Well finally I got ahold to the shop owner and got the dyno results from the ECU. After overlaying them I am even more upset than before but you guys be the judge. I am going to talk with TS and see what they have to say about this, but will wait to hear some responses first.

HP after the ECU is red


Torque after the ECU is the red


A/F after ECU is the red


now that the data is available and no longer just talk please discuss what I should do. Nothing changed from the two runs except the ECU. I did all the steps called for and reset the ECU after installing.

 

I would be very ****ed if i had just spent $500 and seen no effect on the dyno. I think that you should either call them and tell them they made false claims or go and see them if possible. I first think you should call them and ask them what is the deal

 

D'oh..

Does this mean that every other 5.5 gen did not gain anything with this mod?

 

wow...curves look better pre-ecu matt.....

I say, return it!

 

The last time I spoke to Danny, he said that a/f should be between 12.5 and 13.5. Maybe the headers require you to be a little leaner than 13 even which is how I read your a/f.

 

but what I dont understand is how I lost power in the areas where the a/f was untouched. Know you guys see why I was quite upset last week.

 

Now I know why you were so ****ed. Even though you stated it in previous posts, the pictures truly make the entire "episode" come in to focus. I still have no idea why the hell you would have actually lost power in the untouched RPM areas! There's just no way that should have happened. And I do not see why they wouldn't set the overall A/F ratio to 13.5:1. That's still plenty rich enough for every day operations...

 

Yeah. It's almost like they pulled timing between 4400 and 5600rpm. On the other hand, how many dyno runs did you get in w/the TS ECU?

 

I say return the ECU and get your $500 back.

 

3 pulls total and they all looked nearly the same. I used the best dyno before and after both with the air filter in the car.

 

damn I say return it. Same dyno and correction?

 

Matt,
Call TS up and let them know what's going on. At best, they work out the bugs and you get the horsepower you paid for. At worst, you send it back and get a refund.

 

I thank E55AMG2 said his TS ECu worked better with the standard TS program. If they can't explain and/or fix that drop, I'd have them flash it either (a) to the standard TS program OR (b) back to stock.

 

How long did you have the ecu on your car before dynoing?

Also, could pulling the air filter out confuse the ecu? What I mean is, we all know that the ecu needs time to learn, and maybe that affected your dyno.

 

The air filter was in the car for these pulls. Im not sure what the issue is but I made it aware to TS and they acted as if nothing could be done about it and then talked about dumping the whole Automatic program b/c they could not figure it out.

 

Looking at the 5000-5500 dip, it seems your car doesn't like it leaner.

Between 5500-6000 no change and 6000+ ~5whp gain maybe.

If the limiter change doesn't help shifts stay in the strongest part of the powerband, I say return it.

 

You paid $500+ for 1 hp?



I wouldn't return it. I'd keep it, file a lawsuit, and use the money I made off it to import a R34 or three after paying the lawyers.

ECU mods are notoriously flaky. Some people see vastly better gains than others. This is true on any modern vehicle, not just our Maximas! There's very little tweaking that can be done to an ECU these days, not like it was 10-20 years ago before OBDII when almost every parameter could be modified.
These days with federal regulations, etc. it's very difficult to achieve much of a result with ECU modding, even if you reverse engineer the ROMs. Even tweaking AFR, spark curves, rev limiters, etc. is difficult and time consuming these days.

I have a lot of respect for the companies/individuals out there who put the time and effort into these kind of mods but I feel they owe it to us to provide proven results before asking for our money. Only once I have firm dyno results from a wide sample pool of cars would I consider sending my money off for a ECU mod.

 

[Ranting]

I love how everyone one says the same thing about almost every mod made for the 5.5 gen Max. You go out and find me a 5.5 gen Max that lays down more than 240 N/A HP to the wheels. As far as I know, there ain't a damn one out there.

We've tried headers from 2 manufacturers, intakes from countless manufacturers, exhaust systems and parts from countless manufacturers, underdrive pulleys from 3+ manufacturers, spark plug upgrades and replacements, and now an ECU replacement. No matter what combination of any of the above mods, no one has laid down 240+ N/A HP to the wheels. The only ones who are topping 240+ N/A WHP are the Altimas. And we know that their motor is "supposed" to be the same. Even down to the part numbers, their motors are matching up with ours.

So why isn't anyone going any farther into the real source of the problem itself......... the motor? I mean, take a look at the Hotshot headers. Hotshot made alot more HP/TQ on the Altima motor than they did on the Maxima motor. But yet we still b*tch about the fact that their product doesn't perform.

Now, I talked to both Juice and Blu this weekend and told them the same thing. Something else is causing our mods not to make the power that they should be. In design, the mods should make the "claimed" HP/TQ that they are saying. While we have still YET to see a dyno from Stillen about their headers, Stillen knows that "in a normally-functional, VQ35 engine" the headers should show their claimed gains. But Nissan, whether or not they knew about it, has definitely goofed up somewhere in the design or manufacturing of our cars that has caused us to hit a glass ceiling with our mods.

Now I don't know about you, but I'm bound and determined to find that glass ceiling, and bust it with a sledgehammer. And I'll do it by myself if I have to.

But for now, you can all b*tch about how none of the mods make any gains. Send them all back and return to stock. But don't you dare come at me, Blu, Juice, or anyone else who continues to try, and say jack crap about what you think about what we do with our money.

I've told Blu that he should do whatever he feels is best. If he wants to send it back and wait for someone to break the glass ceiling, then so be it. Or if he wants to hold out and hope for a fix, so be it.

And BTW... for the record.... even if the ECU shows no gains on the dyno, it has shown gains on the track. Sometimes a mod isn't all about power and torque on a dyno.

Sorry for the hijack Blu, but it needed to be said.

I'm done.

Edit: E55AMG2 says the same thing.

[/RANTING]

 

Studman,

I think all the negativeness your sensing is just people venting their frustrations. I don't think people mean to be critical of those that are pushing the limits of the car.

I've thought about the motor being the culprit myself. At some point it may be cheaper and more effective to pick up an Altima engine or even a 2004 Maxima engine that came with the appropriate tranny.

In any case I plan on dynoing on friday with the Hotshot headers. I have a full catback which I don't believe blu or juice had and a UDP which I know juice doesn't have. I'll also be running a homemade popcharger type intake. We'll see if any of that helps.

By the way, has anyone with a six speed dyno'd with Hotshot headers yet? I think all the 240+ hp altimas were manual transmissions.

 

I do have an UDP and you are correct all the Altimas in the high 230's are manuals. If Im making high 220's than the manual Maxima should make high 230's thus making them the same motors, same power output as the Altima manuals. When I see an auto Altima making 240+ with my mods then I will get concerned.

 

We are not comparing apples with apples. The 5 speed manual in the Altima is probably the tried true 5 speed that Nissan has been using for years in the Maxima 4th and 5th generation maxs. Their first shot at a 6 speed has been satisfying and/or dissappointing to many owners. I would not be surprised if that is where our major loss of power is. Think about long ago when we were complaining that the Altima's were putting the same WHP down that 5.5 gen maxs were even though we had 15 more horsepower. Our engines have better intakes and headers to begin with, and nissan did this to compensate for the 6sp tranny's loss of power. Since the Alt's have crappy intakes and headers on them they see huge gains on aftermarket products, which when ported to maximas sees very few gains. There is nothing wrong with our motor, the only thing I am curious about is what makes the extra 10hp in the new max and can we get our hands on those parts.

 

Looks like they followed the same approach they took on the 350z, but not as efficient, by straightening the intake tract to minimize restriction.

I think they moved the batter over and really straightened it out IIRC.

At least that's one thing I noticed they also did on the Altima to bump from "240hp" to "245hp" to stay ahead of the new Accord.

 

here a a Auto Altima making some decent HP with the same mod's.

pic 15 is the dyno

http://www.nissantalk.com/registry/v...?vehicleid=225

 

looks about right. Im sure if I added an pop intake, and a rear section my peak number would be a little more but I just don't want the noise. I did pull 234whp when I removed the air filter though.

 

Blu,

Any chance on a PR CAI? Or are you not willing to drill a hole in the fender?

 

I plan to make my own intake for the track. The small battery, removed headlight and filter right at the opening. I have spent to much for intakes and they aren't worth the cash IMO. I will make my own for about $10 and will work better for what I need it for.

 

please dont doubt the ecu. i know that it gains and thats all it matters to mee. people may think ts screwed us but there is no way they would becuase i was the test car and saw my car make power. i also agree in what stuntman said about how dynos dont really mean that much as long as your track time get better. mb the problem is the o2 sensor who knows

 

I have to say I am really starting to feel it. For some reason it seems to take its sweet time in letting the gains emerge. It seems when I hit about 5000rpms my car noticably rocks back on its suspension and it has never done that before (besides the initial launch). I cannot wait to see what the gains are 4/4. I will psot them as soon as I can get them scanned.

 

Blu, are you running the stock catback?

TK

 

I'm running the stock axel back and muffler. I have a 2.5" B-pipe

 

You got some roadside vids of what the headers and stock muffler sound like? Where did you get the B-pipe from?

If not, where should we meet?

 

http://forums.maxima.org/showthread....31#post2822131

 

Once I get the exhaust leak fixed I'll make a quick video of the hotshot headers through stock rear section as well as the cattmans.

I have the WSP B-pipe.