Chris Gregg

iTrader: (59)

This is the same style setup that Cmax had built which led to the newest change in the Cattman 3" catback setup. For some comparisons, the stock resonator is 23 3/4" long, 5" round on roughly 2" pipe. The Cattman is roughly 22" long, 4" round on a 3" pipe. The Magnaflow is 18" long, 6" round on a 3" pipe. Just looking at the Cattman setup, there has been a question about how large a resonator you can fit. A 6" round can is the largest you can fit comfortably. At least in regard to clearance between top of resonator and the heat sheild in the tunnel.

Regarding length, lets first assume the rear floor bracket that crosses over the exhaust tunnel has been removed. In terms of length, there is roughly 24" between the Cattman B-pipe flange and the front floor bracket closest the catalytic converter. Therefore, the only way a resonator longer than 22" could fit would be to remove the front floor bracket.

I did some back to back db comparisons with my iPhone....so you must take that for what it is, an app. Something I could not factor out is how background noise attributed to db readings, although I tried to minimze them as much as possible.

Here are the readings with the car warm and windows down. The before was taken during the day with background traffic and birds. The after was taken at night with crickets and frogs. I believe the night time noise was actually more intrusive into the readings and caused them to actually be a bit higher.

BEFORE: Cattman 4" Resonator..........AFTER: Magnaflow 6" Resonator
Startup - 79db..................................66db
Idle 54db.........................................50db
2k rpm 65db.....................................65db
2.5k rpm 70db..................................68db
3k rpm 70db.....................................70db
3.5k rpm 80db..................................75db
4k rpm 81db.....................................80db
4.5k rpm 90db..................................85db

Here are some videos.

First - Warm idle on standard Cattman setup with 4" resonator.


Second - Cold idle (I say warm up in video for some reason).


Third - In-cabin exhaust volume with Cattman setup.


Fourth - In-cabin exhaust volume on initial startup and revving.


Fifth - In-cabin volume for Magnaflow, driving.

BobPezz

iTrader: (5)

"The relationship between sound intensity and perceived loudness. It is common to express sound intensity on a logarithmic scale, called decibel SPL (Sound Power Level). On this scale, 0 dB SPL is a sound wave power of 10-16 watts/cm2, about the weakest sound detectable by the human ear. Normal speech is at about 60 dB SPL, while painful damage to the ear occurs at about 140 dB SP.

The difference between the loudest and faintest sounds that humans can hear is about 120 dB, a range of one-million in amplitude. Listeners can detect a change in loudness when the signal is altered by about 1 dB (a 12% change in amplitude). In other words, there are only about 120 levels of loudness that can be perceived from the faintest whisper to the loudest thunder. The sensitivity of the ear is amazing; when listening to very weak sounds, the ear drum vibrates less than the diameter of a single molecule!

The perception of loudness relates roughly to the sound power to an exponent of 1/3. For example, if you increase the sound power by a factor of ten, listeners will report that the loudness has increased by a factor of about two (101/3 ≈ 2). This is a major problem for eliminating undesirable environmental sounds, for instance, the beefed-up stereo in the next door apartment. Suppose you diligently cover 99% of your wall with a perfect soundproof material, missing only 1% of the surface area due to doors, corners, vents, etc. Even though the sound power has been reduced to only 1% of its former value, the perceived loudness has only dropped to about 0.011/3 ≈ 0.2, or 20%.

The range of human hearing is generally considered to be 20 Hz to 20 kHz, but it is far more sensitive to sounds between 1 kHz and 4 kHz. For example, listeners can detect sounds as low as 0 dB SPL at 3 kHz, but require 40 dB SPL at 100 hertz (an amplitude increase of 100). Listeners can tell that two tones are different if their frequencies differ by more than about 0.3% at 3 kHz. This increases to 3% at 100 hertz. For comparison, adjacent keys on a piano differ by about 6% in frequency."

tcb_02_max

iTrader: (5)

I'd be interested how the new Cattman 5" compares, as it is sitting in my parents' garage waiting to be installed. Unfortunately, I haven't been home since last October... If someone with said system also has a dB meter, please post your findings.

Chris Gregg

iTrader: (59)

Meant to take some images before installation. No surprise, just painted black to match my Cattman headers, Y, and Cattman catback.

rbaksi

iTrader: (3)

Sounds PERFECT. Thank you for posting this

mikehawk

Good luck with the 6" wide resonator. I had one with a 2.5" exhaust system and scraped on the lower front part every now and then.

Chris Gregg

iTrader: (59)

I initially wondered about clearance. However, once installed the front of the can is just 1/8" lower than the forward floor board joist. I'm only slightly dropped on Eibachs, so I have absolutely no concerns. I appreciate the heads up though!

02whitemaximase

iTrader: (38)

Very nice work, when are you making me one?!

Chris Gregg

iTrader: (59)

My cost in materials is very close to Cmax, although I think he got standard steel flanges where I bought solid stainless flanges. I've still got the torches and stainless welding rods to do at least a couple more. PM me if serious and we can work out the details.

02whitemaximase

iTrader: (38)

Oh yes, I am calling you on this. I have decided not to buy the 370z and keep the max a few more years. I love not having a payment and the four doors don't hurt either.

Prophecy99

iTrader: (1)

nice thread Chris,

any db measurements on stock for reference??

videos do sound pretty sweet though, not loud at all

Chris Gregg

iTrader: (59)

Thanks. Tons of credit to Cmax for all this. He has some videos of his install as well. No db readings from stock, but that would had been nice.

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

Intalled this last night.

Sounds REALLY quiet when started. Is very much quieter while driving but still have a slight drone zone I'm not fond of. Looking into an actual resonated test pipe vs my current pseudo resonated version.

Fitment was perfect. Install was a breeze, as it was noted to be. Love that it's still bolt in.

Anyone want a "resonator" section from the 1st gen batch.


I think the dB readings are pretty spot on. Not much difference in RPM ranges, but certainly more tamed at idle, low RPM.


If only MF made a 22" or 24" version. They do make a 30" version, but that would be a stretch to fit it in the current bolt in configuration.

Either way, awesome product, great service, even better fit.

Prophecy99

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for the post^ quiet is good.

i wish I cared more about exhaust. i just hate being loud so I never even bothered upgrading anything involved with exhaust. but slowly taking notes/bookmarking threads like this for future decisions.

Chris Gregg

iTrader: (59)

The drone is definitely still there but, to me it seemed more tame. Of course, that could be due to my trunk sound deadening.

I made up another unit identical to this one that's ready to ship out, if anyone is interested. I've got it posted in the for sale forums.

T_Behr904

Sounds good

I haven't visited Magnaflow's website to look up the specs on their round muffler/resonators, but I'm kinda curious to know if it's possible to fit two smaller resonators instead of one big one (as far as length goes)

schmellyfart

iTrader: (46)

Make one with the vibrant ultra quiet 3" resonator.

Would anyone with the cartonator be willing to weigh it?

Chris Gregg

iTrader: (59)

No. No options for that kind of set up/design given only the space occupied by the resonator section on the 3" Cattman setup. The length is roughly 30" between cat and b-pipe. There is no Magnaflow resonator longer than 18" with 3" in/out that will fit (there is a 36" but, obviously it won't fit).

However, I've been looking at an option for those running a test pipe. I can put together one of two options: First- utilize two Magnaflow 14" and fills the gap between y-pipe and b-pipe. Effectively creates an 28" resonator. Second- utilize one 18" and one 14" resonator, fitting the same way. Creates effectively an 32" resonator.

I don't have any cost estimates for such a set up. Going to work on it next week. Probably looking at approximately $350 for such a large section. Hard to say how close final cost would be to that number given shipping for such a large section.

Chris Gregg

iTrader: (59)

- 13lbs -

schmellyfart

iTrader: (46)

Thanks!

For comparison, would you or Manny weigh the Cattman resonated section as well?

Chris Gregg

iTrader: (59)

Boy, I was way off! LOL!! It was 13.7lbs box and all. So, I'd say the completed unit is right at 13lbs.

schmellyfart

iTrader: (46)

Excellent, thanks for checking!

Chris Gregg

iTrader: (59)

Are you wanting the weight for the Cattman 4" resonator or the new 5" version?

schmellyfart

iTrader: (46)

The old style, which I assume is the 4" version.

Chris Gregg

iTrader: (59)

I don have an accurate way to weigh the 4" Cattman. My scales are off, I'm sure. If you still need, I'll try.

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

Fit like a glove and quieted it down to where I'm happy with it. Quality and craftsmanship is awesome, fitment was/is great. All I hear is intake now.

The V1 Carltonator helped quite a bit, but I'm getting older this is a DD and so I needed something a lot quieter with no detriment to power.

One thing I did notice about the original is that it quieted it down a LOT from the outside, but still had some drone in the cabin. With this, it's nearly completely gone in the dreaded drone zone. There are some frequencies still audible, but there are some RPM ranges that you can't even hear it, where as before, it was almost unbearable with the OEM 4".

All in all, great working with Chris, and the quality is fantastic.

TallTom

That is one big honking resonator! And you remove your cat because of it?

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

I've had a test pipe forever, that's a 3" test pipe on there bolted onto the original carltonator in the pic.

Chris Gregg

iTrader: (59)

Thanks!! Glad I could help!

On a similar note guys, I've still got one remaining "V1" 18" Carltonator packed and ready to go. Comes with two 3" Vibrant gaskets so its ready to install straight out of the box. Asking $250 plus shipping.

Prophecy99

iTrader: (1)

I am really a newb with exhaust (don't like being loud)

but what does this piece replace?

the postcat and part of the B pipe? (nmexmax's pic showed a test pipe) or just the B-pipe? i thought the B pipe was one piece? as I bought it that way from napa which is already deteriotating by the way.



and would you pass emissions with this "V1" 18" Carltonator?

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

The Cattman B-pipe as all or at least most other B-pipes are 3 piece, 1 section goes from the cat covnertor, then the second pice that looks like a B typically, goes from the straight piece, then the 3rd peice is usually referred as the rear peic, which is basiclal a muffler and some pipe that goes over the rear beam suspension.

3 pieces.



Assembled pieces 1&2:







In short:

My set-up replaces piece #1, but also replaces the cat convertor/test pipe section and bolts right up to the header/y-pipe. So essentially from the purple y-pipe to the end of the large yellow resonator section. Keep in mind, I have a Cattman 3" and Cattman headers.

Chris Gregg

iTrader: (59)

Just to build on what's already been said, the 18" Carltonator ONLY replaces the straight resonator section immediately after the cat converter. Because you retain your cat converter, you should pass emissions assuming it is functioning properly.

The Carltonator is designed specifically for the 3" Cattman system. But, custom built units for other 3" systems can be designed upon request.

Prophecy99

iTrader: (1)

thanks for the additional clarification!

TSelanne

iTrader: (2)

Sorry to up an old thread but this is very interesting. Really cool to see someone use the magnaflow 30". I'm running a full cattman 3" setup front to back on an '01 AE. I currently have the 18" magnaflow like CMax and like you guys its a DD and still too loud for my taste. Few questions:
1- does removing the cross brace (just after the cat) harm or adversely affect anything?
2- How long is the long resonator setup from outside flange to outside flange in post #26?
3- could one pass emissions without Brian's 'fastcat' (or any cat for that matter) installed?
4- which O2 sim do you guys use? I still have my rear O2 sensors hooked up and they're always throwing a code. I have to pass emissions in two weeks.
5- have you guys considered fabricating your own resonator? I have been thinking about this for a while: what's the longest resonator body that could fit in there (if fastcat is removed)? It looks like 40" or so.... Would it be possible to weld two screws and a flange to the rear end of the body of the resonator to gain an extra few more inches? (So it bolts directly to the b-pipe flange instead of needing the extra few inches of 3" pipe after the res body)

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

No worries, I consider this thread ongoing with people giving feedback, etc.

Mine has been off for the better part of a decade and I have yet to notice any ill effects. I tried spacers, I tried modifying it, and finally just removed it, many many exhaust set-ups ago.

Chris has those dimensions.

Nope, you will need a cat of some sort. But, that’s the beauty of this set-up, if you keep the original Cattman resonator and your OEM cat or FastCat, just reinstall those for emissions testing. It doesn’t take very long being a bolt in set-up.

I have a dual output from o2sim.com, I have 2 of them, because I never installed either. Strange your rears are throwing a code. Mine are not. How are your fronts?

40” would be cutting it very close, 30” I think is the max, and also, it be hard to find a 3” 40” x 6 “ resonator. If going with a smaller body (less than 6”) it might be possible, but, then you would semi defeat the purpose of a larger resonator, i.e. longer, but less diameter. Also, keep in mind, not sure of your suspension set-up, but be aware that the 6” does get closer to the ground than anything else. I’ve tapped it a few times and I’m only on Progress Springs.

TSelanne

iTrader: (2)

Looking at the pic in post #26: what if you mounted/welded the rear flange (at the Bpipe) directly to the resonator can? That would offer at least 3 more inches. The can could also be extended forward towards the Ypipe (if there's room), which looks like another 5-6 inches. Crappy MSpaint drawing of what I mean:



The front flange would have to be done like CMax did his - with an extra piece of 3" OD tubing - so you could line up the bolt holes with the Ypipe flange.

clintb3astwood

iTrader: (10)

Viola, O2 sim. http://www.3sx.com/store/comersus_vi...?idProduct=769

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

Depends on the shop. Some only look at actual emissions from the exhaust, some only at codes. I don't get tested here so I really can't speak. [/QUOTE]
P0430 is not an 02 sensor code. More of a pre-cat code. http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y22...nsorsedit9.jpg
Do you have headers? If they are Cattman, they do not have bungs for the secondaries. If not, you still need the O2 sensors plugged in electronically, not in the exhaust stream, and some people hide them under the engine cover. But then again, if you're stock, there are so many heat sheilds, it would be almost impossible to see them without really getting in there. Also, not sure if this is relevant to the convo, but upstream O2's have nothing to do with the conversation at hand, i.e. main cat, and emissions, not pre cats. Since we're on the subject I am still a firm believer in that sims aren't necessary, and the foulers are the way to go. But, also, I've seen members with neither and just their O2's bunged in the headers and they have no codes for the rear O2's. I myself have my rears/secondaries bunged in and I have no secondary codes.
Take a look under there and the tunnel right before the bend would be an issue due to the exhaust hangar there. I honestly do not think that big of resonator will make that much more of a difference unless it was louvered, but that's a bad word around here.

TSelanne

iTrader: (2)

Sorry didn't mean to muck up the thread w emissions questions.

Ok so you have cattman headers, yes? So the two front o2 sensors are on the headers themselves. Then where do you have your secondaries placed? On the longer portion of tubing right before the 30" MF resonator? On the Ypipe? They don't throw a code with the cat removed?

Yeah louvered resonators seem to really have a bad rap. Though I've tried, I cannot find any data or measure for 'how bad' the flow restriction really is. I spoke to the owner of a muffler shop recently and he said "our louvered resonators only cause a 7% reduction in exhaust flow"... but that's the best I've found. I wonder how quiet the system would be using that MF 30" w a louvered core.... and if you'd notice a loss of power.

Mules5555

I just got rid of the y pipe completely and went with a dual in single out Magnaflow resonator. 2 1/4 inlet 2 1/2 outlet and also removed that bracket that was mentioned above. It's been off for a few years now and have also done some exhaust jobs on maximas that I have removed. No harm done to mine and no complaints from customers so must be ok! Lol