Icey needs a new toy

http://forums.maxima.org/showthread.php?threadid=164138

 

Bling bling! My RSM can do all that for much less... AND I don't need a PDA to use it.

 

seriously! That thing works the same exact way as a G-Tech/Pro (accelerometers) only it interfaces to a PDA and gives you a little more data.

You can get a lot of dyno pulls done for $350, and CarTest2000 ($40 dolla) can give you pretty accurate performance numbers based off of said dyno's.

 

1-I already got a pda that I don't use laying around.
2-The RSM look is RICE.
3-The RSM is a permanent fixture.
4-The RSM requires splicing into factory wires.(Some of us have a "warranty" to TRY and use)
5-Try storing multiple runs and overlaying them to see before/after differences.
6-Too many damn button pushing to switch modes, turn things on/off, reset, etc...
7-etc...etc...

The biggest difference is the ability to store data and transfer it to my PC, which allows a lot more data interpretation. Plus, I don't have to worry about pulling over and trying to read/analyze the data from the RSM, instead I can just save it and make more runs to view/analyze later. The RSM is a cool device, but it's lack of memory and downloading data is NOT worth it for what I would use it for.

 

A little more? Try a lot more. I have a G-Tech Pro and I've used it maybe 4x, where as I use my laptop and OBD software all the time. I'm just tired of lugging around the laptop.

Dyno pulls are limited in their scope. Yes, a dyno analyzes engine output, but not in real world situations. Not to mention, how many trips it would take to the dyno shop just to tinker around on the weekend. I'd easily spend 10x that much on dyno time here. A dyno is not very applicable for the type of stuff I or most people do, while tinkering. A dyno is more of a benchmark of total gains at a particular time NOT something you can make changes and see if it helps/hurts performance. Dynos are a waste of time unless your trying to "tune" A/F.

CarTest is not going to allow you to tweak/try different things in the real world. It's a VERY good simulation for known parameters, but doesn't count on the unknowns which is MOST OF WHAT I CARE TO TEST.

 

1-I already got a pda that I don't use laying around.
=== I can get my hands on one too.
2-The RSM look is RICE.:-p
=== That's why it's cool.
3-The RSM is a permanent fixture.
=== Nope, you can always take it off if you plan the wiring procedure correctly.
4-The RSM requires splicing into factory wires.(Some of us have a "warranty" to TRY and use)
=== Can be hidden without a problem.
5-Try storing multiple runs and overlaying them to see before/after differences.
=== RSM can store multiple runs also.
6-Too many damn button pushing to switch modes, turn things on/off, reset, etc...
=== Same for PDA.
7-etc...etc...

The biggest difference is the ability to store data and transfer it to my PC, which allows a lot more data interpretation. Plus, I don't have to worry about pulling over and trying to read/analyze the data from the RSM, instead I can just save it and make more runs to view/analyze later. The RSM is a cool device, but it's lack of memory and downloading data is NOT worth it for what I would use it for.

What's there to analyze?

0-30 MPH time
30-50 MPH time
0-60 MPH time
¼ Mile ET
¼ Mile MPH
60 feet time
Maximum g's for acceleration and braking
Maximum g's for left and right turns
Estimated ¼ Mile time and speed
Estimated Engine Horsepower


If it can pull other stuff then that would be cool (i.e. Pepper's ODB-II thingy). You can buy an RSM AND ODB-II scanner for a little bit more (~$20).

 

Therefore FREE and not an issue. It's definitely not worth spending $100+ on a PDA just for this.

Eventually, you can only put so much crap on your dash. Hmnnnn...Apexi RSM, Apexi AFC, 3-pillar pod gauges, turbo timer, Blitz boost controller, harlan shift ligth, Valentine one, Valentine concealed display, whatelse you need to distract ya? Too much crap for my taste, but that's fine for your flava and EXTREME Maxima. I would just rather have something that's EASY to install and uninstall to be used ONLY when being used.

Wires are still there. Bracket or mounting stuff is still there. Looks like crap once removed? Definitely not plug-n-play.

Yeah right! Most of US can't even splice two wires correctly and you think that's not a problem to conceal. Especially, if there is a "mysterious" electrical problem and Nissan is on a witch hunt. It's permanent, the wires are pierced/cut and will always show tampering.

How many? 8MB worth? No! Plus, I guarantee your little display isn't going to provide you enough resolution to compete with Excel and a monitor. There is no comparison to the amount of data you can store, organize, and interpret from dozens, hell even thousands, of runs compared to the few runs temporarily stored in RSM memory.

Try jumping back and forth on the RSM and writing it all down on paper, while I push a start/stop button on my PDA. I doubt it's even close to all the menus and button pushing the Apexi requires. Just a guess though.

Multiple runs overlayed will show TRENDS. A rate of change, any bumps/dips, and whether your AFC, boost, bottle pressure, shift RPM, is varying. Not to mention ECU learning/relearning. The list can go on and on. I don't know exactly what until I have one to play with.

I agree the OBD-II software with G-sensors and accelerometers INTEGRATED would be awesome! However, nobody will ever R&D that. The pDyno is pricey and isn't for everyone, but the installation and convienence of the pDyno makes it more appealing than my G-Tech Pro and your RSM IMHO.

I'm not trying or going to sell everyone(maybe ANYONE! ) on this, I just think for a LOT of weekend tuners and tweakers this is a GREAT tool to have instead of a G-Tech Pro and ESPECIALLY the butt dyno.

 

How is a dyno not representative of real world situations?

If your tinkering involves making very small changes to your car, I can pretty much guarantee that a G-tech just isn't going to have the accuracy/resolution to tell you anything meaningful. Dynos can see very small differences, but G-Tech's cannot.

err..I don't think so. Granted, this PocketDyno thing is cool, but I just don't see how it's really all that much better than a regular G-Tech for over twice the price. I suppose the 60' time measurement would be nice, if it's actually consistent enough to be useful.

So what unknowns are you trying to test?

 

Shifting, tire pressures, clutch holding strength, ram air, yada, yada... you know the differences.

Not my point. Getting dyno time scheduled and completed is a 1-shot ordeal. The car is strapped down and your no longer able to tweak and try different things. It's more of a wham bam thank you maam kind of ordeal.

Have you ever uses a G-Tech Pro? If so, you'd know it's a bish sometimes to get anything consistant and then you have to depend on your note taking skills to record/catch info. Sometimes, if your not quick enough the data is lost. The Data logging is the biggest difference IMO.

You don't want to know Steve! Hehe. Let's see. TB opening angle, airfilter vs. no airfilter, OSACI vs. POP, Stillen POP with/withOUT Franken midpipe, unbolted cat, double clutching vs. regular, side stepping the clutch vs. granny shifting, RPM shift point, tire pressure, Redline engine and tranny oil, you know anything that's a bored mind can get into on a Saturday afternoon.

 

I'll reply when I get home.

 

What is little ole work getting in the way?


Don't bother Kev. Just reply to my BIG email sooner rather than later.

 

Yes, I do have a G-Tech/Pro sitting around somewhere at home. It's collecting dust. =)

The data logging and interface to PDA is neat yeah, but is it worth an additional $200 over a regular G-Tech/Pro? You decide. If you have money burning a hole in your pocket that you're itching to spend then have at it and don't let me stop you. hehe ;-)

Airfilter vs no air filter? About 5-7HP on a 3.0 engine, from a previous dyno I've seen. Can simulate this in CarTest. TB opening angle???

I'm telling you, you're just not going to have the accuracy/resolution that you need to test out the very minute changes that you'll see between these different setups. A G-Tech can very easily tell the difference between an intake and no intake at all. But geez, you're trying to test the differences between different intake setups! Even if a g-tech/pocketdyno could pickup the changes, you would probably have to make at least 10 runs (at least!) on the same stretch of road just to minimize the error and get any sort of useful data. And by the time you get that done, your car is gonna be heat soaked, which could corrupt and skew your data and make it useless.

The smaller the changes you're trying to test, the greater the error percentages will be. You can still get reasonable data, but you just have to run the same tests over and over and over and over again to statistically calculate out the error and get standard deviations, etc.

Like I said, $350 buys a lot of dyno time

If you want to see the difference with the Frankencar Mid-pipe, tell Steve (dmbmaxima) to dyno it so that we can all justify spending another $50.

I'm pretty sure Paul2kGXE did a dyno of the OSCAI and posted the results at his page @ www.paulwendy.com I checked, but it looks like he took his Maxima stuff down. But he's still around. If you can't find stuff here just email him.

And MaxSE2k just did a dyno comparing a CAI to a WAI

http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/9289/dyno.html

Someone here with a 4th Gen auto did a dyno with stock cat and 3" RT cat. I don't know how much more a test pipe would give you, but I'm sure there's a dyno floating around somewhere for that too.

Shift times are all fully adjustable in cartest.

Granny shifting (0.5s shift, 0.2 engage) 00 5spd: 15.2 @ 93
Speed shifting (0.2s shift, 0.1 engage) 00 5spd: 14.9 @ 94

So about an 0.3s and 1 mph trap between granny shifting and speed shifting. There was just a thread here a little while ago where somebody had a good trap but their ET was just slow and they mentinoed that they really weren't shifting that fast. ding ding! =)

With a chassis DYNO, CarTest will calculate the optimal shift points. This is useful for the torquier engines like the 4th Gen and VQ35's, which max out on power a good bit before redline. But you have a DE-K. Peak power is at 6400rpm and the rev limiter is just past that. . Your shift point is just before the rev-limiter cuts in

Adjusting the redline to 8000rpm in CarTest on a VQ30DE-K, the optimal shift points are calculated to be:

1-2: 7630rpm
2-3: 7080rpm
3-4: 6880rpm
4-5: 6590rpm

CarTest:

1/4 mile w/redline shifts: 14.9 @ 94
1/4 mile w/above shifts: 14.8 @ 94

But since the rev-limiter is well before all of those optimal shift points, you're stuck with wherever the rev-limiter is set at.

Also adjustable in cartest.

Well below the resolution of an accelerometer based tester. Seriously, you'll only be able to test this on a dyno. I think MaxVQ has a dyno of Redline tranny oil at www.motorvate.ca

Seriously, whatever parameter you're looking for or interested in learning about, somebody, somewhere on the Internet has written a page about it. TRUST ME. I am such a complete car GEEK (and proud of it dammit!) that sometimes I HAVE spent an entire saturday just searching for and reading technical articles on cars!

And don't limit yourself to just Maxima.org searches. Internal combustion engines, transmissions, and cars in general all work the same way. If you find a technical article for a Miata, it will apply in some way to a Maxima also. Just remember to keep engine sizes in mind. If you see a Miata intake dyno good for 4HP, then multiply by two to get the approximate gains from the same mod on a Maxima since the engine is twice as big.

The Miata pages/forums are AWESOME places to get tech info. It's an awesome car that's just never had much power. There isn't much that those guys have *not* explored/tested/dynoed in the quest to get more speed out of their cars.

Another great place to look for N/A tuning options are muscle car pages. Lots of these guys have been hot rodding their domestics and running down 1/4 mile strips for longer than most people here have been alive. And any N/A tuning trick is also applicable to a VQ. They are afterall, internal combustion engines too.

Want to learn about turbo's? Checkout www.i-club.com the WRX forum. I didn't know this, but the WRX has actually been around for close to 10 years. It's only in 02 that it finally came to the US. There are lots of very mature tuning options for those cars, and it's a highly technical forum. The best part is, a lot of the big name WRX tuners are REGULARS on the forums, always posting up their latest tests and product info with actual dyno's, along with helping people out with their cars. I once spent an ENTIRE WEEKEND reading and learning about turbo setups and tuning obstacles. You could probably do the same thing at SupraForums.

Want to learn about S/C's? Search here =)

 

Thanks Steve. Definitely food for thought!

You brought up a KILLER point about the redline shift. I'm going to use it as my shift indicator(light) next time I go to the track. I've always figured the best possible times from a VQ30DE-K are by bouncing the REV limiter in 1-2 and 2-3. The question is whether or not to lift on the gas pedal, but since I naturally don't, I'll find out soon enough.

Thanks for the advice about the other forums, I'll check them out.

 

How about pocketlogger.com ? They have one for $175, one of motor trend magazines I think it was, said it was a nice aftermarket addition to their subaru impreza wrx.

 

I emailed pocketlogger.com and got back something pretty blunt like, "we don't do GB". That was it. I was like dayymn that's kinda rude, so I just gave up.

Anyways, I'm still looking for something with G-Tech or RSM abilities AND OBD-II INTEGRATED. One of these days, maybe I'll get frustrated enough and just write my own. LOL!

 

Brennan from pDyno just emailed that Maxima.org members can get $50 off by using the coupon code "maximafifty" until 11/29.