Fair enough.... ya gotta tell it like it is.

 

great write up and nice pics. Cant wait to see info of dyno, and i would like to hear a sound clip. 10 times louder sounds like a lot, and isnt frankencar like the quietest aftermarket exhaust available?

 

I have Cattman rear now, Irish44J bought my Frankencar.

 

Puppet....Nice work buddy. Get that thing tuned. That video of the header clip, I am assuming that is the entire Cattman system. That definitely sounds nasty!!! Gave me goosebumps

 

Dynos and videos will come in time, but don't hold your breath for it. I have tons on my plate at the moment.

 

where did puppet post a video of the header clip??

 

Puppetmaster

I'd like to see what avatar your going with next since you finally got your headers installed j/k

What you going to go with next the safc-II or the vafc-II?
I went with the safc-II since the wires are longer to put it in the sunglasses holder.

 

There is nothing stored in the ECU from it, but it DOES monitor the output from the sensor/sim. I can't explain why it's not goign into ready mode- just listing my experiences with them.
also realize that different brands of sims will act differently and one may work better than the other.
I opened up this one and it's a simple 555timer with a few resistors in there to control the on/off timing and the output voltage.

There may be a difference in engines, but both ECUs follow OBD-II emissions standards and were both designed by Nissan. It's very likely both were done by the same handfull of electrical engineers at Nissan as well. As an EE myself, I certainly carry over as much of my code and design work as I can between projects. no point in reinventing the wheel just because its a different size. and since a rear O2 sensor is a rear O2 sensor is a rear O2 sensor, it's likely they recycled the code for them. thus, logic would state that the 240 and Maxima ECUs will behave the same.

 

I will have my brother check it out. My Sim is from http://www.o2simulator.com/ .

What o2 sim were you using?

 

I was using the one I got from Cattman..

 

I think he was referring to yours. I don't have one of mine.

 

It would be nice to have the longer wiring of the S-AFC II, but I have a V-AFC II: more tunable points plus an rpm switch for the VIAS (although I see no reason to change the switchover point yet).

 

puppet, when you dynoing ?

 

Sorry to bounce around, I was actually referring to the clip that you have posted on your sig.

 

haha ic ic...thanks

anyway, your mod list looks pretty sweet...when ya going to add those headers on? oh yeah, why did u decide to go with the 16 degree timing advanced versus the regular 17? Kinda thought that was funny since most of us go 17

 

Header threads always turn into VAFCII threads... bah!

 

I think that's just a mistype because it says 17 degrees in his mod list on his cardomain page

 

I'll throw in my 2 cents....having both heard Joel's car with this setup approaching from a block away and having driven the car myself at below-highway-speeds.

1. The tone is very nice, but I will agree with Joel that is is pretty damn loud. I heard him coming from quite a ways away and he was on the OTHER side of a row of townhouses.

2. I drove the car a couple of miles and although it is a throaty, mean sound with the Cattman catback, i would most definitely get annoyed. Not sure about on the highway, but at about 45mph in 4th/5th there was noticeable drone. IMO it would sound great at the track but drive me and passengers crazy on any extended driving.

3. The power is most definitely there, though I didn't really push it and still am not used to the throttle lag caused by the throttle-by-wire on the 5.5G..still prefer the throttle cables myself. I could feel the extra power vs. other 5.5G I've driven, but didn't push it hard enough to make a realistic comment.

4. If it was mine, I would definitely have to go with a quieter rear section/muffler. Joel is going to have to be VERY lucky here in Fairfax County if he's going to avoid "illegal exhaust" tickets.

 

an no Joel, I will not trade you the Frankencar rear section back....

 

Stock muffler FTW, I got really sick of the Headers with the full Cattman Catback. Yeah, it sounded really mean when you wanted to, but it got annoying all the time.

 

Once again, sound is a very subjective thing. We've got a couple folks here who find the sound of the Cattman header/catback combination to be too loud, which I understand and is a perfectly legitimate perspective.

But to put this in context, the vast majority of our exhaust part purchasers not only are very satisfied with the sound, they consider it to be moderate when compared to other performance exhausts. We receive this feedback constantly, and they are very pleased. We even get a few comments about wishing it were louder... can't please everybody, but its one reason that we offer two versions of our 04-06 catback.

Its worth pointing out that the only aftermarket exhaust for the Maxima that is quieter than the Cattman exhuast includes a muffler that is so heavily baffled that it makes less power than stock. We've had to temporarily replace this brand of muffler when dyno testing in order not to artificially suppress the results of whatever part we are testing. [There's an intake out there that we have to do this with as well.] Not trying to raise a ruckus, its just a simple, incontrovertable fact. If you have to make the car as quiet as possible, and lose the least amount of power, use our b-pipe and a stock muffler with a nice tip welded on it.

Brian C Catts
Cattman Performance

 

you always do....

 

Dont get me wrong, I loved your Cattback for what it was. I am still running your B-Pipe, but after I added the headers it was WAY louder than just the catback. I really regretted having to sell your muffler, I just got sick of my Fiance and friends complaining about the noise all the time. I even tried foam and sound deadening before I finally had to get rid of it.

I was also worried about tickets with it, I had cops lookin at me all the time... But yes, it is a matter of taste. I just could not make it work after the headers.

 

Brian,
People are simply stating their FIRSTHAND opinions of the sound. Of course it's subjective! And of course some people want it loud. But I'm not sure why you're getting all defensive here - if we think it's loud, we are free to tell others what we think. Just because some of your customers DON'T think it's too loud doesn't mean that others DO think its too loud. It all depends on what you want. Here in Fairfax, Joel WILL eventually get a citation for his exhaust volume. I'll put $10 against you on it.

As to the "other muffler" commentary We all know that the rear section makes little difference to overall whp unless the car is boosted and needs the extra breathing.

1. Since it's obvious your dig is at Frankencar - 1. I have never seen ANY evidence (ANY!) that the Frankencar rear section loses power vs. the OEM rear section. Show me an independent dyno. It's like Warpspeed claiming their ypipe makes more power than yours.....total salesmanship.
2. Most people who buy the frankencar exhaust get it because it is stainless (unlike OEM) and QUIET (unlike yours). I like to be seen and not heard, personally. Others want to be louder. That's fine too, but the Cattman rear is significantly louder than the FC, even without headers, and that is a FACT.
3. Let's not kid anyone here - most people buy rear section exhaust for sound, not power. If any rear section alone adds any kind of power to a N/A (unbuilt engine) car, it is in the very low single digits. So let's not stack up rear sections next to ypipes or headers here as monster power adders, ok?

As for me, I've always said good things about Cattman personally (having bought things from you in the past and using an old-style cattman ypipe that is great), and you've always been helpful in answering questions I've had...

.....but I swear to God nothing pisses me off more than when one manufacturer talks **** about (either directly or in allusion to) another manufacturer. Completely uncalled for. Feel free to talk about how "great" your products are, that's cool. But you just sound like a "salesman" when you dog other companies, especially without evidence. It's bush-league. Reminds me of the way Warpspeed talks **** toward Cattman, and we all hate Warpspeed because of their garbage attitude. Don't be like them. You make a good product, and so does FC....that's the bottom line. IIRC Joel did not see any gains/losses in power when switching from the FC to Cattman rear section....he bought it for the sound (pre-headers).

You said you're "not trying to raise a ruckus"...well, if that is the case, you shouldn't have said anything that was sure to raise a ruckus from those of us who own the product in question.

And I'm not sure why you're taking digs at Frankencar anyhow, since it's next to impossible to get one of their rear sections these days....it's not like people have a choice right now...it's either Cattman or OEM or fart can.....

I can't believe I have to get upset about this **** on a Sunday

 

whoa...damn josh...you're so right in a way....

just take it easy though....smoke a cigarette

 

you know me, I'm not pulling punches, just speaking my perception of the truth. Maybe you need to re-read my little note to Dallas as WS if you think this one is somehow harsh.

I just hate how the various manufacturers here ALWAYS seem to take a shot at their competition, even when there is no reason to. There are enough actual USERS here on the org of equipment to give unbiased opinions.

What Dallas thinks of Cattman, or what Brian thinks of Frankencar, or What Brian (Berk) thinks of Injen, or what Corey (RedlineMax) thinks of CustomEnterprise are certainly NOT unbiased opinions, no matter how nice guys they might be

(note to Corey: I didn't mean that )

Brian Catts is a good guy making good products, but this is not the first time I've heard him denograte other companies....and I'm just tired of it. Let the people who use your product talk **** for you (as they will), don't do it yourself.

i wish they would just stick to talking about THEIR products and not talk about other peoples' products....in this case, I can't think of anyone who owns a Frankencar catback who isn't happy with it - so that should say enough. It's not "better" or "worse" than the Cattman catback, because it is a different system for different priorities...

EDIT: I just came upon a perfect example of how all these guys should talk about other companies. I'm a bit surprised it's customenterprise who said it:

and no, I'm not buying any spoilers...don't worry

 

BTW P-master I have a stage II under brace sitting around if you want to test the fit with the headers. Just let me know.

 

not using it??

 

Heck, no apologies or anything like it need be said, your perspective on this is as valid as anyone else's, its an individual thing - my point was just to place it in the larger context of the customer feedback we get on our exhaust systems.

There's a definite proportion of customers who feel that some exhaust part combinations are too loud and, as you note, there's a big difference between the volume of our catback by itself, with a y-pipe, and with the headers; each sound is unique in tone and volume. Transmission makes a difference too - I'm not sure there is a performance exhaust that doesn't drone on an automatic. It seems like auto trannies always cruise in the "zone of drone" on the rpm scale. OTOH, I've had customers who added the catback to their headers because they wanted the distinctive sound of the headers to come through clearly.

Additionally, I was just talking about a majority of our customers thinking the volume is OK, I definitely would not speculate that a majority of their wives, girlfriends, fathers, mothers, etc. felt the same way. And those opinions can be VERY important to our quality of life. ;-)

I've got an 02 6M with Cattman headers, FastCat and catback, and maybe my perspective is a little skewed for reasons that include: 1) I'm not only used to the sound, I'm quite fond of it, 2) I've had louder exhausts, so this doesn't seem too bad, 3) cops don't look twice at me here in Tucson, 4) nearest female relatives (wife, daughter) are not bothered by the sound, and 5) I'm a bit older than most of you so I figure if it doesn't bother me, it won't bother the younger guys.

Brian C Catts
Cattman Performance

 

Wow... Punchy!

Im with Josh, I like to be seen and not heard. Brian, we all know you make great products, but I wouldnt worry about it if people say they dont like your product. Hell, Im sure there are people out there who love the Greddy Evo exhaust... I sure dont. Doesnt mean I dislike Greddy, they make good products for their mainstream market.

 

I don't think anyone here is saying that they don't like his products. We all love his products. I think some are just saying that the sound level when all of them are combined (particularly headers+catback) is a bit high for their liking. Nobody is questioning the quality of the products



Greddy exhaust doesn't have quite the quality reputation that a Cattman or Frankencar have in terms of exhaust....From what I've heard they have some rusting problems, as well as fit problems.

 

Not right this minute. Same goes for the BABK, Intake, Pulley, stereo, and a couple of other goodies. Things change when you have a kid, start a new job, and redo your entire basement. Free time is almost non-existent. Still have about two miles of trim to paint

 

sounds like you and Joel are in the same boat.

you gotta do like I did today - finish shoveling the snow and then sneak out and work on the car for 2 hours while the wife is watching the olympics

I hear you about the home renovations, big-time. This has been a project house for the last 5 years and I'm trying to finish up some last-second projects so we can sell it this summer (and buy a house with a garage )

 

With all due respect, the point we are making here is that the headers amplify the volume of the cat-back a little more that we expected. I'm not sure how you surveyed your customers or gathered feedback on this in order to determine the statements I quoted above, nor is it my intention to examine those claims, but of that "majority" of your customers, how many of them are 00-03s with a set-up that consists of headers and the cat-back? I just have to point out that taking a header set-up into consideration, 4 of the 5 people in this thread with headers plus cat-back have explicitly stated that its too loud for their respective tastes.

My sample may not be at all representative of the status quo, since it is constrained to only those who are reading/posting in this thread, but I think it does illustrate somewhat of a trend, even if restricted to these circles.

Just an observation...

 

On a lighter note, I can't believe this thread got over 1,100 views...

 

Exactly the same, but he's about 4-5 months ahead of me.

 

From reading all this. I believe that Cattman Has Great Products & I also believe everybody has their own Opinions But I think everybody has taking it a little to Far.

This is not an accusation or insult, this is just my observation.

 

"I just have to point out that taking a header set-up into consideration, 4 of the 5 people in this thread with headers plus cat-back have explicitly stated that its too loud for their respective tastes."

Trust me, that's your opinion and well "4 of the 5 people" in this org's opinion- and nothing more. Keep in mind there is a whole big world of users outside the org (possibly 1 or 2 of the more than 1K+ hits on this thread) that have Catt heads & catbacks that don't share the "4 of the 5 people" thoughts on volume levels.

I myself have all the above (and quite a bit more) on my 03 and am blown away by the sound & so is literally everyone else I've come into contact with.

Thanks Brian for a killer performance product that was easy to install with a perfect fit & that sounds incredible as well! Don't change a dam thing (well, except for possibly those gaskets ) unless it nets more hp's.

 

I'll simply note that, as you'd expect, we get a lot of direct feedback on a substantial part like our catback systems - I hear back from at least half of our sales. If we felt that the majority of customers were uncomfortable with the sound, we'd change the design.

BCC

 

sound opinions are such a subjective thing and theres no use in arguing over them. When i first got my cattman y installed with my frankencar b pipe and cattman rear section, I hated the sound. After a while I got used to it and now I love it. Everytime I hear a fart can going by I realize how happy I am my car doesnt sound like that! I mean I dont know the situation with headers, but the point is that products should be praised for their quality and effectiveness, not on something as individual as sound, because everyone has different tastes. I mean if you want to have a good product, then buy Cattman, if you're not happy with the sound, don't buy it, someone else will...

It's all about personal choice. A manufactuer makes a product and puts it out there and its the consumer's decision to buy it. You can't expect a company to change its product based on how individuals feel about it.

Just my 2 cents...

Anyway, good luck with the headers