maximachad

Is there much of a difference between the stock BOSE systems and the regular (non-BOSE) double-din unit that looks just like it? They both have 6 speakers, the head-units look EXACTLY the same (except for the tape deck door that reads "BOSE" on it) and they both sound great for a stock system. Also - If you have the non-BOSE system, can you just upgrade your speakers to the BOSE ones and keep the same head unit? I'm thinking the head units are really the same for both systems, and that the difference (if there really is much of one) is in the speakers/speaker amps. Thanks...

dwapenyi

iTrader: (3)

The bose system is vastly different electronically. The amps are in each speaker, each of those amps has some EQing in it. The head unit doesn't put out a standard signal. After the physical resemblance , it stops right there.

DW

maximachad

Wow...thanks dwapenyi - appreciate the info. Do the BOSE/NON-BOSE units sound much different, or is it subtle? I'm wondering if there's a big enough difference to make a BOSE upgrade worth it.

dwapenyi

iTrader: (3)

In my car the Bose was a $900 option, it better sound way better

Actually, it does sound better than the Nissan stereo systems.

If I were you, though, I would invest my time in putting in a very good aftermarket system. The bose ain't bad, it's weakness is that it doesn't have quite enough power and the 6.5" speeakers are too small to put out the bass that the Bose pushes thru it. The speakers should be bigger. They were, the 3rd gen bose had 6x9 speakers and had better bass. Bose must have cuts costs when it came to the 4th gen.

DW

balki

There is lot of difference between BOSE/NON-BOSE in "head-units". There is lot of digital signal processing in BOSE when compare to a NON-BOSE one. Also, BOSE speakers added clarity to the sound. If you are going for bose speaker, I suggest go for head-unit too. Have fun with your car system.

Infinitbird

Yeah I agree with dwapenyi, besides the physical resemblences the two systems are totally different. As far as the sound difference goes I have the bose system in my 96 and it sounds better in my opinion that the non-bose system in my moms 2001 max(even without my subs). If you are thinking of upgrading I personally wouldn't go with the bose. When I had the bose system in my old 91 max the speakers sounded good but the amps one by one started failing. The cost to replace or fix the bose amps is way more than what it would cost for all new speakers. However, currently I have had nothing go wrong in my 96.

T

ericdwong

Read my post on the Max FAQ up above.

RapidMax

iTrader: (2)

The Bose sounds much better than the stock. I love mine and see no need to get an aftermarket stereo but I also think it depends on the music you listen to. If all you listen to is rap and stuff that needs really heavy bass then an aftermarket system is probably worth it. If you like rock like me theres really no reason to get an aftermarket system as the Bose still does have great sounding bass it just wont cause that really loud thump that you can hear from 2 blocks away with subs. When I was looking at a Max the dealer said they would install the Bose speakers into a stock system but then I read on Bose's website that it has to be put in when the car is made or it won't have the same sound. I'd believe Bose over a dealership.

95maxrider

iTrader: (32)

all i did was put 2 subs in my trunk to get me that bass that my bose lacked (even though i thought it had some good bass). subs make a world of difference. i think this sounds just as good as some after-market systems, just not the ones that cost $2000....

pocketrocket

iTrader: (1)

My 95 SE non-Bose sounds pretty good in my opinion. I have not heard the Bose in a 4th gen, and I think it is unfair to compare the 5th gen Bose with a 4th gen.

The stock non-Bose uses a Clarion headunit w/ Panasonic speakers. If the speakers aren't blown, and you're not planning to 'blast' it, I think the stock system is pretty good.

Plus, it's pretty nice with an in-dash 6cd changer.

Infinitbird

I wasn't comparing the 5th gen Bose with the 4th gen. The 5th gen bose sounds imo better than the 4th gen bose. I was comparing the non-bose 5th gen with the mine. I still say uprgrade to aftermarket unless you can get the whole system at a really low price, but thats just what I would do.

T

Max99ES

iTrader: (3)

My friend is offering me his Bose system off his 98 Maxima for $200.. I would like to know how difficult will it be to upgrade non-Bose to Bose system?

meccanoble

iTrader: (22)

i also agree because my factory bose literally busted my speakers wide open, but they were 6X5 in the back and the usual in the front, now that i got MTX 6X9's (200 watt peak) in back, there isn't enough power hitting them and my system sounds weaker than it did wit the bose but now that i got my kenwood double din, it's gonna change...just gotta find someone to install it...hmmmmm

JeepRage

iTrader: (1)

its however hard its going to be to switch out every spekaer and the headunit. very doable id say. i put a kenwood unit in, and kept the bose speakers without too much trouble. added a sub, and i love how it sounds. the Bose speakers arent bad if you dont have to push them too hard for bass. i guess its however hard you think it is, its not a big job to me, but might be to you. either way it shouldnt be too bad, not sure if the wiring will plug right in or not, probably will... goodluck

Hall

dwapenyi

iTrader: (3)

If you can verify that the cabling for non-bose is the same as BOSE, then it will be a simple swap. If not, then it will be quite a headache, but still doable.

DW

ericdwong

The cabling is DEFINATLEY NOT the same. My FSM has 2 complete seperate sections in the electrical wiring part for the Bose and the NON BOSE systems.

AllGo

iTrader: (1)

I have the 4th gen bose in my I30 and it sounded pretty good. I had an audio control 3.1 that has spk level inputs, equalization, 24db per octave xover and line driver. I ran all my signal into the 1/2 din unit and then back to the bose amps. They are now only seeing 90hz and above and I turned the 125hz **** way down. The bose amps are seeing a balanced signal and play much cleaner and louder. I also ran the sub output 90hz and lower, to an amp and a set of 12's so the system sounds very clean, 10 times better than even the 5th gen with the neodymium sub. I now have complete control over the sound at my fingertips and can adjust it to the current music source i.e. fm radio or cd. As far as upgrading to the bose system it would be very intensive, because not only would you have to install all of the speakers but you would also need to run independant power and ground to both doors and the rear deck. Bose amps all are power by 12guage wire at every location throughout the car. A good 4ch amplified system with the stock cd player should only cost you about $400 if you do the work yourself?

dwapenyi

iTrader: (3)

Well, there's your answer! I kinda figured the wiring would be different anyway, just wasn't certain.

DW

pianoman41

Actually, there is absolutely *no* difference in the Bose and non-Bose head units (except for the Bose logo on the cassette door). Bose does not make any head units for any cars, period. They are in the speaker/amp/eq business. Clarion provides the head units for both systems. The non-Bose system is rated at 100W (25W X 4) with 4-ohm speakers at each corner. The Bose system is also 100W (25W X 4), but it has 1-ohm speakers at each corner. Also, the Bose system adds (and here's what they whack you $900 for) a special parametrically EQ'd 25W amp designed to drive the 1-ohm speaker at each corner (this is how they come up with the 200W spec (25 + 25 X 4)). This is where all the extra wiring comes in for the FSM. And this is why you cannot easily replace the Bose speakers with aftermarket ones (or just the head unit and leave the factory speakers). Not many aftermarket head units can drive 1-ohm speakers and not many aftermarket speakers are 1-ohm.

I replaced my non-Bose speakers with some Boston Acoustics all the way around (separates up front) and put a JL 10W6 in the trunk with a Kenwood mono sub amp and the system rocked. Total cost installed was around $500--almost half the cost of the Bose upgrade and I've got a great sound but still have the factory "look" so no one is tempted to steal the b!tch.

Now here's the part I liked: My single CD-player died and Nissan wanted $1200 (WTF!) for a replacement head unit. Instead, I went on eBay and grabbed the single-DIN Nissan OEM head unit out of a 2000 Nissan Frontier pickup and a brand new Nissan OEM in-dash 6-disc changer (from the 2001 Sentra). Now I've got the changer with the great sound and the security of OEM stuff. Total cost for the new HU and changer = $240 combined. BTW, any of you 4th gener's with a GXE with the single-DIN head unit and the pocket directly underneath can add this changer with no wiring needed--plugs right in.

Sure, there are probably better aftermarket systems out there for cheaper, but I really wanted to retain the stock look for security reasons, and where can you get a 6-disc in-dash changer for $200?

Maxima95GLE

I'm having a problem doing the math with your explanation of the Bose amplifiers. Correct me if I'm wrong, but why would someone want to amplify a signal (adding noise to it, as no device is perfect), and then amplify it again (which adds even more noise to it)? From what I understand from my digital electronics elective course a while back in the undergraduate days, if you use 2 amplifiers sequentially, you'd get a multiplier output, not an additive manner--which is not the case that you're presenting. Further, amplifying a signal sequentially will add more noise to a system than just merely using 1 amplifier.

Yes, Clarion makes the head units for Bose and non-Bose systems. While I will probably agree that the headunits are similar, they do have a very fundamental difference. The Bose units only send out a cleaner pre-amplifier signal to the high efficiency 1-ohm speaker/amplifier units (with their own separate equalizer) at each of the 4 corners of the car (the front tweeters are powered separately by the front units). Just a FYI, the non-Bose units use 4-ohm Panasonic speakers. Nonetheless, each of the Bose manufactured amplifiers are 50W, and since I'm not sure if that is peak or RMS output, I'm not going to speculate. Simply, 4 x 50W gives you a 200W stereo system. Nonetheless, the Clarion-Bose headunit does have pretty good specifications for itself (FM unit: 25-15kHz; Cassette: 40-18kHz; CD 17-20kHz) considering it came out in 1995 (for my car's year). The electronic specs may be different for the later 4th Gen, despite a different outward appearance.

Further, for those in the stereo business or has a good understanding of power output, it's not necessarily the power output that is the most important thing, it's the efficiency of the speaker--the more efficient speaker, the louder it will be for a given power output compared to a less efficient speaker. A speaker w/ 98 dB/1watt efficiency will be WAY louder than a speaker w/ 90dB/1watt efficiecy, and it won't require a huge 500W amp to make it sound very loud--let alone blow it. And like pianoman41 said, Bose uses 1-ohm speakers, and they are very rare to come by in the aftermarket, and since I'm sure some have used 4-ohm or 8-ohm speakers as direct replacement speakers to use w/ the 1-ohm Bose amplifier, they'll find themselves a problem w/ impedance mis-matching, and thus drastically reducing their output--so afterwards, when they jump to aftermarket amplifiers (bypassing the Bose amplifier), comments like "my stereo sounds much louder now" is due to the fact that their stereo have impedance matched components (4 ohm headunit with a 4 ohm speaker, or 8 ohm headunit with a 8 ohm speaker setup)--I'm not trashing aftermarket systems (as they can sound real good), but to illustrate the important point of impedence-matching for proper amplifier operation. Nonetheless, it has to be pointed out that since Bose uses 1-ohm speakers, they are relatively efficient in power transmittance (lower resistance than a 4-ohm setup, thus the amplifier wastes less power on making heat), but I'm not sure of the overall efficiency, as Bose does not publish those numbers.

As for the 4 connectors for the Bose speaker, it think it's pretty simple. Two are for the audio signal from the head unit (colors L/Y is positive and L/W is negative), and the other two are for the power to the amplifier (colors R and B for the power connections). If you want to use an aftermarket headunit from Kenwood, Pioneer, Sony, or Clarion with the stock Bose speaker/amplifers, then you'll need to get an aftermarket converter that converts the headunit signal output to be properly matched w/ the 1-ohm Bose speaker/amp units.

Gary95

What is this head unit you refer to that looks exactly like a Bose head unit? If it does not have amplified speakers with it, it is definitely not a re-badged Bose. If the speakers are amplified, and in a Maxima, the head unit is a Bose (actually Clarion--Bose just took the credit for a rebadged head unit).

If you're talking about installing Bose speakers with a non-Bose head unit you obtained, you will have to do some investigation. I have a non-Bose head unit (replacement) that is mated to my OEM Bose speakers that came with the car. I installed an adapter for it ($45) to make the amplified speakers work. The speakers sound beautifully, maybe even better they did when the original Bose head unit was in place. I'm using a JVC KD-SH99, which plays MP3s (either from a CD or from an external MP3 player).

I wouldn't shell out money for a new Bose head unit. You can do much better for less money. Also, I'd stay away from buying a used Bose head unit. These units experience various problems over time (my display went completely blank, though all functions were still operative). A used one is a crap shoot--who knows how long it will be before you suffer one of the classic problems. I almost had mine fixed, but I couldn't see shelling out $200 towards old technology.

pocketrocket

iTrader: (1)

Infinitbird

Agreed, but the 4th gen headunits look better!!!! 5th gen headunits look like the GM/Buick oversized button types



Matt

Glad your headunit combo is working great!!! I love mine too. I only wish that one of the repeat modes included RANDOM same disc, then change disc after finishing one disc. Currently, you only have the option of RANDOM (same disc, non-stop) or RANDOM ALL ( keeps switching CDs after each song, annoying!!!)

MONTE 01&97 SE

iTrader: (1)

I have both 4th gen and a 5th gen BOSE and the 4th Gen one actually sounds better to me. Also looking at a 99 Maxima brochure Nissan claims the stock double unit went up to 120watts can someone tell me were the extra 20 came from?

dwapenyi

iTrader: (3)

Yeah, you're right. When I replaced my Bose (clarion) head unit, I developed a deeper understanding of how the Bose works. The Headunit sends out a line level signal that has been BOSEfied, 35Hz is boosted, but otherwise it's a standard line level RCA signal. That low level signal goes to each of the 4 amps that are mounted to each speaker. Those amps not only add power to the signal, but also process or EQ the signal to suit the speaker. The front speakers have a differnet EQ setup than the rears. Also, on the fronts, the tweeter and the 6.5" front speaker both work from one amp.

Replacing the headunit was a good move, because the CD player was way more capable with it's dual 24 bit D/A converters, and I also got MP3 capability Actually, I replaced the Bose/Clarion headunit with another Clarion, the DXZ 815MP. The Bose adapter I used was the PD-4 from www.linkmeup.com. I still have the same 200 watts, but now I have more features, and better, clearer sound. Those 1st 2 weeks after install, I heard the 815 piicking detail in my Cds I missed with the stock system. Music was much more enjoyable. And the bass was much more well defined. I didn't realize it until I replaced it, but the bass kinda muddy on the original Bose system.

Now, I'm used to it, so I dont notice it as much

DW

co_maxima98

iTrader: (3)

You said you had an apdapter so you could use your non-bose unit with your bose speakers. I am wanting to buy a '99 Bose unit on eBay and use it with my non-Bose speakers. Can I do this?

Is there some sort of adapter I can buy, and where would I get it?

maximised

I agree completely! Both 2k2 and the 2k3 I have test-drove (with BOSE) actually sounded like crap when turned up. It doesn't have the warmth the BOSE system in my 97 has. I think BOSE is getting cheaper and cheaper with their car systems. That would explain why the 4th gen sounds better.

Does anyone know of any good 1 ohm speakers?? I had a set of Q-series MB Quart's that I had been hanging on to for over a year. When I took my door panel off to do some dynamat, I mounted the crossover in the door, installed my MBQuart tweeters, and while I was at it, I tried out my 6.5 drivers to see what would happen. The ohm-mismatch made the stock BOSE speakers sound like they were supposed to be the MBQuarts So I've got Quart tweets, and the rest is still stock. I need some good 1 ohm, efficient speakers. Anyone?

dwapenyi

iTrader: (3)

I'm pretty sure you can just plug the Bose HU right into the factory harness on the upgraded Nissan system if not both systems. The 100 watt system, maybe not the 60 watt one. Don't quote me, though.

You can also use the PD-4 I mentioned before, but admittedly, it's kinda pricey. Anyhow, why would you want to put a Bose HU to a non Bose system?? Whichever way you decide to go, you will not get the Bose sound, most of the Bose sound is derived from the EQing in the individual Bose amps. The only thing you will get is a factory Bose look, and maybe automatic loudness, but that's it. You are better off with an aftermarket deck which will give you more features, or the original deck that came with the car, if you want to keep the factory look.

DW

dwapenyi

iTrader: (3)

It's very easy just to put it in the amplifier in the HU. The difference between 100 and 120 watts when it comes to sound is not really that much. To double the sound output of a 100 watt system, you'd have to go to 200 watts.

DW

96_vqmax

iTrader: (16)

to me,it's like a waste of time and money.first the bose HU is a non power unit,that's why it need amp at each speakers in order for it to work,the non bose HU is an amplify unit with built in amp like the after market,so they don't need amp at each speaker,if you want to change the bose HU into the non HU then you need some kind of amplify to push the speaker,it's probably only dealer will have those kind of upgrade system to power your non bose HU,in order for it to work.i would get a decent after market unit and an external amp to drive my non bose speaker,if i got the money then i would go after market speaker as well,because the factory speaker are paper cone that doesn't produce very good high like the after market one does,of cause that's just my opinion.

dwapenyi

iTrader: (3)

There's a common mis-conception about paper speakers. They are actually very good, and better than most materials,like polypropylene, for bass and mid-range, in terms of sound. For highs in tweeters, metallic materials are better.

What paper sucks at, is durability. Drop some water on it and it's mush. That's why most high end systems use materials other than paper.

DW

96_vqmax

iTrader: (16)

. For highs in tweeters, metallic materials are better.

that's what i mean,i used to have a 96 with non bose HU,after changing it to Boston Rally component,the sound is so amaze compare to the stock,

RodolfoGraziani

Bose is sad.

Their head unit is a joke
Their speakers suck
But you can sell them at high price on ebay.

And for your Q's:

1. No, bose and non-bose headunits are different/non-exchangeable.
2. No, bose and non-bose speakers are different/non-exchangeable.

So, if you don't like bose speakers, you have to throw away amps, speakers, and head unit.

I have alpine and polks and they rock!
Get that component with subwoofer and leave bose to ebay.

NisMoMAX01SE

if you go look at the bose website, it tells you whats so good about the BOSE system, the speakers and the way the system was designed were put in and setup before the car was built. the car was built with the BOSE system in mind, thats why it sounds so much better. just changing the speakers won't help that much, you can go look at the site, i wouldn't waste money on the speaker upgrade, it won't sound the same as a BOSE system that came out in the car originally. or else everyone would just spend a few hundred and get the spekaers. go aftermarket.

BOZOnPJs

it's better than some stock systems i've had.. and i really dont need my aftermarket system stolen for the thrice time..i'll keep my bose for a little while longer.

Older Kid

The Bose system is absolutely the worst stereo system I have ever heard. I have competed in IASCA with other vehicles, so I know what to listen for, and what I want to hear.

I turned AM on during the first week of owning the Max, and it's been there ever since. I'd rather listen to talk shows than to listen to the crap that the Bose system puts out.

I have contemplated jerking the Bose come out and I'm mailing it back to Nissan with a nasty note attached! They have some nerve trying to push this s**t!

But, then again, that G35 coupe looks pretty "hot." I'm chomping at the bit to test drive it, and if I do order one . . . it will be sans the Bose.

maximised

I don't know if you kids are trying to be some sort of tone snob, but to say a comment like that shows your stupidity to reality. The BOSE system, like it or not, is actually one of the better sounding stereos on the market for the under $30k market. Mind you, some of the premium systems that are featured in BMW, Subaru, Mercedes definitely stomp the Nissan BOSE, but we are talking a $30k car versus $60-$120k cars.

The 5th gen BOSE sytem is dissapointing, I will say that.

"I have contemplated jerking the Bose come out and I'm mailing it back to Nissan with a nasty note attached! They have some nerve trying to push this s**t!"

Please....I as well as many others could just start naming all of the vehicles that have sucky stock audio systems compared to the 4th gen BOSE.

Older Kid

First of all, thanks for the compliment . . . I'd bet that I'm at least twice, or more, your age!!!

I've probably owned more cars than than number of years you've been alive!!!

So, I believe I can compare vehicles. Examples - my wife's car is an '02 Saturn SL-300, and her "STOCK SYSTEM" puts the Bose to shame. The guy I commute with has a Mitsubishi Montero with the Infinity system, and it puts the Bose to shame. My previous car, a '98 Camaro SS, had a Monsoon system (for a while before I pulled it out), and it sounded better.

No mention of BMW, Subaru, or Mercedes here . . . or other $60-$120k cars!

And 'yes,' we all could start naming vehicles that have sucky systems, but we're on a forum for Maximas. That's the car with the Bose system that we are comparing "apples to apples" with - not "apples to oranges."

We are all entitled to our opinions, and the Bose system (in the 2K2) is not worth the $$$. I agree though, the system in the 4th gen is much better!!!

maximised

Quote:

So, I believe I can compare vehicles. Examples - my wife's car is an '02 Saturn SL-300, and her "STOCK SYSTEM" puts the Bose to shame. The guy I commute with has a Mitsubishi Montero with the Infinity system, and it puts the Bose to shame. My previous car, a '98 Camaro SS, had a Monsoon system (for a while before I pulled it out), and it sounded better.

Two things:

1) Is it possible that your USED Bose system had been ragged before you even listened to it?

2)Stock audio systems have come a long way in 5 years. Comparing an '02 to a '97 or any other 4th gen is not fair. The standards are being raised every year. Heck, you can get XM radio STOCK in an '03 Chevy 3500HD.

I'm a musician, soundman, and car audio enthusiast. I know a little about what sounds good. I get compliments from people who drive new cars about how good the stock stereo sounds. All I have done is dynamated the doors and deck and installed some Q-series MBQuart tweets along with the crossover. Its going to hold me over until I do the whole video/audio system. Which will come after everything else...

Quote:

No mention of BMW, Subaru, or Mercedes here . . . or other $60-$120k cars!

And 'yes,' we all could start naming vehicles that have sucky systems, but we're on a forum for Maximas. That's the car with the Bose system that we are comparing "apples to apples" with - not "apples to oranges."

wait...[checks url]...this isn't the v-tec forum?????

Quote:

We are all entitled to our opinions, and the Bose system (in the 2K2) is not worth the $$$. I agree though, the system in the 4th gen is much better!!!

I don't know what happened in the 5th gens...hopefully the G35 coupe will sound much better. And hopefully someone will make a piece to allow for aftermarket systems, because the radio face is integrated with the rest of the dash...

dwapenyi

iTrader: (3)

You can put a BOSE system in your 4th gen Maxima. If you have a 4th gen Maxima GXE or SE that came without BOSE, then just replace it with the entire Bose system from any 4th gen(HU, amps,Speakers) and you will have the BOSE sound. BOSE tailored that system to a 4th gen Maxima interior, so any will do. You can even leave out the HU b/c the aftermarket has so many Bose adapters for an aftermarket HU.

That being said, it will be quite a bit of work, as much as if you were to put in your own high end system, in which case, just put in you own high end system I really like the 4th gen Bose system, but it has weaknesses. Those 6.5" speakers just can't handle low (60Hz and below) frequencies at volume. You ever watch them pumping from the trunk?? They are really trying. The tweeters should have been located in the pillars, like earlier 4th gens. Spend a little more on the aftermarket. The power handling will be better. Tuning your aftermarket setup for a very neutral frequency response, that will be the real challenge, a part that's already taken care of in the Bose system which most people don't appreciate.

DW

Older Kid

1) Is it possible that your USED Bose system had been ragged before you even listened to it?
.....Not possible - it's brand new, along with the car! A 2002!

2)Stock audio systems have come a long way in 5 years. Comparing an '02 to a '97 or any other 4th gen is not fair. The standards are being raised every year. Heck, you can get XM radio STOCK in an '03 Chevy 3500HD.
.....My Maxima is a 2002, therefore I'm comparing an '02 to an '02! Plus I test drove 8 of them before I purchsed. I don't think I ever turned the system during any test drive. I was too impressed by the sound of the engine . . .

I'm a musician,
.....Me too. Had a band in the '60s. I have an American Standard Telecaster and a Bassman amp still in excellent condition that I purchased back then. I also play bass, the piano, and the drums. My son plays lead guitar for an up and coming metal band called "Breech." Look for the their name in the near future. If you can handle the music???

soundman,
..... I too am a soundman for the youth rock band at St. Joseph's Catholic Church on Sunday nights and have mixed in the studio with my son.

and car audio enthusiast.
.....I have 3 cars, a Silverado, and a Harley.

I know a little about what sounds good.
..... I've competed in IASCA and have installed many, many systems.

I get compliments from people who drive new cars about how good the stock stereo sounds.
.....Yep, me too, In fact I get people who ask me for advice on these stuff. And I have a home theater and have set up several systems in the area - just for fun!

All I have done is dynamated the doors and deck
.....OK, you got me. But I did install Lanzar TWS tweeters in the pillars, and a better free-air (8 inch Pioneer) in the deck being run with A Rockford Fosgate Punch 100 in mono. It helped somewhat.

and installed some Q-series MBQuart tweets along with the crossover. Its going to hold me over until I do the whole video/audio system. Which will come after everything else...

By the way . . . you are one of the better Individuals who 'can' write on this forum. This was fun, thanks. Another by the way - I'm also from Virginia. Left there in the 70s.