clutch masters fx250 + fidanza flywheel
11-07-2014, 10:48 PM
#2
Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 154
Use Fidanza flywheels at your own risk
Fidanza uses a 124 tooth flywheel(350Z). Our Maximas take a 125 tooth. I believe this is why some members have starter grinding issues with the Fidanza and some do not. What follows is my email conversation with Fidanza:
Dear Sales and Technical departments,
I am writing to you because I think there is a problem with your aluminum flywheel for the 2002-2005 Nissan Maxima, P/N 143951 . I confirmed through Alice @ Fidanza, that your flywheel has 124 teeth, as does the OEM 350Z flywheel. However, through our Maxima community on “Maxima.org” several members have confirmed that the Maxima flywheel has 125 teeth. I have tried to verify this via my local Nissan dealer, but they don’t stock the factory flywheels and they can’t seem to confirm the tooth count for me (info not available in parts books). I will continue to try and get confirmation through a dealership, but it is something I think you should take a look at because many people on Maxima.org have tried using your flywheel and have had grinding and or other starter problems. Unfortunately, most members are just taking their cars to a local mechanic and asking to have their new clutch and flywheel installed and having all sorts of problems after it’s all back together. Most not even thinking that there may be a problem in mismatched teeth count.
Please let me know what you find. I have purchased one of your flywheels and will be returning it unless I can get and answer to this issue.
Thank You,
Tom K
Fidanza's response:
Dear Mr. K,
The information you have provided is most likely correct from what we can see on our records, but the bottom line is that the 124 tooth flywheel does work on both applications and has for years. These flywheels for the 350Z and Maxima were originally developed in cooperation with Jim Wolf Technology and they used them successfully for years until they chose to go with another manufacturer that copied our design and does it for them private label. Literally hundreds of these flywheels have been installed over the years, and when looking, you will see that some individuals had starter noise and some did not; some needed to shim the starter slightly and some didn't. The difference between the 124 and 125 teeth is negligible in the final measurements including the thread pitch and engagement angle, that s why most aftermarket flywheel companies use only the 124 tooth ring gear. In some cases, due to variances in block or starter flange castings, it is necessary to slightly shim the starter to provide the correct gear clearances. Most domestic car manufacturers have followed this practice for decades, while many of the import manufacturers have tried to say it is not necessary... but if you check a factory service manual, they will usually give a standard clearance or engagement spec for the starter & flywheel gear, and this should always be checked and adjusted when doing any starter, flywheel or clutch replacement, as this "gap' is critical to smooth operation. Please note, that in addition, the sound of the starter engaging on a lightweight aluminum flywheel WILL be slightly louder (and different) from a heavier, stock flywheel.
We hope this information helps. Please keep in mind that these flywheels are performance parts and are not meant to exactly replace the OE part without accomodation or adjustment by a knowledgeable installer: Please refer to the first paragraph of your Fidanza Aluminum Flywheel Instructions.
Thank You again for your business & Best Regards,
The Fidanza Sales Team
Engineered Excellence,
Proven Performance
4199 Main St.
Perry, OH 44081 USA
P: 440-259-5656
F: 440-259-5588
www.fidanza.com
sales@fidanza.com
Here is my response to Fidanza:
Dear Fidanza,
I must say I am surprised and disappointed at your response to my letter concerning an Engineering deficiency in one of your parts. I would have thought that a company with the catch phrase “Engineered Excellence” would have more Engineering competency than to release a product that was at least fully tested to ensure proper fit and function while not creating damage to other mating components. Many auto manufacturers, including the domestics, have switched to accurately machining a pilot diameter on the nose of the starter and positively locating it, via the crankshaft centerline, into the block or bell housing. The radial location of the starter to crankshaft centerline is now positively established and can be tightly controlled through geometric machining tolerances, hence eliminating the need for starter shimming.
I’m sorry to hear that you feel it isn’t necessary to manufacture an aftermarket performance part that at least meets the precision and quality of an OEM part, never mind surpass it, but there are companies out there who do. Jim Wolf Technologies happens to be one of them and they in fact do offer a 124 (350Z) tooth AND a 125 (Maxima) tooth flywheel, and for a lower cost. I have already returned your flywheel for one of theirs and will do my best to make sure others in the Nissan community know of the consequences of using your product.
Regards,
Tom K
Moral of the story, use a Jim Wolf flywheel and NEVER have a problem! I also used their 350Z clutch and it works great.
Dear Sales and Technical departments,
I am writing to you because I think there is a problem with your aluminum flywheel for the 2002-2005 Nissan Maxima, P/N 143951 . I confirmed through Alice @ Fidanza, that your flywheel has 124 teeth, as does the OEM 350Z flywheel. However, through our Maxima community on “Maxima.org” several members have confirmed that the Maxima flywheel has 125 teeth. I have tried to verify this via my local Nissan dealer, but they don’t stock the factory flywheels and they can’t seem to confirm the tooth count for me (info not available in parts books). I will continue to try and get confirmation through a dealership, but it is something I think you should take a look at because many people on Maxima.org have tried using your flywheel and have had grinding and or other starter problems. Unfortunately, most members are just taking their cars to a local mechanic and asking to have their new clutch and flywheel installed and having all sorts of problems after it’s all back together. Most not even thinking that there may be a problem in mismatched teeth count.
Please let me know what you find. I have purchased one of your flywheels and will be returning it unless I can get and answer to this issue.
Thank You,
Tom K
Fidanza's response:
Dear Mr. K,
The information you have provided is most likely correct from what we can see on our records, but the bottom line is that the 124 tooth flywheel does work on both applications and has for years. These flywheels for the 350Z and Maxima were originally developed in cooperation with Jim Wolf Technology and they used them successfully for years until they chose to go with another manufacturer that copied our design and does it for them private label. Literally hundreds of these flywheels have been installed over the years, and when looking, you will see that some individuals had starter noise and some did not; some needed to shim the starter slightly and some didn't. The difference between the 124 and 125 teeth is negligible in the final measurements including the thread pitch and engagement angle, that s why most aftermarket flywheel companies use only the 124 tooth ring gear. In some cases, due to variances in block or starter flange castings, it is necessary to slightly shim the starter to provide the correct gear clearances. Most domestic car manufacturers have followed this practice for decades, while many of the import manufacturers have tried to say it is not necessary... but if you check a factory service manual, they will usually give a standard clearance or engagement spec for the starter & flywheel gear, and this should always be checked and adjusted when doing any starter, flywheel or clutch replacement, as this "gap' is critical to smooth operation. Please note, that in addition, the sound of the starter engaging on a lightweight aluminum flywheel WILL be slightly louder (and different) from a heavier, stock flywheel.
We hope this information helps. Please keep in mind that these flywheels are performance parts and are not meant to exactly replace the OE part without accomodation or adjustment by a knowledgeable installer: Please refer to the first paragraph of your Fidanza Aluminum Flywheel Instructions.
Thank You again for your business & Best Regards,
The Fidanza Sales Team
Engineered Excellence,
Proven Performance
4199 Main St.
Perry, OH 44081 USA
P: 440-259-5656
F: 440-259-5588
www.fidanza.com
sales@fidanza.com
Here is my response to Fidanza:
Dear Fidanza,
I must say I am surprised and disappointed at your response to my letter concerning an Engineering deficiency in one of your parts. I would have thought that a company with the catch phrase “Engineered Excellence” would have more Engineering competency than to release a product that was at least fully tested to ensure proper fit and function while not creating damage to other mating components. Many auto manufacturers, including the domestics, have switched to accurately machining a pilot diameter on the nose of the starter and positively locating it, via the crankshaft centerline, into the block or bell housing. The radial location of the starter to crankshaft centerline is now positively established and can be tightly controlled through geometric machining tolerances, hence eliminating the need for starter shimming.
I’m sorry to hear that you feel it isn’t necessary to manufacture an aftermarket performance part that at least meets the precision and quality of an OEM part, never mind surpass it, but there are companies out there who do. Jim Wolf Technologies happens to be one of them and they in fact do offer a 124 (350Z) tooth AND a 125 (Maxima) tooth flywheel, and for a lower cost. I have already returned your flywheel for one of theirs and will do my best to make sure others in the Nissan community know of the consequences of using your product.
Regards,
Tom K
Moral of the story, use a Jim Wolf flywheel and NEVER have a problem! I also used their 350Z clutch and it works great.
11-07-2014, 11:41 PM
#3
1 tooth less is no big deal and the OP wants to know about chatter, not starter grind.
Oh, and I had a stage 2 clutchmaster on my 4th gen and it came with a defective pressure plate that they wouldn't warranty because I admitted my car was not stock..so tell them even your gasoline is purchased from Nissan or I'm sure they will back out of the warranty.
Oh, and I had a stage 2 clutchmaster on my 4th gen and it came with a defective pressure plate that they wouldn't warranty because I admitted my car was not stock..so tell them even your gasoline is purchased from Nissan or I'm sure they will back out of the warranty.
Last edited by Fakie J Farkerton; 11-07-2014 at 11:43 PM.
11-08-2014, 12:11 AM
#4
Grinding isn't Fidanza's fault. I have two of them. One car grinds and the other does not. Cheap castings with poor QC sound a lot more likely.
On topic: Is that clutch a 6 puck ceramic or regular?
On topic: Is that clutch a 6 puck ceramic or regular?
Last edited by Child_uv_KoRn; 11-08-2014 at 12:14 AM.
11-08-2014, 06:53 AM
#5
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 161
Okay... So jwt flywheel... How much chatter/noise it has? And the clutch masters fx250 is a whole disk stage 2.5 made up of kevlar... Or just go with jwt clutch? Who makes the jwt flywheels? I heard clutch masters makes clutches for them...
11-15-2014, 05:43 PM
#8
Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 154
JWT flywheel
There is no noise or chatter associated with the flywheel itself. In my opinion it's not even worth gambling on the possibility of getting starter grind with the wrong flywheel tooth count, especially when JWT has the correct tooth count and it's cheaper than the the Fidanza! The aggressiveness of the friction material (and how clean you kept the flywheel/clutch surfaces during assembly) will determine how smooth the clutch will engage and disengage. The JWT 350Z clutch should be all the clutch you'll need for any NA application. I've had it in for over two years now and it has performed flawlessly. If you have any more questions just call JWT, they were extremely helpfully and willing to discuss any questions.
BTW our starters are NOT designed to be shimmed like an old GM starter! I've heard of people attempting it, but it's not practical or advised.
BTW our starters are NOT designed to be shimmed like an old GM starter! I've heard of people attempting it, but it's not practical or advised.
11-18-2014, 11:14 PM
#11
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 161
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