Don't forget Don has an n/a 4th gen max runing 12.2. And a benz clk60 runs 11.9 auto. don't doubt the power of an auto done right

 

I look forward to AMG expanding their business to Nissan.

 

that will be awsome....Maxima AMG...hehe

 

the clk 60 isn't a amg, but you get my point

 

they should just call this thread (auto vs. manual) This debate will never end. Manual owners sometimes wish didn't have to shift and could just relax or have their mind elsewhere. Likewise Automatic owners wish they could shift to have some fun. I think what max'n-out did is awesome. I drive an automatic (i would have considered getting a stick but I go to SF so much, I didn't want to stress those damn hills ) and it's kewl to know what "else" can be done to improve automatics.

that's my 2 cents

 

If youre just talking about a quarter mile, then yes all you do is steer. But if you think that there no technique involved in driving an auto in real world racing (i.e. the freeway) then you are simply wrong.
Last night, I smoked an A6 2.7T in my 2000 GLE (just intake and S-03's) and it certainly wasn't because my car was faster. It came down to manuevering technique and *****. The A6 was modified and probably a stick, but he wasn't having much "fun" looking at my tail lights!

 

Come to think of it, what is a CLK60? All the two-digit models are AMG in the U.S. Further, the current CLK is a 55. Are you referring to a Euro model of the CLK?

 

The clk 60 is made by renntech, and is the perfact example of an o my god automatic. neck snaping aceleration. Certainly not good for the street, but it was the only dramtic example I could think of off the top of my head. The clk 55 is a nicly calm moded auto, but not the example I was looking for.

The simple point Ive been trying to make is that auto people thed to think they only can go so far, and with these few examples and now with what Ive done, I hope people see, that they can go just as far and maybe farther than a 5 speed when you consider so much more is in an auto tranny, it just really comes down to the cost reward principle.

 

It would be my asumption that yes since it's N/a. But I never read the whole thing. Just heard the final time. But I never said I'd run a 12.2 more like a 12.5 to 12.9. I heard sombody say he had 375, I think I'll produce around 330-350, so I don't think the times are far off especally once I learn to drive it good.

 

I dont see what all the debate is about. If you feel confident in the job you've done on your car, just dyno, and post your results. Thats the best way to end the argument. What you've done does sound vey innovative and I'm sure anyone who could scrape together enough money to do something like this would feel proud of the final result. Congrats on the success of your new mod man! Put some numbers up too though so we can see if its worth it for other auto guys to pursue similar options...

Deac

 

It is getting dyno'd and I will when I have them. I'm not the one that started the debate. I'm just trying to broden peoples look on things, seems like some feel the 5 speed is God. The reality is really Ive got nothing to gain by posting any of this.

 

its no fun in heavy traffic is it

I wish I had one of each
I will enjoy my auto

 

Dam kid!! you are a true Maxima fiend, last week you dropped4k on new brakes and now this!!
Dam , all i can say is you better be faster than an M5(cause i am)

Congrats!!
well my major new MOd well be new Maxspeed springs!!!

Roger

 

\


Yeah im working on being faster and faster and stoping faster. Plus I'm reading the stereo. In the end maybe I'll be maxima or the month here But I'll probley have the mags b4 that O and the brakes arn't quite 4 k. All I have to say is this, the most fun I will have is after roasting a svt mustang or somthing like that I can yell out the window auto, and be gone. Now thats priceless

 

Do you have some form of electronic traction control? Positraction was a proprietary implementation of traction control by GM, it was on a lot of their cars during the late 80's and early 90's. It was a electronically controlled suspension system that actuated the dampening rates of the suspension system in real time with road conditions. You can find this system on most corvettes of the previous generations made during that time. I think what you are refferring to is a Limited slip differential of some kind. Canadian 4th gens come with a viscous type LSD, and 2k2's come with a heliacal LSD. Both types are a vast improvement over conventional open differentials, but it's not "instant traction." BTW the maxima is NOT a "one wheel drive" car, it's FWD, power gets to both front wheels, but in an open differential system, the torque will take the path of least resistance, causing the wheel without traction to get the bulk of the power and spin while the other one does not. The main benefit to an LSD is during hard cornering when one wheel may lose traction completely. It also serves to limit torque steer on launches.

But if you think that it will completely eliminate your traction problems, especially in a FWD vehicle with 300+ hp/torque as you claim, then you're in for a surprise. You're still in for a world of wheel hop. The only thing that can really help is either major suspension/chassis/engine mount modification, or some sort of AWD/RWD conversion. Radial arms such as those being developed by warpspeed are known to be a big help as well.

Personally, even though I drive an auto, I would by far prefer a 5-speed or a 6-speed. My reasoning is not because of shift times, it's because of drivetrain power transfer and gear ratios. No matter how fast you can make an automatic shift, unless you have a locking torque converter, direct power transfer is impossible. There are no friction plates that directly transfer torque in a standard auto tranny.. Torque is transferred via a fluid medium.. ie.. ATF. Therefore there will always be a signifigant drivetrain loss compared to a manual transmission. Also, gear ratios play an important role. Our automatic trannys have 4 gears in which the engine needs to rev through to attain acceleration. You may have over come this problem, as you seem to be mostly concerned with drag racing, and are also supercharged. But in an NA max, this becomes a signifigant issue. Any auto max that has tried to floor it while cruising at 35 mph knows what I'm talking about.

On the other hand, I don't agree with the statement that it takes no skill to drive an auto, try road racing, and you'll find "steering your car" becomes quite difficult. =D

peace

Dennis

 

Nitrous = Forced Induction...Don's not N/A....

12.5-12.9...330-350hp...hmmm...it's nice to have goals, but speculation is just that. Means nothing.

 

Turbo, S/c = forced induction. Last I knew Nirtous was not put into that field. I don't think the numbers are unresnable, from what Ive seen.

 

well now you know.

unreasonable, no. unlikely, yes.

 

The form of possitraction I have is a custom form, it does not acually exist in any prebuilt form. Like I said b4 I can't get into the specs of it, not cuz i don't want to, but because I was asked not to since he's trying to patent it. Limited slip and possitraction are different forms of the same thing. In my case with the factory wheels on now with the stock boost, it used to be that you could just roast one tire and the other would do nothing, that to me is one wheel drive. Now, one wheel takes what it can the other gets going then and as it sits now traction is about instant. And your right there should be minimul torque steer. As for traction though when it's done and i put the 19"s back on with the coilovers tightened down real tight with the large contact patch the tires have traction should be pretty good, I don't know if there will be none but close to it. At least as good as most. Engine mounts probley would help though it's still sorta a daily driver so I don't know that I want the huming noise most talk about at idle. After all Im only gonna hit the track once. Really RWD ins't the answer either look how that don't work and people roast tires just for fun. AWD 50 50 split would be good but i'm not that into it to jump on that either. As for powertransfer to the ground, thats one of the things we think we improved. It may or may not be to the point of a manny, but better and I still get the ease of the auto. And the gear ratio's have been changed. A lockup torque converter is unnessacary at this point to, it's still a daily driver. As for the lag most have at 35mph, I don't have that lack of kick down anymore, it does it instantly.

 

why do you think 330hp is so hard to reach?

 

Just do that math with me. 12hp per lb of boost, base is 175 + 10 lbs of boost 120hp = 295 + intercooler (depends on air movement alot) 15-30 hp = 310-325 + full custom exhaust, fine tuning the fuel and ignition. So I think the 330 hp range is atanable and thats all with basic numbers with out the thought of tranny improvments. Only thing that is up in the air is by how much the intercooler will decrease boost, so figure .25lb to .50lb loss, so lose maybe 6 hp.

 

Why has the forum turned into this? People get excited when they get an intake, and ***** at people when they do extreme things, yet always want to see them done.

 

Don't worry about it. Nice addition to the maxima mods. But can you give an idea when this would be available to everyone else? Or can the vendor offer the mod right now?(for xxx price?) Or is he finalizing everything before offering it? Seems like it's ready to go if it's done on yours already. Once the pat is pending, I suppose he can release everything.

 

$.02: So much BS back and forth, I got tired
of reading after the second page...


ADMAN

 

This isn't gonna be an open market kinda mod. The patents he's going after are for certain parts that can be used on most cars, but this isn't going into a kit form. If you want it done you can take it to him and he can do it.

 

Fine. Does he have an idea how much it would cost to get this done by him? Again I think if the Pats are pending, he can say what's involved in the mods. Reason is if someone is going to pay a few grand to have this done, they will want to know what's involved(just prudent to do so) It's IS his intention to offer this to others right? (hence your ultimate purpose of this post)

 

Ive gotten a few "Im's" about geting peices of what's been done to mine out to the generel public. So I guess what I'll do is talk to him when I go down, and see if he's willing to put some different things together for the org. I have no idea what he plans to market to. All I know is he told me what he was doing in some detail and told me to keep it quit, and in exchange for me telling peple about him and mentioning him in the mag articles, he'd keep the price low.

But custom stuff like this is what he does. He does trannys for exact dutys that they need to be setup for such as the 2000 hp drag cars he builds custom trannys for.

My ultimate purpose for the post, was just to mention my mod, just like people on here saying "i got an intake and ypipe" and basically just to show that options for autos arn't as limited as some think. And I thought people would see it as a kewl and happy post. Instead it got turned into a auto vs manny situation.

It's kinda like doing suicide doors, it takes direct car mod so you can't really market it to the masses.

 

One other thing I'd like to add. I never said this was going to be made into a kit for the masses. And never said it was affordable for the masses. I know it sucks, but I did say it was custom. I will do as I said as see what he is willing to put out there.

But look at it this way. Don has somthing big done to his tranny, and refuses to tell anybody about it and only sells the vb. Now it's either cuz he wants to keep it a secret or cuz he knows there is no real market for it. So if your really looking for sombody to make a big kit to go agansist level 10 maybe Don is the one to talk to.

Don't ***** at me cuz mine isn't going to be a kit. It sucks I know. But come on.

Sorry I had to vent like this. But It seems like people want to ***** at me like I was suposed to do somthing and let them down. And the reality is ive just tried to make people more aware.

 

So will this guy have the stuff available for a 4th gen? I'm not sure how different the parts are. Check your email, I'd like this guy's number. I'm already having the LSD and axles built by another company, but I do need some work done to the tranny. And I have a spare one I bought for rebuild. I'd just like to have other options besides Level10.

 

Other stuff like clutchs, bands etc? Pretty much any mod/pop store that does performance app stuff could put new clutches in. Ah if you want to go with the ceramics like I have then you need to harden the casing, and what ever it was he did to add more. Probley the best thing to do is call him and say hey if i send you my tranny what route do you think we should take to acheive this goal. ive got no email from ya.

 

WOW.. all i gotta say is WOW...

it is extremely cool that someone has stepped foot in the unfamiliar territory of modifying our slush boxes... and my god all those componets you have listed has got me drooling.. however, what many of us would definately like to know is were those peices put together so they'd fit in a maxima's slushbox and work real well? or were they machined to spec, tested, retested, modified, and tested again so they could perform all out to their full potential?? because either way it's still cool, but like any average Joe, i want something that was made for my car, not something that was made for some other car ans stuffed in my car. You see many companies out there make alot of parts for various cars, but they are made just to fit and do offer a performance gain over stock, but all those components used to create that single part are not acting up to their full potential.. And we all want to inquire about this. BUT our questions tend to be man-handled by you in a sense that you dont' want us to know about this awesome mod of yours, you're not willing to share, and it is quite apparent that you redundantly say "you have to drive it to know the feeling." (now that's a paraphrase but u get the point) so if we're in town, would u let us take YOUR car out for a spin? because if u do, WOW u are a man of great generosity because i for one dont' let people drive my car, the car is just one of the things i don't like sharing with others..

If possible i would more than apreciate a scan of a dyno plot from your car with the transmission upgrade. it would more than benifit us if u did that prior to the adition of any other irregular mod so we can actually compare it to another car with "similar" mods.. and belive me i do understand that dynoing a car cost some money, and just dynoing a car to prove a point is a dollar wasted. however.. i think you'de benefit from dynoing it. the dyno plot would be a good indicator for you to refer to, you for yourself will get to see what extra numbers you put out from that project of yours, and many of us would be more than grateful if you shared the results with us. But if you aren't willing to share the results, or give us any constructive feedback pertaining to your mod, and if you are nothing but flanting your material posessions, then please, don't post ever like this again, because it makes our hearts bleed have a false sense of hope for our slushboxes, and be turned down by people like you.

-daniel

 

I don't know about you, but Jason's been really helpful to me with all of my questions concerning this.

 

OH no... i didn't mean to bash him one bit, i do find his post rather informative. and for that very reason i replied. if it was nothing but jibberish i wouldn't even finish reading the post and would have moved on. i just feeling that he was a lil agitated by a few members and have seemed to be slightly tempermental with his replies. so i thot it might have helped if i posted through a different approach. i basically asked alot of the same questions but in a different way, possibly nicer or not. i didn't read the last two posts because i got a lil anxious and wanted to spew my mouth full of jibberish. so by the time i replied it was too late, i didn't see that he stated his original intent to posting this.
there still will be questions lurking about his mod, and i'm just one of the curious types, i may not be in the market for the same modification, but having a background in automotive technology sure makes me real curious about this particular modification. It's not everyday where someone jumps out and says "hey i beefed up my auto gearbox" and since he did, i'm going to be one of the many people that will swim around him like school of sharks keeping an eye out on this new enhancement of his. thats all.. no harm intended on my side.

 

if you are spending so much on an auto tranny, why not just get a manual and do something to that transmission,..... it would probably cost less and perform wwwwwaaaaaayyyyyy better....
just curious...

 

The pieces were fit specifically to the max and were tested out everything fits just about perfect. And was done to be as affective (to potential) as possible. This is not something done for any other car, it uses technology he's used in other cars, but in this case it's all fit to my maxima, and my application.

I’ve tried to answer sensible q's that have been asked to me. I’ve only manhandled the negative comments. At least that was what I’ve felt. I’ve tried to answer all q's that I can, I’ve said I can't get into full specs of certain things, but for what I can I have.

Now would I let a stranger I just meet drive my car? Of course not I'm insane but not stupid , but if it was somebody from here at say a maxima meet, I’d probley take them for a drive so they can see just how fast it kicks down and accelerates, I mean after all every can still see the diff even just by being in the passenger seat. I'd say that’s pretty good. Try getting a Porsche owner to do that for you at a car show.

if you go back through you will see that I’ve said the dyno is coming a b4 and after (more boost and intercooler etc). The car was late to the apointment, and they are now working around everything else they have to do. I actually thought I’d be here by now. But the sheer numbers do not encompass a mod like this. I mean think about it, people love there valve body mods, but it does not put down more numbers on the dyno, and maybe the track numbers are only slightly better, but the feel is what really matters and streetablity. But I’m betting it puts down the numbers as well as the feel.

By the way, why not ask don what he has done? Why not ask him to produce the kit? Put down numbers? It's his business and he isn't sharing, I’ve become sorry that I’ve even posted this, I thought it would be something kewl, and expand peoples mind, but I guess being stuck in one minded pursuit is what this forum has become.

 

First you need to keep an open mind. If you want to stick to manual's your gonna have a big shock when gear'd trannys go away. It would not have been just as simple as droping in a manny and beefing it up, and that would have been hellishly more expensive, from what I paid, and even what reatil would be. Auto's do not have to be as bad as what you think. In fact they can be awesome.

 

why not ask him? well i have my reasons why not.. but i wanted to ask you because u've actually listed the components that were invovled in ur mod, u've been alot more informative and i was just seeing if could milk u a lil more for what u had
it's real cool seeing that u've went to higher ground with your transmission. but then i have another question. is it possible that u might make some type of mechanism similar to i30krab's for shifting? making it so u can shift to a specific gear at either a pull of a lever or a touch of a button? that'd be real nice.. the last time i replied in his post he displayed a bit of hostility towards my comment. that was a long time ago and i'm not holding grudges on that. i tend to be real selective as to who i reply to because half the time people would just jump out and chew whomever out. i'm glad that you answered my few questions and am thankful that u've took your time reading my long replies.. wouldn't it make life easier for u?

 

I'm not trying to come down on you. But people think I'm a ***** or somthing for not getting real detailed. I just thought it was kinda ironic since Don keeps real tight liped, and is So respected. And Ive been nice enough to tell, and I don't benifit in any way from doing it.

If you have q's that I can answer I'm usally very glad to answer them, no matter what they are about, I have about 50 people on my aol buddy list from helping people consistantly. It's just that I show people the same respect they show me, and Ive just become frustrated.

Now, I have no idea what "i30krab's" has at all. From what your saying I doubt i'd ever put somthing like that in. The gear ratio was changed and is pretty good for what i'll be using it for, it's no longer in the wrong gear. It instantly kicks to the right gear, and is in the right rpm range. So I don't really see a benifit from hiting a switch, even for winter conditions I could just put it down to 2 or 1, but I doubt i'd even take it out in the snow just to much power. And to big of wheels.

 

You know the only comment I have is that people who buy manuals should be more interested in road racing, not drag racing. Any idiot can drive an automatic car fast in a straight line. It takes much more skill to drive a manual car at a road course. Remember, drag racing is for fast cars, road racing is for fast drivers. Why only live a 1/4 mile at a time? I prefer to be on track for 1/2 hour at a time, Not 13 or 14 seconds!

 

totally agree