Didn't want to create a whole new topic for this so sorry guys. Please move it to the appropriate place if need be.

So I found a dealership willing to advance my timing for me. If anyone is in northern VA and interested I can tell you where.

I just had a quick question for the pros. The guy said he's gonna use a Consult II and he definitely knows what he's doing, has done a few before. Now he's just waiting on the cables for it because the old ones are no good, so I have to wait until Wednesday to have this done, which is fine.

My question is, is there anything I need to know or should look out for after he does the job? Like I said he's going to use a Consult II, which I would imagine is good for this right?

Thanks for the help guys, sorry I made a new topic for this.

 

You are good. Watch him do it. Have fun.

 

Now the wait is on. Thanks for the reply dude. I guess this means / thread.

 

It is a Nissan dealership? Im assuming a smaller dealership as large dealerships dont usually bother with that

 

It is a Nissan dealership, actually one of the biggest in the area (Brown's). The service manager there (now working for BMW) was a really cool guy, believe it or not I actually bought my car from his 80 year old dad and all the service was done at that dealership on the car.

So I go there today only to find out this dude is gone to the BMW dealership up the road and the new service manager at Nissan tells me he just came up from the Ford dealership up the road, and doesn't know much about Nissan.

So I'm thinking, damn just my luck, this guy has no idea what I'm talking about. But I told this dude I was one of the old managers customers, and everyone there knew instantly what that meant (because that dude was kind of like the Dave B of the Nissan dealerships for my area). So they really wanted to help and keep a long time customer.

Finally he goes to ask the techs working in the shop, and sure enough one of the tech comes up to talk to me and not only knows exactly what I'm talking about he has done it and knows all about performance and hooks up his car. So the dude finally agreed and said when their new Consult cables come in then they'll do it for a $55 half hour labor charge.

 

Ouch. You will be at the dealership all of 5 minutes. Might as well run in and grab the free coffee and doughnuts if they have any! Guess they gotta charge you though.

I'd ask him what he's going to do for the remaining 25 mins they've charged you for. Eh, catch more flys with honey..... definately ask them to charge at a 1/4 hour rate or something, anything more closely representing the actual time and effort.

 

Make sure you runnin premium fuel. i was running 89 n lost power after they advanced it and it lost power n was weak till ran 93.

 

Oh yeah, the service manager (old Ford employee) knows it takes 5 min. They tried to claim that a half hour labor charge is minimum they would do, because otherwise I'm sure it's not even worth it. So I figured, let the guy eat his extra $30 but at least I'll have this done right the first time and just have it done period.

$55 isn't much money to do this mod, I just wish someone in the area had a consult to do it for me, I would gladly hook it up with a nice steak and maybe even some "magical pollen" from my garden.

Any takers in northern VA?

Yeah that's very good info right there, luckily I already know all about it. But anyone looking to do this should know to run 93, or at least 91 at all times!

I've actually been running 93 in my cars for years, I have never filled one of my cars up with regular in my life (but my GF did fill up my old Infiniti I30 with diesel one time and needless to say she has been my EX for years). Probably because I've always had a VQ engine ever since 17 years old and you have to use 93 for the VQ because otherwise your performance goes to pure **** and also hurts your engine.

Also, I could never figure out why so many people go for regular. My friend just got a used 04 Acura TL and was putting in regular for like a month. Long story short his car actually started knocking when shifting at WOT, I told the moron to use premium only, and he did and all problems went away and now he swears up and down that his car gained 10WHP from using the 93 octane gas over 89! Which I mean, it really may have gained about one horse from that just way more responsive. I just don't see the benefit of using crap gas in our cars, especially since you're literally saving like ONE DOLLAR at MOST if you fill up a full tank (89 to 93 price).

This guy put in an autozone SRI (otherwise bone stock) that he ASKED ME TO HELP him with and swears his car feels like it has a TURBO. (This is not a joke, this is what I get to laugh at every day). My Maxima was pulling on him off the line pretty decently and he would start to climb and catch up after his VTEC kicked in and it's a stock TL but still my Max only has 204WHP right now and is not tuned compared to his stock numbers which should be nicely higher no? His car definitely climbs way better after he started using 93. What kind of WHP do the stock automatic 2004-2005 TL's put down (not typeS)?

I bet after my timing advance is done and I have the car tuned, I should really start pulling on this friend even more afterwards? At least off the line, he may get me in a roll for now but off the line...

 

You got ypipe?

His is 3.2l v6 270hp 238tq my buddy has one its really quick! y pipe timing advance and intake should beat him by a little.


what year is your car?

 

My car is a 2000. I have Cattman Ypipe, high flow CAT, custom SRI intake thermal sealed, NWP spacers, and Haltech but for the most part like I said the car still needs to be tuned. About to have timing advanced in a few days.

And I was talking about WHP not crank on the TL, what do the 2004-2005 automatics run stock? I know that car is fast, no question, but wondering what they put down to the wheels stock in automatic form.

 

Says they run low 15s 1/4 mile.

http://cl.acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=468255

 

Yeah I just checked that out. They are indeed saying low 15's, and then a few members there claimed to have run like 14.8 stock. I don't know, I looked up WHP claims for the stock 04-05 TL autos and apparently they only put down like 208WHP stock.

Anyone know if that's really true or what the accurate WHP is? I can't believe that's really true that it only gets 208WHP from the 270 claimed and that much is lost, I mean I know there is a huge loss but that's a really huge loss.

And then the TL's are also around 300 lbs heavier than the 5th gen if I'm not mistaken. I mean basically either one of the two cars you really need a MT because AT robs ridiculous amounts of power.

 

I am running 17deg advanced timing and do 89 for half the time, and don't have any issues and it feels pretty much the same (still can feel the timing across the board just not a really a huge dif in ocatane)....maybe a hair better w 91... its all butt dyno though.

just saying it's not that bad to run the 89 with 17 deg timing though the ECU will figure it out

 

I just got it done, timing advance that is. Gotta go drive it now.

 

True but the downfall with running 89 is that with 17 degree timing advance your ecu will just pull timing since it will most likely trigger the knock sensor so then you will basically lose any power you gained from having the timing advance done in the first place.

On my 2000 with the timining advance to 17 degrees i will get knock showing on the consult II with 89 and sometimes 90 octane. 91 octane i'm good but i just run 93 to be safe.

 

^^THIS^^

Timing advance makes your pistons move farther up before being sparked and so basically the 89 octane isn't strong enough of an explosion to push your pistons back with the less room it has to work with like 93 octane can, and so you get problems (pinging and knocking).

On top of that, like a33nismo said whatever you gain out of doing a timing advance would probably be completely negated with running 89 gas.

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So I just had my timing advanced at a different dealership then I initially was going to, because I didn't feel like waiting til Wednesday and was able to get her done. But really it ended up real well, at this new place even the service adviser knew what I was talking about unlike the other dealer.

Waited 15 min for the tech to come back from lunch and let me tell you he walked back real slowly. After that he did it and knocked it out in 10 min, then it took them no joke 30 min to pull my car out of the bay. But still, wait and all I'm happy.

I was just driving it and at WOT it really makes a nicely noticeable difference in how it pulls.

I got a question though if anyone can chime in, a33nismo perhaps you can answer this one since you did it on a 2000? My idle speed is @ 713rmp after timing advance, it says the same on my ticket. But I heard with timing advanced idle is usually higher for people like at 900? Is that true or is that just for the MT cars? Anyone that knows this please enlighten me!

Just want to make sure I'm all good on this. Thanks guys.

 

Mine's an automatic and on my scanner i'm reading right around 745 to 749 rpm once its warmed up at idle so pretty close.

 

Hopefully MrEous will do mine! Then I can join the club So whats the most noticeable thing after its done? Just WOT pull?

 

If you can find someone with a Cipher, they can also adjust idle too. I'm just curious to see if it can be done via Cipher on the 00-01 models.

I didn't notice much other than a slightly different tone and a little idle difference.

 

My idle didn't change one bit at all...but if it does they say it idles up 75rpm that's it.

And on 89 i felt small missfires or power loss's it was a weird feeling when floored wasn't running right that's forsure. 93 cleared it up.

 

You know, if you do a search here you shall find two different dyno result threads from two people who have dyno'd their cars before/after 17 timing advance.

Basically what it comes down to is this, you can clearly see that the advance gives a nice gain in the mid range (one of these dudes gained 10hp at 4000RPM) And you can also clearly see how the RPM band changes top to bottom, all of it.

It makes a difference, especially depending on what other mods you have. This is one of those things that really goes well together with other mods and if your car is already at least lightly modded you should feel something.

Doing this to a stock car would most likely just make it run a bit smoother, and idle should never change long as you do the relearn.

 

$55 is a lot. When I did mine, I just went to the dealership, didn't bother talking the guy behind the desk. I went there just before 5pm, when the techs were not busy, I talked to one of them and he said he'll do it when I showed him a $20... Not even 10 minutes later it was done.

 

another idea is to get some other regular service done and try to slide this one in there and not pay any extra since it's so simple (minutes)

maybe I will try and stay around 91 then but I didn't notice much doin 89 (I also didn't floor it too often to notice if 89 did anything diff)

 

Yeah I agree, I mean it definitely shouldn't cost that much. It just comes down to what you're doing and what the situation is. If I was getting other work done there maybe I'd just try sliding it in there or whatever.

Thing is that I never, and I mean NEVER have any work done at the stealership unless it's under warranty. Why would you ever have work done at the dealership (unless you need to, for something specific)?

All my cars have never been to the dealership after warranty expired, no point for that at all. Why would you do that? And let em steal your money? Work on your own car, learn everything, save thousands among thousands.

Here is another thing, which really makes sense. Sliding the tech a $20 could work, but if something goes wrong after he does it who are you going to with the problem? Yup, having it done legit through the service desk means they're RESPONSIBLE for it, so you gain that advantage for the extra $30

Besides, $55 isn't much to pay for a few HP and TQ, I would gladly pay $20 per HP if I could, heck I'd pay $50 per HP if I could. And you get the added piece of mind that you can always go back and have them look at it if something goes wrong, you have your ticket and all which if you just slide the tech a dub you will not have and be all shady.

Honestly, I would prefer to just go in there and ask them straight up to do your timing, without being a shade ball. Just don't be shady and say it confidently, if they see that you know exactly what you're talking about and know about cars they will most likely do it. That way you have a legit ticket and they take the responsibility.

You know, it's probably really something like this -- If you run 89 with timing advance it'll probably be just the same as running without the advance on 93 octane just smoother. But if you put 91+ in there W/ the advance, then that's where it makes the difference.

The major gain from the advance is right at 4000-4100 RPM also, and you don't have to floor it to get there, I hope anyway. But yeah, you're probably not gonna feel anything unless you run 91+ octane, and then hit 4k RPM.

 

OK, but there is not much that can go wrong... I stayed next to the guy when he did it, and it's pretty straightforward... it would take a real dumba$$ with two left hands and square fingertips to screw things up.

That's why I'm happy I switched to a forced induction engine... Last week end I just gained 100hp for a simple $330 tune ... That's $3.30 a pony

 

I charge $10 to change the timing +2 with my Cipher...no big deal, takes a whopping 5-10min to do really.

 

I'd say 3-5

 

You guys are all right. But ^^ THIS ^^

Unfortunately in the real world, there is quite a large number of individuals such as you described there.

Now, in most cases I'm sure something this simple will be done just fine. But still who knows, some time could pass and I could get a new ECU and then need to do it again, and perhaps I'll just go there and say it went back to 15 and make them do it free and get my moneys worth.

 

Wellllllll...my laptop boots up slow.

 

Think about all the beer you could buy with the extra money if you do it under the table...

 

Haha I know it dude, damn. Oh well, and that dude clearly looks like a drunk wild Russian hooligan.

 

Here are the steps by the way:

Step1: Warm up vehicle.

Step 2: On CONSULT 2 screen choose ENGINE

After communication with Converter will display a bunch of choices.

Step 3: Press WORK SUPPORT

Step 4: See more choices, press TARGET IGN TIMING

Step 5: Press UP x2 for 2 degrees, correction which you should be able to see.

Step 6: Press UPDATE.

Step 7: Now press BACK

Step 8: On the menu screen find IDLE AIR VOL LEARN.

Step 9: Press, and perform to correct your idle since you just raised it 75RPM with timing advance.

Step 10: ALL DONE!!!

__________________________________________________ _______________________

Oh, I just noticed, you have a VQ30. I thought the timing advance resulted in a HP gain only on the VQ35? I may be wrong on that...

 

Actually the 3.0 gains more n 3.5 don't rearlly benefit from much.

 

Where do you get this nonsense?

If anything, it's been quantified and better documented on the 3.5L. Not so much on the 3L.

 

That's what I thought... Here is a dyno on the 3.5... I couldn't find anything for the 3.0

 

Wow that's just what i read somewhere.

 

Well you better check your facts before you open your mouth boy!

 

The gains of the 3.5 with an advance have definitely been documented, there is one of the two dyno's floating around posted up top ^^

Now, I did read in a few places that the VQ30 did accept the timing advance better, and gained more out of it. I definitely remember reading it somewhere, but at the same time I haven't seen any dyno results or anything to back that up like you said.

Makes me

Perhaps I'm gonna need to do some testing of my own on the 3.0

 

Show us your butt dyno after you are done testing... Here is one of mine

 

Lmao ^^^^^