3rd gen VQ35DE Full ECU Swap Progress Thread
06-30-2010, 05:48 PM
#1201
The new Edge Racing Torque Converter is now installed and the Maxima is alive once again! I just took it for a little test drive to make sure everything shifts properly. I will install my new full sweep electric trans temp gauge tomorrow and test it out further. I can't wait to see what my new stall is! But it definitely seems higher than my previous TC simply due to the fact I have to push the gas pedal more just to get the car to start rolling.
With the old 3K stall, on level ground, the car will roll forward by itself in gear when the brake is released. But now, the car doesn't want to move at idle. Which is perfect!
Edit: I should say that the car doesn't want to move forward as easy as before. But the car still moves by itself in a forward gear at idle.
With the old 3K stall, on level ground, the car will roll forward by itself in gear when the brake is released. But now, the car doesn't want to move at idle. Which is perfect!
Edit: I should say that the car doesn't want to move forward as easy as before. But the car still moves by itself in a forward gear at idle.
Last edited by Aaron92SE; 07-02-2010 at 12:25 PM.
06-30-2010, 07:18 PM
#1202
That's great to hear Aaron! I know a few guys wish their stall was a little higher as well, and I'm glad to see this work out for you. I wanna see how she runs at the track with this new found addition. How much time do you expect this to shave? Nice work once again!
07-01-2010, 07:55 AM
#1204
I may be able to hit the track tonight and make a few passes once I test things out further on the street today. Then, I will almost be ready for the July 10th event in Fayetteville. There are going to be some pretty fast NA imports there that I will have to contend with.
I hope so!
07-01-2010, 08:26 AM
#1205
I am really hoping my 60 foot will go from high 1.8s to low 1.7s with the proper slick and track conditions. That will shave about 3 tenths in the 1/4 mile.
I may be able to hit the track tonight and make a few passes once I test things out further on the street today. Then, I will almost be ready for the July 10th event in Fayetteville. There are going to be some pretty fast NA imports there that I will have to contend with.
I may be able to hit the track tonight and make a few passes once I test things out further on the street today. Then, I will almost be ready for the July 10th event in Fayetteville. There are going to be some pretty fast NA imports there that I will have to contend with.
07-01-2010, 08:29 AM
#1206
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2791098
07-01-2010, 10:23 AM
#1207
Come out to Fayetteville to the SICC event next weekend.
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2791098
http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2791098
07-01-2010, 11:07 AM
#1209
I just had some more time to test out the new converter. Right now, I'm only seeing a 3500 flash stall. That's no where near what I was hoping for. I need at least a 4000 stall out of this converter right now. 
Overtime, it will loosen up a tad, but usually no more than 100rpm. So, I will probably have to pull the converter and install a new one all over again.
I still plan on making a few passes down the track tonight though.
Overtime, it will loosen up a tad, but usually no more than 100rpm. So, I will probably have to pull the converter and install a new one all over again.I still plan on making a few passes down the track tonight though.
07-01-2010, 11:25 AM
#1210
I just had some more time to test out the new converter. Right now, I'm only seeing a 3500 flash stall. That's no where near what I was hoping for. I need at least a 4000 stall out of this converter right now. Overtime, it will loosen up a tad, but usually no more than 100rpm. So, I will probably have to pull the converter and install a new one all over again.
I still plan on making a few passes down the track tonight though.
Overtime, it will loosen up a tad, but usually no more than 100rpm. So, I will probably have to pull the converter and install a new one all over again.I still plan on making a few passes down the track tonight though.
07-01-2010, 11:52 AM
#1212
Yeah, but this torque converter has never been made before on this particular engine. With my low torque output below 4K rpm, it's tough to get this thing to stall to 4500 like I want without bending fins and loosing a lot of efficiency (less whp on top end). According to Andre's math and my dyno sheet though, he was pretty sure I would see something above 4K. He just didn't know how much above. And with this 3500 stall converter I have now, all I'll have to do is spray a little 35-50 shot of nitrous on the launch and I'll see close to 4K just due to the increased torque. But I am not building this car for nitrous. Only naturally aspirated. So a looser and inefficient torque converter that allows me to launch at 4100-4500 will give me a better ET than a very efficient 3500 stall. I'll just build up a lot more heat and may not be able to hotlap or drive in the city, which is fine by me.
I'm waiting for him to return my call to find out where we can go from here. I'm not worried. I know we'll come up with something that maximizes my potential 1/4 mile ET. It just sucks that I am going to have to drop this transmission again!
07-02-2010, 07:06 AM
#1215
I had a chance to make a few passes last night with the new torque converter. The stall is definitely higher than before, but it lags just as bad off the line. My 60 foots are identical even though I'm not hazing the slicks all that bad. They are very close to dead hooking. It's the lag on the launch that's killing me.
With the old 3K converter, it would launch around 3K and gradually make it's way to 4K where the engine comes alive. With the new 3500 stall TC, it launches at 3500 and just sits there at 3500 for what seems to be a VERY long time. Then the revs gradually raise to 4K and the engine comes alive. So overall, I think my lag is exactly the same.
In order to reduce this lag, I will be using my 20" slicks to shorten the gearing for the big import race next weekend. I made a few passes with my 22" slicks and the time that it sat at 3500 was much longer. At least, with the 20" slicks, it seems to sit at 3500 much less. And my 60 foots are definitely lower with the 20" slicks. I cut a bunch of 1.90s with the 20" slicks and could only do 1.92-1.95s with the 22". I ran a bunch of 12.4s and 12.5s @ 111 and 112mph with a DA of around 1200'. So my car is not any slower than it was before. It seems to be running the exact time that it should be running with the old TC.
The new TC is definitely noticeably looser than my old one. I have to push the gas pedal a lot more to get the car to move, especially in reverse. But I like it. That's just me.
My transmission temperatures with the 3K stall have always sat around 135-140 degrees when making passes down the 1/4 mile. With the 3500 stall, they sat at 145-150 all night. So, I don't think heat will be a problem for me, even if I do get a 4300 stall like I want.
And I removed my old Sunpro mechanical full sweep trans temp gauge and replaced it with an Autometer electrical full sweep trans temp gauge. I like the new gauge much better. To see the quick fluctuations in transmission temperatures is pretty nice. With the mechanical gauge, the needle was very slow to move to changes. With the electrical gauge, it reacts much faster and seems more precise.
With the old 3K converter, it would launch around 3K and gradually make it's way to 4K where the engine comes alive. With the new 3500 stall TC, it launches at 3500 and just sits there at 3500 for what seems to be a VERY long time. Then the revs gradually raise to 4K and the engine comes alive. So overall, I think my lag is exactly the same.
In order to reduce this lag, I will be using my 20" slicks to shorten the gearing for the big import race next weekend. I made a few passes with my 22" slicks and the time that it sat at 3500 was much longer. At least, with the 20" slicks, it seems to sit at 3500 much less. And my 60 foots are definitely lower with the 20" slicks. I cut a bunch of 1.90s with the 20" slicks and could only do 1.92-1.95s with the 22". I ran a bunch of 12.4s and 12.5s @ 111 and 112mph with a DA of around 1200'. So my car is not any slower than it was before. It seems to be running the exact time that it should be running with the old TC.
The new TC is definitely noticeably looser than my old one. I have to push the gas pedal a lot more to get the car to move, especially in reverse. But I like it.
That's just me.My transmission temperatures with the 3K stall have always sat around 135-140 degrees when making passes down the 1/4 mile. With the 3500 stall, they sat at 145-150 all night. So, I don't think heat will be a problem for me, even if I do get a 4300 stall like I want.
And I removed my old Sunpro mechanical full sweep trans temp gauge and replaced it with an Autometer electrical full sweep trans temp gauge. I like the new gauge much better. To see the quick fluctuations in transmission temperatures is pretty nice. With the mechanical gauge, the needle was very slow to move to changes. With the electrical gauge, it reacts much faster and seems more precise.
07-02-2010, 12:37 PM
#1218
I just spoke with Andre again. I am completely blown away at his level of customer service! And that's a hard thing to do since I already knew Edge Racing Converters provides the best service and converters for Nissans.
He is going back to the drawing board again with this converter. Since this has never been done before, nobody is going to have math on this particular converter build to PROPERLY get it to flash to 4000+rpm. Anybody can bend fins and produce more cavitation and slippage to achieve a desired stall, but it will be at the expense of reduced horsepower to the wheels on top end, which will decrease trap speeds. Not to mention uncontrollable transmission temperatures causing blown transmissions.
I am going to send back my old 3K stall converter and he'll start from scratch in hopes to custom make or invent a new impeller for this converter. The amount of hours he is spending on my custom torque converter alone will make him lose a lot of money. But just the fact that he's still willing to get me the converter that I need at any cost shows just how great Edge Racing is as a company.
In the meantime, I will continue to use my 20" slicks with the 3500 stall converter to help 1st gear wind up faster.
And that's a hard thing to do since I already knew Edge Racing Converters provides the best service and converters for Nissans.He is going back to the drawing board again with this converter. Since this has never been done before, nobody is going to have math on this particular converter build to PROPERLY get it to flash to 4000+rpm. Anybody can bend fins and produce more cavitation and slippage to achieve a desired stall, but it will be at the expense of reduced horsepower to the wheels on top end, which will decrease trap speeds. Not to mention uncontrollable transmission temperatures causing blown transmissions.
I am going to send back my old 3K stall converter and he'll start from scratch in hopes to custom make or invent a new impeller for this converter. The amount of hours he is spending on my custom torque converter alone will make him lose a lot of money. But just the fact that he's still willing to get me the converter that I need at any cost shows just how great Edge Racing is as a company.
In the meantime, I will continue to use my 20" slicks with the 3500 stall converter to help 1st gear wind up faster.
07-10-2010, 06:33 AM
#1219
I just spoke with Andre again. I am completely blown away at his level of customer service! And that's a hard thing to do since I already knew Edge Racing Converters provides the best service and converters for Nissans.
He is going back to the drawing board again with this converter. Since this has never been done before, nobody is going to have math on this particular converter build to PROPERLY get it to flash to 4000+rpm. Anybody can bend fins and produce more cavitation and slippage to achieve a desired stall, but it will be at the expense of reduced horsepower to the wheels on top end, which will decrease trap speeds. Not to mention uncontrollable transmission temperatures causing blown transmissions.
I am going to send back my old 3K stall converter and he'll start from scratch in hopes to custom make or invent a new impeller for this converter. The amount of hours he is spending on my custom torque converter alone will make him lose a lot of money. But just the fact that he's still willing to get me the converter that I need at any cost shows just how great Edge Racing is as a company.
In the meantime, I will continue to use my 20" slicks with the 3500 stall converter to help 1st gear wind up faster.
And that's a hard thing to do since I already knew Edge Racing Converters provides the best service and converters for Nissans.He is going back to the drawing board again with this converter. Since this has never been done before, nobody is going to have math on this particular converter build to PROPERLY get it to flash to 4000+rpm. Anybody can bend fins and produce more cavitation and slippage to achieve a desired stall, but it will be at the expense of reduced horsepower to the wheels on top end, which will decrease trap speeds. Not to mention uncontrollable transmission temperatures causing blown transmissions.
I am going to send back my old 3K stall converter and he'll start from scratch in hopes to custom make or invent a new impeller for this converter. The amount of hours he is spending on my custom torque converter alone will make him lose a lot of money. But just the fact that he's still willing to get me the converter that I need at any cost shows just how great Edge Racing is as a company.
In the meantime, I will continue to use my 20" slicks with the 3500 stall converter to help 1st gear wind up faster.
AA
07-10-2010, 07:57 AM
#1220
I hope to get a higher stall TC installed within the next few weeks. Heat is controllable right now with the 3500 stall, which is very high for the small amount of power I am making at 3500 rpm. If I sprayed a 50 shot out of the hole, it would flash to around 4000 rpm. And since my engine wakes up right at 4100 rpm, it's very tricky to design a converter that flashes right at that point or slightly higher than that. If you are too low, you get a 3500 stall. If you are above 4100, then the increased power makes it much higher than that.
So Andre is trying to find something that doesn't build up too much heat while still giving me a 4100+ stall.
07-10-2010, 05:34 PM
#1223
Not sure how many inches the convertor is but could you for example go from a 9 to a 10inch convertor to reduce heat since it will hold more fluid. In my truck I had the option to get a 9inch convertor or 10inch with the same stall speed. The differance is the 9inch is quicker but has higher temps in traffic than a 10inch. Also playing with th sizes will also help flash and such
07-10-2010, 06:18 PM
#1224
that sucks. I'm up in the air as to whether or not to get a TC for when I finish the my swap. Based on my reading, though, I actually need to get my swap in and running (and dyno'd) to see what my torque curve looks like.
07-12-2010, 09:49 AM
#1225
Not sure how many inches the convertor is but could you for example go from a 9 to a 10inch convertor to reduce heat since it will hold more fluid. In my truck I had the option to get a 9inch convertor or 10inch with the same stall speed. The differance is the 9inch is quicker but has higher temps in traffic than a 10inch. Also playing with th sizes will also help flash and such
But I did mention that same thing to Andre when chatting on the phone one day. He said if I had a GM, he'd be able to build anything I want. But options are limited with Nissan converters.
Regardless, you'll want at least a 2800 stall. That's for certain. So, no matter what your torque band looks like, the stock stall is simply too low. If you get a 2800-3000 stall, it will be hard to notice the difference during normal street driving and your temps will not change noticeably. But your 60 foot will drop quite a lot with slicks. A stock torque converter has no business being in a Maxima that wants to race, even if they don't visit the track often. It should be one of the first modifications that people do.
07-16-2010, 09:26 AM
#1226
I went to the drag strip last night to test out a new shift map on the Suprastick. I made a burnout map which automatically shifts into 2nd gear. It definitely helps a LOT to heat the tires up. I only have to do a 2 second burnout now and I get plenty of smoke. Before, I'd have to hold it in the top of 1st gear for 5 or more seconds and still couldn't heat them up. Traction has definitely improved too even on the 20" slicks.
I also found a little bug in the Suprastick system. I called Garrett and he was able to help me while I was at the track. Awesome customer service! The problem I was having is I can not switch between maps on the fly. After I finished my burnout, I switched to my normal automatic race map for gears 1-3. But, it kept me in my burnout map. The only way to get it to switch over was the log into the SSv4 Hyperterminal and press option 6 for shift maps. When you pull up the shift map screen, you can see it quickly switch from the old map to the one you have selected on your switch. So the system needs to refresh by logging into the shift map settings.
So I was able to make a couple successful 1/4 mile passes last night by going into the shift maps on the computer. But since I was logged into the Suprastick, I couldn't datalog with UTI3 on my last couple passes. I ran a 12.52 and 12.53 in 1800' DA, which is pretty decent considering I didn't bother with my normal track prep (ram air intake, rear skinnies, etc). Plus, my AFR was 11.5 in some big areas. The UTEC LOVES to screw with my AFR.
It's time for another fuel tune, which I have to do every month or so.
Has anybody ever noticed you can't switch between maps with the Suprastick? Even if you shut the device down and start it back up, it didn't switch to the correct map. It was still stuck in the map that was chosen the last time you logged in via hyperterminal. The only way I was able to get it to switch maps was to SEE it switch when I log into the SS and go to the shift maps (option 6).
I will be sending my SS back to get this bug fixed. Also, Garrett said that he'll be able to get my 16x2 LCD display to read what map I'm in, 1 or 2. That will help me a LOT.
I also found a little bug in the Suprastick system. I called Garrett and he was able to help me while I was at the track. Awesome customer service! The problem I was having is I can not switch between maps on the fly. After I finished my burnout, I switched to my normal automatic race map for gears 1-3. But, it kept me in my burnout map. The only way to get it to switch over was the log into the SSv4 Hyperterminal and press option 6 for shift maps. When you pull up the shift map screen, you can see it quickly switch from the old map to the one you have selected on your switch. So the system needs to refresh by logging into the shift map settings.
So I was able to make a couple successful 1/4 mile passes last night by going into the shift maps on the computer. But since I was logged into the Suprastick, I couldn't datalog with UTI3 on my last couple passes. I ran a 12.52 and 12.53 in 1800' DA, which is pretty decent considering I didn't bother with my normal track prep (ram air intake, rear skinnies, etc). Plus, my AFR was 11.5 in some big areas. The UTEC LOVES to screw with my AFR.
It's time for another fuel tune, which I have to do every month or so.Has anybody ever noticed you can't switch between maps with the Suprastick? Even if you shut the device down and start it back up, it didn't switch to the correct map. It was still stuck in the map that was chosen the last time you logged in via hyperterminal. The only way I was able to get it to switch maps was to SEE it switch when I log into the SS and go to the shift maps (option 6).
I will be sending my SS back to get this bug fixed. Also, Garrett said that he'll be able to get my 16x2 LCD display to read what map I'm in, 1 or 2. That will help me a LOT.
07-16-2010, 03:36 PM
#1228
They were only 1.89-1.91s. Since I am so close to the full potential of my engine and torque converter right now, the decrease in 60 foots may not seem big, but I know my local track very well under the conditions I was racing in. The car felt like it was hooking much better on the initial launch. But the lag is still there since my stall is 3500 rpm. My normal 60 foot under these conditions average 1.94s.
When I am able to launch under more power (4K+ stall TC), I will see a much bigger improvement.
When I am able to launch under more power (4K+ stall TC), I will see a much bigger improvement.
07-16-2010, 05:06 PM
#1229
They were only 1.89-1.91s. Since I am so close to the full potential of my engine and torque converter right now, the decrease in 60 foots may not seem big, but I know my local track very well under the conditions I was racing in. The car felt like it was hooking much better on the initial launch. But the lag is still there since my stall is 3500 rpm. My normal 60 foot under these conditions average 1.94s.
When I am able to launch under more power (4K+ stall TC), I will see a much bigger improvement.
When I am able to launch under more power (4K+ stall TC), I will see a much bigger improvement.
Car should be sick when it can pull some low 1.7 60's.
07-16-2010, 05:48 PM
#1230
They were only 1.89-1.91s. Since I am so close to the full potential of my engine and torque converter right now, the decrease in 60 foots may not seem big, but I know my local track very well under the conditions I was racing in. The car felt like it was hooking much better on the initial launch. But the lag is still there since my stall is 3500 rpm. My normal 60 foot under these conditions average 1.94s.
When I am able to launch under more power (4K+ stall TC), I will see a much bigger improvement.
When I am able to launch under more power (4K+ stall TC), I will see a much bigger improvement.
I can't wait to see what it'll do with a 4k+ stall.
I wish i could take my car drag racing again this season.
07-16-2010, 05:59 PM
#1231
07-16-2010, 06:30 PM
#1232
Last time I went to the track, I burned an exhaust valve on cyl. #5. It was caused by poor nitrous/fuel distribution between the cylinders. 150 shot and single nozzle FTL. I'm very surprised it didn't happen sooner. If I ever spray my maxima again, it'll be direct port.
The car still runs and drives fine on 5 cylinders and it feels like it would still run a 14 second 1/4 na. lol. I'm not sure what I'm going to do with it now. There's a few options floating around in my head...
1. replace head with a used head and install a direct port setup
2. replace heads with pnp heads and install a direct port setup
3. replace ve30 with vq35 and install a direct port setup
4. replace head, stop messing with the maxima and finish my 240
Option 4 is the smartest, but I have a feeling it won't happen.
The car still runs and drives fine on 5 cylinders and it feels like it would still run a 14 second 1/4 na. lol. I'm not sure what I'm going to do with it now. There's a few options floating around in my head...
1. replace head with a used head and install a direct port setup
2. replace heads with pnp heads and install a direct port setup
3. replace ve30 with vq35 and install a direct port setup
4. replace head, stop messing with the maxima and finish my 240
Option 4 is the smartest, but I have a feeling it won't happen.
07-17-2010, 02:57 PM
#1233
There's a few options floating around in my head...
1. replace head with a used head and install a direct port setup
2. replace heads with pnp heads and install a direct port setup
3. replace ve30 with vq35 and install a direct port setup
4. replace head, stop messing with the maxima and finish my 240
Option 4 is the smartest, but I have a feeling it won't happen.
1. replace head with a used head and install a direct port setup
2. replace heads with pnp heads and install a direct port setup
3. replace ve30 with vq35 and install a direct port setup
4. replace head, stop messing with the maxima and finish my 240
Option 4 is the smartest, but I have a feeling it won't happen.
07-19-2010, 07:04 AM
#1235
Last time I went to the track, I burned an exhaust valve on cyl. #5. It was caused by poor nitrous/fuel distribution between the cylinders. 150 shot and single nozzle FTL. I'm very surprised it didn't happen sooner. If I ever spray my maxima again, it'll be direct port.
I am really hoping I can do low 1.7s with the right converter. That should shave at least 3 tenths off my 1/4 mile ET.
07-19-2010, 11:27 AM
#1237
Its always been like that, I talked to Garrett about it a couple of years ago. I can get it to switch by going into the map you want and change one of the values and then back out so it saves, then it will switch to that map.
07-20-2010, 10:01 AM
#1238
For me, I was able to get the maps to switch only by pressing #6. I didn't have to make any change to the map itself. Once the map switch is set to the new map you want. I just pressed #6 and then #0 #0 to back completely out and save. I am able to do that quickly after my burnout. But I can't datalog with UTI. So I hope Garrett is able to fix it.
08-23-2010, 10:17 AM
#1239
I just received my latest torque converter over the weekend! Andre took his time going back to the drawing board with this latest design since he wanted to think about it a while. He has spent quite a lot of time on this build without asking for a penny! So I really appreciate his awesome customer service. I will just have to install it and see if I am able to stall at 4K+. I hope to be able to test it out within the next 2 weeks.
I will also be sending back my Suprastick to Garrett while my car is down to see if he can fix my switchable shift map function.
I will also be sending back my Suprastick to Garrett while my car is down to see if he can fix my switchable shift map function.
08-23-2010, 03:31 PM
#1240