Well... I've never rebuilt a tranny before but I keep hearing is not as bad as it seems.


Situation:

5speed tranny. Very loud, sounds like bearing bouncing around. Input shaft has play in it but rest of the gears are strong. It leaks thru the input shaft if there is enuff fluids in the tranny.

I figure i can change the input shaft bearing and have a much better operating tranny, and stop the leak. If this can be successful, I will be please and would have a better operating tranny.

Has anyone changed their input shaft bearings?
while in there should I change anything else?

what is the difficulty level? I've done motor swaps 3.5 installs, just about everything mechanical on a max.

Looking for some info and whether or not this would be a good fix for the tranny, or should I toss it and get a rebuilt one, or something.

all input welcome.

 

If you've done 3.5 swaps and other motor installs, this should not be a challenge at all. I've only rebuilt small equipment engines, and this was a breeze. the hard part was getting it all out and back in due to no lift. The best route to go is to replace all the bearings and races. I had 213K on mine when I took it down and left my synchro's alone. Use Jtzmax's write up, the write up on motorvate.ca, and the FSM. Thats what I did, and really just for the order of disassembly and measuring shim thickness. I remembered how it came apart to put it back together. Might as well change your clutch while your in there, and if needed, the RMS. Good Luck

NM91

 

I figured its not as hard. I'll go check out his write up and I have plenty of FSMs so I'll start some research on it.

my clutch is starting to slip under moderate acceleration, and I'm tired of babying my car when i can be letting the motor roar. I wanted to get a assessment on the difficulty of it.

WHen you rebuilt yours, about how much did you spend on parts? if you dont mind me asking.

synchros feel fine but we'll see when I get in there. I've pulled my tranny more times than actually wanted to, so I'll probably pull it, get flywheel resurfaced, new clutch in, get all rebuilt then aligned and good to go!

 

absolutely nothing hard about it, maybe the god damn mother****ing POS check ***** but that's not always the case.
If you're just changing the bearings, they are about $40 a piece, maybe less, there's 4 of them, not counting the differential bearings which I haven't done. Get a gear puller and that will be a huge help.

 

Call GT Transmission (forget the phone # and the name of the guy) They are out of Alabama. Just tell them what you need (basically VLSD or Non-VLSD [I garuntee you that you have a Non-VLSD. If you have VLSD, then lucky you{It's stamped on the engine tag RS5F50A = Non-VLSD or RS5F50V = VLSD}]) I think the whole bearing AND seal kit cost just over 200 shipped. BUT that was on trans parts only. No engine parts/seals (which I got from Dave B.) or tools and chemicals and fluids etc… Anymore questions PM me and I'll do my best to help!

 

George at GT Trans .... Good guy, fair prices, quick shipping.

VLSD has different size 1/2 shafts (diff bearings are diff sizes - ds is much larger with VLSD).

I'd due the clutch too .... no reason not to since it's right there.

It's not an overly difficult job by any means. As for the check *****, use a magnet and vasaline

 

I just got a complete kit from GT, I believe it was $380 shipped. Bearings, seals, and syncros.

 

That's a good price. When I did my rebuild, I only got bearings / seals - no syncros. IIRC, it was ~$245 or so - shipped.

 

Just pulled my receipt. $244.84 without synchro's. Whats $.16right? lol

 

Sounds good I'll source a gear puller. Any specific size I should look for?

 

I'll give them a call. Sadly I have the Non-vlsd. I'll pick up the kit. I'll probably pull the trans and tear into it then order the parts for it, i guess I mess anything up I can order it all at once.






So I'll need the kit
Gear puller
big **** flat head screwdriver
sealant
new axle seals
....?

 

oh yea. I'll do the clutch while im in there. check on the rms. resurface flywheel, all that jazz. I can pull a trans quick but will do it while Im in there just to make it simple.

I broke my spec stg 2 into 3 pieces but I loved that damn thing. Time to order another one

 

not bad!

its just good insurance to change out the synchros? or can I examine them and see their condition and decide to swap them out. I've never touched this trans nor has anyone else so Its probably on the same synchros from the original factory.

 

you won't be able to examine the wear on the synchronizers without disassembling the shafts, if you do that you might as well replace them.

 

As for the syncros, unless they are grinding now, I wouldn't mess with them. You can check them while you're in there, they are brass and easy to spot. For them to still be in 'ok' shape, you want them to be almost an 'u' shape. If they are flattened (sometimes one or two might be, but the majority should not), I'd let em be. Ton of work as you have to tear down both the MS and the IPS and remove gears, lots of gears to get to all of them. Just make sure you use GL-4 when you refill the trans, GL-5 will break down the brass (eats it on a molecular level). People will tell you GL-5 is as good as 4, but our cars are not made for that, check FSM.

A kit (bearings / seals) should come with diff seals (axle seals) so you shouldn't need to buy them seperate.

 

Cool. I'll give them a glance. Oh yea only Gl-4. never put gl5 in my trans.

 

The only thing you can tell about the shape of the synchronizers without taking the shafts apart is what condition the blocking teeth are in. The blocking teeth may very well be in perfect condition while the friction surface (the part of the synchronizer that actually does the 'synchronization' of the gear speeds) may well be worn down, or it could be in great shape. you can ruin blocking teeth without wearing out the friction surface, or wear out the friction surface without ruining the blocking teeth.

it's up to you if you want to replace synchronizers or not, if the car isn't grinding or having any problems getting in to gear at high rpm right now, your synchros are fine for the time being at least. how easy it is for you to replace the synchroizers will depend on the tools at your disposal. if you have access to a press then it's a no brainer to replace them, you can replace them with ease. if you have to **** around with a gear puller or some rigged method of getting every press fit part off the shafts, you could be looking at hours and hours worth of work. if your situation is the latter, I'd probably leave them alone unless you're having shifting problems. if you have a press, just replace them, it's cake.

as jtz said GL5 will wear out synchronizers, but does provide better gear protection. in synchronized transmissions that are raced we often put GL5 in them even though it's not recommended because it provides much better protection for the gears in high torque applications, and transmissions that are raced wear synchronizers out very quickly anyways, so they are replaced often anyhow. it's the EP additives (extreme pressure) additives that wears them out but helps protect the gear teeth themselves. in a primarily street driven trans, stick with GL-4 for sure.

 

Thanks for the additonal info neal. Im babying my car I've kept the revs moderate to low but it always goes into gear with easy but I noticed a significant amount of play with the input shaft when I broke my clutch and had to do a quick clutch install for work the next day.

I feel it will sufficient to do a rebuild minus the synchros and the trans will come out fine. I'll try snap some pics incase something look a bit confusing but with the write up and FSM I believe I will be alright, if not I'll post back up here.

My power levels so far dont warrant me to use Gl5 just yet. a un tune 3.5 setup is fine with gl4 for now. once I finally fix this trans, and fix my beater I can look into more power adders, but It will feel great to be able to tear into this trans and rebuild it, this trans have been on its last leg for a looong time and I'd better rebuild it before it does. My clutch has way to high of a clamping force so I know its days are numbered.

 

Awsome info Neal!

It is a good fealing doing the work yourself, paying a shop hurts both my wallet and my pride. lol

 

I thought the write-ups just confused me personally. Once you open the tranny it's fairly straight forward if you are just replacing the bearings. Most of the stuff in there only goes together one way. The most complex part of it is the whole gear selector/reverse mechanism area and even "complex" is an over-statement. It's a little bit of a puzzle, just like anything else.

I'm about to open mine up again after my rebuild a year ago. My year-old IPS bearings are louder than they've ever been and I have no idea why....

deezy, you are going to buy another spec clutch? you aren't worried about the quality?

 

I'd go with a 5th gen OEM clutch (Exceedy stage 1) - well ... I should say, that is what I went with. lol

Chillin Sup bro!
Why are you having IPS trouble again ??? Are you that hard on your car?
Where did you get your bearing kit? Should be a warranty I would think. Sorry you're having trouble.

I agree, it's very straight forward, once it's open. If you have good spacial awareness, it'll be a breeze. The point of my write up was not to confuse anyone, sorry if that was the case. I just did it because it was my first time as well, and I see it posted on occasion - need help - IPS noise.

Anyway ... gotta run, goin to a ball game!

 

yooooo! I was just saying that I personally found it a lot easier to just dive in rather than read about it. Thats how most things are mechanically (with me at least). Once you get caught up reading the details it ends up sounding much more complicated than it is, its not your fault.

I'm not sure why my IPS bearings are failing..... I drive the car hard from time to time but I dont think I'm especially hard on it or anything. Maybe some metal shavings got in there or something. Hopefully none of the other bearings are effected and I can get away with replacing just the IPS bearings. I'd like to do the synchro's as well but...I dont think its in the budget at the moment with the new clutch purchase ahead.

I already have the 5th gen clutch and I feel like I'm pushing it to its limits. I want something that can hold near 300 if I do some more modifications.

also before I forget, mdeezy. For every bearing you replace, do the race as well. One of the write-ups the guy says he left the old one inside the case because it is recessed in there and hard to remove and wasn't worth the hassle considering there appeared to be no major wear. I thought I'd do the same thing only to find out that the new bearing had a completely different bevel and it was preventing me from closing my case. I took the tranny in and out of the car probably 3 or 4 different times trying to figure out what the problem was, what a nightmare. Probably screwed up my shim specs too forcing that case closed like I was.

 

Chillin sup dude!!

I was looking at the motorvate write up and it a looked a bit confusing but so did the 3.5 write up at first. I'll just keep going thru it so when i finally crack it open it will make sense to me and I'll be good to go.

What happened with your trans you need to rebuild it again?

My spec clutch was fantastic very grippy while engagement was still very smooth i was in love with that clutch. I feel due to the state of this tranny is shortened the life of the spec clutch...





but when you have an input shaft with as much play as mine Im sure it will kill any clutch sooner than you expect. I have a clutchnet red in now (grippy as fwack i know) but its starting to slip with anything more than 19% throttle in almost any gear

But before this when the clutch was on my black car, fantastic clutch, love it,just smooth all the time and no chatter. Very chattery during break in but once complete, Fantastic!

 

wow...thank for that info all race for all new bearings gotcha. Part of me wants to dive in head first, but I know how I am if I dont understand it fully or partly I'll get frustrated and confused so I'm going to read thru it a few time and I feel it will click with me once I see it and put my hands on it.


hopefully

 

waddaappp. damn yeah that clutchnet stuff is expanksive.

umm, my tranny is just REALLY LOUD. When I push the clutch in it purrs so quietly, but otherwise it sounds like a bunch of crap being rolled around in the tranny. I've been told the noise is the due to bad IPS bearings (since it stops with clutch engagement).

If you lose any little check ***** or springs or anything let me know. I just tore down a spare tranny so I have extras of most of those parts.

 

Sweet I will...but you describe another sound of my tranny. Clutch in its smooth, but clutch out, its sounds like something bouncing around in there!

 

Typical sounds of bad IPS bearings.

 

I'll check those out too. I though maybe due the input shaft bearing, but if its probably the IPS bearing them I'll be prepared to replace those. It definately gets louder clutch out than clutch in.

 

input shaft bearing = IPS bearing

 

you can tell this is my first time!

 

Free'd up space in my garage, now I can pull my car in and get to work.

GT Transmissions?
http://www.gttransmissions.com/contact.htm

they arei n GA, if this is the one then that is good, parts that are in stock and ship same day should get to me the next day

Also found this site while searching for my thread.

http://www.drivetrain.com/parts_cata...ion_parts.html

 

Glad you got the parts comin ... keep us posted. G'luck~!~

 

Sounds good.

BTW if you get stuck with any of the bearings, I have had very good luck carrying the shafts to a local transmission shop. For $20 they'll pull a few bearings with a bearing splitter and big press. Using gear pullers you will probably not get too far, especially if you're changing the synchros.

 

me and wookie time cadaver did a slight rebuild on mine, it wasnt that difficult, just make sure u seal up the tranny real good, the most annoying part was the little metal ***** in between the shaft that the shift fork is connected too

 

update!!:

I havent done a damn thing





last thursday (8/06/2009)Lost 1st gear...excessive chatter and car shook violently.
Used 2nd gear thurs-sat night(sat=08/08/09)....Saturday night just as I got to my drive way...head bad clunking/boom noises in reverse... went to try 2nd to go into my drive way head first....2nd was now gone.... Had to drag out 3rd and do 3 laps in my cul de sac to build up enuff speed to get into my garage.


My 2nd max has a perfectly fine 5speed tranny so I will pull that, install with a spec clutch, new TB, and call it a day. Then I can take my time with rebuilding this one.

FSM seems helpful...
also reading thru this - http://forums.maxima.org/4th-generat...te-up-pix.html

not sure if I need the dremel like he did, but I'd prefer not....

luckily having an extra tranny will allow me to take my time and not rush too much....


Agenda for tommorrow:

Pull Transmission
Inspect life left on clutch (clutch net red...such a high clamping force)
pull fly wheel
clean mating surfaces
Order clutch (if needed)
order Throw out bearing
take stupid axle rings off my axles for my non abs having car (raxle swapp)
pull rotors to get turned

Crack open Transmission to see initial Damage....

 

Man ... I am sorry to hear this! Is this the trans you just had 'rebuilt' by the shop? If so ... I'd be raising a huge stink!!!!!

As for the rebuild, I just used a dremmal cause I'm lazy, cheap, and didn't know any better. lol If I were to 'redo' it, I'd buy the bearing puller - not cheap, but worth it. For the inner races, you'll need a 'low profile puller' .... and they are not fun to do.

Raxles FTW!!!!!

 

nooo this tranny has been on its last leg for 2 years honestly. I'm surprised and glad it lasted this long! So I was no where close to angry when it died!

I'm actually happy because this motivated my lazy **** to finally get a good tranny on my car so I can truely enjoy this motor...should be getting a vafc-II tommorrow so I can have vias activation again..


Do you recommend anywhere to get a low profile pulley?

My worry is getting lost in the transmission and knowing where everything goes...I plan to combat that by taking a lot of pics and labeling but I'd hate to forget where something goes and now I'm screwed with a open tranny


















edit: yea the raxles were on my black car with as ABS, then I swapped all mods to my white car which has no abs, but I left the rings on... might as well pull them off so the black car can have ABS (good for when I sell), and white car will be good!

 

Nice ...

Low profile puller .... I think you can rent / borrow one from most auto parts places. If not ... maybe Harbor Freight (if you're lucky enough to have one where you live! ) or the net.

Glad to hear this is'nt that trans! lol I would be very worried if it were.

 

oh okay. I'll check auto zone, I do have a harbor freight...I'll search online and check my local store

THanks

 

which one you recommend?
http://search.harborfreight.com/cpis...ller&Submit=Go