Hey Guys!

Just curious to see what your results have been when running a Resistor inplace of the Knock Sensor and have advanced your timing. How far could you go before the car started pinging? What brand of gasoline did you use? anything else?


Personally I am using a 470k resistor from Radio Shack, Arco 93 Octane Gas, and 20* Timing. No pinging.

 

Hm.

I'm using the same resistor as you are. (470K ohm RS)
Chevron 92 Octane
16* timing.
No pinging.

It pings at 17* and up though.

 

MrGone, It wouldn't be a bad idea for you to set that timming back to stock.

 

Hey, you got pics of how to put in the resistor? There's probably some somewhere, but I am feeling lazy right now.

I think I might do that and leave my timing stock.

 

See that connector right below the Fuel Pressure Regulator (on the end of the fuel rail)? Its grey and has orangish colored ends on it, you can see a yellow wire on the left. You disconnect that, take the resistor and put it in the top connector, bridging the 2 terminals.

I hope that makes sense.

 

You can ping and not hear it. I would keep that timing at stock when bypassing the KS. Be safe man.

 

Oh yeah, Gjohnson, why put the timing back to stock? The car hasnt been pinging or knocking. I can fully understand doing that with DaveBond007's car because it was pinging.

 

hmmm. good point. I did run the car really hard though, lugged it, ran it up some nice big hills, etc and I didnt hear anything and it ran strong. hmmm???

 

I have the resistor, and my timing cannot be advanced any further..Also, I can remove all the front coil packs and injectors without affecting my car.

 

Oooweeeoooweeeoooweeee.

 

What performance advances can you achive from the resistor, and timing advace? Can the resistor mod be done to a VG?

 

I'm pretty sure the VG doesn't suffer from the same loss of power as the VE due to the Knock Sensor, so the resistor trick wouldn't do much. As far as advanced timing, make sure you do it carefully and safely and run premium gas, you should see some good gains. Craig B. has some information on his page.

 

That's for sure. I let my friend drive my car with and without the resistor, and being the passenger, I definitely felt a difference. It felt like 10-15hp all over the place.

The throttle is much more responsive as well.

 

Be careful. When I mentioned running with the resistor, I ended up having my azz handed to me.

 

OK, let me get this straight...Spipedong said that he could feel a difference advancing his timing. That makes sense.

However, I thought that if you run the resistor you eliminate "heat soak" (by bypassing the KS) keeping the power from "dwindling" after the car gets really warm. When this happens, is the knock sensor telling the ECU to retard the timing?

Also, why does Darhaw gets his a$$ handed to him? Less power? That doesn't make sense.

Or do you mean the Moderators got in your **** because you should have just replaced the knock sensor?

I want to get all of my info straight here before I start hacking up my electrical system.

 

DARHAW-MAX, why is that?

I said before I put the resistor in that I was going to run 20* timing with the resistor, and the only reason why I would retard my timing would be because of pinging/knocking noises.

So far this is what I have gathered. DaveBond007 and I both have very similiar cars, he has around 160,000 miles, I have 126,930 miles. I have a Fidanza/Exedy Combo, while he has the stock clutch/flywheel, His VTC's are working fine, mine are grounded, and lastly he's using premium Chevron, I'm using premium Arco gas.

The only reasons I can come up with Dave's not being able to run a 20* advance is:
-Chevron Gasoline vs. Arco:I believe this is the reason why its happening. From experience with late model Small Block Mopar V8's, they tend to ping while going up hills when running Texaco and Chevron, 76/BP only does it during a full load (bricks, sand, and wood loaded) when going up a hill, and it does not ping at all when using Arco towing 5500lbs up the same hill.
-Different Engine Conditions: Dave's engine has more mileage, it could have more carbon build up than mine. I ran 2 cans of SeaFoam threw my engine/crank/fuel system about 600miles ago.
-Fidanza has less of a load on the engine: I'm not sure if this would do it or not, but it is a possiability.

I am certian that the VTC's are not causing this because a majority of his pinging was in the higher end of second gear. I am pretty certian that it has to do with the type of gas.

 

The Knock Sensor does exactly what its name is, it detects engine knocking (and pinging). When it detects a knocking/pinging condition it will retard the ignition timing in order to eliminate the knocking/pinging.

Now I believe that the heatsoak every one was always talking about is not actually heatsoak, but the engine retarding its timing to compensate for knocking. I remember on my old black 93 when I would only run Texaco Premium gas, had stock timing and no one really knew of the resistor 'mod', I would have the 'heat soak' problem. With the white 92 I've only run Arco gas, and when I was driving it with the stock timing I never really noticed any 'heatsoak'. I believe this is because the Arco gas is more resistant to pinging/knocking and burns better. Also I'm not saying my engine actually had a heatsoak condition, because alot of time it wouldnt, it would be within a block of my house, with the engine cold, on the way to work. Alot of times when it was wet out I would notice a lack of power in the old car (on the way to work... never had a problem with it in the morning on the way to school when I would do stupid things and run the car hard). Again that was all on the black car.

That's just my experience.

 

One time in the past, I was describing how I regained my power by using the resistor trick. One of the moderators pretty much handed my azz on a plate by stating how I could still mess up my engine due to inaudiable pinging. Even as I mentioned that I did not know that, I got another blast about have I ever see the inside of an engine that has had ping damage.

Either way, I still have the resistor installed. When I rip up the intake manifold, I will then do the proper fix.

 

Since I have the resistor installed, I have not messed with my timing. I decided to leave it stock and run premium gas.

 

i think ill test mine first...my car seems ok...but i just wanna be sure.....she feels a bit slower when warm so i better check it.

 

If you do it, will definitly see a difference. Again, just make sure you run premium to help offset any inaudiable pinging that may or may not be going on.

If you have a reason to remove your manifold, like for injectors or something, then that would be a good time to replace the KS.

 

Removing the intake isnt the bad part, its removing that damn coolant pipe, Its really not bad, I just dont like dealing with it.

On a side note, If for some chance in hell my engine does have problems because of the resistor + timing, then I guess I will have to clean up this block.... http://mrgone.homeip.net/images/92Ma...s/P9160136.JPG

 

Another question from the dumb guy...

If you advance your timing, say to 20 degrees, and you don't use the resistor, will your knock sensor retard your timing as far back as if you had your timing set at 16 degrees? Or will it just retard a set amount (say 3 degrees)?

In other words, if you advance your timing, is the resistor necessary?

 

I hate to say this but gas is gas now a days. The same trucks deliver the gas from the same refineries to all the gas stations. I do agree that premium gas is a must but being brand loyal is a thing of the past

 

you forgot about the stop in the middle where each company adds it's own particular additives.

 

additives schmattives, its all a big conspiracy to get people to think that one gas is better than another. The only additives that are different is the MTBE that California still puts in and the Methanol that is added in cold areas for "Oxygenation"

 

Thank you sir!

 

Do you work for an oil company?
do you anyone who does?
I DO!
So go pull you foot out of your mouth and shove off

 

I'm inviting you out to my house where I will show you how our 1998 Durango reacts to different gas. I'm pretty sure you will be convienced afterward that all gas is not the same.

Oh and for those who dont have Arco Stations, around here Arco is the cheapest (priced) gas around, so I am not claiming that its the 'best' because I pay more for it (some people believe Texaco and Chevron are the best because they have higher prices). I use Arco because my cars like it, simple as that.

 

no one answered my question.

It's funny you mention that Mr. Gone. There's a Flying J in Troutdale that usually has about the cheapest gas in the Portland area. I am not sure about now, but when I had my first Max, it was the only station I could find that had 93 octane premium. Everyone else had 92 octane. My Max ran it's best on that gas, even though it was considerably cheaper than any other gas around.

 

The the knock sensor will vary its resistance if it detects a pinging or knocking condition. I dont know if it retards it a predetermined ammount, or if it calculates the ammount based on the severity of the ping/knock.

With the knock sensor hooked up, it will only retard the timing when it senses a ping/knock, once it goes away it will put the timing back to normal.

The resistor is not necessary to advance your timing, infact it is the oppisite (in a sense). The resistor is just to test and see if your knock sensor is working. If you put the resistor in, make sure your timing is stock, otherwise your car can ping and such.