View Poll Results: Which Setup to Dyno With?
As is right now, dyno with/without Cattman 3"
2
5.41%
Fix the exhaust leaks, dyno with/without Cattman 3"
16
43.24%
OBX 3.5 Headers, dyno with/without Cattman 3"
19
51.35%
Voters: 37. You may not vote on this poll
Dynoing the Cattman 3" on the 4th Gen
11-22-2010, 04:11 AM
#42
http://forums.maxima.org/dyno-discus...n-headers.html
http://forums.maxima.org/dyno-discus...n-headers.html
I did the comparison almost 3 years ago.
To the OP go with option 3. I am looking to do the same with the 2.5" then install the 3" catback while at the shop.
http://forums.maxima.org/dyno-discus...n-headers.html
I did the comparison almost 3 years ago.
To the OP go with option 3. I am looking to do the same with the 2.5" then install the 3" catback while at the shop.
Screw the benefit of everybody else... are they helping with the payments on the dyno, ppl on here need too much at times and to be honest, if you made the statement about the y-pipe about 3 yrs ago I would've agreed but most have recently changed to headers... go to the dyno to get your AFR's right vs some kinda show boat on one mod... either ppl buy it or they don't... you did........
for what? i already proved obx can hang with the best of the best
11-22-2010, 07:46 AM
#44
What some argue is whether or not that extra 10hp on top of the Y pipe is worth the extra money and labor over the Y pipe.
Of course for those looking to gain as much power as possible its a no brainer.
11-22-2010, 08:25 AM
#45
Its been proven time and time again that the headers will give gains over the Y pipe.
What some argue is whether or not that extra 10hp on top of the Y pipe is worth the extra money and labor over the Y pipe.
Of course for those looking to gain as much power as possible its a no brainer.
What some argue is whether or not that extra 10hp on top of the Y pipe is worth the extra money and labor over the Y pipe.
Of course for those looking to gain as much power as possible its a no brainer.
11-22-2010, 10:04 AM
#46
and I'm one of those people looking for every HP possible like flava said, even though I dont think on my first pair of dynos I'll make 183whp.
OBX sure can hang with the best of the best... on the dyno..... But I would like to see someone's OBX's (not mine, mine are going through a special program
) hang w/ cattman 5 years down the line.
Last edited by aackshun; 11-22-2010 at 10:13 AM.
11-22-2010, 10:30 AM
#47
but good luck with whateva u do
11-22-2010, 11:42 AM
#49
Its been proven time and time again that the headers will give gains over the Y pipe.
What some argue is whether or not that extra 10hp on top of the Y pipe is worth the extra money and labor over the Y pipe.
Of course for those looking to gain as much power as possible its a no brainer.
What some argue is whether or not that extra 10hp on top of the Y pipe is worth the extra money and labor over the Y pipe.
Of course for those looking to gain as much power as possible its a no brainer.
11-22-2010, 12:56 PM
#50
(WHICH HAVEN'T ARRIVED YET, UPS is taking it's time getting them here, I wish they arrived today because it's my day off and I can install them, now I won't be able to install them till next monday and dyno next thursday... Speaking of dynoing I'll set the appointments right now).
Yup, there are more reasons besides power to buy equal length headers.
The main reason is that VQ sound which first attracted me to nissan, and well my car is just too loud for my own liking, at the same time I hate how it sounds I love it too.
Even though it won't be as aggressive sounding my car is now, I can enjoy my music at a much lower volume and the car could even sound stock at times and I won't have to prove to people I'm not boosted.
But this isn't dyno talk now, is it
Plus I'm personally interested in the OBX 3.5 headers + 3" catback numbers on a VQ30DE now, because I dont think there is much of a comparison for the 30DE guys....
Yup, there are more reasons besides power to buy equal length headers.
The main reason is that VQ sound which first attracted me to nissan, and well my car is just too loud for my own liking, at the same time I hate how it sounds I love it too.
Even though it won't be as aggressive sounding my car is now, I can enjoy my music at a much lower volume and the car could even sound stock at times and I won't have to prove to people I'm not boosted.
But this isn't dyno talk now, is it
Plus I'm personally interested in the OBX 3.5 headers + 3" catback numbers on a VQ30DE now, because I dont think there is much of a comparison for the 30DE guys....
Last edited by aackshun; 11-22-2010 at 01:08 PM.
11-22-2010, 01:47 PM
#51
I swear by the Y-pipe, die by the y-pipe, especially since a full cattman exhaust (H/C/2.5) A32 maxima can only tie with me.
and I'm one of those people looking for every HP possible like flava said, even though I dont think on my first pair of dynos I'll make 183whp.
OBX sure can hang with the best of the best... on the dyno..... But I would like to see someone's OBX's (not mine, mine are going through a special program ) hang w/ cattman 5 years down the line.
and I'm one of those people looking for every HP possible like flava said, even though I dont think on my first pair of dynos I'll make 183whp.
OBX sure can hang with the best of the best... on the dyno..... But I would like to see someone's OBX's (not mine, mine are going through a special program
) hang w/ cattman 5 years down the line.
11-22-2010, 02:22 PM
#52
i would like to see somebody who beats on the car with cattman's 5yrs down the line... dont think its indestructable.... i remember back in 07 getting banned because i said headers made more power than a y-pipe but because i was fairly new and mods didnt agree i served time...
Hahaha silly mods, look @ the stock design then run the firing order in your head, it's obvious the long tube headers are the better choice for creating power, in any application.
11-22-2010, 03:38 PM
#53
(WHICH HAVEN'T ARRIVED YET, UPS is taking it's time getting them here, I wish they arrived today because it's my day off and I can install them, now I won't be able to install them till next monday and dyno next thursday... Speaking of dynoing I'll set the appointments right now).
Yup, there are more reasons besides power to buy equal length headers.
The main reason is that VQ sound which first attracted me to nissan, and well my car is just too loud for my own liking, at the same time I hate how it sounds I love it too.
Even though it won't be as aggressive sounding my car is now, I can enjoy my music at a much lower volume and the car could even sound stock at times and I won't have to prove to people I'm not boosted.
But this isn't dyno talk now, is it
Plus I'm personally interested in the OBX 3.5 headers + 3" catback numbers on a VQ30DE now, because I dont think there is much of a comparison for the 30DE guys....
Yup, there are more reasons besides power to buy equal length headers.
The main reason is that VQ sound which first attracted me to nissan, and well my car is just too loud for my own liking, at the same time I hate how it sounds I love it too.
Even though it won't be as aggressive sounding my car is now, I can enjoy my music at a much lower volume and the car could even sound stock at times and I won't have to prove to people I'm not boosted.
But this isn't dyno talk now, is it
Plus I'm personally interested in the OBX 3.5 headers + 3" catback numbers on a VQ30DE now, because I dont think there is much of a comparison for the 30DE guys....
11-23-2010, 07:20 PM
#54
doesnt OBX offer longer runners than cattman???
11-24-2010, 11:33 PM
#56
Anyways, headers came in today, pics and detailed measurements when I install em on Monday.
Dyno day Thursday December 2nd, unless the shop says otherwise.
And to schmelly.... I dont think one is longer than the other, because from that angle it seems that cattman's bows out further to provide a smoother transition.
But I preferred OBX's design because I have it in my head the straight section will provide more TQ.
Last edited by aackshun; 11-25-2010 at 01:49 AM.
11-26-2010, 02:40 AM
#58
But to get things back on track, installing headers on Monday, dynoing thursday.
Last edited by aackshun; 11-26-2010 at 02:46 AM.
11-26-2010, 03:26 AM
#60
My thoughts too, but the numbers don't lie, people wanna see the OBX's on, you can rally the 4th gen troops to get their opinion, I'll check again Monday morning before I start the project but if the vote stays as is now, I'm using the headers+3"
But one can make the argument is, that to get the best benefit out of the catback one should have the first half of your exhaust up to the task too, again, many people think different ways, this isn't a header vs. y-pipe thread, just trying to prove how effective is a 3" on a VQ30DE.
Ya heardddd me? Got until Monday morn to get your votes in!
[edit] After re-reading crusher's post, I wanted to state something
I would love to do another dyno, y-pipe+3 vs. obx+3, but headers aren't that easy as we all know and I dont think I can take the headers off fast enough to dyno within the same day, once the OBX's go on, they stay on.
One more thing, after a bit of consideration, I'm going to keep the magnaflow HFC for dyno purposes, after the dyno I'll goto my test pipe.
But one can make the argument is, that to get the best benefit out of the catback one should have the first half of your exhaust up to the task too, again, many people think different ways, this isn't a header vs. y-pipe thread, just trying to prove how effective is a 3" on a VQ30DE.
Ya heardddd me? Got until Monday morn to get your votes in!
[edit] After re-reading crusher's post, I wanted to state something
I would love to do another dyno, y-pipe+3 vs. obx+3, but headers aren't that easy as we all know and I dont think I can take the headers off fast enough to dyno within the same day, once the OBX's go on, they stay on.
One more thing, after a bit of consideration, I'm going to keep the magnaflow HFC for dyno purposes, after the dyno I'll goto my test pipe.
Last edited by aackshun; 11-28-2010 at 09:34 AM.
12-14-2010, 09:22 AM
#62
My thoughts too, but the numbers don't lie, people wanna see the OBX's on, you can rally the 4th gen troops to get their opinion, I'll check again Monday morning before I start the project but if the vote stays as is now, I'm using the headers+3"
But one can make the argument is, that to get the best benefit out of the catback one should have the first half of your exhaust up to the task too, again, many people think different ways, this isn't a header vs. y-pipe thread, just trying to prove how effective is a 3" on a VQ30DE.
Ya heardddd me? Got until Monday morn to get your votes in!
[edit] After re-reading crusher's post, I wanted to state something
I would love to do another dyno, y-pipe+3 vs. obx+3, but headers aren't that easy as we all know and I dont think I can take the headers off fast enough to dyno within the same day, once the OBX's go on, they stay on.
One more thing, after a bit of consideration, I'm going to keep the magnaflow HFC for dyno purposes, after the dyno I'll goto my test pipe.
But one can make the argument is, that to get the best benefit out of the catback one should have the first half of your exhaust up to the task too, again, many people think different ways, this isn't a header vs. y-pipe thread, just trying to prove how effective is a 3" on a VQ30DE.
Ya heardddd me? Got until Monday morn to get your votes in!
[edit] After re-reading crusher's post, I wanted to state something
I would love to do another dyno, y-pipe+3 vs. obx+3, but headers aren't that easy as we all know and I dont think I can take the headers off fast enough to dyno within the same day, once the OBX's go on, they stay on.
One more thing, after a bit of consideration, I'm going to keep the magnaflow HFC for dyno purposes, after the dyno I'll goto my test pipe.
It still hasnt even been proven that a NA VQ30 generates enough CFMs to even warrant the use of a 3" catback.
So you wont be doing the before and after dyno now?
If not, what will you be comparing the 3" catback to?
12-14-2010, 04:27 PM
#63
I'll point out two things that are pretty obvious.
First, we sell stainless steel headers, and we have for 5-6 years. Do I really need to point out that this black manifold is not a stainless header? This was the original header design and the last one was imported from New Zealand 6-7 years ago. We have substantially revised the design twice since then. This particular black header manifold goes back about 9 years - only the early ones in that series were black.
In our current header series the primaries are lightly longer, and the 3-1 collector - a critical element of header performance design - is a much better design than either of the collectors in this picture.
Second, the primary runners are no longer on the OBX than the black manifold. In fact, they're almost identical (isn't that strange? looks like they copied the obsolete set). Its the tubing below the collector that is different.
Brian
First, we sell stainless steel headers, and we have for 5-6 years. Do I really need to point out that this black manifold is not a stainless header? This was the original header design and the last one was imported from New Zealand 6-7 years ago. We have substantially revised the design twice since then. This particular black header manifold goes back about 9 years - only the early ones in that series were black.
In our current header series the primaries are lightly longer, and the 3-1 collector - a critical element of header performance design - is a much better design than either of the collectors in this picture.
Second, the primary runners are no longer on the OBX than the black manifold. In fact, they're almost identical (isn't that strange? looks like they copied the obsolete set). Its the tubing below the collector that is different.
Brian
12-14-2010, 04:33 PM
#64
Pics and such:
The flex pipe clears the xmember fine, but the rear flange on the flex pipe comes amount 1-2mm away from the xmember.
Last edited by aackshun; 12-14-2010 at 04:44 PM.
12-14-2010, 04:42 PM
#65
Comparing stock to a 3" should show some gains for sure, but I thought the true reason for dynoing the Cattman setup was to see the gains over a 2.5 setup?
12-14-2010, 04:50 PM
#66
Its too bad you dont have an aftermarket catback to compare it to, to see the true differences between 2.5 and 3".
Comparing stock to a 3" should show some gains for sure, but I thought the true reason for dynoing the Cattman setup was to see the gains over a 2.5 setup?
Comparing stock to a 3" should show some gains for sure, but I thought the true reason for dynoing the Cattman setup was to see the gains over a 2.5 setup?
As long as I make around 185whp then that's enough proof for me.
12-14-2010, 05:05 PM
#67
As far as I know, no one has done a simple 2.5 catback only dyno.
Id think you would make more then 185whp. Back when I was still NA put down right under 180whp and that was with the Y pipe. I did have the JWT ecu with MEVI though, but the MEVI wasnt opening at that time. That motor also had well over 200k miles on it so it was no spring chicken.
Last edited by Flava_24/7; 12-16-2010 at 06:44 AM.
12-14-2010, 05:07 PM
#68
That's interesting... The primary runners on the new OBX design are clearly shorter than the earlier design that appears farther up the thread. The collector itself is longer, and seems to be moved upwards (toward the engine) a little bit.
12-14-2010, 05:26 PM
#69
Each collector diameter is 2 and 1/4", and the main pipe is 2.5", i forgot to measure the length of the 2.5" pipe, but I can do that while it's on the car.
I'm posting more pics (when they finish uploading) in the 4th gen thread on where the tip sits now (it looks the same to me).
Again, I wish flava!! I may be able to get my hands on a cattman 2.5 but it's for a 5th gen, brian should it fit on my car? Even though you changed the design on the axle back section it should still clear right?
The next best thing I can do for a dyno comparison is just have a friend dyno their maxima... Ugh, I know it sounds terrible but it's our only options for aftermarket catbacks (all of theirs happen to be welded on), if I can get one of them to dyno with me it's better than nothing, right?
::Edit::
This is what you guys are getting, a stock vs. 3" catback comparison, 2 pulls for one and 2 for the other, if you want more, then I am open for donations, it's just going to end up to cost me more. Sure I didn't mind spending $80, a full day, maintenance I haven't planned on doing, and gas on this, but getting my hands on a 2.5" catback seems pretty hard, also doing more pulls = more $$.
back to studying.
I'm posting more pics (when they finish uploading) in the 4th gen thread on where the tip sits now (it looks the same to me).
Again, I wish flava!! I may be able to get my hands on a cattman 2.5 but it's for a 5th gen, brian should it fit on my car? Even though you changed the design on the axle back section it should still clear right?
The next best thing I can do for a dyno comparison is just have a friend dyno their maxima... Ugh, I know it sounds terrible but it's our only options for aftermarket catbacks (all of theirs happen to be welded on), if I can get one of them to dyno with me it's better than nothing, right?
::Edit::
This is what you guys are getting, a stock vs. 3" catback comparison, 2 pulls for one and 2 for the other, if you want more, then I am open for donations, it's just going to end up to cost me more. Sure I didn't mind spending $80, a full day, maintenance I haven't planned on doing, and gas on this, but getting my hands on a 2.5" catback seems pretty hard, also doing more pulls = more $$.
back to studying.
Last edited by aackshun; 12-14-2010 at 08:59 PM.
12-16-2010, 06:52 AM
#72
12-16-2010, 07:26 AM
#73
Aaron you blew a tranny? call me if you need 1. i'll help you find it!
I've been waiting on those Numbers sir.. you've made us wait 2 long..
I'll be posting my GFs dyno sheet shortly.. go check it out..
I've been waiting on those Numbers sir.. you've made us wait 2 long..
I'll be posting my GFs dyno sheet shortly.. go check it out..
12-16-2010, 12:08 PM
#74
Good! I need one! But she limped to powerfab auto this morning and put down 190whp and 210 wtq. No comparison will be done because I want to drive it as little as possible, but the numbers should speak for themselves.
Remember I am UN-TUNED, and no internal work has been done.
Remember I am UN-TUNED, and no internal work has been done.
12-16-2010, 12:28 PM
#75
Good! I need one! But she limped to powerfab auto this morning and put down 190whp and 210 wtq. No comparison will be done because I want to drive it as little as possible, but the numbers should speak for themselves.
Remember I am UN-TUNED, and no internal work has been done.
Remember I am UN-TUNED, and no internal work has been done.
Im sure most of that was from the headers, so Im still curious to see how much the 3 exhaust freed up.
But good numbers for sure, with some tuning and VI you would definitely be knocking on 200 if not slightly above.
12-16-2010, 12:53 PM
#76
I'm more interested in making 200 w/o a VI, the car is running near a near 15 A/F at redline 
, I'm surprised it's running so well soooo lean.
So my VQ35 plans have been put on hold indefinitely (yes that means the 6spd too), but in the mean time I am now on the hunt for a 5spd tranny (this one is TOAST), I found one in Dallas now to see if someone can help me with moving it to Houston....
As for the comparison? I mean hell... I don't see any VQ30DE touching these numbers (WITHOUT A ECU) in the dyno thread (moderated), so I'm sold that the 3" really helped.
You can take it two ways.... A. The OBX headers are really awesome for this motor or B. The cattman 3" really did help.
, I'm surprised it's running so well soooo lean.So my VQ35 plans have been put on hold indefinitely (yes that means the 6spd too), but in the mean time I am now on the hunt for a 5spd tranny (this one is TOAST), I found one in Dallas now to see if someone can help me with moving it to Houston....
As for the comparison? I mean hell... I don't see any VQ30DE touching these numbers (WITHOUT A ECU) in the dyno thread (moderated), so I'm sold that the 3" really helped.
You can take it two ways.... A. The OBX headers are really awesome for this motor or B. The cattman 3" really did help.
12-16-2010, 01:28 PM
#79
I'm more interested in making 200 w/o a VI, the car is running near a near 15 A/F at redline , I'm surprised it's running so well soooo lean.
So my VQ35 plans have been put on hold indefinitely (yes that means the 6spd too), but in the mean time I am now on the hunt for a 5spd tranny (this one is TOAST), I found one in Dallas now to see if someone can help me with moving it to Houston....
As for the comparison? I mean hell... I don't see any VQ30DE touching these numbers (WITHOUT A ECU) in the dyno thread (moderated), so I'm sold that the 3" really helped.
You can take it two ways.... A. The OBX headers are really awesome for this motor or B. The cattman 3" really did help.
, I'm surprised it's running so well soooo lean.So my VQ35 plans have been put on hold indefinitely (yes that means the 6spd too), but in the mean time I am now on the hunt for a 5spd tranny (this one is TOAST), I found one in Dallas now to see if someone can help me with moving it to Houston....
As for the comparison? I mean hell... I don't see any VQ30DE touching these numbers (WITHOUT A ECU) in the dyno thread (moderated), so I'm sold that the 3" really helped.
You can take it two ways.... A. The OBX headers are really awesome for this motor or B. The cattman 3" really did help.
Some dynos are known to read higher then others, just as you stated about that stock 3.5 dynoing a bit higher then most normally do.
Im still just a bit leary about the 3" catback based on what Ive seen them gain on boosted setups. I dont see how it would be possible for it to free up more power on an NA setup when its not pushing as many CFMs as a boosted setup.
12-16-2010, 01:29 PM
#80
