I just sent this e-mail. Please don't tell me I should've said something different because I already sent it....


I apologize for the long e-mail, but I have a hell of a bad experience and I think you should know the entire story.

On August 1st, 2002, I purchased an Underdrive Pulley for my 2000 Nissan Maxima. I bought it from a local shop called Southwest Auto Works. I paid $170 plus tax for it.

I was referred by them to another local installation shop called Uro-Tek so I could have it put on on August 1st, 2002. The charge: $75.

When I went to pick up my car at Uro-Tek, it took a few cranks of the starter to get it going. The shop owner told me that my ECU probably had to learn the new pulley and it should be fine in a few hours. It did not get any better. Every single time I tried starting it, it took at least 2 or 3 long cranks to get going.

The following Monday, I was forced to drop off my car again to have them take another look at it. They pulled the code on the SES light and it came up as a bad "crank position sensor", so they charged me $100 to replace the sensor. This did not fix anything. They kept my car for an entire week to work on it and were still unable to diagnose the problem.

Then I called and e-mailed Joe in your tech department and explained the problem to him. He could offer no explaination as to how this could happen. He said the problem has never occurred before and that the only problem was with some of their old pulleys and it sounded nothing like this.

So then I went back to Southwest Auto Works to see if maybe they gave me the wrong pulley. They did not. The box was clearly marked 95-01 Nissan Maxima. All of their 95-01 Maxima pullies look the same.

At this point, I gave up and went to the dealer- Midway Nissan. They charged me $300 to put the stock pulley back on, along with resetting the SES light.

I am a donating member of Maxima.org and I decided to share my horrible experience with your product online in that online forum. Many people came to your defense and told me how great your products are. One member even posted a picture of his uninstalled from his car. That is when I realized that the pulley I received was defective.

Here is a picture of his pulley (Kevspulley).


Here is a picture of my pulley (badudp2).


Notice anything different between the two? I am missing the timing ring on my pulley. My pulley is defective. All of the problems I have been experiencing are because of your defective product.

Let me give you a quick recap of my experience with your company:

8/1/02 Purchase pulley: $170
8/1/02 Install defective pulley: $75
8/5-8/9/02 I have no car because it is in the shop
8/9/02 Replace sensor: $100
8/21/02 Dealership puts stock pulley back on: $300

Total time without a properly functioning car: 3 weeks
Total amount spent because of your poor quality control: $645

Incidentally, Southwest Auto Works has an entire shelf full of these pulleys WITHOUT the timing ring. The shop was unaware of the missing timing ring on my car because ALL of their pulleys are missing it. I don't know how I am the first person to experience this problem, but I'll be willing to bet that there are more on the way.

I am hoping that your company will do something for me other than just replace my defective pulley. You have cost me a significant amount of money because of this error. I am not trying to threaten you in any way, but I think you should put yourself in my shoes and look at what I have gone through by making the mistake of putting my money into your product.

Members of Maxima.org are advising me to seek legal advice, but in all honestly, I don't have the time, energy, or desire to do such a thing. I am hoping that your company will step forward and take responsibility for this error. Attached is a copy of my receipt from Midway Nissan, which clearly diagnoses the Unorthodox Racing aftermarket pulley as the problem.

Please feel free to contact me directly at 602-410-2639 or reply to this e-mail. I will be anxiously awaiting for your reply.

Andy Logan

 

Good letter. I note you have a 2000 year max like Kevina. My question is why are the other guys chiming in and stating that the 2k2 pullies are different? Just for reference sake?

 

I think that they are trying to tell me that I might have been given a 2K2 pulley by accident.

Damn you read fast. It took me like an hour to write......

 

First I would like to aplogize for any inconvenience this situation has
caused you. - What I would like to know is what was the part number on the
box that the pulley came in? The reason I ask is because if Southwest Auto
Works has a shelf full of these pulleys they may be trying to sell 2002 and
up pulleys for 1995-2001 owners. The 2002 and up pulley does not use a
timing ring but uses the same pulley. It is possible that the wrong box
label was put onto those boxes.
- Did you recive the installation instructions that came with the pulley?
The reason I ask is because the installation instructions say very
specifically for the installer to check that the timing ring must be
attached and the secureness of the bolts must be checked before the pulley
is to be installed on 1995-2001 cars. Attached to this e-mail is a word file
of the installation instructions for your car, if you cannot open it please
let me know.
- So before we jump to conclusions about defectiveness or quality control I
would just like to have answers on these questions. This will determine if
we were wrong or if the dealer or installer was wrong. We can make mistakes
are not afraid to own up to them.

Respectfully,
UR

 

very good letter. It always works better when you make the reader understand your point without being overly aggressive. I work in a field where i read a lot of complaints and i put the $hitheads at the bottom of the pile.

 

Finger pointing is to be expected in a situation like this. I'd suggest you follow up as UR has requested.

 

02.10.110.04
1995-01 Nissan Maxima/1996-01 Infiniti I-30 3.0L DOHC 24V

There were no instructions that came with the pulley other than what I printed offline from Maxima.org. I believe this includes the instructions from your website. In the box, I received the pulley and some popcorn. I think I might have received a sticker as well, but I'm not too sure because the installer threw the box away for me on August 1st. But looking at your instructions, I notice that the 2K and 2K2 instructions are printed on the same page. This might be confusing because (correct me if I am wrong) the 2K2 does not use the timing ring.

Regardless of whether or not the installer thoroughly read the instructions, I was still sent the wrong pulley. And I would imagine that he did thouroughly read them because he had my car on his rack for an entire week.

I'm sure that from a legal standpoint you can dismiss this by putting blame on the installer. But I'm asking you to do what you think is fair......

 

Ah see? You can tell UR is trying to defer blame from themselves to the owner or installer. But they do have an out if the instructions are indeed correct. But if boxes are all labeled wrong etc..

 

I'm already out the $$, so I guess I've got nothing to lose on this one. I'm going to take the high road though and play the sympathy card. The "DIE DIE DIE" card never works.......

 

Dude, where the hell have you been? I haven't seen you post in forever....

 

Again nice reply. I'm suprised they responded that fast. Hopefully that's an idicator that they will at least replace/refund your $ for the sake of customer service.

 

I doubt they will refund me anything. But maybe they'd be willing to compromise and ship me out an aluminum flywheel at no charge so I could sell it and recoup SOME of the cost.

 

Isn't their flywheel like $550+? That's alot more than the pulley. If I were them, I would just give you the correct pulley. It would be cheaper. Just thinking like they would.

 

you say "Southwest Auto Works has an entire shelf full of these pulleys WITHOUT the timing ring" .. are they labelled correctly? If so, UR might have some responsibility. Are there installation instructions in those boxes? If not, UR just got 'more' responsibility.

If the boxes are labelled correctly and the instructions are in the box, they have *NO* responsibility, it's the INSTALLER who is responsible.

Did the installer read the instructions? Did the installer check to make sure that part is made for that car? Or did he just take your word for it that it goes on that year/make/model car?

I'd say, in my very un-legal opinion, no matter *what* the situation is, the INSTALLER has as much responsibility, if not more, than UR. Have you talked to them yet?

 

I'm trying to protect the installer on this one because the guy busted his a$$ trying to figure out the problem. He read the instructions to a "t". Now that I remember, he actually went over them in front of me.

The boxes at Southwest Autoworks are ALL mislabeled. And I did not see instructions, although there was a hell of a lot of popcorn in each box.

 

Well, the pulley is already a given. I paid for it, so they wouldn't be "giving" me anything.

I want something that will compensate me for the $475 in labor I have had to pay for to make up for their incompetence. I think a flywheel is a perfect compromise. What does it cost for them to make one? $20?

 

Most makers will only replace a wrong or defective part. I honestly see no reason why they would compensate you for more than that part. Expecially when you already conceded the instruction part of the problem already. Even if UR was totally in the wrong, I very much doubt they would compensate labor charges or any other charges.

But if you can get them to give you a flywheel, more power to ya.

 

I know it's a long shot, but they are partially responsible because they have already admitted to mislabeled boxes. And there were no instructions that they included, so they are screwed there too.

I think I've got a pretty decent legal case on this one....... I might take jjs up on his prepaid legal if all they do is give me the correct UDP.

 

Which item should I get?

I just spoke with Kevin concerning the description on that box. The
Part#02.10.110.04 is for a blue 2002 and up Altima/Maxima/I35 3.5L DOHC 24V
pulley. Kevin also described to me the installation instructions that are in
each of the 4 pulley boxes he has on the shelf. The instructions say that
1995-2001 vehicles must check that 4 bolts holding the timing ring are
tight. We do acknowledge the application error on the sticker but the final
control over installation is the responsibility of the installer and the
instructions specifically say that the timing ring need to be checked and
the bolts holding it to the pulley need to be tight. But we do feel some
responsibility regardless and would like to make this up to you. We will not
cover you entire bill but there must be something for your vehicle that you
are interested in that we may be able to provide, even something from
another manufacturer although we do have a flywheel and clutch also
available.

 

Wow, that's pretty impressive! Not many companies would offer an item from another manufacturer. Asu -- has this communication with UR all happened today? If so, I'm amazed -- a lot of companies would drag their feet for weeks or months to try to avoid dealing with an angry customer. Kudos to UR.

 

I am glad you have taken the high road, I think it paid off for ya. I think they, UR, also are being gracious and operating like a good company. Looks like it turned out well....given the circumstances. I would purchase from UR at this point. I will give final "opinion" once they agree to a "selected part" to settle the discrepancy.

 

that is great news! I think this is a perfect example on how to handle a situation like this. So do you think you could could get both the clutch and the flywheel?

 

ooooh oooh ask for magic beans.

Congrats, that is great that the stand behind the mislabeling. You probably saved them a ton of money (well, after the recall and fix to the label machine.)

 

That's true. I did, huh? I never even thought about it that way.

I don't think I deserve BOTH the clutch and flywheel. I just want what's fair too and both items would be taking advantage of them. I think just the flywheel (and a replacement UDP of course) would suffice. They won't lose any money because they manufacture it too. It's a win-win for everybody.

By the way, is it possible to run a flywheel AND a UDP? The Stillen car has it don't they? But I have heard that you aren't supposed to do it too though.....

Hmmm. He says he can get stuff from other companies. Nitrous??

 

By the way, all of the correspondence occurred within 10 minutes of me sending my e-mails to them.

 

That kind of response is very unusual, glad to see you're eating a little crow from earlier.

The only time I have seen that is with Fram. The cap to my Oil Drain Kit does not fit the oil drain. I emailed them asking if I could get a new cap. No response.

3 days later I get a box with a new kit, an apology letter, and a return evelope for the old kit so they can study the problem.

 

Great news Andy!

Don't forget that the flywheel or clutch are going to cost some HEAVY installation fees.

Maybe, you can get a "credit" anybody can use or just sell whatever part to someone else, whatever is easier. Then at least you don't have to spend MORE money and you can recoup some you've already spent.

However, I'd probably go for the flywheel.

 

Shawn- It is surprisingly refreshing to read your unexpected response. I think that is a perfect compromise and I would love to take you up on your offer.

When I was digging through their boxes, I was not looking for instructions and they must have been beneath the popcorn. I was just concerned about looking for the timing ring on the UDP at the time. I very well may have had instructions in my own box, but as I said before, I printed out the ones off of the internet, so the shop had them regardless.

I have a few questions for you:
1. If I accept the offer on the flywheel, will I still receive the correct UDP? Do I get that from SW Auto Works?
2. Is it possible to run a UDP and a flywheel together at the same time? I have heard rumors of timing and balancing issues.
3. Ideally, the next mod for my car was going to be nitrous. If I cannot run a UDP with flywheel, do you have access to any 75 shot kits? However, if you are going to have to be paying out of your own pocket to buy one from NX or NOS, please disregard this question. I do not want to take advantage of an already generous offer. I could find use for a flywheel or clutch I'm sure.....

Thanks again. I have already posted your reply e-mail in the Maxima.org forum, so the members will understand that you have handled this situation appropriately.

 

I think 2k2_6spd can do it.... I'll e-mail him.

 

That would be VERY nice of 2K2_6spd!

I believe you have to drop the transmission for either, so withOUT a lift it's going to be a LONG project.

It will be quite interesting to see what difference it makes. Any plans on dynoing soon?

 

I will dyno once it cools down and when I get the UDP and flywheel on.

How hard is it to drop a manual transmission? There can't be too much involved, can there?

 

Hey man, congrats !! I'm so glad it all worked out in the end for you.

 

Yup, Shawn called us and told us to open all the boxes (which, I would never think to open EVERY damn box in my store-that's ridiculous, that's what manufacturer is supposed to do)....But, nicely enough, it appears that at least five pulleys (and god knows how many more in our warehouse) were mislabeled, so guess what fun we here at SWA get to have when these get here.....So anyway, UR decided to ship out the plates to us today...All in all, a bit of a *****, but hey, believe me ALL when I say this, most manufacturers give us HOLY HELL if any situation like this arises, so I too, am impressed by UR's response.

Andy, stop by when you get a chance too
Thanks
Alex

SWA

 

According to some posts I've read on the Org, you should NOT run a UDP and a lightened flywheel at the same time. And to answer your question as to where I've been, I've been around. I've just been busy, so I've had to cherry pick the threads I respond to. This thread was definitely worth jumping into, however.

Nice work on the correspondence, by the way. Oh, and welcome to the custom exhaust, OEM rear section club. It's quiet at idle and cruising speeds and mean as hell at WOT! Suhweeet, no?

 

I've never done it, so I wouldn't know for sure. Ask some 4th gens., since they've been through a few.

I've heard of people getting charged $400-500 for just the clutch install and that's typically around $40-50/hr., so I'd guess 8-10hrs for a mechanic(It's actually probably around 5-6hrs.) = almost DOUBLE that in a driveway.

 

Hmmm. Well then I'll just sell it and get that 75 shot that I've been eyeing.

Alex- Should I pick up the timing ring from you guys?

And yes, the stock muffler RULES! With the intake and Y pipe, the noise level is perfect! No offense, Alex, but that one I got from you guys was just a little too deep for my taste.

 

That's a MUCH better idea IMO!

Especially, since you and 2K2_6spd(willing and experienced!) can hook it up in a few hours with NO down time.

I can't wait to see them dyno and/or 1/4 times.

 

None taken, different mufflers-different tones
I will call you as soon as they hit here
Thanks
Alex

 

Nor should any be taken. A straight-through muffler works fine without a Y-pipe. But add a Y-pipe and the drone can get to be EXTREMELY annoying. This topic has been pretty thoroughly covered in other threads, however. So there's really no need to expand on it here.

 

Get the shiney flywheel... if you decide to install it, get a new clutch also since the whole tranny needs to be dropped.