spdfreak

Whats the best kit, for a novice in the n2o feild. I am looking for a kit thats not too hard for the install (I assume a dry kit) and one that includes all parts and hoses.

Please advise, as I want to buy a kit by tonight, or tomorrow morning, so the weekend at the track will be of pleanty fun.

Thanks

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

I installed but wet and dry kits and neither one was harder than the other

dry you tap the vac line to controll the amount fuel

and wet to tap the fuel line

if know you will never go above a 75shot go dry but chances are you will want to run 100shot or higher so I would say get the wet

Aaron92SE

iTrader: (128)

It really depends how knowledgeable you are with nitrous and what your ultimate goals are. How large of a shot do you plan on going? Do you know how to read plugs? Do you have a wideband o2 sensor?

If you want a newbie kit, then just go with a 35 or maybe 50 shot Zex and you should be ok.

If you want to have the possibility to go with a 100+ shot one day, then NX wet is a popular choice around here that has always gotten good results.

I have the Dynotune Kit, which is very inexpensive, but it's nice. It gets the job done and should be good for up to 150 single stage shot of nitrous.

The most important things you will need to keep in mind is your timing, AFR, and bottle pressure. If your timing is stock, with 1 step colder plugs, with AFR in the high 10s or low 11s, then you should be fine with a 35 or 50 shot.

Personally, I just don't understand how someone can spray nitrous without knowing their exact AFR. So a wideband is a MUST for any size shot of nitrous. But if you are going to get nitrous anyway, don't go with anything higher than a 50 shot without a wideband.

Start with the 35 shot and go from there. And take it SLOW with your jet size upgrades.

spdfreak

Thanks for the quick answers. More suggestions would be great.

I wont be using a wideband, but what the hell, I won't be putting it on my car .

The kit will be installed for a weekend in a car, yet to be announced. All i'm allowing myself to say is that it is a late model v6.

A dry kit seems to be what I will get. I'm not sure which system to buy and where to get it. I am also not sure what nitrous lines or hoses I will need in addition to the kit.

50 hp kit it will be. Let the sugestions and comments continue.

00SEMAX19

iTrader: (4)

I have the NX wet system and it was a easy install and has always done me good for over a year now. However I helped a friend install the Zex kit and it deffinately is the easiest plug and play setup out there to install. It takes less wiring skills and you only have to mount one control box instead of seporate cylinoids. I personally prefure wet because I have future plans to go for bigger shots.

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

wel I am planning to run a dual set progressive shot, so if you settle on a dry kit holla at me

Aaron92SE

iTrader: (128)

Oh, you mean you are changing from a dry to wet kit?

Make sure you keep me informed on your progressive shot ventures. I will be learning a lot in the couple few months. We might as well start a new running thread so we can post our information pertaining to progressive nitrous.

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

yes my dry kit can only handle a 125shot max and I want to run a 150 also since the extra fuel is coming from the injectors I would need to upgrade to bigger injectors if I want to run large dry shots so it's much easier to convert to wet. right now I am running a 75shot and try'd a 85 and 100 a few times but even with the walbro 255 the injectors just can not keep up. I really want to run a 100shot so next month I am planning to hit the dyno to confirm how the car is doing since I do not have a wideband, oh yeah and I am no longer a auto broke my TC

I also have a fjo mini and zex wet kit on my s10 and luv it, man to think you have traction problems trying spraying a v8 s10 out of the hole

I started a thread a few months ago about the controller, jime helped and gave some pointers but I learned the most on ls1tech alot of guys there are using the controller and have some great idea's

I'll do a search and dig it up

spdfreak

I'm looking to install it for just a weekend, so it seems like a zex kit is for me.

Theres no need to talk about progressive setups here, because i'm not installing a complicated system for a day at the drag strip.

How do I know how big of a shot I can run safely?
I think a 50 shot would be safe. Even on stock plugs.
I think I may be able to run a 75 shot with one stage.

Note, that I would be running the car with 93 octain.

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

a 50 shot is fine, if you plan to run a 75 then add some 104 to the mix, hack I would throw in some 104 in with the 50shot never hurts to be safe and with the 75shot switch to colder plugs with a reduced gap

00SEMAX19

iTrader: (4)

Honestly, if you are just using it one day you probly would be fine with the 75. Only upgrade I've ever made to my nitrous system is colder plugs and havn't had any issues yet. Most install guides state that all of there recommended shots are safe on stock engine. This is why nx and I think zex only offer a basic kit up to 75 shot.

Seems like alot of work for just one weekend though, not counting the cost of the kit. What do you plan on doing with the kit just selling it the next day? Kinda like getting loosing your virginity to a hooker and then going abstinent...

Have fun either way, and let us know how it works out

spdfreak

A dry kit shouldn't be too much work, esspecially the ZEX kit. The bottle brackets will be mounted on a sheet of plywood on the front passengers foot well, and the lines routed throught the firewall. Hook up the power to the horn, and that saves allot of wiring. It's all been done before.

Me and a friend are trying to show the world what a ************* can really run on the strip with "some" juce. (I won't name the car yet.)

Aaron92SE

iTrader: (128)

I read a lot on the ls1tech nitrous forum. I like all the activity that place gets. I've even posted a few times.

Knowing what engine you have plays a big role in how much you can safely spray. Just by saying that it's a V6, it doesn't help me. I will assume it's a VQ30DE for now.

Also, with a 50 shot, go with one step colder plugs and gap them to about .036" - .038". It will cost you no more than $8 and it's some safe assurance. Also, with the stock gap, I experienced spark blowout with only a 35 shot! So you may need to decrease your gap.

Also, since you are not properly tuning your car, use a few gallons of unleaded 100 octane. There is a good chance you will detonate even with the 50 shot and one step colder plugs and stock timing on 93 octane. So dump in some higher octane fuel for the sake of your motor. It'll be a good precaution.

spdfreak

Well, to clarify things a bit more, there are a couple of cars that I plan on using this setup on. Choices are,but not limited to a 6th gen Maxima, 07 V6 Camary, 07 Pontiac GXP, 07 Avalon, 07 Charger (not sure which engine size), 07 Impala SS...
I want to take the "family oriented" cars to the track and see what they run.

Open exhaust, filter box, and hpoefully this little setup.

Questions.
Do I need to change the plugs and gap them if I will only put a couple of passes on the car?
How many passes can I get from a 10# bottle with a 75 shot?
This is a technical question; Whats the reason that the vacume line needs to be tapped?)

Aaron92SE

iTrader: (128)

It sounds like you work at a rental car place. I've seen a lot of rental cars racing at the track. But, be careful, it's easy to blow your motor with a 50 shot if you don't know what you are doing.

Yes, you need to change the plugs and gap them. You'll know what spark blowout is real soon if you don't gap them down. Especially if you spray in 3rd gear where the engine load is very high or if the spark strength is low. And the colder plugs will help prevent detonation. But since you are asking about a 6th gen Maxima, the rear bank is tough to change plugs on. So if you are going to spray a 50 shot on the stock plugs, you BETTER have 100 octane unleaded fuel!! Detonation can blow a motor before you realize anything is wrong!

If you don't have your car tuned properly and haven't taken the precautions to prevent detonation, you can blow your motor within a second of the first time flipping that switch! Please do a little more research about how nitrous works and know what you're getting into before you do it. Have you had a chance to read over the FAQs in this Nitrous forum? It's stickied.

I have to be very honest with you. I would first install the kit on your personal car and get familiar with how the kit works. Once you build the knowledge about nitrous that you need, then you will be able to know what you are doing when you install it on a $30K car.

I went through 3 or 4 bottles of nitrous on the street before I sprayed the entire 1/4 mile. Take your time. Start with a 35 shot and go slow.

spdfreak

No. I do not work at a rental place, but your guess was close.

100 will only ensure that I dont detonate, but I will still have to gap the plugs. Correct?

I will read a bit more, but am sertain that I can run a 50 shot.

About my question from above, some one pleas explain why the vaccume line needs to be tapped.

Aaron92SE

iTrader: (128)

100 octane will ensure that you won't detonate on a 50 shot. But gapping the plugs will prevent the spark from blowing out (aka misfire). But since you are spraying such new vehicles, they should have a spark strong enough to withstand the 50 shot on stock gap. My 1992 Maxima does not have a strong enough spark in order to spray the 35 shot with the stock gap. So I had to close my gap to .036" to solve the problem.

So, you can run a 50 shot and you shouldn't have any problems. Just make sure you run 100 octane since you aren't going to spend any time tuning it properly or going to change the plugs or gap.

You don't need to tap into a vacuum source if you run a wet kit. But with some dry kits, you may need to. Go to Zex's website and read up on the installation procedure. I am not totally familiar with what is involved in installing a Zex kit.

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

you will need to only tap a vac source on the dry kit cause this is how the unit controls how much extra fuel the injectors will provide

I tapped the fpr, check out the instructions on the zex website

2002AltimateV6

iTrader: (7)

+1. I've gone through quite a few ZEX kits and have the best success with them.

How's the kit I sold your friend doing? I lost your phone-number/card and I've been meaning to call you to get you out to one of the "meets" for some street fun.

00SEMAX19

iTrader: (4)

Everything went great with that kit. It was a very easy install and was done in no time.

We will be going on the Toys for tots drive on the 8th. You should come, there will probly be 4-500 cars. Pm me on nwmaxima.com and we can talk about those other meets. He is on there to, I'm 026speedse and he is 04altima(3.5). You should really get ahold of us, he has done many upgrades to his alty since then and I think you would really like to check it out.

spdfreak

Sounds like I will be going ***** to the wall and running a 75 shot.I will first run a 50 to see if anything goes wacky. If all is ok, I will go with the 75 shot.

Three quick questions.
Do the bottles have a built in safty valve that bleads off nitrous in the event that preassure rises unexpectedly?
What brand/style wrench style spark plug gap tool should I purchace?
And last; Based on what someone wrote, that by tapping the vacume line its needed to add fuel; How does the zex sysrem add fule? That only works on carberated cars.On our cars we place the jet before the maf and that calculates the fuel to be added by the factory injectors. Or thats atleast what the Zex tech told me. If it is truly unneeded, do I hook that part of the system up, or leave it alone and it will work without it?

Thanks for the tips, and if you see a Camary running 13.0@109 it just may be me .

2002AltimateV6

iTrader: (7)

The bottle has a pressure relief valve if the pressure in the bottle exceeds 2000PSI I believe. You can buy higher capacity burst discs, but the only way the pressure can ever get high enough is if you leave the bottle warmer on and forget to turn it off.


This is what I use to gap my plugs. Very easy to use. I just don't use their spreader. You never really want to place any pressure on the electrode since it can break. I use a pair of pliers and just separate it as much as I may need too and then measure to check gap. If too much, I press it gently down against a hard surface.


I really don't know how the ZEX system works to increase fuel pressure.. so I'll leave that to the guys that know (looks like that was answered above) Some people place the dry nozzle before the MAF so that as the denser air from the cooling effect nitrous has passes through, the ECU will adjust accordingly and add in more fuel. Only problem with that is that our MAF's are so fragile (at least the VQ35s are) that it's risky to run it like that without the worry of busting the sensor. Another problem is the ECU may not always give you enough fuel. Nitrous has a chilling property when first injected, but as it reaches the combustion chamber and goes through the compression cycle the two parts nitrogen and one part oxygen separate to basically double the amount of air that was once in the cylinder. Sure you might have added in fuel from the colder air, but it may not be enough to accommodate all of the extra air from the N20. Sure for a 35 shot its not much of a problem. But when you go up to a 50 shot, it gets harder and harder for the fuel system.

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

you normally want to install the nozzle a few inches before the tb and after maf

but you are not going to use a maxima so it maybe different, I say this cause the ls1 guys spray the maf. I suggest find out which car you are going to use and research whats needed for THAT car

as for the vac source your fpr has a rubber diaphram in it and is connected to your intake manifold and depending on the intake vac psi it will determain how much fuel psi you will have. by using different size jets the zex unit controls the amount of fuel psi while you are spraying and this is how you get the extra fuel for the nitrous

example at idle you fuel psi is around 34 and your vac is around 20, now under a load the vac drops to say 5-10 which will cause less psi on the diaphram in the fpr and allow for high fuel psi

spdfreak

The part I colored in red, is for a wet system where you add fuel along with the nitrous. In that case, the car doesn't have to add fule though the injectors, so it goes 6-18 inches in front of the TB. In the case of a dry system, you have to place it before the MAF inorder for the computer to recognize it.

I understand the second part of your post, about how the vaccume works, but from the conversation I had with the ZEX tech, he said that was mainly used on carberated motors.



Are the NX, NOS, ColdFusion systems installed with this "vacume line tap"?
IIRC I have never heard of the guys with NX using this, vacume line tap.
I think the ZEX kit makes for an easyer install when being installed for the long run, but a kit like NX might be better if I want to install it for a two day period.

Nitrous gurus, please step in and add anthing you want to this conversation. I want to buy the correct kit.

spdfreak

I was looking into getting this. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Summi...QQcmdZViewItem
But I'm sure the little disc one would wirk fine.

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

I am talking about a dry kit, you only need to tap a vac source with a dry kit

as for spray the maf do not do it wet or dry the only cars I seen do this is the ls1 guys

look at some maxima nitrous setups wet or dry pretty sure you will not find one where they are spraying the maf. I suggest you download the install instructions and read them, now be my guess and do not tap the vac line and spray it and see how long the maf and motor last

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

here are come pic's of both wet and dry setups

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

Aaron92SE

iTrader: (128)

Using the disc to open the gap doesn't put any pressure on the electrode. If it does, then you're using it wrong somehow. But you stick the ground strap through the hole in that disc, then you can pry upward on the tip of the ground strap. It PULLS the ground strap away from the electrode. It should never touch it. I do this all the time when gapping my plugs.

That gap opener hole isn't there for keychain purposes even though I sometimes use it as such.

spdfreak

So in the first picture, vaccume was taken off the FPR? I can't enlarge that picture up to see it clear enough.

About the spraying before the MAF, you are correct. Only spray after it. I just confemed that with a tech.

As for gapping the plugs, is it ok for the car to run the .038 gap all the time vs the stock gap?

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

I drove around with 1step colder plugs gapped at .037 for about 6months zreo problems

your mpg may go down alittle and I mean alittle thats the only thing I can think of

spdfreak

Just spoke to another tech over at NitrousExpress. The conversation I had with him, has me thinking that a wet setup would be better for me.

Thats not good news for t6378tp, as I was thinking about buying his setup.

The tech suggested that I buy a wet kit, and set it up as follows.

Hook up the nitrous as regular, but use the washerfluid reservoir to hold my fuel. Buy a used fuel pump and FPR and run a pump with an inline pump and FPR from the new fuel source, to the solenoid. For saftey I can pich up a fuel pressure safety switch. And to expand my kit, buy some jets for higher hp settings if desired.

Thats all folks. Now onto the new(er) idea.

Now shoot ideas for me. Where to buy my wet kit, and which pump and FPR to buy.

PS. Since someone mentioned rental car and nitrous, I found something. Search youtube for "nitrous rental".

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

it's cool cause if I can not find another kit for a good price I'll just convert mine to a wet kit

as for nitrous kits, pump and fpr you can search the for sale section and sponsored forums. the only bad thing this is going to cost close to 1000.00 if you buy everything new and might as well get a bottle warmer also.

if your worried about cutting the fuel line it's cheaper to just replace it when your done, you should only need to replace it from the filter to the fpr (if it's a maxima) and should not cost more than 10bucks compared to almost 150.00 for a pump and fpr
good luck with your project

00SEMAX19

iTrader: (4)

I've never head of that idea of using a different fuel containor, pump, and fpr. Interesting.

As for replacing fuel line, I've always just repaired them by sticking some sort of tube in the line and then just sticking some hose clamps on.

spdfreak

What you gain by this is that you can run 100 or 104 octain to better prevent knock, without putting anything other than the regular 93 octain or whatever.

Just don't forget, that if you use your washerfluid resivoir as a fuel cell, don't forget to dissconnect the fuse to the spray pump, or you may be cleaning your window with 100 octain. Expencive washer fluid.

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

thats true but it this is a loaner or rental car it needs to be stock when he brings it back

t6378tp

iTrader: (69)

jime was running this type of setup, he used a 1gal fuel cell

alot of v8 guys use this setup with larger 200+ nitrous shots, also this is what I plan to do this way I do not have to re-jet and tune my carb for a larger fuel pump cause the nitrous has it's own fuel system