'02 4AT Transmission problems, HELP plz. slipping, no OD, etc.
12-28-2009, 06:09 AM
#1
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 53
'02 4AT Transmission problems, HELP plz. slipping, no OD, etc.
Alright, so before I get flamed, just wanted to say that yes I have searched and read through about 5 pages of transmission threads.
The problem I am having seems to be a culmination of some of the experiences of other .org members.
To begin, For the last few weeks the car has been shifting hard from 1st to 2nd. Was not really slipping just shifting rough. This kept getting rougher and rougher as time would pass until eventually it was slamming into gear. 2-3 was not an issue at this point.
Last week, the tranny began to slip on the 1-2 shifts only. even just barely accelerating, it would take off fine, but when it was time to shift, it would sort of "free-Rev" up another 1-2k rpms before shifting, like I was WOT. and from this point it would skip second and just shift to 3rd, where as if I were giving it more gas it would find 2nd, but it would slip BBBAAADD.
This morning, driving to work, the car was doing as the above states, but after about 10 minutes of highway driving, it would not go into OD. I have not yet had a chance to drive it again, because I am stuck at work, but I attempted manually shifting back and forth between D and 3 to "coax" it into gear with no response.
After reading threads I know it would be anything as simple as an ATF change, to cleaning sensor connectors, to replacing revolution speed sensors , solenoids, and possibly a whole transmission.
Basically it seems to be getting worse and weirder issues as time passes.
Here are some things I do know and facts to help eliminate obvious questions.
-The car has 93k on the ODO.
-I have never changed the ATF fluid, which is dark red, almost blackish but does not have a burnt smell to it.
-I will attempt to clean the connectors with electric parts cleaner ASAP, as well as drain and refill ATF.
-I have a check engine light, but It has been there since the MAF swap a couple months ago (long before these problems arose) so I will need to get it scanned for a code.
-While the car would not go into OD, I did find that the transmission was still "locking/unlocking" and dropping down to low RPMs like it should when the gas is released, however when the gas was reapplied, it would rev up back to its corresponding RPM as if it were in 3rd even though it was in D.
I am basically trying to see if anyone else has had these exact problems. Like I stated, i know many members have had some of these, or variations of these, but no real results seemed to come from efforts, except for replacing the transmission, which is what I am trying to avoid as I am in college currently and on my own... i.e. no $$$.
ANY help at all would be GREATLY appreciated guys.
Thank you again.
The problem I am having seems to be a culmination of some of the experiences of other .org members.
To begin, For the last few weeks the car has been shifting hard from 1st to 2nd. Was not really slipping just shifting rough. This kept getting rougher and rougher as time would pass until eventually it was slamming into gear. 2-3 was not an issue at this point.
Last week, the tranny began to slip on the 1-2 shifts only. even just barely accelerating, it would take off fine, but when it was time to shift, it would sort of "free-Rev" up another 1-2k rpms before shifting, like I was WOT. and from this point it would skip second and just shift to 3rd, where as if I were giving it more gas it would find 2nd, but it would slip BBBAAADD.
This morning, driving to work, the car was doing as the above states, but after about 10 minutes of highway driving, it would not go into OD. I have not yet had a chance to drive it again, because I am stuck at work, but I attempted manually shifting back and forth between D and 3 to "coax" it into gear with no response.
After reading threads I know it would be anything as simple as an ATF change, to cleaning sensor connectors, to replacing revolution speed sensors , solenoids, and possibly a whole transmission.
Basically it seems to be getting worse and weirder issues as time passes.
Here are some things I do know and facts to help eliminate obvious questions.
-The car has 93k on the ODO.
-I have never changed the ATF fluid, which is dark red, almost blackish but does not have a burnt smell to it.
-I will attempt to clean the connectors with electric parts cleaner ASAP, as well as drain and refill ATF.
-I have a check engine light, but It has been there since the MAF swap a couple months ago (long before these problems arose) so I will need to get it scanned for a code.
-While the car would not go into OD, I did find that the transmission was still "locking/unlocking" and dropping down to low RPMs like it should when the gas is released, however when the gas was reapplied, it would rev up back to its corresponding RPM as if it were in 3rd even though it was in D.
I am basically trying to see if anyone else has had these exact problems. Like I stated, i know many members have had some of these, or variations of these, but no real results seemed to come from efforts, except for replacing the transmission, which is what I am trying to avoid as I am in college currently and on my own... i.e. no $$$.
ANY help at all would be GREATLY appreciated guys.
Thank you again.
12-28-2009, 06:48 AM
#2
If it isn't the speed sensor, it is probably the clutch packs going out. Your symptoms sound like the ones people with bad speed sensors have had. I'd drive it as little as possible before you can have it checked out because even if it is the speed sensor, all the slipping is eating up the clutch packs which will require transmission replacement if you let it happen long enough.
12-28-2009, 02:09 PM
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: roc ny
Posts: 124
i had this problem but it was the 2nd to 3rd gear shifts. it would slip and rev up 1k in the rpms. car has 70k on it and i changed the fluid twice before. it ended up being bad clutches and bands. so i got the tranny rebuilted
12-28-2009, 02:31 PM
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Pleasanton,CA
Posts: 1,136
I would do the following,
1) Get a new pan gasket and new magnets from stealership.
2) Drop pan and clean up all that is in the pan (gives u an idea what is happening in the tranny). Use the same bolts, no sealant etc needed. Replace gasket and magnets and be nice to the bolts with tightening sequence criss-cross.
3) Fill pan with Castrol Import MV ATF (5 Q when u drop pan).
4) Clean the revolution sensor off the mettalic gunk.
Drive and report.
1) Get a new pan gasket and new magnets from stealership.
2) Drop pan and clean up all that is in the pan (gives u an idea what is happening in the tranny). Use the same bolts, no sealant etc needed. Replace gasket and magnets and be nice to the bolts with tightening sequence criss-cross.
3) Fill pan with Castrol Import MV ATF (5 Q when u drop pan).
4) Clean the revolution sensor off the mettalic gunk.
Drive and report.
12-28-2009, 03:06 PM
#6
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 53
I would do the following,
1) Get a new pan gasket and new magnets from stealership.
2) Drop pan and clean up all that is in the pan (gives u an idea what is happening in the tranny). Use the same bolts, no sealant etc needed. Replace gasket and magnets and be nice to the bolts with tightening sequence criss-cross.
3) Fill pan with Castrol Import MV ATF (5 Q when u drop pan).
4) Clean the revolution sensor off the mettalic gunk.
Drive and report.
1) Get a new pan gasket and new magnets from stealership.
2) Drop pan and clean up all that is in the pan (gives u an idea what is happening in the tranny). Use the same bolts, no sealant etc needed. Replace gasket and magnets and be nice to the bolts with tightening sequence criss-cross.
3) Fill pan with Castrol Import MV ATF (5 Q when u drop pan).
4) Clean the revolution sensor off the mettalic gunk.
Drive and report.
It would not go to OD at ANY speed. I was anywhere between 60-80 mph and it would not take, but even on the street at slower speeds, i can still feel it in 3rd.
Love 00 Max-
I will try to clean the revolution sensor and connections and do a regular drain and refill without dropping the pan first and report back asap.
I need the car for work to get my lousy pay. So I will try to simplest things first since I am running out of daylight and time.
Thank you so much for the replies everyone.
12-28-2009, 03:28 PM
#7
jasonmax-
It would not go to OD at ANY speed. I was anywhere between 60-80 mph and it would not take, but even on the street at slower speeds, i can still feel it in 3rd.
Love 00 Max-
I will try to clean the revolution sensor and connections and do a regular drain and refill without dropping the pan first and report back asap.
I need the car for work to get my lousy pay. So I will try to simplest things first since I am running out of daylight and time.
Thank you so much for the replies everyone.
It would not go to OD at ANY speed. I was anywhere between 60-80 mph and it would not take, but even on the street at slower speeds, i can still feel it in 3rd.
Love 00 Max-
I will try to clean the revolution sensor and connections and do a regular drain and refill without dropping the pan first and report back asap.
I need the car for work to get my lousy pay. So I will try to simplest things first since I am running out of daylight and time.
Thank you so much for the replies everyone.
12-28-2009, 06:07 PM
#8
I would do the following,
1) Get a new pan gasket and new magnets from stealership.
2) Drop pan and clean up all that is in the pan (gives u an idea what is happening in the tranny). Use the same bolts, no sealant etc needed. Replace gasket and magnets and be nice to the bolts with tightening sequence criss-cross.
3) Fill pan with Castrol Import MV ATF (5 Q when u drop pan).
4) Clean the revolution sensor off the mettalic gunk.
Drive and report.
1) Get a new pan gasket and new magnets from stealership.
2) Drop pan and clean up all that is in the pan (gives u an idea what is happening in the tranny). Use the same bolts, no sealant etc needed. Replace gasket and magnets and be nice to the bolts with tightening sequence criss-cross.
3) Fill pan with Castrol Import MV ATF (5 Q when u drop pan).
4) Clean the revolution sensor off the mettalic gunk.
Drive and report.
12-29-2009, 05:29 AM
#9
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 53
Alright so this is where I am at.
Yesterday driving home from work, it was giving me the latest problems as mentioned above, but now I know why it was shifting directly into third from first...
When I would take off from a stop (not quickly or hard acceleration) I would manually shift it into 2nd to see how the gear responded (to keep it from going straight to third as mentioned above). It will not stay in 2nd!!! It feels like it wants to grab the gear, but whenever ANY type of throttle is applied, it just free revs, and eventually will accelerate a SLIGHT bit as if it is just burning the Tq converter bad.
I got home, and immediatly began draining the tranny fluid. What I found was a liquid darker than oil, and with a very STRONG burned smell. Like I said above, I checked this a couple weeks ago, and it was dark red, like it had been used, but was not burned.
I replaced the fluid after draining (car took 5 quarts to fill back up) and also used CRC electric plug cleaner on the Revolution sensor.
-I added 2 qts first while cold, started the car, then added the rest, and also cycled through the gears spending 30 sec on each one to let them "fill".
Initial tests, and my drive to work this morning showed absolutely NO difference in transmission performance or stability.
Also, last night I took the car up to AdvDiscountAutoPts. and had them OBD2 scan it for codes.
Ahhh, and here is the answer... 0745. "Solenoid "A" Malfunction/Failure".
Now I am not sure of the workings of internals of transmissions, but if it is just this solenoid, can just this one be replaced, rather than buying the entire pack? Is it possible to do for a weekend mechanic? WOuld that even be smart? Also, if it just this one, assuming it would affect the 1-2 shift, why is OD not working, and the whole transmission appear to be failing.
Again, thank you so much everyone for your input, it is still GREATLY appreciated.
Yesterday driving home from work, it was giving me the latest problems as mentioned above, but now I know why it was shifting directly into third from first...
When I would take off from a stop (not quickly or hard acceleration) I would manually shift it into 2nd to see how the gear responded (to keep it from going straight to third as mentioned above). It will not stay in 2nd!!! It feels like it wants to grab the gear, but whenever ANY type of throttle is applied, it just free revs, and eventually will accelerate a SLIGHT bit as if it is just burning the Tq converter bad.
I got home, and immediatly began draining the tranny fluid. What I found was a liquid darker than oil, and with a very STRONG burned smell. Like I said above, I checked this a couple weeks ago, and it was dark red, like it had been used, but was not burned.
I replaced the fluid after draining (car took 5 quarts to fill back up) and also used CRC electric plug cleaner on the Revolution sensor.
-I added 2 qts first while cold, started the car, then added the rest, and also cycled through the gears spending 30 sec on each one to let them "fill".
Initial tests, and my drive to work this morning showed absolutely NO difference in transmission performance or stability.
Also, last night I took the car up to AdvDiscountAutoPts. and had them OBD2 scan it for codes.
Ahhh, and here is the answer... 0745. "Solenoid "A" Malfunction/Failure".
Now I am not sure of the workings of internals of transmissions, but if it is just this solenoid, can just this one be replaced, rather than buying the entire pack? Is it possible to do for a weekend mechanic? WOuld that even be smart? Also, if it just this one, assuming it would affect the 1-2 shift, why is OD not working, and the whole transmission appear to be failing.
Again, thank you so much everyone for your input, it is still GREATLY appreciated.
Last edited by TheOnlyDRAGooN; 12-29-2009 at 06:09 AM.
12-29-2009, 06:51 AM
#10
If the fluid is very dark and has a burnt odor, you've probably done some damage to the clutch packs. A new solenoid may buy you some time but probably not all that much. When you drive a car with a slipping transmission for any length of time, it takes out the clutch packs.
At this point, you are probably better off replacing your transmission with a used one rather than replacing just a solenoid.
At this point, you are probably better off replacing your transmission with a used one rather than replacing just a solenoid.
12-29-2009, 07:05 AM
#11
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 53
If the fluid is very dark and has a burnt odor, you've probably done some damage to the clutch packs. A new solenoid may buy you some time but probably not all that much. When you drive a car with a slipping transmission for any length of time, it takes out the clutch packs.
At this point, you are probably better off replacing your transmission with a used one rather than replacing just a solenoid.
At this point, you are probably better off replacing your transmission with a used one rather than replacing just a solenoid.
*sigh* I knew that was coming
Guess its time to be optimistic and look into a 6MT swap?
Thank you so much for your help and the quick replies.
12-29-2009, 09:43 AM
#12
Depending on your finances, a used automatic is going to be the cheapest route. I would strongly suggest you not get a rebuilt one unless you go through the dealer. Most transmission shops replace only what is needed to get the transmission working again instead of fully rebuilding it. Ask me how I know that.
12-30-2009, 03:05 PM
#14
12-31-2009, 01:21 PM
#17
Do not get it rebuilt, get a used one. 99% guarantee they will only replace what they need to get the car running again instead of going all the way through it like they should.
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