TravisCadello

my brother has been experimenting with turning h2o into h22 or some **** im not too sure but everyday i come home from work hes working on it lol, he made a fuel cell,ran steel lines around a bottle filled cell up with water and is charging it with 18v and it makes the water bubble and supposebly them bubles are exactly like gas but its hydrogen, hes telling me my car will run cleaner and smoother and way more powerful if i let him convert my car to a hybrid kinda 50 gas and 50 hydro gen.


its a hydrogen cell, i told him hellll no if it would of worked they would of had cars running on water by now and he said nope because then the market will crash because fuel and oil is a huge part of the marketing system or some crap.


what do you guys think about this theory lol.




he wants to direct inject it into my intake manifold if i wanna use it as a nitrous or he can make it to my injectors. is he crazy or just has waaay too much time on his hands?

DennisMik

iTrader: (2)

I'm a big fan of the hydrogen powered car but hydrogen is extremely explosive. Its going to take a lot of engineering to create a fuel system of hydrogen that won't go BOOM (ala the Hindenburg in New Jersey) when somebody taps your bumper. I don't know how much knowledge & experience your brother has with cars but you make him sound less than professional. And as to a 50-50 mixture, well have him try it on his own car first. With hydrogen, you better retard your timing to be no more than 1 or 2 degrees before TDC.

TravisCadello

yea hes not very acknowledged with it, and thats exactly what i was telling him it would take a lot of tuning and **** to get the perfect mixture without a huge backfire.

nelledge

iTrader: (6)

My brother-in-law engineered a system similar to that with a hydrogen generator feeding directly into the manifold. He had to retard his timing a huge amount in his v8 to get it to run properly. He put the project on the backburner because he deduced that the only viable way to do it would be to have a stand-alone engine management system. I don't believe a 1:1 gas:hydrogen is realistic with that type of setup. It doesn't generate hydrogen in large enough quantities unless you use a huge exchanger which is not really that feasible. This is also why it's not a 'hindengburg' danger. I believe DennisMik is thinking of the hydrogen fuel cells which are highly compressed and must be chilled.



Props to your bro for trying to design an alternative fuel system, though.

colombianmaxima

I think thus is possible just gotta **** with it alot to get it right , more research more time more tests and he'll might be able to get it right , I say let him try it on his car first

jasonaaronfox

HHO production is fantastic for diesel engines because it drastically increases knock (pre detonatnion,) which is what diesel feeds on. Your EFI engine on the other hand will read the change in the fuel mixture and automatically adjust for it giving you only slight increases, causing horrific knock in your engine, and overall not doing you much good. NOW, if you take over the ECU with a emanage or some such you can control such problems, inject the hydrogen through your air intake, and I would highly recommend doing water injection to avoid and/or remove the high knock.

Your brother should get an old diesel car to test his HHO with, much easier to work with. HHO works far better with anything carberated(sp?) BTW.

silencecalls

iTrader: (2)

buy an old beater car for like $500, and experiment on that. Once it works, (if it works). Then modify your existing car.

I've heard about people converting their cars to be something like that and it worked for them. They did get slightly more power and did get better fuel mileage. So it's worth a shot.... just not on your daily driver =P

BlackMamba

iTrader: (1)

Wouldnt the Volo chip for HHO ( http://yhst-19807630266082.stores.ya...hoedition.html ) do the EFI part ? as just to avoid getting $ emanage $

TravisCadello

he may end up trying it on his 88 civic lol. ill make video if it blows lol.

beegeezy

iTrader: (3)

well, an 88 civic is worth about $100 so it can't be too bad...

Bassman607

Travis,
The amount of hydrogen your brother's system will generate will make no real difference. The amount of electricity required to make significant hydrogen is way beyond the capability of the Max'es generating power. Search "HHO". You'll find a bunch of younsters banging their heads against the wall because they never took high school chemistry or physics. Long story short; it's a waste of time and money.

Leo_Koneval

iTrader: (4)

What if somehow you removed the A/C compressor and slapped on a separate high output alternator just for that hydrogen making process? And then somehow modified the regulator so that the voltage output is a lot higher than what is safe for cars. But since this alternator is not going to be hook up to the cars electrical system, we shouldn't worry about that.

Also isn't hydrogen a bit safer compared to gasoline? Because in a accident if your fuel tank gets ruptures all the hydrogen would just rise into the air so if there was a fire wouldn't that fire go straight up, instead of burning on the ground like gasoline?

TravisCadello

yea, lol they have people who have hydrogen cars and my brothers talking to them on youtube and trying to make something happen. sounds interesting but idk.

DennisMik

iTrader: (2)

Down here in Texas we just love having a car without air conditioning in the summertime.

Hydrogen is extremely flammable. Unless you have a permeamable (can't spell it) membrane fuel cell, any puncture to the fuel tank would not be pretty.

maxgtr2000

iTrader: (29)

HHO was talk of the town when gas was closing in on $4/gal. It does work, especially on older vehicles, our ecus try to keep afrs in specific ranges so you would have to run a a lean afr with a piggyback or standalone and consistently be producing/inducing hydrogen. As far as getting it to run 100% off of hydrogen, it would run, but like it has been said, you would have to generate a huge amount. If there ever was a conspiracy theory imo hydrogen is one of them, with all the inventions and techonlogy we have we are still "trying" to figure out how to bring hydrogen technology to the public safely. When you try to shut down the fossil fuel money making industry no one will go silently into the night. There is alot of info if you search in this forum for "hho intake", there was a huge thread that got shut down (for no real reason imo, maybe the page count got too big.)

Leo_Koneval

iTrader: (4)

Ah yes, but you see in Washington its a different story. So no A/C wouldn't be the end of life. But the idea could also work by attaching a separate alternator to the engine without removing anything.

And what I was wondering was that hydrogen is lighter than air (If I remember?) and it rises when not contained and so if there was a leak and it was all leaking into the atmosphere and then a spark somehow ignites it, would the flame travel up into the air?

LOL it is actually very hard to explain my question. But whatever its just a random thought.

BlackMamba

iTrader: (1)

About the amps from the alternator, you can replace it with a 230amp , but its
worth a s* load of money (400$-+) but i found an alt pumping around 140amps,
i imagine (from what i have gathered, im no expert, and failed all physics classes, but my dad is an electrical and mechanical engineer) that with around 2.5v and 15amps and a well made drycell you could gather more than a liter/pm ? of HHO.

My question is, what is the CFM of our engine around 4k rpm, and that translated to liters, to see what would be a target of requirements to be satisfied with a HHO setup ?

96i30azn

you guys make it seem like explosions only kill cars

jasonaaronfox

Optimal voltage for HHO production is below 2v, allot of the guys producing it shove too much voltage through one cell instead of powering multiple cells in seriers. Amperage increases HHO production, not the voltage. Properly set up a person shouldn't need a ridiculously large power source. You could always use the HHO as a booster fuel to methanol to help deal with the knock propensity.

silencecalls

iTrader: (2)

Ah, the thing is - the kind of system this guy is trying to make will only produce enough hydrogen to make a burp and singe a few eyebrows if it gets out of hand. So the biggest concern is making a mistake and screwing up the engine, not killing one self. =)

96i30azn

Lol damn I was too lazy to read. Now that I did, it makes even less sense. So he wants to power the engine using hydrogen which is generated using electricity from the alternator which will lose some energy in heat. This alternator then draws it's energy off the engine whose efficiency is less than 20%.

Correct me if I'm wrong but this means that even in the best circumstances (you car has the most efficient engine AND your alternator converts 100% kinetic energy into electricity) you'll spend 5 joules worth of hydrocarbons for every 1 joule of hydrogen you generate using the system.....

BlackMamba

iTrader: (1)

There must be alot of stupid folks out there if they are doing this kind of stuff.