Advanced Timing vs The Dealer
03-02-2005, 05:53 AM
#1
Advanced Timing vs The Dealer
Sooo... I am having my radio replaced at the dealership today, and I asked them to bump my advanced timing to 17 degrees. He says he cant do it. I say, I know you can, people have done it numerous times before. He goes to talk to one of his techs, and comes back with this answer. We can hook it up here in the bay, but as soon as we disconnect Consult, the computer will default back to factory settings. I say, are you sure, I know people have done it before? He says it always defaults back to factory settings. Are you guys aware of this? How do you know if it acutally saves the setting in the car computer, and does not revert back to factory settings?
03-02-2005, 08:17 AM
#6
See...the TRUTH comes out.
They are scared of the hypothetical consequences, HOWEVER tell them the FACTORY SERVICE MANUAL states that ignition timing is within specifications if it is within the range of 15 degrees PLUS or MINUS 5 degrees. So, up to 20 degrees, if possible, is apparently fine according to the people who actually built the car.
Anyways, tell them 15 degrees is so people can run crap lower octane gas and you EXCLUSIVELY run premium Chevron/Mobil quality fuel, therefore you'd like to take advantage of the extra costs and have better throttle response. Just my .02.
They are scared of the hypothetical consequences, HOWEVER tell them the FACTORY SERVICE MANUAL states that ignition timing is within specifications if it is within the range of 15 degrees PLUS or MINUS 5 degrees. So, up to 20 degrees, if possible, is apparently fine according to the people who actually built the car.
Anyways, tell them 15 degrees is so people can run crap lower octane gas and you EXCLUSIVELY run premium Chevron/Mobil quality fuel, therefore you'd like to take advantage of the extra costs and have better throttle response. Just my .02.
03-02-2005, 08:22 AM
#7
Called different dealer, they will do it for $79 for hour labor. This is the minimum they will charge. Going there at lunch today. Does this really make a noticable difference. I use 93 octane, and hopeflly it will be beneficial at 17 degrees for timing.
03-02-2005, 08:27 AM
#11
Originally Posted by chr0nos
Called different dealer, they will do it for $79 for hour labor. This is the minimum they will charge. Going there at lunch today. Does this really make a noticable difference. I use 93 octane, and hopeflly it will be beneficial at 17 degrees for timing.
03-02-2005, 08:50 AM
#12
I was actually gonna get my ECU done at the dealership to bump up my timing....but I held myself back becuz I am going to get the TS ECU once my headers go in (2months or less)....and I know the TS ECU bumps timing up with an all new A/F map.....so Imma' hold back on doing this....and to all those who plan on going the TS ECU route should hold back as well....
03-02-2005, 08:56 AM
#13
FYI, TS modifies the open-loop timing used during WOT and aggressive throttle increases, however the Consult is changing base idle timing that is used during normal easy driving, ie closed-loop.
Anyways, I'd do both.
Anyways, I'd do both.
Originally Posted by steven88
I was actually gonna get my ECU done at the dealership to bump up my timing....but I held myself back becuz I am going to get the TS ECU once my headers go in (2months or less)....and I know the TS ECU bumps timing up with an all new A/F map.....so Imma' hold back on doing this....and to all those who plan on going the TS ECU route should hold back as well....
03-02-2005, 12:52 PM
#17
Went to a different dealer at lunch, they charged me $85 with tax to do this. I said its a 15 minute procedure. He said we are using Consult, this is a $5,000 dollar instrument, blah, blah, blah. I said fine, do this anyway. Sooo, the tech does my timing (it was set to 14 BTW, resets it to 15, then bumps it up to 17), and does the idle air volume procedure. I have not had the chance to open it up on the streets yet, but dont feel that much difference during normal (slow) driving. Here is a print-out of the Consult.
03-02-2005, 12:56 PM
#18
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 587
In canada we dont get 93 octane commonly.We commonly find 91 octance..in that case would it be benficial to advance to 17? that will cause pinging right? what is the factory default? Can we bump it up to somewhere between factory default and 17?
03-02-2005, 02:05 PM
#19
factory default is 15. some may have it between 13-15. I think on a different thread i read that with 91 octane you should be ok with 17 degrees timing. you could always have it set to 16 degrees just to be safe.
03-02-2005, 02:20 PM
#20
Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 297
Very interesting, now i'm considering this chr0nos. Let us know when you acctually push the car and see if you feel anything different. I always fill my can with 93 octain, so if this will make more use of my gas $$ i'd be glad to get my timeing set to 17
03-02-2005, 02:56 PM
#21
Originally Posted by Maximax2
Mine has "stuck" for over six months now. Just had the max in for some work, and the dealer re-ran the tool to confirm.
Mine has stuck for 18 + months..., and yes, my car likes it plenty fine.
03-02-2005, 03:01 PM
#22
Which dealership did you go do? Falhaber, Kings or Jeff Wyler. Which one gave you the shoulder and which one did it for you? I've only serviced my car at Falhaber and it was all warranty work.
03-02-2005, 03:28 PM
#23
gonna be 4 years soon on my Maxima since I had my timing done, never has it changed. Tell the techs to go to Nissan training school and learn something bout the cars they are working on. Peace out. I advanced the timing even on my moms 00 Altima, and it runs 87 octane every day with no pinging- problem is Altimas need 20 deg timing stock, and my Altima was set at 15 ! I bumped it up to 22 deg and the car lays rubber (auto) better than my brothers auto 4th gen.
03-02-2005, 03:34 PM
#24
Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 297
Originally Posted by BlackBIRDVQ
gonna be 4 years soon on my Maxima since I had my timing done, never has it changed. Tell the techs to go to Nissan training school and learn something bout the cars they are working on. Peace out. I advanced the timing even on my moms 00 Altima, and it runs 87 octane every day with no pinging- problem is Altimas need 20 deg timing stock, and my Altima was set at 15 ! I bumped it up to 22 deg and the car lays rubber (auto) better than my brothers auto 4th gen.
03-02-2005, 03:48 PM
#25
I'm having this done Thursday. I'll post with any difference I feel. Someone mentioned this mod was less useful on manual cars than autos. Has anyone dont this to a 6 speed and what were the results. I may have him bump it to 20 since 93 octane is readily available here in Florida.
03-02-2005, 11:22 PM
#27
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 211
Originally Posted by Derrick2k2SE
Someone mentioned this mod was less useful on manual cars than autos. Has anyone dont this to a 6 speed and what were the results.
any effect on mpg?
03-03-2005, 05:35 AM
#28
Which dealership did you go do? Falhaber, Kings or Jeff Wyler. Which one gave you the shoulder and which one did it for you? I've only serviced my car at Falhaber and it was all warranty work.
03-03-2005, 06:06 AM
#30
Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 297
So do you guys think it's best to only get this done at a dealership, because i know a mechanic who lives up the street from me and does work on my car here and there including my 60k checkup, car felt great after that. So unless this timing should be done by the dealership i'd probably get it done cheaper through him
03-03-2005, 06:31 AM
#31
Originally Posted by dextterity
So do you guys think it's best to only get this done at a dealership, because i know a mechanic who lives up the street from me and does work on my car here and there including my 60k checkup, car felt great after that. So unless this timing should be done by the dealership i'd probably get it done cheaper through him
03-03-2005, 09:33 PM
#32
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 531
i have had my timing advanced 2 degrees for a while now. cant really say if it makes a difference. but it was checked last time it was at the dealership and it still showed it.
i was told if you unhook the battery it will reset the timing. is this correct? i need to know before i start messing with my stereo again. i usually unhook the batt just to be on the safe side before messing with any power wires.
i was told if you unhook the battery it will reset the timing. is this correct? i need to know before i start messing with my stereo again. i usually unhook the batt just to be on the safe side before messing with any power wires.
03-04-2005, 07:28 AM
#33
removing the negative cable will do nothing to the timing. you would have to run crappy gas then get knocking for it to pull timing. that or use the consult to retard the timing.
03-04-2005, 11:27 AM
#34
Just posted on another thread that I found a dealer in the Tampa Bay area (Autoway Nissan of Clearwater) that will advance my timing to 17 degrees. Have an appointment for this coming Wednesday.
Pedro
Pedro
03-04-2005, 03:31 PM
#37
My dealer (Liberty Nissan in Libertyville IL) did it without my asking and never even told me they did it. My MAF was bad. Before going to them, my OBD program reported 15. After they replaced the MAF, my OBD showed 17.
It definitely gives a little boost at the top end. I lost about 2-3 mpg though. I am pretty sure that is why they dont do it at the factory.
Oh and they did not charge me, unless it was built into the labor for the MAF.
It definitely gives a little boost at the top end. I lost about 2-3 mpg though. I am pretty sure that is why they dont do it at the factory.
Oh and they did not charge me, unless it was built into the labor for the MAF.
03-04-2005, 03:37 PM
#38
Advanced timing will not decrease, but actually increase fuel efficiency.
More time to burn means peak cylinder pressure is higher and occurs earlier before the exhaust valve releases/wastes the unburnt fuel.
More time to burn means peak cylinder pressure is higher and occurs earlier before the exhaust valve releases/wastes the unburnt fuel.
03-04-2005, 03:48 PM
#39
Maxima Pilot
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Beaverton, Oregon
Posts: 1,467
Originally Posted by JimmyH
it definitely gives a little boost at the top end. I lost about 2-3 mpg though. I am pretty sure that is why they dont do it at the factory.
And mine has been at 17 degrees for -ooohhh- maybe two years...nothing changes this except another date with another Consult II
03-04-2005, 05:22 PM
#40
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 564
i dropped about two miles per gallon.. but that was because i was "testing" out the timing off of everystop light this week.. I LOVE IT, Car has Power from 2000rpm-5000rpm then VAIS kicks in WOOHHHHOOHHHHHH..
Buy the way pedro, go to infiniti of tampa and ask for miguel, mickle, michel, some guy who starts with an M like that.. give him 20 bucks and hell do it, takes him 5 min.
Buy the way pedro, go to infiniti of tampa and ask for miguel, mickle, michel, some guy who starts with an M like that.. give him 20 bucks and hell do it, takes him 5 min.