ES bushing for Axle beam ?
Sorry for posting a second similar threads but since no one is answering on my N/A thread I thought of posting here.
I want to know if anyone has replaced the bushing on the swing arm attached to the rear axle beam (on a 2k1 ) I see the bushing are shot, so I have 2 questions: 1- Does anyone has attempted to replace the oem busing with ES, if so what is the ES bushing part number ? ( I'm not referring to the trailing arm ) 2- If no ES bushing are available can we replace with stock bushing or do I have to replace the entire swing arm or whatever that part is called. Thanks a lot for any useful information. Cheers AA |
Just to be clear, you are not talking about the trailing arms, but the Scott Russel link, correct? Part 55130P here.
I know the bushing from a sentra will fit in the trailing arms, but to my knowledge, no after market bushings exist for the Scoot Russel linkage. |
Originally Posted by ajm8127
(Post 7748569)
Just to be clear, you are not talking about the trailing arms, but the Scott Russel link, correct? Part 55130P here.
I know the bushing from a sentra will fit in the trailing arms, but to my knowledge, no after market bushings exist for the Scoot Russel linkage. Cheers AA |
I have just ordered a new SR link from Courtesy, so this way if I screw something I wont be screwed.
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I actually though about replacing mine as well. It seems to be the only way to fully rejuvenate the rear. You need that one to flex from side to side and be rigid up and down. ES definitely does not make a bushing to replace it. I've read through your build thread and it's quite impressive. It's good to see some guys going all out, which you have undoubtedly done. Great work.
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Wait for it guys. :)
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Originally Posted by ajm8127
(Post 7748569)
Just to be clear, you are not talking about the trailing arms, but the Scott Russel link, correct? Part 55130P here.
I know the bushing from a sentra will fit in the trailing arms, but to my knowledge, no after market bushings exist for the Scoot Russel linkage. I am wondering would this work with our car. It is for the B14/15 Sentra. http://www.b15sentra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=175733 http://tw.myblog.yahoo.com/b14-ser/a...1413&l=f&fid=7 http://www.b15u.com/sentra-specific-...step-step.html |
It seems to me that those parts still use squishy rubber bushings, which still aren't made to rotate smoothly. Just as bad as stock, they are simply adjustable which is not really a great thing.
What should be adjusted is the mounting point on the large arm where it attaches to the chassis. |
http://www.nittotire.com/blog_detail.asp?id=15
Scrap the Scott-Russel all together and go Panhard Rod. I know, it's kinda extreme but definitely worth doing if you're into AutoXing/Road Racing. |
Originally Posted by Omegasrk
(Post 7757998)
Hi Guys,
I am wondering would this work with our car. It is for the B14/15 Sentra. http://www.b15sentra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=175733 http://tw.myblog.yahoo.com/b14-ser/a...1413&l=f&fid=7 http://www.b15u.com/sentra-specific-...step-step.html This would help the people that lower the car alot and can't get the rear beam "re-centered" no matter how much they adjust the stock parts.
Originally Posted by speedymax99
(Post 7758110)
It seems to me that those parts still use squishy rubber bushings, which still aren't made to rotate smoothly. Just as bad as stock, they are simply adjustable which is not really a great thing.
What should be adjusted is the mounting point on the large arm where it attaches to the chassis. I've been hesitant to mess with the rear beam. It has only been bent to correct the awful factory toe in and has a set of Superpro bushings on the trailing arms. Kinda tempted to rip the whole thing out and convert to IRS. :laugh: |
Originally Posted by 98SEBlackMax
(Post 7759279)
They would fit on the A32s no problem. I had thought about making this part adjustable to allow for some adjustability of the rear beam without having the bend the sh!t out of the beam. I might try it just to see what it does to the rear suspension on the alignment rack. Kinda cool having a friendly race shop that likes to mess around with the suspension on my car.
This would help the people that lower the car alot and can't get the rear beam "re-centered" no matter how much they adjust the stock parts. Delrin bushings aren't always the best solution either. With the A32/A33 rear beam those rubber bushings have to stiff in one direction and soft in the other. There have been situations (Not Maximas) where stiffer bushings, delrin, or sphericals have made the cars handle worse. I've been hesitant to mess with the rear beam. It has only been bent to correct the awful factory toe in and has a set of Superpro bushings on the trailing arms. Kinda tempted to rip the whole thing out and convert to IRS. :laugh: |
Originally Posted by 98SEBlackMax
(Post 7759279)
Kinda tempted to rip the whole thing out and convert to IRS. :laugh:
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I have ordered another Russel Link and received it, I want to remove the one on the car and see what I can do with it, to be honest at this point I dont know what I will do. I like what they did with the Sentra, but can we buy those parts ? Where ? Any link that can save me search time. I dont mind to be the guinea pig and test it on my max.
As 98SEBlackMax said I would also like to scrap the rear trailing arm and convert to independent suspension but at this point I wouldn't drive the car for another year or so. I have been working on the car for 4 years now without driving it, so for now I want to start the car this month and drive it before the winter, at least make a test drive. Essentially the car will be ready for spring 2011. |
Got my upgraded parts installed in the rear beam! :woot: Feels a bit smoother now, and got rid of the rear end twitch when hitting a bump or road joint while cornering.
When they showed me the stock parts, it's no wonder they suck! The oem bushings DO NOT want to turn. But they are squishy and move side to side. The new pieces have 0 noticeable freeplay, but I can swing the link up and down with 1 finger. :) With oem bushings, I could not swing the link even pushing or pulling with both hands. Carnal_C30 should have them available asap. Maybe he'll chime in here. |
Originally Posted by jac121479
(Post 7758151)
http://www.nittotire.com/blog_detail.asp?id=15
Scrap the Scott-Russel all together and go Panhard Rod. I know, it's kinda extreme but definitely worth doing if you're into AutoXing/Road Racing. |
Originally Posted by Shift_Max
(Post 7810328)
This is very interesting. I wonder if any of these parts can be found somewhere to be bought.
If you want a great fix for this at a low cost, see my post above. |
track car != street car. completely different use and completely different type of handling than you want for a street car.
And don't listen to the off road or drag racing guys for racing stuff. they have a completely different setup and installation requirements. A panhard rod doesn't jack the car around in a corner if you set it up right. put the thing together so it's parallel with the rear axle when the car is at static height, and make it as long as possible. Assume a 48" panhard bar and the jacking will be almost nil and lateral movement will be less than 0.1" through 4" of suspension travel- which is way more travel than you have on a track car. 0.1" of smooth lateral movement is taken up in the sidewall of the rear tires alone and will completely disappear. |
Thanks guys for all the reply. For now I'm going to stick with a new scott russel link and call it a day. Every time I work on the car I always find something that can be improve and this keep stretching the date the car will be back on the road. Starting now I'm just going to concentrate and finish it asap and step a side for a little while. I mean it's been almost 4 years now, the car has to be and will be finish by spring 2011.
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Originally Posted by doublea
(Post 7811393)
Thanks guys for all the reply. For now I'm going to stick with a new scott russel link and call it a day. Every time I work on the car I always find something that can be improve and this keep stretching the date the car will be back on the road. Starting now I'm just going to concentrate and finish it asap and step a side for a little while. I mean it's been almost 4 years now, the car has to be and will be finish by spring 2011.
The ones they made for the 4th gen are amazing quality, and noticeably improved the performance of the rear. They are delrin bushings with a strong aluminum sleeve that turns smoothly. No more "jiggle" when hitting a bump in a corner. Feels more stable. Found a pic they took when installing on my car: http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m...01103-1831.jpg |
Originally Posted by speedymax99
(Post 7853870)
Just send me the old link and I'll see if the shop can make delrin bushings for those too. If you leave rubber bushings in there, it will still bind.
The ones they made for the 4th gen are amazing quality, and noticeably improved the performance of the rear. They are delrin bushings with a strong aluminum sleeve that turns smoothly. No more "jiggle" when hitting a bump in a corner. Feels more stable. Found a pic they took when installing on my car: http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m...01103-1831.jpg Thanks a bunch AA |
Anybody else interested in the delrin/alu rear link bushings? I can see if the shop will make maybe 10 sets.
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Originally Posted by speedymax99
(Post 7944383)
Anybody else interested in the delrin/alu rear link bushings? I can see if the shop will make maybe 10 sets.
Cheers AA |
I would be interested in one unit.
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don't you want big soft rubber bushings in a Scott Russell. i thought the reason for the squishy stuff was to keep the beam from binding causing an infinite spring rate???
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Originally Posted by jac121479
(Post 7944443)
don't you want big soft rubber bushings in a Scott Russell. i thought the reason for the squishy stuff was to keep the beam from binding causing an infinite spring rate???
You don't want a big squishy bushing that allows the parts to move side-to-side unwantedly and that doesn't rotate smoothly, but rather twists, adding an unknown spring rate into the equation. |
i didn't really get what you meant by moving the link with your finger.?.?.? this is what i'm actually wondering. with the new link in the scott russel fully attached to the axle (without your rear shocks and springs installed) can you swing the rear axle throughout it's full range of motion. i would assume no as i'd expect bind, more bind then the stock bushings since they essentially bind on themselves, just with less resistance since they are softer which would result in a longer range of motion. obviously we would never use our complete range of motion. it just seems like this mod would limit our already limited range of motion. i've been examining these pics below and it seems like the more rubber that's replaced with poly or anything else hard then you'd have little to no travel. just my opinion though. :gotme:
http://www.se-r.net/about/g20/scc/oc...er14_small.jpg http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...ll_Linkage.jpg |
here's a quote from Mr Kojima, whom i trust when it come's to suspension.
To keep the stock rear suspension from flexing sideways under load, Nissan uses a device called a Scott-Russell linkage. The linkage does reduce flex but the big soft rubber bushings needed to keep it from binding up hinders it. The linkage causes binding and uneven wheel rates from side to side. |
Originally Posted by jac121479
(Post 7944811)
here's a quote from Mr Kojima, whom i trust when it come's to suspension.
http://www.nittotire.com/blog_detail.asp?id=15 |
Hey guys i am the one who is selling the QT adjustable link so if you have any question feel free to ask :d The link will bolt on all the a32 and a33 for sure.
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Originally Posted by speedymax99
(Post 7944929)
There are 4 bushings back there. Only 1 is made to flex sideways, and that's left alone. 2 are in the link, and these make that link operate much smoother. The remaining bushing is almost too small to replace with delrin/alu and would require a spherical bearing because it moves in more than 1 axis.
http://www.se-r.net/about/g20/scc/oc...er14_small.jpg Point b is where the bushing goes that allows side-to-side flex. Although this diagram is a simplified version of the linkage on the 4th gen. Notice how it is lacking the extra link at c. I suspect that the addition of this smaller link, the one that is getting the delrin bushings, better approximates vertical motion of the rear beam without inducing as much side to side motion of the beam, or flex in the bushing at b. Less flex = less bind. Point b is on the very right side of this picture: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...ll_Linkage.jpg Speedymax, are these delrin/aluminum bushings for sale, or are you just trying to generate some interest? |
Originally Posted by ajm8127
(Post 7955399)
http://www.se-r.net/about/g20/scc/oc...er14_small.jpg
Point b is where the bushing goes that allows side-to-side flex. Although this diagram is a simplified version of the linkage on the 4th gen. Notice how it is lacking the extra link at c. I suspect that the addition of this smaller link, the one that is getting the delrin bushings, better approximates vertical motion of the rear beam without inducing as much side to side motion of the beam, or flex in the bushing at b. Less flex = less bind. Point b is on the very right side of this picture: [IMG]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/20/Scott_Russell_Linkage.jpg/800px-Scott_Russell_Linkage.jpg[IMG] Speedymax, are these delrin/aluminum bushings for sale, or are you just trying to generate some interest? The rear beam link bushings are already available for 4g and soon for 5g, and several people have picked them up. TheWizard even stopped by the manufacturers shop and will be getting a couple sets. I can get them any time, just let me know. Forgot to mention. The FSM states (and good shops will know this) that all the link bolts need to be tightened "at ride hieght." Most people lower their cars and never do this, causing all 4 of those bushings to be "pre-twisted." They need to be loose, raise the beam so the wheels are at the same fender gap as when on the ground, then tighten everything. This helps center the beam too. Also, not to criticize the adjustable link guy, but although it's the easiest way, it's not the best way to adjust side-to-side position of the beam. Pushing or pulling it from the little link will cause bushing "B" in diagram above to be stretched a little one way or the other, instead of staying centered. The optimum way would be to adjust the whole assembly from bushing "D", as the shop has done on their track car, but it's not easy or cheap. |
Originally Posted by speedymax99
(Post 7944383)
Anybody else interested in the delrin/alu rear link bushings? I can see if the shop will make maybe 10 sets.
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Originally Posted by aackshun
(Post 7956135)
Ballpark a price? Could do this along with some more suspension mods soon....
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A few guys have ordered the delrin/aluminum link bushings, and should be putting up reviews soon. Couple sets were installed in the QT link also, apparently those bushing sizes are slightly different. They just sent in the link and bushings were custom made.
They are available for sale, just waiting for the manufacturer to get some pics so I can put up a thread. |
Originally Posted by speedymax99
(Post 7974969)
A few guys have ordered the delrin/aluminum link bushings, and should be putting up reviews soon. Couple sets were installed in the QT link also, apparently those bushing sizes are slightly different. They just sent in the link and bushings were custom made.
They are available for sale, just waiting for the manufacturer to get some pics so I can put up a thread. |
FS thread is up guys. http://forums.maxima.org/4th-generat...-bushings.html They will get me some better pictures later, but for all those that have PM'd me, they're ready to ship.
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I will do the Panhard Rod next fall, for now if I just can get the bushing. I just want to finish my car and drive it this summer, it's been in the garage for 4 year 1/2 now.
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rear bushings
Originally Posted by doublea
(Post 8042406)
I will do the Panhard Rod next fall, for now if I just can get the bushing. I just want to finish my car and drive it this summer, it's been in the garage for 4 year 1/2 now.
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Originally Posted by gbm25
(Post 9133105)
the rear bushing you have been talking about are available for the a32 and a33 from febest a german company link is shop.febest.eu.they ship world wide.stock loads of parts for a33 and a32. mine are shoot so ive ordered a new set cost 42 euros.
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Which one you think it is:https://shop.febest.eu/catalog.html?...&p=5&year=2001
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