Dave B

http://www.nissanx.net/gall/album52

This was Ethan's attempt at installing the 350Z/G35 intake manifold on his 03 Maxima. According to him, the fitment and clearances were way off. The picture of his hood cracked is showing that he can't close the hood with the manifold in place. There are some good pics showing the guts of this great manifold.

99Maxima5sp

If he is saying that, then hes crazy, because there is no difference in size of the engine compartment.



Thanks for all those links Dave, im still debating on this. Granted this wont be in my immediate future, but im thinking. Also, heres a good question i think. Since im a 99, no ECU is in my future, so therefore a MEVI would seem useless since i cant stretch its legs to 7200rpm. So therefore, this (EH USDM) really would be my "MEVI" and probably the best for 99s since it doesnt lose low-end like a mevi, but gives slight high end and shifts the power slightly higher. What do you think??



-eric

krismax

iTrader: (15)

No im not saying that but i only say what ive verified personally i have the 95-96 model so with my eyes i can tell you that for 100%.
I dont guess things or assume things ,theres too much of that on this site.

BEJAY1

iTrader: (19)

Oh, now they come out with a group deal.
Anyway I got some gains on my 4th gen when I used to run it Seemed just shy of Kevin's gains but nonetheless gains. Dealers get like 10%-20% off their MSRP. And there's a few local shops around the country besides EH that have the equipment too. One machinest in Rockford for instance was supposed to do it for like half the EH price.
I still have an extra upper & lower plenum lying around. If we do a GD I'll send those in and sell off to somebody as a swap.

Shadow

iTrader: (15)

If you guys actually make one, I'd be first in line to get it.

If you guys don't get it done, then it's back to my previous plan of making my own. I was planning on going the standard big plenum, short runner intake manifold. I was going to incorporate individual air horns in each runner, and a flange to run the pathfinder TB. Plus the TB would be mounted in a slightly different location due to the shorter runners.

Obviously a production model would be simpler, cheaper and cater more to the masses, but if it was available, showed gains, and saved me the hassle of making one, once again, I'd be first in line.

Dave B

Keven emailed me back with the before and after dyno plot. I'll upload it tonight when I get home. After looking at the graph, here's what I see:

2000-3500rpms: small gains of around 1-2whp/wtq
3500-4000rpms: gain of 3-10whp/wtq
4200-5200rpms: gain of 4-12whp/wtq
5200-6500rpms: gain of 5whp/wtq

From 3900-4300rpms there is the typical drop in power where the gains aren't terribly good, however with the JWT ECU, this drop in power disappears. So it would be safe to say you will see more power in this area with the ECU in place.

One thing I never caught before was the correction factors of the dyno. The before dyno had a .99CF (63 dgrees, 29.66 baro), but the after dyno had a much higher 1.05CF due to excessive heat (97 degrees) and low baro pressure (29.10). High correction factors can influence dyno gains and make it appear that there is more power there than there really is. Of course seeing that the conditions were so hot, his car was most likely heat soaked also and a little down on power so it may all even out.

99Maxima5sp

For 450 bucks, those are some good gains. Not everything will cost 150 bucks for 10-14fwhp like the Ypipe, you definately have to pay. But this is something that looks like it has some solid gains, and right where its needed. The only problem i can see is that with the added air, the car may start to lean out. An S-AFC would be needed im sure. Also, im not sure how this would affect my car personally since i do spray.

Also, if stillen were to get this piggyback system going, i think this would definately be a good problem solver for us 99's without the ECU/MEVI potential, and in the end it would cost just about the same, yet we wouldnt have to deal with the headaches associated with the mevi (diffculty installing, butterflies, rpm switch, blah blah). The power gains might not be as high, but hey, its something...




-eric

Ant96GLE

iTrader: (4)

Very good info Dave and Ceasar... wouldnt it work even better with the intake spacers that we were SUPPOSED to have a g/d on but never did? From what the g/d had said, it was expected that the spacers would give another good 5hp.

Zack342

iTrader: (89)

So is this going to happen. you guys with 95-96's have it sweet. even 97 guys have options but 98-99 guys like myself have nothing, absoloutely nothing. we can do mevi but at the cost of low end, why can't we have our cake and eat it too. this has always been a reason i envy the honda guys especially the civic guys. they can get anything for their car but as a nissan guy our options are limited. if you guys can make this and show a proven gain in power. i will put a down payment right now....

Ceasars Chariot

iTrader: (16)

i feel this way too, where is the ssr guy ? he and the knowledgeable maxima owners need to hit the drawing board and make it happen.

Dave B

Here's the dyno plot of before and after with the Extrude Hone intake manifold:

nismology

iTrader: (8)

That dyno isn't impressive at all for the cost involved. For that much money, you might as well retrofit the DE-K VI, which I think is the best option period, custom intake manifold or not, because it doesn't compromise any part of the powerband as i said earlier. All we need is a lower intake manifold made that will accept the DE-K VI while allowing the 4th gen fuel rail to be used.

Dave B

Well, the point to all of this is to show there are gains to be had Extrude Honing the intake manifold, whether it's the MEVI or stocker. The MEVI guys can gain back some of their lost torque and addtional topend power and the 98-99 guys and those that choose to keep the stock manifold actually have an option to gain very useable power. To me, the gains are quite impressive for such little work involved. Sure, it's expensive, but making additional cheap power in an NA car is hard to do. It may be that you can get this manifold done for as little as $400. Remember that this dyno was without a JWT ECU. The JWT ECU effectively whips out that dip in power between 3900-4400rpms plus the JWT ECU adds a solid 8-12whp/wtq. With the stock manifold and the ECU, you could be looking at 200+whp/210+wtq (basically 5.5 gen power in a 300lb lighter car). With the MEVI, you could be looking at 210+whp/200+wtq.

As for the DE-K manifold, that a lot of work for a part that serves the exact purpose as the much easier to install MEVI. Also, the DE-K manifold can't be Extrude honed. I also find it very interesting that the plastic DE-K manifold only lasted 2 years on the market before Nissan went back to cast units. I think the high rate of VAIS failures due to the plastic design was the culprit. The DE-K manifold hasn't really proven itself at the track yet either. According to Krismax's ETs and MPHs on drag radials, he's no quicker than Neal's MEVI running on full blown 17" street tires and without the extreme weight reduction Kris has done.

Zack342

iTrader: (89)

I see what Dave B is trying to get at and i can see how he is right but. i really do think this would be a very good project for one of these shops to undertake and who knows maybe it will become a "standard" maxima mod like the Y-pipe has become. i love midrange power always have and always will that is what has attracted me to nissans in the beginning but this doesn't mean i mind having topend power. this was the same proble me 240SX suffer from the KA24DE has potent mid range but not very good top end. this maybe rabling but i would be willing to bet that if they can develop something that will make power people will buy it. it grets me exceited thinking that i can have the power at redline that the VI and JWT ECU guys have without losing that wonderful midrange i have come to love. like i said i have my down payment if that's what it will take.....

jcy98maxse

iTrader: (8)

Dave B- where can I get the MEVI extrude honed?

SSR Engineering

Well whaddya know, we are in southern california

krismax

iTrader: (15)

Sorry dave you have to remember the facts my car on that run was the same weight as neals ,also my car is dumping another 300 cc's of fuel into my cylinders.
When people stand by my car they comment how it smells like fuel . And to top it all off i ran that with a leaking rear main seal ,3 rd gear synchro gone ,and oil in my radiator . With my 200,000 mile car heatsoaked from driving there with oil leaking from my water pump with no cool down at the track.

What elevation did neal run that ?Also what was the temp and did he do a cool down?

And also i believe my time was still faster 13.82 vs 13.83

Ceasars Chariot

iTrader: (16)

SSR Engineering - do you guys have a plan ?

Dave B

I believe the only thing Neal removed from his car was the passenger seat, rear cushion, and spare/jack. I thought your weight reduction mods were light rims, removed sound deadening, and whole slew of other things to get your cars race weight into the 2700lbs range?

I believe the elevation is around 900' and temps are in the 70s. I'm not sure because I wasn't there.

But his traps are better suggesting he's making more power. The point is from what we've seen so far, the difference in ET/MPH is very minimal. I spoke with BSwithTF (Travis) a few nights back and he said he was no quicker or faster with the DE-K manifold vs his MEVI under the same conditions. He said the car feels better, but he's not running better. His 60 foots were slightly better (high 2.2s vs low 2.3s), but nothing else improved. His A/F gauges indicate a fairly rich condition above 5000rpms. With the MEVI he'd see a slightly rich A/F, but with the DE-K it's close to pegged on the meter. There might be 5whp to be found in the topend. Otherwise, he says the car runs great.

VIP Maxima

to me it depends on the power gain

maximus_pr

iTrader: (3)

waiting to hear something from them too

Ceasars Chariot

iTrader: (16)

http://www.extrudehone.com/index.html

there are other places just do a search on google for keywords: extrude hone, extrude honed, extrude honing

the group buy looks pretty easy, but still want to see what ssr could do

jcy98maxse

iTrader: (8)

thanx Ceasars, I'll check into it.

Zack342

iTrader: (89)

free bump because i will put my money where my mouth is, if you make it and it gives some kinda power gains,i will buy it. so what are you guys going to do?

Midknight MAXX

iTrader: (1)

I'm down if it comes as a complete kit, no going here and there getting swiches, relays and stuff.

GarciaMaxima

Count me in !

Maximeltman

iTrader: (11)

will this be a straight bolt-on for a 1999 w/o any ecu tweaking?

99Maxima5sp

Im sure it will be a straight bolt on for every 4th gen. However, im sure A/F ratio tweaking will be needed (like an S-AFC)




-eric

maximus_pr

iTrader: (3)

same here i'm in if its a bolt on nothing else to buy or to worry about

SSR Engineering

Right it will be a bolt on affair, and it will have all the stock sensors and everything.

Zack342

iTrader: (89)

that's what i wanted to hear.i am not sure if it was mentioned but i have a 1999 which has california emissions i believe that they have swirl valves and some other junk. can anyone elaborate on this? would i still beable to use the ssr manifold if it is ever concieved?

Zack342

iTrader: (89)

i am going to bump this thread again because i was wondering if SSR could give some definitive information about what they plan to do

endus

iTrader: (1)

FYI there is another possibility as well. Someone figured out that UNICHIP makes a piggyback for our cars. I don't have the link for the (Austrailian?) site that lists our car, but here is the link for the US site...

http://www.unichip.us/index2.html

I emailed them a few weeks ago and have heard nothing. I will give them another try today.

As far as the subject at hand: Us 98+ guys need *something*. If you ask me, the older 4th gen guys have enough options already. Why build *another* product targeted at a group that already has solid options? If the SSR manifold will be aimed at turbo/SC then that's another story, but it seems to me that the biggest market is doing something for 98 and 99 cars.

How many people who have 96s who have not done the MEVI are going to do this? The answer is not nearly as many as 98 and 99 guys who do not have that option.

Now, we're talking about 500 bucks for this thing, right? And we're talking about $400 for honing? That's not a big difference. Seems to me that selling a manifold that was basically a "pre-honed" version of the 4th gen might have some potential. Sending out my manifold for honing would be difficult. Swapping my manifold for 50 or 100 bucks more seems easier and like a fair tradeoff. Maybe there are additional gains to be made over honing the stock manifold as well?

All this needs to be figured out. If an ECU for late 4th gens is actually going to be a reality, then things may change somewhat. I will say it again though: in my (admittedly biased) opinion the benefit for the Maxima community as well as the financial motive for SSR lays in doing something for late 4th gen cars who cannot get an ECU. I see no reason to do another manifold for early cars who have the option of a variable length manifold already. Doing it this way WOULD also provide an option for early 4th genners who might not want to do a MEVI because of whatever concerns (butterfly valves, installation, low end power, whatever) or who did not want to do an ECU. Seems to me that's where the money and benefit to the community is.

I might even count myself among people who don't want to do the MEVI, even if the ECU ends up coming through. If there was an option that gained some power and did not require butterflys and loss of low end, that would be attractive to me. Low to mid range power is more useful to me than high end.

endus

iTrader: (1)

Speak of the devil.

I just got a reply from the UNICHIP guy today. I did not explain why we wanted to raise the rev limiter, so that's where the confusion is. I just emailed him abck with an explanation. This *sounds* like it is a (rather expensive) solution to the late 4th gen's ECU problem. Good news!

Midknight MAXX

iTrader: (1)

Uhhh...I'm a little confused by your post. I don't believe SSR said anything about a chip. The point you are trying to make about late 4th gens loses as well. This ultimately will be a competitor for the MEVI and DE-K manifold swaps. As far as the 95-96s folks that'll buy it, it's quite possible they might have recently got the car, recently starting modding the car or don't like the idea of pieceing the install kit for something that already has cost them $500. I'm pretty sure you also know the 99s are the only 4th gen not capable of running a 95-96 JWT modded ECU. I don't know maybe I got it all wrong but just some clarification in what you are making a point on is all I'm trying to get.

endus

iTrader: (1)

My point is that there are a fair number of 98 and 99 guys out there who would like to do an intake manifold, but for us the MEVI is not an option...at least if we don't want to drive around with a CEL all the time. If SSR did a manifold that was only single length and provided gains without a raised rev limiter that would probably prove to be very popular with late 4th genners.

The bottom line is that if they built a variable length manifold that required the raised rev limiter, they are competing with two other options. If they created a manifold that did not reqire a raised rev limiter, they have no competition at all and are opening up an avenue for performance to a whole group of people who ahve had no option at all up until this point. They would also be providing an option to those who don't want to do the MEVI for other reasons. Look at it this way: the 2k+ and MEVI intakes provide somewhat similar gains...2k will probably give a little bit more once Krismax get's his car completely tuned, but how much more are you going to gain from redesigning the variable length manifold? Why reinvent the wheel when there is a whole other segment of the market that has nothing?

Of course now, it looks like 98 and 99 guys might be able to do the MEVI if the UNICHIP thing goes through. Sorry if it's a little OT, but it definitely relevant to the discussion of the possibility of a new intake manifold for 98 and 99 guys.

99Maxima5sp

I couldnt agree more with your opinion. Very well said. I for one do hope for this Unichip to go through, as it would open up a world of possibilities for us lat 4th gens...in particular 99s...if it works.

All i know is that im going the route of honing the intake manifold. Ive hopefully (knock on wood) got a KILLER deal on price for honing...only a fraction of what everyone would pay online...



-eric

MardiGrasMax

iTrader: (14)

Take the bulb out or put a switch on the CEL wire from the ECU so you can turn it off.

JeffesonM

iTrader: (5)

SSR... any more details aroud what kind of manifold you're thinking about designing?

Zack342

iTrader: (89)

maybe we should call them. i am anxious to hear what the plan is. ssr manifold and unichip here i come. why is it suddely so good to be a 99 max lol