kukx30de

iTrader: (4)

I tried searching for a basic dyno for a y-pipe as the only addon on the 5th gen and couldnt really find anything.

I have an 01 GLE with close to 192K miles... I am sure at this point the cat and pre cats are probably clogged though I have no CEL but sometimes I do feel the car doesnt get up and go as she used to.

I have been reading up on how the y-pipe is supposed to be the single most bang for the buck upgrade on the 5th gen and have saved up about 400 to get this done.

I saw the warpspeed setup on ebay for the y-pipe and high flow cat and i'm considering it.

I realize that the front precat continues to stay on the car and only the rear precat is removed since it is in the y pipe. Does that create any issues to the motor since one bank of the "V" breathes better?

By any chance does someone have a dyno chart showing the true gains achieved?

Input appreciated.

MrEous

iTrader: (11)

Enough of a negligible gain for the mfgrs to not really support ypipes like the 4th gen VQs...lol

There needs to be a thread/forum with dyno charts of different mods per VQ.
(I know about the dyno forum but nothing is consistent which makes it hard to navigate)

kukx30de

iTrader: (4)

true... i hv heard of the so called numbers... but they generally are either on the 5.5 gen... have a host of other mods... the interesting thing I have read on this forum is folks putting numbers without dyno charts to really prove it LOL!

I want to keep the car stock... i.e from the intake and cat back exhaust perspective.... and rather than go buy oem pre cats and a new cat... i might as well take the cheaper route and go aftermarket!

essential1

iTrader: (5)

Am I the only one with a headache?



No you havent.


http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/OBX-E...Q5fAccessories

There you go. $380 with shipping so you'll have lunch money left over. Spoon feeding done.


Can we please lock this up and ban anyone else that starts a new header/ypipe thread?

5 ltr. beater

easy there bud...easy

i've always seen forums kinda like a "virtual" classroom and people can choose to come in and sit down and learn something or get up and walk out if they don't like the topic. no need to expell someone all together for seeking an answer to an honest question.

im sure you were a noob once and probably got flamed a few times for asking honest questions. i know i have!

jowo9

iTrader: (1)

+486!!! You flamers really need to get a life. If you don't like a thread, just don't participate in it. It's really just a mark of an inflated ego when people feel the need to flame constantly. 5 ltr. beater said it perfectly. Just calm down, take a walk.... From what I can gather from forum activity, most members are 5th/5.5 gen owners. Most every topic related to our cars has already been discussed and if we all followed the "wisdom" of the flamers, we might as well all just use the search function and ban any present or future forum activity! Come on, just let everyone (including those who are new to the maxima world) enjoy learning in the same way the old-timers did way back when they discussed these things.

kukx30de

iTrader: (4)

Hey smart alec....

Yes I did search. Here is something for you... FIND me the thread where there is a DYNO CHART of a 5th gen with only a y-pipe and NO other mods!

I already mentioned about the ypipe combo so lets not get into that....

Also, did you actually read my post? I already mentioned I found the y-pipe and cat on ebay so I don't need your links to what I should buy. Infact your link itself makes me believe you dont know your stuff coz you're telling me to buy headers meant for a 5.5gen and put them on my 01??? gees...

If you dont like what you read move on and get doing what you were doing!!

Yes, I reported your unwanted post to the admins!

Rochester

iTrader: (3)

You'll see an improvement over your OEM exhaust, sure. But "most bang" is a stretch. Someone recently asked me why I have the Cattman y-pipe instead of headers, and the answer was "cost" at the time the mod was done. If I were to do it over again today, then I'd go with headers. Hands down. Without hesitation. That, and a 3" catback.


Lots of fires in our forum lately. Short tempers, touchy nerves... serious road rage on the Org. You think everything is in good fun, then BAM! and someone goes ballistic. Must be a summer-heat thing. IDK.

Here's what I learned today in another thread: you aren't responsible for the way someone else behaves. But you do have a responsibility to see it coming, and not coax them into road rage. There are a lot of children on this forum who haven't learned how to cope with their anger. And it's scary crap when teh stoopid go crazy.

Puppetmaster

iTrader: (48)

This thread can live for now, but please play nice, folks.

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

I wouldn't ever do just a y-pipe for 400$, that's insane.

rroderiques77

iTrader: (45)

No crap!! Specially if can get headers for about the same price.

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

Let's face it, these cars are getting old and should be paid off. So, with prices for header sets dropping in recent years, more companies getting on the bandwagon (albeit of various quality) it would only make sense to go with headers vs a y-pipe.

On the other hand,m if you're only interested in replacing your current jacked up cats, go with reman'd precats.



http://forums.maxima.org/5th-generat...ld-vs-new.html

kukx30de

iTrader: (4)

yeps... car was paid off the day i bought it.

My goal here is to go aftermarket since the OEM part would be more expensive.

Since we are in FL ... no pre cats will not create an issue. That is the reason why i'm thinking about the y-pipe only.

The car has considerable age on her 191K. I dont see myself pushing on her at this point. The part is going in only as a cheaper replacement. However, I still am concerned that the front precat continues to be on... while the rear would be off... are there any issues with that?

I saved 400 just for overhead... I see the warpspeed y-pipe and cat are 285 so if i buy new oem gaskets maybe a few new tools... 400 would cover all that.

essential1

iTrader: (5)

I know exactly why soonerfan posts the way he does now. lol

So you try to insult someone that literally spoon fed you the info you needed.. That's not only ignorant, but hilarious in my book. But dont use my info. Buy your $400 y pipe and have fun.

If you would have searched, you would have known why I linked you to headers meant for a 5.5 gen. I bet you think you can plug all your O2s and your "egr valve" into headers made for a '00 maxima too.

But who am I anyways. It's not like i've pulled apart multiple versions of the VQ down to the bare block, and installed headers and y-pipe on just about every year maxima. Not to mention the number of 3.X (yes, X can mean anything, letyour mind wonder) swaps that have taken place within the last couple months.

But since all my posts are "unwanted" I will never put any results or how to's on maxima.org from this day forward. I might post some legit dyno numbers to make you guys jealous but thats it. No mod lists, no explanations.


All i've got to say is the HR feels good at 7500rpm in a maxima.

kukx30de

iTrader: (4)

Thanks for your presence! It wont be missed on this thread.

kukx30de

iTrader: (4)

Rochester:
Thanks for your post. It is def true that there are some of us, and I put myself in that boat, who drive are cars for their sole purpose of being a family car and do the work needed to keep them running like workhorses.

Yes, in the past I have done a good amount of involved work to replace several components on the car and when something wasnt found on the ORG I posted my thoughts, observations and pics to share.

It's just concerning that, when someone does search and as in my case doesnt find what we were looking for, posts a thread... we get just this online bullying attitude. We all know a lot of the links on the forum themselves are broken and dont get us anymore. Moreover, a lot of the older information laden threads now have missing pics etc.

It would really help if there is real knowledge share... folks might be good on the core motor side of the maxima may not know about other aspects of the car and thats normal. That is the reason we have a forum such as this.

Again, I appreciate your input on trust me its well received to the point that I might do the headers too

Rochester

iTrader: (3)

That makes my day, man. Thank you.

Particularly since just yesterday I was PM'd by some poor, confused kid that I was a "smug and condescending low life". Yikes!

Anyway, positive stuff like this makes a real difference. Well, to me, at least.

5 ltr. beater

hey "smug" did you ever get you spacer installed?

j/k

Rochester

iTrader: (3)

Spacers? Last Fall. That must be when Teh Smug really started coming on strong.



What you talkin' bout, Beater?

5 ltr. beater

nm. i thought u had started a thread about the spacers recently and i just realized that it was last year. someone kick me.

irish44j

iTrader: (38)

I wouldn't say that. For the 00-01 5th gen the ypipe makes just as much difference as it does with the 4th gen. Now, for the 02+ 3.5L that's a different story. The ypipe doesn't eliminate the precats, so it doesn't do much on the 3.5s, hence the need for headers on those.

who made you the n00b police....newbie.

People who complain constantly about valid threads give me a headache.


Rochester, you have an 03, where the ypipe doesn't do much. It is much more effective on the 3.0L 5th gens, because it eliminates the precats (like the headers do for the 3.5L cars).


OP - I would agree with the statement that a ypipe is the best "bang for the buck" mod for power, at least short of nitrous or FI. With a y-pipe and cattman catback and stock intake, my car made 201whp/200wtq. Adding a place racing intake put that to 202/202 (IIRC). Stock 00 5MTs usually dyno around 180-185 or so, and the catback had little effect on power - it was the y-pipe that was responsible for probably about 15whp. And mine was Cali spec (or was it fed)...in any case, the ypipe only elminated 1 precat, not both - cars where it eliminates both show larger power gains, obviously.

btw, it was a Cattman. Cattman is the only ypipe I would buy, personally. WS and Budget and ebay ypipes seem to have alot of fitament issues.

2000_MAXIMA_KING

iTrader: (30)

Ok I've been researching this subject for a while now (for about 3 weeks) and I have found old threads, new threads, and even pm'd some experienced members on the subject (special thanks to essential1) and I have come to the conclusion that just purchasing and installing a y-pipe is not a mod you should be going after if you want performance, especially if your going to pay $400. First, of all later in the future your going to want headers anyway if your going after performance so a y-pipe now is just going to be useless and a waist of money and time. To the OP for $400 you can get urself headers, why would you just want to purchase a y-pipe? I was going to do the same thing as you purchase a y-pipe because I was on a budget and its way easier to install then a full header set and a quick way to gain a few horses. But after throughly researching its not worth it at all because if your like me after the y-pipe your going to want more hp and end up getting headers anyway. Plus a y-pipe by itself doesn't seem to do much since our stock headers have a restrictive design to begin with.

irish44j

iTrader: (38)

3.0 guys with N/A engines rarely upgrade from ypipes to headers around here. On the 3.0's there is not much additional gain with headers vs. ypipe, maybe a couple whp. Certainly not enough to justify the much higher cost.

1. $400 is way too much to pay for a ypipe. Even Cattman ypipes (the best) only run $350, and other ones are even cheaper.

2. You cannot get quality headers for $400. You can get crappy ebay headers for that price. IIRC the cheapest GOOD headers out there for the 3.0 5th gen run around $600 or more.

BECAUSE ON A 3.0L 5th GEN THE YPIPE AND HEADERS ACCOMPLISH THE EXACT SAME THING: ELIMINATION OF THE PRECATS (note: on some, not all depending on fed vs. cali spec). There is not a signficiant upgrade in performance on an N/A 3.0L (particularly if the ypipe also eliminates the front bank cat as well).


I'd love to see your dyno numbers with the ypipe and with the headers. My 202whp dyno with a ypipe was about 2 hours after an 00 with headers put down 200 (with a different catback).

how is the design restrictive, exactly? I mean apart from having precats in them (which a ypipe eliminates). Do tell....

The OP noted that he is going to keep the engine stock, IIRC. He has no need for additional flow that headers *might* give over ypipe unless he is going to go FI, NO, or internals.

bottom line, OP: buy the Cattman ypipe for $350 and don't waste your money on headers that won't give you much more power. Alot of the guys who swear by headers (correctly) have alot more going on with their engines than you sound like you want.

If your plan was to do internals or boost - well, of course you would want headers.

For a STOCK engine, a ypipe is sufficient.

Rochester

iTrader: (3)

So who's arguing with you, Irish? I said if I were to do it over again, I'd get headers without hesitation. Either way, Catts y-pipe is a more efficient design than OEM. Sounds much better, too.

Your point, if I may now that I'm reading back through this, is best money spent for gains is a Y-pipe on the 3.0, and headers on a 3.5. All of which is good advice for the OP.

For myself, if I knew then what I know now...

irish44j

iTrader: (38)

lol...I wasn't sure if you noticed the OP had a 3.0 or not

Didn't want him to get too confused.

Your reading of my point is correct though. Yeah, headers on a 3.0 have some gains over a ypipe, but not enough to justify the added expense (and added hassle) in my opinion.

For a 3.5 you're definitely right....ypipe is worthless, headers FTW.

Damn why did I get into this thread, lol...I haven't been in the 5th gen section in many months now~!

irish44j

iTrader: (38)

OP also note: my dyno numbers were with the original (Gen1) Cattman ypipe (it was actually a prototype model, actually). The Gen2 (current) version is reportedly better in flow and fit, and should be good for a bit more power than mine gave.

essential1

iTrader: (5)

Thank you very much for that. I appreciate it Mr. maxima.org rent-a-cop. But I have first hand proof to show otherwise as far as your theory on headers vs. y pipe only on 3.0s goes. And this is on the same fed spec car by the way.

No problem man. Let me know if you need anything again.

2000_MAXIMA_KING

iTrader: (30)

I'll show how the design is restirictive Irish since you seem to know everything.



"The bends and rough edges inside the manifold all hinder exhaust flow, creating backpressure." quoted from vipervadim of nycmaximas who btw did an outstanding comparison of the stock headers and the different aftermarket headers. And the obx headers are under $400, they cost about the same as the cattman y-pipe you speak of Irish. So you now tell me how only a y-pipe would be better then the aftermarket headers when the stock headers are actually restrictive?

denny_1986

iTrader: (1)

4th gen guy with a y pipe and intake ~ 19 WHP
http://forums.maxima.org/5th-generat...pipe-dyno.html


2k1 guy with a y-pipe and intak~ 19WHP
http://forums.maxima.org/5th-generat...et-y-pipe.html

some more
http://forums.maxima.org/5th-generat...-saturday.html

http://forums.maxima.org/5th-generat...ults-mods.html
~21whp

im considering a y-pipe too but the obx headers are tempting. Most likely im going to get a y-pipe since its less headache and i really don't want to over mod a daily driver..

if only cattman didn't charge an arm and a leg and your first born for his y-pipes the choice would have been obivious.....

btw, i spoke with Brian (cattman) the other day and they are in the process of getting the 5 gen y-pipe fit tested in the coming week. So hopefully a new batch should be just around the corner..

2000_MAXIMA_KING

iTrader: (30)

Now compare this pic of aftermarket headers with a 3-1 collector, to the pic i posted above. You can clearly see the difference.



The collectors are one of the most important thing when it comes to headers.

irish44j

iTrader: (38)

I believe it was you who was asking the moderators to lock and ban, not me. Who exactly is the rent-a-cop?

headers vs. ypipe on an otherwise completely-stock engine. Post up your proof of a significant horsepower difference and I will be THE FIRST to admit that I am incorrect on the matter. Really, I will. I'm going by information from over the years. If you have better information, I'm all for seeing it and going with it.

Nobody is arguing that headers are better than a ypipe. The argument is whether on an otherwise completely stock engine that the additional cost and installation difficulty (not to mention emissions issues for those who have to deal with that) are worth the gains.

Again though, please prove me wrong.

irish44j

iTrader: (38)

never said I know everything. Far from it when it comes to power-adders - I was more interested in chassis/suspension/brakes when I had my max. Now that you've shown the pic, I will concur that the design is restrictive. I have no problem admitting I'm wrong when proven so.

let's put it this way:
if the headers are $400, and the Cattman ypipe is $350....(and others are cheaper), that is a 15% cost difference.

On a stock maxima (no intake, no catback, restrictive stock b-pipe, etc)....will the headers gain 15% more whp/wtq than the ypipe. THAT is the question. I've always been under the impression that the headers would not give more than 1-2whp (~10%) gain over ypipe on a stock VQ30DEK. Since few people actually dyno the same car with both, especially when stock, there's not a huge body of evidence out there to work with. I'd be more than happy to see conclusive evidence that it isn't the case.

I'm arguing from the OP's standpoint. He clearly stated he wanted "most bang for the buck." So that's the argument: I s the ypipe or the header "more bang for the buck"///

noplace did I say that the ypipe would be better than headers in actual gains. My comments were whether the additional cost/hassle of headers was worth the gains, which from what I have seen are not significantly higher than ypipe gains.

It's like asking what is more worth it, a $1000 set of 18lb wheels, or a $1500 set of 15lb wheels. Obviously the 15lb wheels are going to help performance more. But is it worth an extra $500, with all other things (looks, strength, etc) being equal?

Also keep in mind that when I bought my ypipe (for $250 or so) back in '04 or so, most of the available headers at the time were more in the $600+ range. So my historical opinion on cost vs. benefit was based on those numbers. If the OBX headers now are only $400, that does change the calculations somewhat.

Rochester

iTrader: (3)

And here you thought we didn't need another header/ypipe thread. This is pretty interesting, if the reader can get past all the defensive bluster.

Speaking of which... Irish, saying that Catt's 3.5 Y-Pipe is "worthless" is a little over the top. Saying that I'm right in saying that, when I didn't... classic. But in the end, you can say whatever you want because you bring good stuff to the table whenever you find your way back to the Forum.

Maxima King: good photos. Those pics on the collectors are great.

You know, even if headers on a 3.0 offer only 2hp gains over a comparably good y-pipe, for only $50 more, I'd spend that extra $50. It's certainly a better bargain than blowing $200 on a worthless crank pulley... for example. (There's a regretful decision for you.)

essential1

iTrader: (5)

I dont need to prove anyone wrong. I will let the org keep thinking what they think. There is alot of power left on the table with these cars and the .org mentality is something that is keeping people from getting better results out of their cars.


lol. I still think this thread is worthless and just a waste of space.



Bottom line is:

Y pipe=good

Headers=better

And now that we have a decent and affordable set of headers available to us:

Headers=best value

And while you guys are all discussing information that is already common knowlege, there are other subjects that have yet to be discussed which explain the other big bottleneck for the VQ engine that people keep looking past. And no, it's not internal.

Rochester

iTrader: (3)

That actually sums it up pretty good, looking at today's options, and taking into account the variations between the 3.0 and the 3.5.

So... (getting ready to duck), are the OBX headers as good as Catt's, which everyone already knows are excellent, but you pay big bucks for that quality.

essential1

iTrader: (5)

Hell no! OBX is nowhere near as good as Catt's. Nothing can touch Brian's products. But that doesnt mean that OBX is a waste of money either.

denny_1986

iTrader: (1)

well its not even about the price difference...OBX headers are the same price as the cattman y-pipe ($350). The BIG difference would be in the installation cost + a ton of headache

Headers will produce more power than a yipipe IF they are properly tuned (more $$$). Most ppl only do headers and dont get it tuned and hence the similarities b/w the hp/tq gains

y-pipe + install ~ $500?
obx+ install ~ $850? + getting it tuned (incl VAFC) ~ $500? = $1350?
But if i were to get headers, i'd also get the cat-back replaced with a 3" and of course a fast cat + $$$$
Bottom line
headers will suck you in the modding world and force you to keep modding lol
a y-pipe would just be a y-pipe

Rochester

iTrader: (3)

You say that like it's a bad thing.

Know what... nevermind. Some people just want to fix their exhaust and be done. That's fine, too.

irish44j

iTrader: (38)

[groggy] I had about half a bottle of Captain in me last night, so whatever I was talking about take with a grain of salt. I get argumentative when drinking! Hell, I'm surprised I didn't blame 9/11 and the BP oil spill on you. Frankly I'm surprised I didn't start talking about downpipes and such.....since that's all I hear about these days on the subie forums

yes, "cattman 3.5 ypipe worthless" is indeed over the top, admittedly. It should have been caveated "for the money."



We are also comparing the most expensive ypipe (cattman) with the cheapest headers (OBX) though. The difference is more than $50 if you compare best-best or cheapest-cheapest.


Hey, not everyone can be as cool as you are, such a rebel with your "non-org mentality" and secret mods

Anyhow, when it comes down to it, the maxima doesn't need more power nearly as much as it needs brakes, chassis, and suspension improvement. And in the end, you can do whatever you want with it, including FI, and it's still not a particularaly fast car, either at the drag or at the road course. It is what it is.

I would tell the OP to forget the ypipe/header and spend the money on brake and chassis upgrades. $400 will get him 6th gen brakes and SFCs, which will be far bigger of an improvement than 20-30hp. And get a b-pipe while he's at it - because that is cheap and is a major bottleneck in the stock exhaust system.



welcome to the internet.

please, keep it a secret! If you tell everyone they might think you're less cool!

this is the "org mentality" that I dislike though....the thought that somehow putting headers and a tune on the car makes it somehow "heavily modded".....

I would consider my old max to be more heavily modded than alot of FI maxes on here. It's not just about how much power you can show on the dyno.

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

Control yourselves, Jesus.