecor/sp..._decision.html
12-01-2004, 12:14 PM
#4
My .02 - save your money from FSTB's and RSB's. Get Warpspeed SFC connectors they make a HUGE differnence. I currently only have Stage 1 and I love it. Hands down best suspension mod if you are not going to lower your car.
12-01-2004, 12:26 PM
#5
Originally Posted by juice
My .02 - save your money from FSTB's and RSB's. Get Warpspeed SFC connectors they make a HUGE differnence. I currently only have Stage 1 and I love it. Hands down best suspension mod if you are not going to lower your car.
Btw, this is OT but what sorta "custom" muffler do ya have? Looks like a Stillen.. I really like the looks of it... and yeah, your car just looks good overall...
12-01-2004, 12:32 PM
#6
Yes they are welded on...cost me $80 to have them installed. I dont remember how much they were but I know it would be cheaper than Stillen FSTB RSB combo. the muffler was a DynoMax Superturbo...but I removed it and reinstalled the stock muffler.
12-01-2004, 12:42 PM
#7
Originally Posted by juice
Yes they are welded on...cost me $80 to have them installed. I dont remember how much they were but I know it would be cheaper than Stillen FSTB RSB combo. the muffler was a DynoMax Superturbo...but I removed it and reinstalled the stock muffler.
Just to point out... ya don't always have to get Stillen stuff.... you can get a Progress RSB for around $160 and an eBay FSTB for $25, install em yourself for free (except with the cost of time and effort)... although "bigger" mods like SFCs and LTBs do seem like they'd much greater improvements to overall handling... but I'm not gonna be auto-xing anytime soon, nor do I drive hard on the curvies... at least for now...
12-01-2004, 01:04 PM
#10
Originally Posted by maximillus
wats an ltb? sorry i'm a newb
http://www.mattblehm.com/suspension.html
Quote from the website:
"This is a bar that ties together the bolts on the front lower control arm gussets, providing sharper steering response and less chassis flex in corners. Handling improvements are very similar to installing a strut tower brace, which you can also add on the top of the suspension to tie the front end together really well!
The only drawback is that you lose a bit of ground clearance- but since it sits between the front wheels, the only time you might have a problem is when driving over extremely uneven surfaces. I have had the Stage II bar on my car for six months now and have only scraped it three times- all of which could have been prevented had I been paying more attention while going over extremely rough roads. "
Also, if ya want personal opinions, talk to Irish44J or VMaximus02 (I think)... they have em...
12-01-2004, 01:54 PM
#11
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Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,042
Originally Posted by Preston Drake
Took a look at Cattman and Stillen for sway bars and tower braces. I would imagine they make a notable improvement for a NON-SE Maxima.
Would I notice an improvement on my '03 SE Max? I don't drive hard all the time, but the once in a while when I do, it would be nice to not have the car flopping around like a dead fish.
What do these things do to overall cruise ride quality? Would this turn a nice plush highway ride into a something that feels like a wooden rollercoaster?
Thanks for tips.
Would I notice an improvement on my '03 SE Max? I don't drive hard all the time, but the once in a while when I do, it would be nice to not have the car flopping around like a dead fish.
What do these things do to overall cruise ride quality? Would this turn a nice plush highway ride into a something that feels like a wooden rollercoaster?
Thanks for tips.
The car corners flatter, really noticeable even on the SE (which wallowed a bit too much for my taste...)
The front end is much more stable with the FSTB - when you hit expansion seams, bumps etc., the steering wheel doesn't jump as much. Also more stable in high speed turns (actually drove around with it on and off, to test).
The car now has a rougher ride, because both back wheels react to bumps. So while it's not uncomfortable, on bumpy roads you're definitely being moved in the seat.
In the one emergency maneuvering situation since installation (90 degree turn, coming in fast to test the RSB, and a car pulled out), the car did a perfect four wheel drift - rear end did not come out, but car didn't understeer either. Your mileage may vary, but that's what mine does.
12-01-2004, 02:09 PM
#12
Not that people do this everyday but if you floor it from a stop or slight roll, especially in the 5.5 gen there is MAD Torque Steer. The FSTB helped reduce this 90-95%. I suppose it has helped some on cornering as well. The biggest difference in cornering has been adding aftermarket springs and struts, mainly springs. For the price, I paid $52 for Otto FSTB, it is well worth it. I think it looks as good as the Stillen one. And there is no need to pay an extra $100 for a bar that will do the same thing.
12-01-2004, 02:11 PM
#13
Originally Posted by Epacy
Not that people do this everyday but if you floor it from a stop or slight roll, especially in the 5.5 gen there is MAD Torque Steer. The FSTB helped reduce this 90-95%. I suppose it has helped some on cornering as well.
Originally Posted by Epacy
The biggest difference in cornering has been adding aftermarket springs and struts, mainly springs. For the price, I paid $52 for Otto FSTB, it is well worth it. I think it looks as good as the Stillen one. And there is no need to pay an extra $100 for a bar that will do the same thing.
on the struts/springs and the cheap FSTB.... But I paid $23 for my eBay FSTB, so I win the cheap battle?
12-01-2004, 02:14 PM
#14
Originally Posted by Puppetmaster
Interesting point... I need to check that out sometime... never realized that after I put it on.... thanks for the info...
on the struts/springs and the cheap FSTB....
But I paid $23 for my eBay FSTB, so I win the cheap battle?
on the struts/springs and the cheap FSTB.... But I paid $23 for my eBay FSTB, so I win the cheap battle?
LOL, tis true. There are many low cost bars out there, all virtually doing the same thing. Seems like there are suspension posts going on here. I guess "suspension" is the topic of the day.
12-01-2004, 04:05 PM
#15
Originally Posted by juice
My .02 - save your money from FSTB's and RSB's. Get Warpspeed SFC connectors they make a HUGE differnence. I currently only have Stage 1 and I love it. Hands down best suspension mod if you are not going to lower your car.
I definitely agree with this. My car has no suspension mods other than being lowered. I drove juices car when he had the FSTB and RSB I noticed it handled better than mine but I wasn't all that impressed, especially after reading about all the threads about what a difference they make.
It was a different story when I drove juice's car with the SFC's. I took his car for a test drive after he had a new mod (either headers or TS ECU, I can't remember) and he didn't tell me about the SFC's. I remember his car feeling quicker but was floored by how great it felt and handled. Even at regular driving speeds the car felt so solid and stable. I'm a bit **** about adding weight to my car, but if did any handling mods to my car, this would be the only one.
12-01-2004, 08:12 PM
#16
Originally Posted by Puppetmaster
Here is what Irish44J wrote in another post... I thought he summed it up well in terms of the handling aspect....
Originally Posted by irish44j
You see, the STOCK maxima setup gives the car some slight understeer. Slight understeer is the "safest" setup for a car, especially in emergency maneuvering because it keeps the tail in. When you add the RSB, it switches the suspension balance and makes the car oversteer. This is a less-stable condition. The FSTB will have little effect on correcting this issue, except in high speed cornering perhaps. The LTB acts as a "counterbalance" you could say....With the Stage II LTB, RSB, and FSTB the car once again has the *slight* understeer that is the ideal setup (very close to balanced).
As for cruising ride quality, RSBs, FSTBs, and LTBs do not affect the car that much, or at all.... only aftermarket struts/springs would....
Originally Posted by irish44j
You see, the STOCK maxima setup gives the car some slight understeer. Slight understeer is the "safest" setup for a car, especially in emergency maneuvering because it keeps the tail in. When you add the RSB, it switches the suspension balance and makes the car oversteer. This is a less-stable condition. The FSTB will have little effect on correcting this issue, except in high speed cornering perhaps. The LTB acts as a "counterbalance" you could say....With the Stage II LTB, RSB, and FSTB the car once again has the *slight* understeer that is the ideal setup (very close to balanced).
As for cruising ride quality, RSBs, FSTBs, and LTBs do not affect the car that much, or at all.... only aftermarket struts/springs would....
by the way, a few additional comments:
- I plan to put the stage I subframe connectors (SFCs) on next summer
- I have an SE....it makes a difference, trust me
- I also am lowered a little bit with maxspeeds and illuminas, which also make a difference.
With my current setup (see my sig) ride is similar to stock SE ride, but much quicker rebound over big dips, which is nice. Car is MUCH more controllable than stock and evasive/emergency maneuvers are done with high confidence.
12-01-2004, 09:41 PM
#17
Originally Posted by 03BlkSETE
It was a different story when I drove juice's car with the SFC's. I took his car for a test drive after he gotten a mod done (either headers or TS ECU, I can't remember) and he didn't tell me about the SFC's. I remember his car feeling quicker but was floored by how great it felt and handled. Even at regular driving speeds the car felt so solid and stable. I'm a bit **** about adding weight to my car, but if did any handling mods to my car, this would be the only one.
12-01-2004, 09:43 PM
#18
Originally Posted by irish44j
With my current setup (see my sig) ride is similar to stock SE ride, but much quicker rebound over big dips, which is nice. Car is MUCH more controllable than stock and evasive/emergency maneuvers are done with high confidence.
12-02-2004, 08:31 AM
#21
Originally Posted by maximillus
it seems like people rather have juss the ftsb or is it juss me? and if it is better to have the rear sway bar, is there a difference between addco or progress or any other brand?
As for differences between brands, I think there isn't, but I don't know from experience cuz I've only tried the Stillen set-up and can't speak for Progress or Addco....
12-02-2004, 10:38 AM
#23
Originally Posted by Maximax2
I have an 03 SE, and have the Cattmann RSB and a random (Bomz?) FSTB. Here's what I've noticed:
The car corners flatter, really noticeable even on the SE (which wallowed a bit too much for my taste...)
The front end is much more stable with the FSTB - when you hit expansion seams, bumps etc., the steering wheel doesn't jump as much. Also more stable in high speed turns (actually drove around with it on and off, to test).
The car now has a rougher ride, because both back wheels react to bumps. So while it's not uncomfortable, on bumpy roads you're definitely being moved in the seat.
In the one emergency maneuvering situation since installation (90 degree turn, coming in fast to test the RSB, and a car pulled out), the car did a perfect four wheel drift - rear end did not come out, but car didn't understeer either. Your mileage may vary, but that's what mine does.
The car corners flatter, really noticeable even on the SE (which wallowed a bit too much for my taste...)
The front end is much more stable with the FSTB - when you hit expansion seams, bumps etc., the steering wheel doesn't jump as much. Also more stable in high speed turns (actually drove around with it on and off, to test).
The car now has a rougher ride, because both back wheels react to bumps. So while it's not uncomfortable, on bumpy roads you're definitely being moved in the seat.
In the one emergency maneuvering situation since installation (90 degree turn, coming in fast to test the RSB, and a car pulled out), the car did a perfect four wheel drift - rear end did not come out, but car didn't understeer either. Your mileage may vary, but that's what mine does.
12-02-2004, 10:46 AM
#24
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Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,042
Originally Posted by juice
RSB and FSTB will have no affect on how bouncy the ride is.
12-02-2004, 10:58 AM
#25
Originally Posted by Maximax2
Sorry - wrong. The ride quality is affected by the RSB, because instead of the rear wheels reacting independently to bumps, they both act together and the car is jolted more. Could be magnified for me because my RSB is adjusted all the way stiff.
12-02-2004, 11:13 AM
#26
That is not bounciness....it is actually more of a pulling or sliding of the rear. That is the affect of hitting an uneven surface while making a turn. That efect is there with or without an RSB since we have a rear beam axle...it may however be slightly enhanced with an RSB...it will not make the car more bouncy at all.
12-02-2004, 12:05 PM
#27
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Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,042
Originally Posted by juice
That is not bounciness....it is actually more of a pulling or sliding of the rear. That is the affect of hitting an uneven surface while making a turn. That efect is there with or without an RSB since we have a rear beam axle...it may however be slightly enhanced with an RSB...it will not make the car more bouncy at all.
You're right that in corners, this translates to the rear wheel losing traction on bumpy roads, although that's not particularly a problem.
12-02-2004, 12:09 PM
#28
Thanks for clarifying guys... guess we were talking about 2 different scenarios... straights and turns.... also I apologize for using "bounciness"... that was inaccurate in describing what I meant... jolts or reacts was a better term....
So with a RSB, the car does react more to bumps on straights and curves... only the rear doesn't try to "jump out" while going straight on bumpy roads like it does on curves.... makes sense... and I hope I finally got that right...
So with a RSB, the car does react more to bumps on straights and curves... only the rear doesn't try to "jump out" while going straight on bumpy roads like it does on curves.... makes sense... and I hope I finally got that right...
12-02-2004, 01:40 PM
#31
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 426
I've got the Stillen RSB, and I noticed the car's suspension felt stiffer in the back once it was installed. Not bouncy, but a more stiff/firm reaction to bumps and irregularities in the road surface. Don't get me wrong, it is not harsh or jarring, but just a lot more solid feeling which is very desirable IMHO. The RSB makes the car much more responsive in the corners which is really noticable. The RSB and FSTB are the first things to consider when starting suspension mods for our Maxima's.
12-02-2004, 07:35 PM
#32
There's alot of discussion about "bounces" "jolts" etc.....
bottom line - you cannot tweak out your suspension just by adding 1 or 2 pieces. suspension parts are complimentary to each other, and the correct combination will give you:
1. better straight-road ride quality than stock.
2. better cornering ability
3. less body roll
4. better grip even on bumpy corners...
5. less "bounce" in big dips on highways
Frankly, I think the suspension setup I have is a good balance of handling and ride (not super-stiff springs). I have yet to be in a situation that I felt was "uncomfortable" doing quick maneuvers - I had many of these situations when just stock or with RSB only. I have no intention of changing anything, except adding the SFC's for even more solid body feel.
my 2 cents.....suspension is a personal preference - we aren't all looking for the same thing - you cali guys with nice roads can drop 2" with stiff springs and still not kill the ***. Those of us with marginal road surfaces have to compromise between ride and handling....
keep in mind tires/wheels have alot to do with it too...18's, 19's...you're gonna get a much firmer ride....
bottom line - you cannot tweak out your suspension just by adding 1 or 2 pieces. suspension parts are complimentary to each other, and the correct combination will give you:
1. better straight-road ride quality than stock.
2. better cornering ability
3. less body roll
4. better grip even on bumpy corners...
5. less "bounce" in big dips on highways
Frankly, I think the suspension setup I have is a good balance of handling and ride (not super-stiff springs). I have yet to be in a situation that I felt was "uncomfortable" doing quick maneuvers - I had many of these situations when just stock or with RSB only. I have no intention of changing anything, except adding the SFC's for even more solid body feel.
my 2 cents.....suspension is a personal preference - we aren't all looking for the same thing - you cali guys with nice roads can drop 2" with stiff springs and still not kill the ***. Those of us with marginal road surfaces have to compromise between ride and handling....
keep in mind tires/wheels have alot to do with it too...18's, 19's...you're gonna get a much firmer ride....
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