Alright! Here it goes. The motor is torn down and the build has begun.
I want to do a full build (bore .20 to .30 over, forged rods, pistons, ARPs all around) I'm going to spray at first then adding boost later. So what do you guys suggest? Brands? Cheap places to buy parts? I don't really want to cheap out but I don't want to go overboard ya know? YES! I have searched. I just want to see what people suggest now. Give me some input folks. I wasn't going to bore but.... well you can see as soon as i get the pics up.



here are the pics

 

I went with wiseco .20 over 96mm 8.8:1 pistons since i am going with tons of boost. What you need to figure out is your final goal. If you plan to boost you dont want to do a hc build but if you plan to boost lc is better. Do tons of reading and you will be ok after that. Also i got all my stuff of ebay .

 

8.8:1 is exactly what I was thinking. What Head gasket did you go with? I do plan on boosting but it is getting pushed back now that I got to see what this freakin motor looks like inside.

 

 

I think it's safe to say that it had a blown head gasket... cylinders 3 and 5 were shot and as you can see there was a ton of sludge in the oil pan.

 

Also, the bearings are shot. Aftermarket or OEM?

 

Ouch! I would tear the motor down to the block and crank, take the block, crank, and heads to a good machine shop and see what kind of shape those parts are in. Looks like most of the short block will need replaced, and depending, maybe some head work will be needed to get rid of rust.

Evaluate what you have to work with first....

As someone said, boost and spray/NA take different compression ratios. You should decide which way you are going before buying parts - and how much WHP you hope to create. All rods and pistons are not created as equals. 400WHP can use cheaper parts - 500WHP gets expensive quickly. See my engine build thread.

 

My goal is going to be 400whp. I don't think a stock 6 speed trans will even hold up to that. We will see. I am def. going low compression.

 

Low compression and spray is not ideal. It can be done but not ideal. I personally went with Cometic head gasket, arp head studs, oem mainstuds, Eagle rods, Wiseco pistons,ACL race bearings, And low compression 96mm pistons. That is a ideal setup for boost but not so much for spray. What grey did (i.e) High compression pistons are perfect for spray. We are both shooting for about the same power but to different paths. Neither one to me is wrong, he is in love with the gas and i am in love with the boost.

But this is all stuff you need to think about before you go out and spend thousands of dollars and trust me is will be thousands. I said i would do pistons and rods and now 3k later i have rods,pistons,headstuds,hg,and bearings. This all adds up quick just to let you know. The best thing to do is take your time and figure your goal and the path you want to take.

Last but not least where is the block? i would like to see your walls. If your pistons look that bad and you did indeed have a blown hg i would have a shop check your deck on the heads and block and also your bores.

 

My buddy is a mechanic. He helped me tear it down. He says the walls need to be bored. He is unsure about the head. I'll be taking it to a machine shop soon.

 

Please - let a good machine shop analyze the crank, block, and heads. Don't poke thousands of $$$ into a poor foundation. Get the block and heads hot-tanked first, then miked and measured. If you have a good block and crank, get the outside glass-bead blasted to get off gunk. Surprising what you find when the metal is cleaned off. You might need to polish the crank journals - I'd count on that. Bearings only come in a few service sizes - check before touching the crank.

Do the same to the heads - you didn't mention cams but you def should plan on cams unless you boost. kzoosho and others can advise you on that. Heads and valves should be torn down and blasted as well - then it's time for a "valve job" at the minimum.

If you get this far, plan on a .5mm overbore, and ACL bearings and ARP main and head studs. HR head studs will save money. HR head gaskets are good enough for me - and a bunch of boosted 350Z owners.

Oh, yeah, pick good pistons and rods and get everything balanced together.

Still sure you want to do this?

 

no. haha. I'm still going to do it. Just going to take longer than I thought. I need to plant a money tree

 

Lol yea like i said my minor build has ended up costing me more than buying the 5.5 i wanted.

 

Yup - just remember, a "half-assed " job means you'll be running half-fast.

Find a racer machine shop and listen to them - carefully.

 

I went with a similar or almost exact same setup as kzoosho, Wiseco 96mm 8.8compression ($600), eagle H beam rods($400), ACL Bearings ($130 and please check if ur crank is good and in spec), HR head gasket ($60), stock HR head bolts, Rev up oil pump ($170). Thats about $1,360 on parts alone, plus random parts another like $200 bucks.

Now, goes the machine work, which you should estimate to between $600 and $1,000.

mine was:
balance 150
resurfance block 100
polish crank 40
file fit rings 60
225 to bore and hone (make sure the shop your using uses a Torque Plate, a must!)

As you can see, my bill is about $1,935 right there, add a couple hundreds bucks for random things.

As far as my build, im leaving the heads completely stock.
and no, im not a baller lol. I aint got work, and im going to school full time with penny's in the bank lol. But if you shop around and take your sweet time, eventually you will have everything you need done. I am almost done, just dropped off the block at the machine shop yesterday to get balanced n stuff.

Goodluck with your project, btw, with my setup, im looking to produce about no less than 400 and no higher than 550whp with my HX35 turbo. On the z forums, the builders and people on there say the block unsleeved can handle about 550hp, but, i havent found anyone to crack a cylinder wall (maybe there is but i havnt seen it), so who knows how much hp it can really take, im willing to bet its alot more, without having to sleve which that alone is another $2k on top of the above mentioned pricing.

 

I actually have about 2500 set aside to play with. So I may be alright. Should have a decent bonus coming so we will see. My only concern is that I will probably need to spend more money on the machining part due to the area I live in. I hope not

Kinda O.T. but I just got my birthday present that my girlfriend gave me installed. Umnitza 3Ks. Looks pretty good. haha. Back on topic.... So what is the bore needed for the 96mm wisecos? Also... Would I run the risk of internal damage with the 8.8:1 cr with a 75 shot? or even a 100 shot?

 

The bore needed will be specified with in the box when u get your pistons, the machine shop takes care of that. no you wont have any damage from spraying on low comp, you'll just lack some power. Maybe someone else can elaborate as to why low comp isnt need as much as boost. im not 100% sure.

 

ok cool. I didn't think the juice would hurt a low comp motor. I'll order the pistons soon. You have a linkey or something so I can see exactly what I'm looking at?

 

Lower compression = lower NA or N2O HP. It also reduces the chances of knocking, detonation, or preginition, since cylinder pressures are lower.

Once you build your motor with 8.8:1 pistons and good rods, you could probably spray a 200-shot with not a lot of drama. Wouldn't make that much HP, but it would be exciting.

You can spray a stock 3.5 with a 75-shot and probably have no problems.. even using pump gas - and that's the stock 10.x:1 CR. Reason for the higher CR is that it makes more power for most things - but power is not free. Higher octane race fuel ( I use 109 ) and less ignition advance is good as you spray more.

My latest 3.5 build has a super-strong short block - the weakest parts are the Cosworth bearings at 1000 HP -11:1 double-coated CP pistons and Carrillo rods are rated at 1500 HP. It just takes money.

 

I see. So how much power do you think will be lost with the 8.8:1 cr?

 

??? without boost or spray, just NA, it will probably feel like a 3.0 ...

 

Err...just building the motor and putting it back in, no power adders? It'll feel like the motor's worn out and leaking compression, as that's essentially what you did - you lowered compression.

 

ok right on. I'm planning on running juice at first. Who knows... I may just wait for the turbo kit to put it in...

 

If you can find them I would go with 9:1 compression pistons. I know AAM has them special ordered from JE and use them in most of there twin turbo builds. It may cost you a little more but I believe that 8.8:1 is a little low for the VQ35 especially if you are going with a big turbo.

The stock VQ35 has been deemed safe to 450 WHP (Max) as long as the block is in good condition.

I have seen stock 350z blocks run 450 on the dyno and never have an issue, granted it comes down to how you drive it.

obviously you have to put some money into the block as it has some issues, but if you are shooting for 400 WHP I wouldn't go with such low compression pistons.

Honestly in regards to VQ35 builds, I would check my350z as they are going to give you some of the best knowledge in regards to high horsepower builds

example...

http://my350z.com/forum/shop-builds/...8wtq-8psi.html

Stock VQ35 pushing 415 WHP.



AAM STG I Twin Kit
- Twin Ball Bearing Garretts
- AAM COMP Manifolds
- Vertical Flow FMIC (retains front impact beam)
- All aluminum fittings and teflon lines
- AAM F/I Flash
- Black 4ply Couplers
AAM Oil Cooler
AAM Oil Pan Spacer
AAM 3" HFCs (NO CEL!)
AAM 2.5" True Dual Exhaust
AAM Basic Fuel System w/ Walbro
AAM Angled Plenum Spacer
Deatschwerks 440cc
UTEC
HKS EVC
HKS SSQV
Competition Forged Flywheel w/ 6 Puck Sprung Clutch
Autometer Nexus Oil Press & EGT

http://s221.photobucket.com/albums/d...t=MVI_9173.flv

 

that block looks nasty lol. Deff have all that stuff checked before you dump money into it.

 

If you're going to get machine work done, I'd honestly go straight for Alex at AAM. Especially if you're going to get it bored out, have any head work done, etc.

 

ok Thanks for the input guys. How much does AAM charge to bore? Do I smell a hook up? haha

 

The only issue I see here, is that you won't be spraying every time you step on the gas, so during normal driving you will notice the deficit. Spray should be an additive on top of the boost you would be running if it was up to me. Nice little 5-9 psi on a turbo with a sweet 35 - 50 shot on top out of the hole.

 

Yea, I wasn't planning on spraying all the time. Just at WOT at the track.

Merlyn or Paul, Give me a call when you get a chance if you don't mind. Thanks

 

No idea the retail cost on that. Give them a call.

Actually, if you do, ask for Alex directly, tell him Merlyn or I sent him your way, he might be able to do it for you after hours. Probably not, but it's worth a shot.

Ha, no hook up. Hell, we don't work there anymore...

 

PM sent paul

 

aam meaning alteredatmosphere in md?

 

Indeed.

 

been trying to figure out what size piston to go with. If the bore would be between .20 to .30 about what size would the piston be? I just want to make sure I get pistons that will allow me to bore a decent amount but not too much.

 

The bore is always fit to the pistons and not the other way around. You can go .030" with no problems, however the standard off-the-shelf aftermarket oversize is .020". BTW, if your machine shop is willing to bore out the block without knowing the precise piston diameter and material (silicon content) beforehand, RUN.

 

haha, no no no. I understand that, I just don' wat o go with a piston tha would require NO bore. The want the piston first. I guess I just need tokw what size piston to go with. Thanks

 

Well I have some bad news... the build is on hold and the job search is on. Keep you posted. Wish me luck.