this article simply goes against everything i have ever heard about autos/manuals. not buying it sorry.

and there is no feeling like when your 'ultra advanced state of the art' computer decides to shift into 4th while you are confortably climbing a hill in 3rd... i hate that @#$@# thing when it does that.

i wish nissan had tiptronic....

Houston, isn't that the 3rd largest city in the country? Probably need an auto there. Do you always take everything literally, or have you ever heard of satire? Superiority? OMFG like the saying goes, RELAX, IT'S ONLY A GAME!

Manumatics and sequential shifting are the future (for sports car). this thing shift faster than any human can shift (at least in an F1) less mistake could be made and more shift more precise.

some of us are just adding counter point to what the author said. I don't think that I am superior.

I've always felt that an individual should pick the vehicle that is most appropriate for them. Automatic transmissions do make alot of sense in urban areas. I don't think a manual tranny is superior to an auto. In the same car, a manual transmission is faster than the auto looking at the majority of the vehicles on the road. However a manual tranny can't match the convience that an auto offers. It's not a matter of which is better, it's about which one fits into your life the best.

What raised the ire of us manual tranny guys is the general attitude of the article and the misinformation contained in it. To me the author is pretty much calling manual tranny guys posers, especially in the last paragraph. The author seems to think I can go out and buy a honda civic, ford focus, dodge neon, ect and have a quality automatic transmission that offers the same performance as a manual. IMO upper tier luxury cars and sport cars offer automatics that shift as fast or faster than manuals. At this level there is little compromise between performance and convience because these autos have both.

However looking at cars, both new and used, below 30k, the manual transmission does offer more performance than an auto. Now whether or not the manual driver is better/faster than an auto driver is a whole other story.

Ok
I went back to the 5 speed yesturday and boy did that feel good
the auto is bearable but the 5 speed is just too ****ing fun!..

The impetuous feeling you get as you shift to a lower gear while discharging the clutch pedal and generously stomping the accelerator.... is simply orgasmic ... and just can't be experienced with an automatic.

i think i'm going to go for a drive right now

Ye all that power almost made me crash yesterday. As I slowed down from 3rd to 2nd gear but gave it a lot of gas and released the clutch, just when I went to make a 90 degree turn and my car broke traction and was about to hit a car but I was able to get it under control.

glad your ok

Nobody ever seriously said I'm better than you because I drive a stick, that's childish! We're just responding to the dude who wrote the article. Where I come from, a man simply does not have a hyphenated last name.

All of a sudden the other dude snaps and says he's a 36-year old ironman! I dunno, I'm built like Eric Lindros, does that make he or myself superior? I don't think there's enough info and who cares. Only somebody who is insecure really has to find out.

I prefer manuals even in the 5th largest city in the good ol USA. Maybe I'm superior, maybe I'm not. I never even thought about it but the dude said the camel's back was somehow broken. Guess it's the wild wild web!

No, you all have it wrong, I am superior! Not only do I drive a manual transmission, with 6 gears, but I am also 6'4.5" tall and can dunk a basketball one handed! Bow to my superiority! Bwahahahahah!!

^*%&%^()$&*(&**&)% what can I say? You got 1/2" on me, I drive a 5-spd, I cannot dunk either. But I do secretely call anybody who is bossy and 6' or shorter "little Napoleon's." ahahahahahaah

Ok tough guy, are you 36 and an ironman?

Personally, I think if the auto transmission had smaller gears we wouldn't have all of this talk about 5 speeds being faster. Regardless, a well modded or maintained auto will run close to a 5 speed.

True, with these newe technology 5 speed autos, the performance gap is closing. BMW has a 6 speed auto in their 7 series. And CVTs will become more common as well.

The performance gap between auto and manual will gradually disappear, but the manual will never lose it's fun factor

DW

Thepower thing is BS too. Look at dyno slips on a stock Max auto and 5 spd. 5spd has much less power loss. Other mftrs may be diff but most still lose power with the autos compared to 5 speeds..

I don't think thats nescessarily the case at all. The 5 speed simply puts more power to the wheels than an auto, not to mention that you can get a better launch. There are 5 speeds on here who have nearly a 1 second faster quarter mile time than autos with the same mods. Meaning you could slap a supercharger on an automatic and still lose to a N/A 5 speed. On the otherhand, stop and go traffic during rush hour just plain sucks now compared to when I had my automatic.

I know its the case. yeah we lose power but the gap at the track or on the road is not a walk for 5 speeds at all.

Maybe I'm really just a stick shift wannabee...

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Kevin Wong
[B]This would be awesome in the max - wonder if there's a way to put the shorter 1,2,3 gears on the max tranny?

You have to keep a few things in mind. the 2000-2001 Altima uses a 150 hp 4 banger. That motor has a much shorter torque band,and quite a bit less torque, when comparing to the VQ. So the ratios were adjusted to compensate for that in the 5 speed tranny. Can you imagine making 1st shorter in a 5 speed Maxima? I burn rubber at will in first. With a shorter 1st gear, you'll light up the tires from just tipping in the throttle

As for the VQ being at 3000 rpms at 75-80 mph, yeah, I kindof agree. But SteVTEC pointed out something very interesting. Because of the VQ30DE's bore and stroke, the pistons aren't accelerating as much at 3000 rpms as in other motors. In other words, there's less wear and tear on the motor than you'd think. My memroy is vague but he compared the VQ to a Honda V6. The honda, revving at 2500 revs or so, was working harder than the VQ30DE at 3000 rpms, . . .or something like that. The VQ30DE even works less hard than the VQ35DE. Lucky for the VQ35DE, it has a 6th gear which balances everything out.

DW

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Kevin Wong
[B]

autos are not fun to drive

I drove a F355 F1... now that is as good as it gets and thats the only sequential I'd choose over stick for fun because Ferrari s cursed with the stupid gated shifter...

automatics shift at the wrong times, its very disconcerting when I drive one I just am like why did it shift into 4th on the highway onramp? so I have to punch it to make it downshift... its annoying and it gives me nowhere near as much control as my 5spd

I think driving an auto is just boring.

Even tractor-trailers are available with auto trannies now. Do you think a person in that situation cares which is cool and which is not? Of course not, they want a manual to get all the torque to the wheels because they are paying for the capital cost of the vehicle and the fuel to operate it--if they are losing torque to the wheels they are losing money.

Do you think Lance Armstrong would use a bike with an auto tranny in the Tour de France? Do you want an auto tranny on a Harley or BMW bike?

All this CVT talk, 6-spd auto BMW, Tiptronic etc. talk is rationalization. It does not replace a clutch. Nobody said that people who drive autos aren't real men, so I don't understand where all the defensiveness and counter-rationalization is coming from. Last time I checked a person had to spend hard-earned money to buy, insure, and operate a car. So if they want an auto, that's perfectly fine. But they should also stop trying to say an auto is just as good or there is technology that makes it as good etc. We people who drive sticks enjoy it, and we're entitled to enjoy it as well. And yes you will get more torque to the wheels too.

Yeah that's about right

Last three posts on this page...

http://forums.maxima.org/showthread....0&pagenumber=2

Just like people with slow cars will tell you what great hp per liter their car has

As already stated, the VQ has a TON more torque than that KA24 engine. I don't know how much shorter the gears could get in the Maxima. Any shorter and the only thing that would happen is that your tires would get ripped to shreds.

For example, the Mustang V6 (190HP/225TQ) runs the SAME GEARS as the Mustang GT does (260HP/300-ish TQ), right down to the final drive ratio. The gearing was designed for the V8, and the V8 gets good performance. Ever wonder why the V6 Mustangs are so slow? It's because they're straining trying to turn V8 gears. The ratios in the Altima were changed because that little 4-banger was straining trying to turn 3.0 VQ gears, which it probably didn't have the torque to do. Fortunately for the V6 Mustang guys, they have RWD which makes changing out the rear-end pretty easy to do, and from what I know (not much) it's a popular mod for them.

A 3.0VQ running at 3000rpm at 70 mph is more or less equivalent to a Honda 3.0 or Toyota 3.0 running at 2500rpm. Read through the post I linked above.

As for the short gearing, THANK GOD FOR THAT!

It's what makes this car so much fun to drive. I enjoy the fact that I can step on it in 5th, and have so much acceleration that I don't even need to downshift. In fact just this past week I was passing somebody and reached to do the 4-5 shift, only to realize it was already in 5th! I enjoy knowing that if I need even MORE acceleration, I can still downshift one or even TWO gears.

If I told you that a BMW 330i 5MT ran at about 3000rpm @ 70 in 5th, would you be more or less happy? If I told you that an Audi A4 2.8Q 5MT also ran about 3000rpm @ 70 in 5th, would you be more or less happy? The fact of the matter is, the Maxima has performance-oriented gearing in it. That's rare enough these days with everybody trying to maximize fuel economy, especially in a family sedan

If it's just the high revs that bother you, read my post about the piston speeds and you'll realize that despite the higher revs, the engine isn't working nearly as hard as it appears to be at face value. Not all RPM's were created equally ;-) You'll come to appreciate how Nissan designed the VQ and why it's been a Ward's 10 Best engine for over 7 years now. You can run short gears on the highway to keep the engine very responsive, yet still not working it hard at all and still getting excellent fuel mileage.

If you just want lower revs anyways, and a bit more relaxed and economical cruising, trade in for an automatic. The automatic gears are the complete opposite of the 5spd gearing. *VERY* tall and widely spaced, vs very short and closely spaced on the manual. You get a slower car overall that is much less responsive, all for 1 LESS mpg in the city, and only 1 more on the highway.

Two years ago in my 01 Accord V6 4AT (tall econo gearing) I spent my weekends burning up and down I-95. 4th was always too tall and useless, and 3rd was too short. Never a good gear to be in, and my mileage always sucked because I was always getting on and off of the gas, shifting, etc. Car wrecked...buy Maxima. I can do the whole trip in 5th, never need to downshift, and because everything is so much smoother, I actually get the same or better mileage as my Accord did, which was actually rated at 28 mpg highway, vs 27 in the Max. I actually get 27 in the Max on the highway. I never broke 24 in the Accord because of all the downshifting.

And on top of all that, I broke my MD/VA/DC to southeast PA (180 miles) commute time record of 2hrs 30 min in the Accord to 2hrs 10min in the Maxima, all while still getting better mileage in the Maxima.

Oh, that's with 20 miles of low-speed city driving too, and 3 toll stops. You do the math

No matter what they do to an automatic transmission to make it feel more like a manual, it just won't be the same without a clutch. To me, the whole point is being able to select the engine speed at which it engages the drive system. You can't do that, even on the most sophisticated systems found on BMW, Porsche, and Ferrari.

I dunno, not to be funny, but unless you were born 1994 or later, there is a good chance that "grandpa can't do math." (From Fraser)

I see so many quotes and figures outta nowhere but people done even aknow what dey mean. For example, WTF is a cd without the frontal area (11th graders help me out here)? WTF is a gear ratio without knowing the final drive? It's like the people who order a diet soda with their Biggie Fries.

Anyway, BMW, be it 5th or 6th, it's 1:1. And the gas mileage is fine. Let's be honest, what's the different between a manual and auto in bump-bump traffic? Basically the left foot and the ability to talk and stroke your Moto.

Good. I feel like I passed my VQ motor final exam

DW

hehe...





they love their stick

haha I thought I was the only one who really enjoyed this factor.

Oh, and don't forget, Chicks dig guys who drive 5-spd. And that's really what it's all about right?

EXACTLY....why do people act like sitting in traffic with an auto is so much better than with a stick? It's almost like they enjoy it