On Christmas Eve I was coming back from Midnight Mass and a younger kid rolled up next to me in a funky metallic red/rust Mustang GT convertible. He was trying to look important by sitting slung over and talking on his cell phone. I'm just rolling along at 45mph on a long and straight empty road as he starts pacing me. Eventually he hammers it and flys by. I quicken my pace to show I'm game at the next light. I pull up and wait for the green. He revs and I look over and he's talking away so I figure I own this guy because he's probably driving an automatic. The light goes green and I holeshot him hard and pulled a good 3 cars on him 75mph. I figured that was about right. I slow down and he wants to play more from a roll. I drop it into 2nd at 45mph and punch it and pull about 1 car on him and hold it to about 75mph. Now I'm starting to get confused. Why can't I pull on this overweight GT with what appeared to be an automatic tranny. We grab another light and he points ahead. I wind up to 2000rpm and quickly slip the clutch on the green. I get bad wheelspin thru 1st which leads to wheelspin thru some of 2nd. We are dead even up to 80mph with no one gaining on each other.

I'm completely perplexed about this race because my Maxima should be much quicker than a auto GT convertible on the topend. I thought even if I blew the launch, I'd still get him once I got into 3rd. The GT appeared bonestock and sounded like it too. My Maxima is running in tip top shape too and typically traps out in the 95mph range in the 1/4mile. I've never raced a stock 94-98 GT, especially a auto, that was able to hang like this. Most 94-98 GT autos are lucky to break mid 15s. All I can think is that I screwed my launch so bad on the 2nd run that I severely lost any advantage I had and/or he was a 5 speed.

Dave

 

Located a few websites for STang drivers. Stock Auto GT's have run 14.6's with nothing but a drop in K&N filter. Some faster. Assume that a Convertible will be .1-.2 quicker. You've got 14.8's right there. Assuming the one you found wasn't stock, or if it was a '99 (260HP) then you shouldn't be disappointed at all.

 

I'd have to say that launch really hurt you. The older GTs are a good race for our car, but with an auto you really had the advantage. Mustangs tend to get a good launch when launched correctly, but you're right they are heavier. Watch out for the new 99-00 GTs though because they'll smoke ya
-hype

 

It wasn't a 99 GT. The strange thing is that this 98 convertible auto GT hung with me as if it were a 99+ GT covertible auto. I've raced a 99 GT covertible auto and it barely pulled away from me at 80mph and it's got a better shifting auto and about 45 more hp. I'm really confused about this and a bit disappointed. I've driven a few 5 speed 96-98 GTs in the past and they felt pretty good down now, but didn't have much after 4500 rpms and that's where I start pulling. I've never driven a newer 96-98 auto GT, but from what I've seen at the track, they aren't quick. Maybe this GT had a set of gears and a couple other tweaks. He got a good chirp into 2nd which really surprised me. Maybe those things run really good when it's 7 degrees outside I've noticed my car runs better with a little humidity and about 35 degrees. 7 degrees seems to be too "harsh" for the motor. Ahhh...now I'm just making excuses.

Jim-
What site did you get your info from? I guess I'll check out the "corral".


Dave

 

If it's a manual, it should have walked you easily at 80+, is that what you are saying?

 

there you'll find links (you can search by et's and/or MY)
Most Stang owners I know at least have gears in them. Almost every auto stang that I've seen/heard has Flows and or shorties. Shift kits in the tranny with the gears will get you nice "chirps" all the time. My 85 CFI would chirp second with 2.73's in it and a shift kit.

 

Yep, that's what I'm saying. Like any other car on the road in the top end, a manual Mustang will always be quicker than a automatic. I holds true for the LT1/LS1 F-Bodies with 6 speeds vs automatics.

A 215hp 98 GT convertible auto should be significantly (.4-.5 in the 1/4) slower than the 260hp 99 GT convertible.


Dave

 

and you can kick the crap out of the manual 98 mustangs...I've done it many times.

 

Uhh...he's saying that if the 99 auto only walked away slowly at 80 a 98(45hp LESS) should have not kept up so well.

 

Same here HAWKDOG. I just raced a 98 GT Convertible 5 speed 2 days ago. He got dusted. And, he even had a fire extinguisher mounted on the pillar

All kidding aside, Ive never lost to a pre 99, non Cobra GT. Even mildly modded ones (exhaust, filter, gears, etc) have been rudely introduced to Mad Max. Two Cobra Stangs have kicked my a@#.

Ive never raced a 99+ GT but would like to. Im sure Ill get spanked but Im never one to mind losing a race Im more curious than anything. Heck, what do you have to lose in a Maxima?

 

Don't get me wrong guys, I've beat plenty of 5 speed 96-98 GTs, a handful of 5.0s, and even a 95 Cobra. Many of my wins are at the track which is even better. This heavy automatic 98 GT convertible I ran was either a "ringer" or something was hidden under the hood.

BTW, I think I've got plenty of power to show most 5 speed 2K Max's my taillights Look at my et and trap speeds.


Dave

 

after he raced you he probably overheated at the next light.

DEBO

 

Awww...wish you were closer to Tampa! We could sure find out!

 

What are your special toppings?

 

Ah, don't worry about it Dave - he was probably an abused child.

 

Here are my special toppings added after my best run in September:
-better driving
-earlier shifting
-RT cat
-new struts all around
-lightweight 16" racing wheels
-stickier tires

Believe me, I too wish I was in Tampa. This ice and snow in Kansas City is killing me plus I'd love to race your 2K Max.


Dave

 

Ah well...for now well just have to bench race! Ive only got 2 mods on my Maxima (intake and Y pipe). Im not modding the Max any further as I dont feel its worth it for me. I have another car (the fast one) that I do that to. With 4SFED theres not a Maxima in the universe that can hang! (350-400 hp and 350-375 ft lb in a 2250 lb car will do that)

Ill run the Max a few more times this year when we get a cold night. Ill be able to better my best time, by how much I dont know.

 

Oh yeah? The only thing my Max has that your's doesn't is a RT cat and B-pipe. How 'bout them apples You're Max is suppose to have 30hp more than mine. What gives? hehe..I'm just playing with ya.

:adding more fuel to the inferno:

My 14.91@94mph was in 80 degree weather, 70% humidity, WITH a 2.4 60 foot, AND at 1200 feet above sea level. Tell me, what's the altitude in Florida and your 60 foot?


Dave

 

there is no way that you can beat a 2K with out your "secret toppings" I thorougly beat a 4th gen with my 5th gen...rolling, dead start, anything...you just can't beat the extra 32 hp. there is no way you are running a 14.91 with a stock 4th gen...and if you are, let me take my 5th gen to that track and I'll run a 14.5 I promise.

 

The alititude is damn close to sea level! My 60 foots are usually mid 2.2's. If I get a 2.4 60 foot, my ET's are usually in the high 14.8's to low 14.9's. I had hoped the general "0.1 sec 60 ft = 0.2 sec ET" rule would apply. But, it hasnt for me yet...ARGH. MY best time of 14.75 was run in the 70's. I dont know the humidity off hand, but it was typical Florida type air.

The one thing I can say about this car is that it is consistent. Its not the fastest car out there thats for sure, but it always very close (within 0.1 sec)of my best time on almost every run.

Did you find that the B-pipe and RT cat helped any? We did a dyno test on the 5th gen with NO exhaust whatsoever after the cat and gained 3 wheel hp (203 to 206 hp) with no loss in low end. Thus, Ive left my exhaust alone.

And, one final note......In our local informal Maxima club, Mad Max used to hold the ET crown. But, just last Saturday, Terry in his 4th gen usurped the title! 14.73 @ 94.1 (2.23)

Congrats Terry! We are all gunning for you now!

 

Well, Dave's car isnt stock.

But, your point is well taken about different tracks yielding different times. We see that here somewhat in the 2 tracks that are within 90 minutes of each other. The track in Orlando is almost always quicker. But, Orlando is alot farther away than DeSoto (Bradenton, FL) for me, so I always go to DeSoto. Ive made runs at Orlando, and its definitely stickier. In my last car, I ran at least 0.1 sec faster in Orlando, usually, 0.2 sec.

 

Mad Max-

You're right, the Maxima is incredibly consistent. On the same night, my runs are within .1 seconds and 1 mph of each other considering the 60 foots are similiar. It's a relatively easier to race when rolling, but I haven't figured out the launch yet. I see that you launch at 4500 rpm slipping the clutch big time. I'll have to try that. Usually I just wind it up to 2200rpm, quickly slip the clutch, get a some wheelspin, then get going.

I haven't track tested the RT cat yet, but I doubt it is worth much-atleast by my butt dyno. The B-pipe was good for atleast 1.5-2mph in the 1/4 mile. Traction is still the problem. After adding the B-pipe, I gained a bit more low to mid range torque which is kinda wierd. I went from 14.9-15.0@92-93mph to consistent 14.9-15.0@94-95mph with slightly worse 60 foots and slightly warmer weather. I doubt they will make a B-pipe for the 5th gen because the piping is already bigger on 5th gen vs the 4th gen plus you guys have that nifty muffler.


Dave

[Edited by Dave B on 12-28-2000 at 08:51 AM]

 

Hawkdog-

Until you actually run the 1/4 mile your "kills" mean little to me, sorry. Street racing and track racing are completely different, believe me. I can hang with and have beat 5th gen Maxima's in my 4th gen. I've already done it once. I got a 14.99@95mph compared to a 15.3@92mph out of a 2K SE 5 speed. The 30hp difference isn't that big at.

I do have power mods, but they aren't very serious. My mods at the time of my 14.9@94mph were a y-pipe, B-pipe, and HKS intake. A month earlier I ran a 14.9@92mph with just the Y-pipe and intake. Since the last time at the track I added a RT cat (no big gains), new struts all around, lightweight 16s, and new tires (all my prior runs were on bald 15" RSAs). My car hooks much better and now that I dynoed my car, I realized I was shifting too late. I've adjusted accordingly and am waiting patiently for Febuary when we can start racing again.

You must remember I am racing at 1200' above sea level which is worth atleast .1-.15 in the 1/4 mile and that I have run as quick as 96mph in 1/4 mile as observed by 2 Maxima.org members.


Dave

 

that 15.3 is not a very good time for a 2K 5spd. I see most of the people on here running 14.9's stock with theirs. you do seem to have one of the best 4th gen times though...a 5th gen with the mods you have would be running mid 14's

 

Most stock 5th gens seem to run very low 15's, with a few dipping into the 14.9's. Im not sure anyone has run faster than that stock.

As far as mid 14's in a 5th gen with the mods Dave has.....well someone needs to put those mods on their car and find out! Im pretty sure no one has run a mid 14 in an N/A (meaning no nitrous or FI) 5th gen yet with any amount of mods and stock street tires. As far as I know, no 5th gen has run faster than a 14.75 But, that will change soon.