Well after a one day trip out of town and about 8 hours of driving, I get home, park the car, and go to sleep. The next morning I need to run an errand so I go to the garage to use the max. But, to my surprise I see a bunch of large oil spots right under the front bumper . I was hoping it was just a loose hose barb or something simple like that, but no such luck. The cooler had sprung a leak! It was pretty obvious it was the cooler because the bottom right half of the cooler was soaked with oil (the underside of the car was a mess too!). Fortunately I'd only lost about a quart and a half.

I'd been pretty impressed with the quality of Stillen's stuff until now, for example their STS, Y-pipe, RSB ect. But this is pretty disappointing so I'd recommend against anyone getting their oil cooler. To be honest the cooler itself doesn't look to be as well made or as sturdy as others I've had like B&M's stacked plate coolers or Hayden tube and fin types and especially the Hayden headered cooler I'm now using (model #1040 - I highly recommend this one anyone considering putting an oil cooler set-up together).

 

you didn't need an oil cooler in the first place

 

Enlighten us on why he wouldn't need one? Other than a blanket statement "you didn't need one anyway". The remark seems flippant rather than constructive.

I've heard that oil coolers reduce engine temps about 60+ degrees, thus reducing wear, etc. Many engines come with a stock oil cooler or tranny cooler anyway (worked at radiator shop for a summer).

This seems like a benefit to me.

Hayden Catalog

http://www.haydenauto.com/hc2000/e_c...f/contents.pdf

 

Well generally speaking in a normally aspirated motor, you want cool coolant, hot oil, and cold air (coming into the intake). If you are trying to keep the motor cooler and the timing up, you would be better to invest in a high efficiency radiator and/or 10 degree cooler thermostat. Unless you run long autocrosses on a regular basis, the oil is getting all the cooling it needs while it runs through the oil filter assembly. Not that a oil cooler is going to hurt anything..

Jesse

 

Actually I have to agree - you don't NEED an oil cooler otherwise Nissan would have included in in the first place. You stated an obvious fact and thus used up bandwith and server drive space uneccesarily - I can only interpret this as a hypocritical post on your behalf.

The question is does an oil cooler prolong the life of an engine and engine oil, and/or help performance? The answer is yes!

I have a 180 degree oil thermosat and if the oil never excceded this by a significant enough margin the thermostat would not let any oil through the cooler - at least not enough to make it extremely hot to the touch even immediately after receiving 80Mhp wind right in its' face. But the cooler gets very hot, which tells me there is ceratinly a benefit to having a cooler. It also really does help maintain the timing up, resulting in noticeably better and smoother throttle response, and acceleration. The motor runs much smoother regardless of RPM range or speed also.

02MaximizedVQ - I'm not so sure a better radiator and/or different thermostat would or wouldn't be better. I can tell you an oil cooler is much cheaper and easier to install. Plus I like the idea of having two basically separate cooling systems for the top and bottom halves of the motor. I just think (intuitively) this may result in a more uniform temperature throughout the entire engine. But regardless, at the very least it's certainly not going to hurt anything. Keep in mind also that I live in Texas where in July and August a day below 100 degrees is a "cool" day.

 

You want your oil to be at LEAST 100C (212F) at operating temp.
As a matter of fact normal operating temp for most engines (which our oils expect to see) is 215F to 235F.

100C (212F) is the warm running temp which is used to grade your oil viscosity.
If you are running cooler, you should adjust your oil viscosity, BUT making it too low (ie 20 weight) would be bad too, as the hot spots (bearings) would still be hot needing thicker viscosity.

Some engines tend to be a bit hot running others aren't.

An oil cooler in an engine model that is not known for running hot is only a good idea if autoXing.

my $.o2


Fred...

 

Fred, I appreciate the info. I'd like to do a bit more research on this then. Could you point me to some links that I could read up more on this? I understand that you statements hold in general. But I'd like to get more info specific to V6 2.5 to 3.5 ltr engines. And better yet specific to Nissan engines. I know for a fact that my oil is more 180 degrees at operating temp and I'm also using Amsoil 5-W30 so given this I'm not too concerened about viscocity or flow issues - but I want to make sure about this.

 

Been looking at nissan.co.za, they have a parts section that lists parts for the world market Maxima/Cefiro. Guess what? in addition to a y-pipe w/no cats, world market VQ's come with an external oil cooler! Go figure! Sure wish I could order non-USA stuff!

 

Do some research here:

http://forums.maxima.org/showthread....hreadid=100060


Then, do some research on this database, look for "oil cooler". There are a lot of discussions about it from people far more versed in its advantages and disadvantages than myself.




So, you said my post wasn't constructive, yet all you can give me is my wife's-brother's-sister's-husband's-son's-daughter's-second-cousin-removed says that oil coolers reduce temperature. Uh, yeah, that's what they do. The point is whether they are effective in a N/A motor. Again, do research here and see if that's the case.

My statement was based on RESEARCH here, yours was not.

 

I disagree. But if you point me to the study you are performing or have performed on a normally aspirated VQ engine to see if installing an oil cooler effectively:

A) Prolongs engine life
B) Extends drain intervals
C) Increases efficiency

all regardless of climate, then I'm eager to know more about this.



Many here get the same "butt dyno" feeling just using synthetic oil.

For now, I call:



The point I tried to make before being lambasted for putting together a nine word response (and I'll be on the lookout for the same people to be consistent in their assessment of others' posts, especially when it is in conflict or in agreement with their own statements) was that you only made more trouble for yourself installing an oil cooler that was not necessary given your current modifications. Should you have had boost or NOS, then it would be understandable.

 

Sleeper:

Sorry I don't have any links on Nissan V6's ..

It all really depends on the effectiveness of the cooler too.

A thermostically conrolled cooler that only runs when temps get over 245 F or so might not be a bad thing.
It generally wouldn't be worth putting one in ,unless you know or suspect your oil sees hi temps.

Hmm maybe doing an IR thermometer on the oilpan after a autoX run or after 100mph on a hot summer day would point one in the right direction.

This temp would still be lower than the running oil temp by a few degrees but within reason I think one could infer running temps.

What you dont want is a effective oil cooler when you dont need one, that keeps your oil from reaching the boiling point of dirty water (212 F for pure water when dissolved in your oil higher).

Then your well meaning efforts to do something nice to your engine might actually backfire.


Fred...

 

To clarify some more:

Oil coolers are not a bad thing, the consumer just need to have a rasonable degree of confidence, that they won't depress his oil temps too far (boiling point of water and oil viscosity issues).

Being able to limit temp spikes in motor oil is potentially a great thing especially for autoX'ed or heavily modded cars and in those cases may help cams and bearings and such tremendously.

Both of which generally see wear (during running) from vicosities being too low (which is sometimes due to VI' shearing, in any case not a big issue with full syn oils).


Fred...

PS; Members will please excuse my run on sentences and I hope these musings made sense.

 

Bill, you just contradicted yourself! C'mon bud what's the deal?

"Should you have had boost or NOS, then it would be understandable"

????????????

Why would it be "understandable" in this case and not on a normally aspirated engine? Do you have a study that shows whether it would or would not be of benefit in this case to be able to confidently make this statement?

I don't even know why I'm making the effort to respond to your pointless post. I'm speaking to you as a board member not as a moderator since I hope your comments are not as a moderator - because this has nothing to do with moderating.

 

Fred - thanks for the great info. I need to do more research on this then. But I wonder why companies like Hayden and Permacool have their oil thermostats set to 180 degrees or so? I don't know of any that sells a thermostat set to 245 degrees. Also Stillen sells their cooler with no thermostat at all!
So the main reason to get the oil temp to 212 is to quickly evaporate water which you definately don't want in your oil? Again I appreciate the USEFUL info and you've certainly provided some food for thought for me! I may have to revisit the idea of having an oil cooler (but the little extra pep from the advanced timing is nice, and tough to give up though)!

 

hey sleeper max,
why don't you return the oil cooler to stillen and have them send you another. the one i have is fine.
oil coolers do help engines run cooler. especially when the weather is not so hot.
in texas its like 110 in the summer, so maybe you may need a fan to blow into the oil cooler too, also a high performance radiator wouldn't hurt.
living in texas, you need everything you can get your hands on, to help cool the engine down. right. it won't hurt anything, only help keep things cool. i have spent sometime thinking about keeping things cool under the hood in the past. synthetic oil, helps keep things cool. also a good exhaust system, high flowing.
nos helps cool down the combustion chamber too. lol.

 

Read very carefully to what he wrote...then go look at the mod list you have. What he is saying, based upon your MODS that you currently have, is that an oil cooler was not really necessary for the VQ.

Additionally, he clarified in a later post, that if you had a forced induction application or N20 then an oil cooler was probably in order.

You CAN put an oil cooler on whether it is needed or not. Your choice. He was not questioning that. He simply stated that since you have not gone boosted yet...you know?

He also said he would be willing to change his answer/opinion/whatever if there was some kind of research available to read how it:

Quote:

Originally posted by bill99gxe
But if you point me to the study you are performing or have performed on a normally aspirated VQ engine to see if installing an oil cooler effectively:

A) Prolongs engine life
B) Extends drain intervals
C) Increases efficiency

all regardless of climate, then I'm eager to know more about this.



Many here get the same "butt dyno" feeling just using synthetic oil

Quote:

I don't even know why I'm making the effort to respond to your pointless post. I'm speaking to you as a board member not as a moderator since I hope your comments are not as a moderator - because this has nothing to do with moderating.

Bill runs in fact land and does not hide behind the moderator title. If you have read any of the research he has done in regards to oil and his posts...then maybe you would not be so quick to get irratated with him?

 

Colonel, I appreciate you clarifying what Bill was trying to convey. My question is why didn't Bill say what you said because that's ceratinly not how I took his statements (and no one appreciates the BS flag either)?

I never stated what my MAIN motivation behind installing oil cooler was. I was really looking for a way to maintain a little timing advance for performance's sake. I KNOW that the VQ does not NEED an oil cooler. This is obvious. I just like to get a little more power any way I can! And if as a side benefit the engine is better protected then great! But I'm thinking heavily about Fred's comments and as he stated I may be doing more harm than good. But there's no question regardless of what's Bill's opinion of the sensitivity of my butt dyno is, there is no question the cooler does provide a little more pep. Yes I have serached through just about all posts related to an oil cooler. Most memebers ARE of the opinion that you don't NEED one. I'm not disagreeing with this. However, I have seen at least two longtime and knowledgeable memebers also post that they do feel a bit of a performace difference.

I too run very much in fact land and appreciate facts presented with logical and legit backing, not what a lot of times amounts to useless and overbearing opinions.

Guys, it's been fun - I'm pretty much done for the night!

 

In order to field and arguement based upon fact, its essential that the facts are divulged as a basis of the arguement (premise, syllogism). Otherwise, one can be percieved as being merely argumentative (an ****).

I'm not a fan of:
Anatomy of an Internet Argument
<paste someone elses sentence in pieces>
<pick it apart, piece by piece while it has lost its context>
<gloat while using bogus logical fallacies: ad hominem, slippery slope, appeal to ignorance, irrelevent conclusion, and many more>

Internet post-whoring. Those tactics aren't constructive....and will not lead to anything constructive.

You know what they say about arguing on the internet.....

 

I can't help it if you don't understand the approach or don't like it. Some here should learn to read AND think rather than just knee jerk on every statement someone makes.



I'm not a fan of others sticking their nose in a conversation when all they have to contribute is an attempt at sounding intelligent for the sake of making themselves appear "above it all". This is at least the second time you've done this, and it's been noted for the record.


.....and what they say about sticking your nose where it doesn't belong.

 

My question is why didn't you understand the statements yourself instead of needing to have someone interpret them for you? Obviously you aren't lacking in intelligence, so I don't know if you got emotional and took it the wrong way or what.....

Again, I want to know:

A) Unless your hand is a thermometer, stating the oil cooler "gets hot" is not profound or scientific. Of course it gets hot, that's what happens when oil goes through a combusting engine. Simply concluding that because your oil gets hot the cooler is effective isn't exactly conclusive that it will always be effective.

B) Who has done research to allude to this benefit on normally aspirated engines? Based on oil analyses results, I could almost see the need for a cooler on some Honda products, but Nissan engines just don't exact harsh stresses on an oil the way VTEC Hondas seem to.

C) What instruments tells you the motor is running "smoother"? That's a real subjective term, which is why I called B.S. and equated it to "butt dynos". It's not really based in anything factual.

D) What gain on a dyno have you seen using an oil cooler on a N/A engine? Has anyone else endeavored to see the differences? I'm curious to know if such results are how you determine your engine is smoother and more powerful.



Amazing what the power of 9 little words can be.

I'll say it again since people here prefer to be argumentative rather than read: you made life harder on yourself by installing an oil cooler, but you knew it so that is a moot point, which wasn't stipulated in your original post.

 

Fred - hopefully you're still reading this thread although I wouldn't blame you if you checked out long ago!

Viscocity and flow issues aside - you're saying that it's absolutely critical to maintain an oil running temp of at least 212 degrees. I'm not sure if my oil gets to 212 for any significant amount of time (I seriously doubt it, especially now with the very efficient heavy duty Hayden cooler I'm using), but obviously it gets above 180 consistently. Given my current basic NA mods do you think I should just lose the oil cooler?


SeattleMax - ditto!

(Bill, I have yet to get any single constructive item, not even a single little bit of useful info from any of your posts on this thread. Amazing!)

 

So Fred has the same advice for you as I did, I was first to say it and just stated it directly (and told you to do research to confirm it, which you say you have done), and yet only Fred's post was constructive enough to change your mind. Ok.

 

Might be a dumb question, but does the same logic apply to the tranny cooler? I'm considering getting one but don't want to do something if its not a benefit in day to day somewhat aggressive driving.

 

I doubt it would apply to a tranny cooler because you don't have nearly the need to disipate unwanted water (thus the need for a running temp of 212). I had a tranny cooler on my auto and was very happy with the way the tranny behaved. The cooler I used had a "thermosatic" feature as well - actually it did this via viscocity regulation. Here's the one I used model #130-70268.

 

Sleeper,
Thanks for the link. In your previous installation, did you do it yourself? Only question I had, based upon my previous readings on the tranny cooler revolved around the hoses underneath for the return line. Did you find this part to be a hastle?

I've contemplated both, only to generate a larger margin for operating temperatures (oil, tranny, etc). Especially as engines get older and the potential for cooling system failures pop up. Anyone who has ever warped a head or overheated can sympathize. Albiet, I don't have any concrete figures on the productivity of such oil coolers outside of market spiel. I've been watching some of the threads on oil here within the org....very interesting and informative info (if disclosed). I have wondered what made the $350+ dollar Stillen kit any better than the other kits available (Permacool, Hayden, etc).

Bill
I'm not here to bust your *****. I just get torqued to see people get lambasted on these forums. Especially torqued when its moderators doing the lambasting. Overall, my perception of a forum like this is to engage in dialogue and share enthusiasm....not diminish it. Moderators are the facilitators of such enthusiasm and dialogue....or they should be. Don't take it the wrong way.

In response to any personal statements towards me directly:

and

Your right. I didn't come here to learn anything. I only came here to engage in useless dialogue in order to make myself feel good inside. Your "noted for the record" is "Appeal to Authority".

I'll cease with the learning and learn to subjugate myself to your merciful and omnipotent powers.

 

I'd highly recommend get the tranny cooler for sure. Routing and securing the hoses was very easy. The front left splash guard is kind of "indented" (cant't think of a better word right now!) in a place that allows you to easily rout a hose under the radiator but above the splashguard. The hard part was mounting the cooler itself to the condensor given the zip tie-like dealies that come with the cooler!

Check out this link Greg's Page - pretty much takes you step by step (it might also be a good time to switch to synthetic tranny fluid as well).

 

Tranny coolers are a must for many japanese transmissions.

The main killer of auto tranny is heat, which eventually warps/shrinks the seals, which lets ATF flow where it shouldn't thereby lowering linepressure!!

Japanses trannies (just like german ones) often have less heat reserve than domestic ones due to much milder summers in those countries.
The larger and morfe powerful your car, the bigger the TC, the more heat it will generate.

Even just sitting in traffic with foot on brake in "D" will produce a lot of heat.

When going 90 mph for an extended time many trannies will create more heat than they can bleed off.
Remeber a certain percent of your power is lost via tranny this all needs to be bled off.
Most factpry auto trannies have heat exchangers into teh radiator but the effciency of those is rarely up to the job.
Even if your rad is running nice and cool (say 180F) and you tranny is running hot (say 210F) then you only have a diffrence of 30 degrees that can be applied to cooling.
Not enough in most cases.

But in those situations when you are likely to need ATF cooling most, your rad is also likely to run warmer (even if the coolant gage indicates little or no change from normal op temps) you may run 20F hotter and the differnce shown on the gage may be slim to none.
Now the tranny has even less of a heat sink.

Or imagine travelling up hill at 75 in 85F ambient AC on.
You TC unlocks producing more heat, but you are on O/D making less revs thereby lowering the ATF pump speed which means the hot fluid wont flow thru the heat exchanger (such as it is) very fast.
At teh same time your coolant temps are rising (which may not show on your gage) making for less ability of teh factory set-up to accept heat.

result: The tranny cooks its seals, when they cool down they shrink ever so slightly.
Next time they shrink some more, until finally your line pressure drops which will really screw the tranny up.


Tranny coolers extend transmission life, even for those with moderate driving habits.

Fred...

 

I'd say it's pretty important to stay above 212F ( or a couple degrees more) when engine is fully warmed up, otherwise the oil may be hampered by a bigger water load than you might like.

Also oil additives such as dispersants and detergents are optimized to work around 210 to 240F (give or take).
Most chemicals work better at certain temps.
It may not be a huge issue for them to stay at say 185F, but we don't know for sure why take the risk?

I would not run an oil cooler unless I was autoXing.

Fred...

 

 

I'm not here to bust anyone's *****...I'm just full of love, but palmerwmd can you please explain this comment (edited for brevity):

Are you saying Japanese engineers make the Maxima (or Honda engineers make a civic, or Suzuki engineers make a Samauri) and don't take into account that the car will be shipped to a different country? I find that hard to believe.

Nissan, BMW, Mercedes, Volvo... they all know which cars are bound for which places and I can't believe they'd engineer their cars to 'better handle' their local climate. Please document your assertion (see, 2kSeattleMax isn't the only one who can use big words!)

 

2k2:

Just quoting what has been conventional wisdom for some time ; many companies' engineers design their cars with a local bias in them.

Thats why traditonally for example a BMW's AC wasn't as powerful as a american cars' in the same class (if there is such a thing), same for cooling.

In the year 2002 probably not as relevant a consideration as it used to be, as cars are partially designed in their target markest (if different from home markets) for this very reason.

Still it's something to keep in mind, when considering the totality of ones car.

Recent example:
The entire Toyota engine sludging debate.
Engine was designed in home market and oil change intervals and oil quality assumptions were made, based on a japanese drving environment that were not borne out by maintenance habits in the US.

Fred...

 

In all fainess to Stillen I have never seen their tranny coolers, but I find it hard to belive how one could possible made so well that it should cost $350+.

The hayden and B&M (no experince w/ permacool yet) work perfectly well, come in various sizes/abilties and most importantly are cheap enough to encourage people to put them in.
A tranny cooler can be the most cost effectrive maintenace (other than fluid changes) I can think of.

I think a few years ago i had a B&M put into my previous Q for $150 installed.
(Yes, I didnt DIY it..)


Fred...

 

I stand corrected. The Stillen is 390 bucks!!!

 

Wow Bill tries to help and gets flamed...

I don't understand why sleeper is so set on an oil cooler. An engine's temp is much more dictated by the car's cooling system, than the car's LUBRICATING system. I would say, in order to cool the engine enough to make a temp difference(oil cooler wise), it could very well pose viscosity concerns. The oil will act thinner when colder and thicker when warm? So telling your oil to act like a thinner oil when you want the protection of a thicker oil when driving the car hard is hard to understand.

I could just run a colder thermostat in my car and make the same if not larger changes in engine temp. That is if I thought it would do any good(which I don't yet)

 

Jeff, aka Lockmaster!, a few posts up I stated the main reason for the oil cooler was performance related. I wanted to keep the timing advanced a bit. The ECU retards the timing as the engine gets hotter and hotter. In fact advancing the timing, or keeping it from being retarded, is one of the main things that aftermarket ECU's or tweaked ECU's do! Advancing the timing is a very well know way of getting a little more pep. The cooler does help do this by lowering the engine's operating/running temp. It really makes a perceptable performance difference regardless of what certain moderator's opinion of my butt dyno may be. But lowering the engines operating temp may not be such a good idea as Fred has stated so I think I'm leaning heavily toward removing it, but as I said earlier it sure is hard to give up that extra little pep! Now if someone would come out with an ECU for 5th gens (that among other things advanced the timing) then there may be enough of a heat load where a cooler would really be beneficial.

By the way I understand you have to stand up for your fellow moderator but if what Bill "contributed" is considered "helpful" then I'll have to revise my definition of "help" at least when it comes from Bill!

 

I understand you want a lower engine temp. That is exactly what I addressed in my post. I lower engine temp IMHO could be obtained easier by a thermostat that opens sooner(ie.. a 190 deg vs a 220 deg-for purely example purposes only) So how much easier that would be? And the temp would be maintained much more consistenly. Not just by how much the oil cooler happened to cool the oil and then the engine. Again the viscosity of the cooler oil is also a concern.

 

Here are some tidbits, as those getting bent out of shape for me stating a common sense response has been knee-jerked out of proportion:

Let's say you are using Mobil 1's new SuperSyn synthetic, which has a sustained viscosity at 100 Celsius of 10.1, which is about 11% lower than Mobil 1's old tri-synthetic at a 5W/30 viscosity and already in the low range of the proper viscosity for a 30 weight oil at temperature. I know because I am looking at the results in the soon to be updated oil spreadsheet.

Ok, let's arbitrarily say that a cooler lowers the temp by 20 degrees when operating properly (10%; fairly typical average stated through manufacturers, etc.). What do you think the viscosity will be at 90 degrees celsius, which is what the cooler will "force" the oil to run at? That's right, it will be lower.

So, with Mobil SuperSyn, it's safe to say you will be running an equivalent viscosity of an xW/20 with an oil cooler, as you won't be allowing that oil to get to its higher viscosity at full temperature for the proper engine protection.

Translation:


Therefore, with the VQ you'll probably do more harm than good in a N/A situation (unless you constantly drive in the desert).













And my defintion of help is helping yourself and trying to contribute rather than jump down people's throats for stupidass reasons. This will be remembered the next time some of you utter an opinion about something and try to hide behind your perceived rights here.

 

Ok fellas, allow me to review some of the basics here:
(No flames please)

Viscosity: A given fluids resistance to flow.

Viscosity rating: A number that represents a given fluids' resistance to flow; in proportion.
(ie the higher the # the higher the viscosity(!), also proportional means that a 40 weight will have twice the resistance to flow of a 20 weight at the same temp)


If a given oils viscosity# is lower, it will offer less resistance to flow , ie it will flow easier ie it is thinner (!).

Example a 30 weight oil (say 11cSt) at 100C (212F) has a given resistance to flow, then it will have more (!) resistance to flow at 90C and offer less (!)resistance to flow at 110C.


ECU and "engine temps":

In most cars (certainly in mine and I suspect in VQ's as well, if that is not so techs educate me...) the ECU measures the coolant temperature as it's main parameter for engine management.

If the coolant temp is too low, it will change the fuel mapping into start-up mode.
If the coolant temp is too hi it will start retarding the timing and run the mix richer to cool down.
For maximum power one wants to keep the coolant temp in the range where neither happens.

If you wish to prevent summer powerloss, the answer is a higher cap radiator rather than a "off" thermostat.

Alternatively it may help to thin your coolant mix.
Say to 70% distilled water, 3.5 % redline wetter water rest antifreeze.

This happens to be the mix I am currently running in my VH45DE...


Fred...

PS: Advancing timing can be done very(!) carefully but only with a coolant in aboslute tip top shape, as the radiator is your cars heat sink, you obviosuly dont wanna wind up suffering from "summer knock".

 

Fred, once again thanks for the excellent info. After reading your post I can pinpoint exactly what I was trying to achieve with the cooler - preventing the ECU from retarding the timing and keeping the engine in that optimum temp range you referred to for peak performance. I misworded this when I said I was trying to advance the timing - these are two different things and I was referring to them as one in the same. But I like your suggestion MUCH better. By the way, I removed the oil cooler tonight and instead will try the coolant mix you suggested. Another bit of info - I really was not very concerened with viscocity issues since I assumed that AMSOIL 5-W30 maintained acceptable viscocity over a wider temp range. One should never assume though and I never researched if this was the case or not, but it's irrelevant now!

Just to pick your brain a bit more - I'd appreciate your take on the following: I have a service manual for the 5th gen Maxima (I know nothing of other gens) and it turns out the max has a coolant thermostat that opens at 180F (same temp that my oil thermostat opened at), additionally it has a "water control valve" that releases the coolant from the cylinder block into the return stream to the radiator once the temperature reaches 203F. This is somewhat confusing since you mentioned that ideally the coolant temp should be 212 or a couple of degrees above. Does this make sense to you?

SeattleMax - $390 or so is actually the price of Stillen's Oil cooler. They don't sell a tranny cooler.

Bill, Jeff - I'm not going to waste my time.

 

Note: Doesn't really matter what you do with the radiator cap. If the thermostat is set at xxx degrees, the engine will maintain that temperature. If you increase the capacity or efficency of the radiator, the thermostat will still keep opening/close within it's set range. I will go out on a limb and state the maxima radiator is probably over engineered(I've never seen a post regarding high engine temps as of yet-but it could happen)

And Sleeper, thanks for basicly taking Bill's/my advice. We were telling you not to concentrate on the oil but the cooling system. After all that's what you were trying to do anyway(indirectly) Palmer just spelled out in plain words.