General Turbo Question: Spooling up... turbo lag etc
07-27-2002, 10:04 AM
#1
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General Turbo Question: Spooling up... turbo lag etc
We all know that the turbo gets its power by spinning from the exhaust gases coming out of the car. Do cars that are more liters/more pistons have a less turbo lag,
This is my thought, experts please correct me at any time.
1. When a turbo civic is @ WOT, the combustion takes place in the cylinder and the valves open up and the gases are flushed out (normally into the headers to the exhaust system and out the grape fruit shooter
) b/c there is a turbo the piping is reworked and the gases flush through the turbo, spooling the impeller blades sucking in outside air and vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV PSSSSST. but there is lag to spool the turbo and get her movin'
Now with the couple of maximas on board with turbos do we have a spooling advantage. B/c our engines have more combustion area. 3liters vs. 1.8 or however small a civic is and 6 pistons instead of 4 would our engines spit out more exhaust?
Total Hypthosis::: Maxima driver steps on the gas, car revs up and b/c of our bigger engine, more exhaust, if the CIVIC and the Maxaim had the SAME TURBO and same length of piping etc (least possible variables between the two cars) would the Maxima SPool and reach full boost quicker than the civic?
It'd make since, but all my turbo experiences comes from literature... and no actual first hand experience
Thanks for your responses!!!
This is my thought, experts please correct me at any time.
1. When a turbo civic is @ WOT, the combustion takes place in the cylinder and the valves open up and the gases are flushed out (normally into the headers to the exhaust system and out the grape fruit shooter
) b/c there is a turbo the piping is reworked and the gases flush through the turbo, spooling the impeller blades sucking in outside air and vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV PSSSSST. but there is lag to spool the turbo and get her movin'Now with the couple of maximas on board with turbos do we have a spooling advantage. B/c our engines have more combustion area. 3liters vs. 1.8 or however small a civic is and 6 pistons instead of 4 would our engines spit out more exhaust?
Total Hypthosis::: Maxima driver steps on the gas, car revs up and b/c of our bigger engine, more exhaust, if the CIVIC and the Maxaim had the SAME TURBO and same length of piping etc (least possible variables between the two cars) would the Maxima SPool and reach full boost quicker than the civic?
It'd make since, but all my turbo experiences comes from literature... and no actual first hand experience
Thanks for your responses!!!
07-27-2002, 10:51 AM
#2
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 7,060
The turbo you'd put on a Civic would be rather small. You wouldn't need a very high flowing turbo (cubic feet per minute, CFM) because the engine is so small. If you put the turbo from a 1.6L Civic on a 3.0L Maxima, what you would get is the following...
Extremely quick spool up and good low-end power. But you'd max out the flow capabilities of the turbo by the time you got to the mid-range because the turbo wouldn't be able to keep up with the engine, or something like that. You'd get good boost at low RPM's but it'd fall off rapidly at the high-end.
Volkswagon knows that American's HATE turbo-lag and need good low-end power, so they've done a marvelous job on their 1.8T motor, which is also a Ward's 10 Best engine in its various forms for several years now. I believe those engines have smaller turbo's for quick spool and minimal lag, but the boost pressure falls off at the upper RPM's because it's a smaller turbo.
The tradeoff is that if you go with a larger turbo with higher flow capacity, it takes it longer to spin up and start creating boost, so you get more lag. But you can also maintain boost at higher RPM's and make more top-end power. A lot of Supra TT guys switchout their smaller sequential twin turbo's for a larger SINGLE turbo and they get INSANE top-end power, although their low-end I guess isn't as good as before.
Tuning turbo's is very complex. There are lots of variables and factors involved, but there are also LOTS of options so that's what makes cars with turbos such great tuner cars. Just look at all these VW 1.8T's with chips...
Extremely quick spool up and good low-end power. But you'd max out the flow capabilities of the turbo by the time you got to the mid-range because the turbo wouldn't be able to keep up with the engine, or something like that. You'd get good boost at low RPM's but it'd fall off rapidly at the high-end.
Volkswagon knows that American's HATE turbo-lag and need good low-end power, so they've done a marvelous job on their 1.8T motor, which is also a Ward's 10 Best engine in its various forms for several years now. I believe those engines have smaller turbo's for quick spool and minimal lag, but the boost pressure falls off at the upper RPM's because it's a smaller turbo.
The tradeoff is that if you go with a larger turbo with higher flow capacity, it takes it longer to spin up and start creating boost, so you get more lag. But you can also maintain boost at higher RPM's and make more top-end power. A lot of Supra TT guys switchout their smaller sequential twin turbo's for a larger SINGLE turbo and they get INSANE top-end power, although their low-end I guess isn't as good as before.
Tuning turbo's is very complex. There are lots of variables and factors involved, but there are also LOTS of options so that's what makes cars with turbos such great tuner cars. Just look at all these VW 1.8T's with chips...
07-27-2002, 04:41 PM
#4
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Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 129
regarding turbo lag.. this is the way i see it
if you are NA, then you have "turbo lag" from 0RPM -> redline
if you are turbo, then you have "turbo lag" from 0RPM -> 3000-4000RPM , after that you hit full boost and vrooooooooooooooooooom
now, would you rather have scenario #1, or scenario #2 ?
I pick scenario #2
if you are NA, then you have "turbo lag" from 0RPM -> redline
if you are turbo, then you have "turbo lag" from 0RPM -> 3000-4000RPM , after that you hit full boost and vrooooooooooooooooooom
now, would you rather have scenario #1, or scenario #2 ?
I pick scenario #2
07-27-2002, 04:54 PM
#5
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Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,012
Exactly what i though!! Thanks for your time and writing that out! I guess general physics haven't failed me, yet! haha
About the Supra TT... yea switching over to the single is INSANE!... i frequenlty check up the boards over there and some of those are just remarkable!
About the Supra TT... yea switching over to the single is INSANE!... i frequenlty check up the boards over there and some of those are just remarkable!
Originally posted by SteVTEC
The turbo you'd put on a Civic would be rather small. You wouldn't need a very high flowing turbo (cubic feet per minute, CFM) because the engine is so small. If you put the turbo from a 1.6L Civic on a 3.0L Maxima, what you would get is the following...
Extremely quick spool up and good low-end power. But you'd max out the flow capabilities of the turbo by the time you got to the mid-range because the turbo wouldn't be able to keep up with the engine, or something like that. You'd get good boost at low RPM's but it'd fall off rapidly at the high-end.
Volkswagon knows that American's HATE turbo-lag and need good low-end power, so they've done a marvelous job on their 1.8T motor, which is also a Ward's 10 Best engine in its various forms for several years now. I believe those engines have smaller turbo's for quick spool and minimal lag, but the boost pressure falls off at the upper RPM's because it's a smaller turbo.
The tradeoff is that if you go with a larger turbo with higher flow capacity, it takes it longer to spin up and start creating boost, so you get more lag. But you can also maintain boost at higher RPM's and make more top-end power. A lot of Supra TT guys switchout their smaller sequential twin turbo's for a larger SINGLE turbo and they get INSANE top-end power, although their low-end I guess isn't as good as before.
Tuning turbo's is very complex. There are lots of variables and factors involved, but there are also LOTS of options so that's what makes cars with turbos such great tuner cars. Just look at all these VW 1.8T's with chips...
The turbo you'd put on a Civic would be rather small. You wouldn't need a very high flowing turbo (cubic feet per minute, CFM) because the engine is so small. If you put the turbo from a 1.6L Civic on a 3.0L Maxima, what you would get is the following...
Extremely quick spool up and good low-end power. But you'd max out the flow capabilities of the turbo by the time you got to the mid-range because the turbo wouldn't be able to keep up with the engine, or something like that. You'd get good boost at low RPM's but it'd fall off rapidly at the high-end.
Volkswagon knows that American's HATE turbo-lag and need good low-end power, so they've done a marvelous job on their 1.8T motor, which is also a Ward's 10 Best engine in its various forms for several years now. I believe those engines have smaller turbo's for quick spool and minimal lag, but the boost pressure falls off at the upper RPM's because it's a smaller turbo.
The tradeoff is that if you go with a larger turbo with higher flow capacity, it takes it longer to spin up and start creating boost, so you get more lag. But you can also maintain boost at higher RPM's and make more top-end power. A lot of Supra TT guys switchout their smaller sequential twin turbo's for a larger SINGLE turbo and they get INSANE top-end power, although their low-end I guess isn't as good as before.
Tuning turbo's is very complex. There are lots of variables and factors involved, but there are also LOTS of options so that's what makes cars with turbos such great tuner cars. Just look at all these VW 1.8T's with chips...
07-27-2002, 04:56 PM
#6
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Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,012
Not to be a true d!ck, but what the hell was this post about?
Not only did this add useless info to my post, but it also made everyone else read it less intelligent...
Not only did this add useless info to my post, but it also made everyone else read it less intelligent...
Originally posted by bacid
regarding turbo lag.. this is the way i see it
if you are NA, then you have "turbo lag" from 0RPM -> redline
if you are turbo, then you have "turbo lag" from 0RPM -> 3000-4000RPM , after that you hit full boost and vrooooooooooooooooooom
now, would you rather have scenario #1, or scenario #2 ?
I pick scenario #2
regarding turbo lag.. this is the way i see it
if you are NA, then you have "turbo lag" from 0RPM -> redline
if you are turbo, then you have "turbo lag" from 0RPM -> 3000-4000RPM , after that you hit full boost and vrooooooooooooooooooom
now, would you rather have scenario #1, or scenario #2 ?
I pick scenario #2
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