differences between 5.5 gen max and 350z intake manifold?
03-14-2005, 11:05 PM
#1
differences between 5.5 gen max and 350z intake manifold?
Recently met up with a local who had a 350z 6spd performance trim with JWT intake and greddy evo2....I have a 2k2 6spd with BERK/APEXi and Cattman catback.....we did a few pulls for fun from a 10mph roll...suprisingly we were dead even up until 110ish when he SLOWLY started to pull away...other than dat we were dead even....some might call BS, but i'm not stock either....I don't have anything in the trunk (no spare,jack,carpeting) and i'm running VERY lightweight rims (16lbs flat in 18x8.5 size)...while the z probably had everything in his trunk...and I saw he was running the stock 18s (i know they are really heavy)
anyway after the runs...he asked me why my car was screaming so loud...."I said its becuz its my VI kicking in at 4k.....doesn't your vq have that loud switch over with that JWT intake?" he said "naw all I could hear is your car screaming right next to mine"
so my question is....is the 350z intake manifold only single runner? I know the maxima has dual runners and the 2nd one actives at around 4k RPMs....and the result is a very loud switch over and large pull with an intake.....and no i'm not a noob...i've searched on my350z.com and have not found any results on the STOCK intake manifold on the 350z..only aftermarket ones.....
was wondering if anybody on here knows anything about this 350z intake manifold? and can elaborate more on this manifold that gives the 350z more power than the maxima....
anyway after the runs...he asked me why my car was screaming so loud...."I said its becuz its my VI kicking in at 4k.....doesn't your vq have that loud switch over with that JWT intake?" he said "naw all I could hear is your car screaming right next to mine"
so my question is....is the 350z intake manifold only single runner? I know the maxima has dual runners and the 2nd one actives at around 4k RPMs....and the result is a very loud switch over and large pull with an intake.....and no i'm not a noob...i've searched on my350z.com and have not found any results on the STOCK intake manifold on the 350z..only aftermarket ones.....
was wondering if anybody on here knows anything about this 350z intake manifold? and can elaborate more on this manifold that gives the 350z more power than the maxima....
03-14-2005, 11:27 PM
#2
Check out your own IM, it's just a trick IM, not dual runners per se', more like a top and bottom half, top half is for 3 cyls, and the bottom half, is for, you guessed it, the remaining three. There's a small throttle body like flap that closes and straightens the path @ 4k. It's located on the passengerside, you can't miss it, the only actuator around there. Follow the IM from the TB and you'll notice the same 2 paths whcih get divided into the aforementioned top and bottom. Our IM's seemed to be designed for low-mid rpm torque, not necassarily high end power, when compared to the 350Z/G35. Look at the dynos for those cars, they typically put down more hp, but lack, or are on par when compared to our cars, torque, typical dyno for 02 G35's is 220hp/210tq. They do have a VIM, as they also exhibit a small dip in power suggesting it does indeed have one. But usually peak a@ a higher RPM compared to our Maximas (Except for SR20DEN respectively) Our IM is a lot louder and less smooth both in sound and feel than those RWD VQs. I cannot vouch or even say how the G35/350z IMs are, I've seen it laying on the engine, and there would have to be some pretty substantial changes that would have to be made so that for one it would even fit under our hoods. Emax was closest to doing it, though never finished. IIRC, most if not asll RWD VQ owners state the tamed mannerism in sound of their cars even w/ intakes, whereas ours are pretty vocal when pushed hard. Just putting a midpipe and GAB, my car was much louder than I appreciated, and even rivaled the loud offensive note my 4g gave with the USIM. There's a spacer between the plenum or a new plenum itself that those guys have been putting and it does help, but I have still yet to look deeper into the G/350 IM.
03-15-2005, 12:10 AM
#4
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Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 45
Here is a thread on 350zmotoring.com that may give you some insight about the innerworkings of the 350z intake system.
http://350zmotoring.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23423
This thread was showing off the new lower plenum used on the 35th anniversary model.
Heres a pic of the engine bay on my Z. I have replaced my upper plenum with the Crawford Plenum. It doesnt slope down as much in the front and allows more airflow into the front 2 cylinders. One of the more popular 350z mods. I got my 2k3 max SE about a month ago and I can definitely vouch for you. It is 100% stock and pulls nearly as hard as my Z which last dynoed at 257 to the wheels.
http://img153.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img1...img00184bm.jpg
http://350zmotoring.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23423
This thread was showing off the new lower plenum used on the 35th anniversary model.
Heres a pic of the engine bay on my Z. I have replaced my upper plenum with the Crawford Plenum. It doesnt slope down as much in the front and allows more airflow into the front 2 cylinders. One of the more popular 350z mods. I got my 2k3 max SE about a month ago and I can definitely vouch for you. It is 100% stock and pulls nearly as hard as my Z which last dynoed at 257 to the wheels.
http://img153.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img1...img00184bm.jpg
03-15-2005, 12:14 PM
#6
AS far as aftermarket companies go mass producing one for the A33, A34 like Aerosmith says "Dream On"
For now let's work with what we have, try to improve it, but as those links states, it moved the power band up and lossed tq. Good forrace apps, but if you're just a normal around town type of guy, then you should be fine wiht what it has. .
For now let's work with what we have, try to improve it, but as those links states, it moved the power band up and lossed tq. Good forrace apps, but if you're just a normal around town type of guy, then you should be fine wiht what it has. .
03-15-2005, 12:49 PM
#7
for sure....I can say that the stock 2k2 IM is wonderful for low end grunt....and it does hold its ground when it comes to high revs as well...unlike the stock USIM for the 4th gens....where it has good low end grunt, but signicantly drops off on top end...this IM is not as bad as I thought after running that 350....i mean damn we were dead even the whole way....I thought his top end would eat me alive (287hp vs 245hp)
03-15-2005, 02:14 PM
#9
Originally Posted by vsamoylov
if i could find one from a 350z, i would so try to put it on my max. anybody got one for sale?
Won't fit...FWD/RWD, and the intake (and aftermarket ones) for the 350Z/G35 sit too high to close the hood...
03-15-2005, 02:22 PM
#10
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Originally Posted by Quicksilver
Won't fit...FWD/RWD, and the intake (and aftermarket ones) for the 350Z/G35 sit too high to close the hood...
03-15-2005, 02:38 PM
#11
Originally Posted by vsamoylov
the fwd/rwd make no difference to me. i could fab something up and how do you know that it sits way too high? it ooks flat and if a 3.5 Maxima IM clears the 4th gen, i dont see why the 350z IM wont fit.
Because I've tried it, and aftermarket Z upper intakes...Also, the aftermarket ones don't include everything we would need in the 5.5th Gen Maxima to perfectly mount up anyway...
03-15-2005, 02:40 PM
#12
I think the FWD and RWD thing has nothing to do with this scenario.....but yes I did hear about hood clearance problems....EMAX tried to fit a 350z IM into his 2k2 and it wouldn't clear....but it did bolt up....I can't remember how much modification was required....or if any was even needed
03-15-2005, 02:43 PM
#13
Originally Posted by steven88
I think the FWD and RWD thing has nothing to do with this scenario.....but yes I did hear about hood clearance problems....EMAX tried to fit a 350z IM into his 2k2 and it wouldn't clear....but it did bolt up....I can't remember how much modification was required....or if any was even needed
The stock one fit/lined up fine...it was an aftermarket one that didn't (my prior post)...
Turn that intake 90^ and look at what a PITA it is to make it work...
03-15-2005, 02:46 PM
#15
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Originally Posted by Quicksilver
Because I've tried it, and aftermarket Z upper intakes...Also, the aftermarket ones don't include everything we would need in the 5.5th Gen Maxima to perfectly mount up anyway...
and the result of that was? and what would we need to mount it perfectly? hood clearance i cant see why it wont clear becasue as i said it is flat on top and the 2k2-2k3 max is loped up and it clears perfecly and there is still enough room. but who knows. i never tried to put one on.
and plus you said the stock one fit? what was needed to make it work?
03-15-2005, 02:52 PM
#16
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and here is a pic of a engine comaprtment. looks like there is enoguh romm for it to fit even if you have to turn it 90 degrees. the TB would come out next to teh radiator and then you run a midpipe towards the resrvior for the coolant from the radiator and put the filter there.
03-15-2005, 02:53 PM
#17
Originally Posted by vsamoylov
and the result of that was? and what would we need to mount it perfectly? hood clearance i cant see why it wont clear becasue as i said it is flat on top and the 2k2-2k3 max is loped up and it clears perfecly and there is still enough room. but who knows. i never tried to put one on.
and plus you said the stock one fit? what was needed to make it work?
and plus you said the stock one fit? what was needed to make it work?
Dude, it won't fit. it you don't believe those of us who tried it, then find your own on the 350Z forums (from one of the guys/gals that purchased aftermerket ones) and buy it off them. There are like 3-4 of us that tried it. It's a couple inches of clearance that are needed at the very least (could probably make it work with less, but it would require more modding than just changing out the hood). We had (those of us working on it) talked about an aftermarket hood...almost like a Chevrolet Cowl Induction hood...to make it fit. That went no where, of course...
I almost want to say that's when SR20DEN started his little intake plenum mods...and his do work and fit fine. Look at the numbers he puts out in his 5.5th Gen...
03-15-2005, 03:23 PM
#18
I just want to do some 105mph+ traps in my 6spd....I know most 6spd owners who have the stock IM only do like 101-102mph with the same setup as SR20den...i/h/e/weight reduction....that intake manifold plays a damn big role in sr20den's amazingly high traps....gosh I sooo want to trap his speeds...hehe....
as for me hitting low ET's like SR20den....I know i am not capable of it...my driving isn't on PAR with his....plus in the end its still FWD and A33 (heavy body)....so I ain't gonna trip if I get crappy ETs....these A33s are just tricky little things to launch...as long as my trap is blazing....I can brag about something....
as for me hitting low ET's like SR20den....I know i am not capable of it...my driving isn't on PAR with his....plus in the end its still FWD and A33 (heavy body)....so I ain't gonna trip if I get crappy ETs....these A33s are just tricky little things to launch...as long as my trap is blazing....I can brag about something....
03-15-2005, 05:20 PM
#22
Originally Posted by vsamoylov
so did anybody try to use both lower and upepr from the 350z?
That's the real trick. No one wants to give up a 350Z lower, and I don't have the time to put my car down for a day or two to try it out...
03-15-2005, 06:01 PM
#23
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ahh i c. well according to this thread, cant you use the one this guy bought? http://350zmotoring.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23423
i understand that people dont want to buy it and then try to make it work and it doesnt work. once i get some money, i am going to look for a parts car that is totaled and go from there.
i understand that people dont want to buy it and then try to make it work and it doesnt work. once i get some money, i am going to look for a parts car that is totaled and go from there.
03-15-2005, 06:35 PM
#26
Same engine, VQ35DE, but it comes in different flavors as we already know.
Not sure if it will bolt up to our block.
So is the 350Z a single runner, w/o "VI"?
There would be some tricks to extending the TB wiring 90* from where it's at, as this would also include the MAF wiring & electronics.
Not sure if it will bolt up to our block.
So is the 350Z a single runner, w/o "VI"?
There would be some tricks to extending the TB wiring 90* from where it's at, as this would also include the MAF wiring & electronics.
03-15-2005, 08:28 PM
#28
Originally Posted by vsamoylov
well the wiring is not a problem. just the holes in the block i hope are the same.
I hope the lower is the same as well. If everything does properly line up, it might solve the upper half intake problem...but I imagine it will still require some custom hood modding...
03-15-2005, 10:14 PM
#30
thanks quiksilver....it seems as tho the crawford intake manifold is the most popular choice at my350z.com....i wonder wuts so good about this one when the stock 350z IM already flows well....maybe this crawford regains low end tq? while still maintaining the stock high revving 350z IM characteristics...
03-15-2005, 10:23 PM
#31
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Originally Posted by Quicksilver
I forgot to answer you question from earlier regarding what brand of aftermarket upper plenum I tried. It was a Crawford. Let me find a pic of it real fast...
03-15-2005, 10:35 PM
#32
Keep in mind that's only the top 1/2.
I can't find the picture of emax where he placed it on top of his engine to show that it wouldn't fit, and I can't remember if he had removed the stock A33 top portion, whcih if I remember right, he did remove it. But ony the top part.
I can't find the picture of emax where he placed it on top of his engine to show that it wouldn't fit, and I can't remember if he had removed the stock A33 top portion, whcih if I remember right, he did remove it. But ony the top part.
03-15-2005, 11:10 PM
#33
Originally Posted by vsamoylov
yeah what is the difference between this one and a OEM one? and you saying that this one wont clear the hood?
03-16-2005, 11:21 AM
#36
Originally Posted by vsamoylov
yeah what is the difference between this one and a OEM one? and you saying that this one wont clear the hood?
I'm saying, as I've said in my prior posts, that neither the stock 350Z UIM nor the aftermarket 350Z UIM fit under the hood with the stock Maxima VQ35 upper removed (and the stock Maxima VQ35 LIM left in place). You need at least two more inches (by my rough calculations) to get it to close correctly. That's why people thought up the cowl induction hood...which would probably work IMHO. After that, most everything would be academic. Remove the battery and place it in the trunk, get rid of all the stock airboxes and silencers, run your intake tract to the right headlight assembly/fender area, extend MAF system wiring...etc etc etc. I guess I could just go ghetto and run without the hood for a bit...
03-16-2005, 12:58 PM
#38
Originally Posted by NmexMAX
So with that being said, is the blot pattern the same from the upper z33 to the A33 lower IM? Now to try the lower z33 to the A33 block.
Believe it or not, that's not what I actually checked (as dumb as that may sound). The stock 350Z UIM looked like it lined up well, but the Crawford didn't...
So, take that info with a grain of salt...
03-16-2005, 01:49 PM
#40
Let's clear one thing up.
My question is ...
The z33 manifold, both upper and lower PLENUMS, would be all together 3 pieces ... correct? The top piece breaks in half, then is tehre a bottom piece that connects to the heads?into the cyls?
My question is ...
The z33 manifold, both upper and lower PLENUMS, would be all together 3 pieces ... correct? The top piece breaks in half, then is tehre a bottom piece that connects to the heads?into the cyls?