MaxPerformanceSE

iTrader: (2)

I went out and bought a set of Toyo Proxes FZ4 this morning for the Max (stock rims). I originally wanted Michelin Pilot Sport A/S or Dunlop SP Sport A2. The Town Fair Tire I went to didn't have either in stock. The guy suggested the Toyos and decided to give them a try.

I did a search here and most of reviews weren't too favorable. Should I go back and have them order Dunlops or should I stick with the Toyos?

Also, does $162 per tire sound right?

gtr_rider

iTrader: (50)

my condolences..

KL99SEA

iTrader: (1)

No, not me.

StygianMax

iTrader: (8)

I bought them before I discovered the org. I got them as a replacement for my stock Toyo A05s. They're okay in the dry but poor in the wet. I plan on getting Yoko ES100s next time around.

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

$162/ tire in what size... I hope you are talking about at least 18's or you got ripped. I had FZ4s on my civic and was never happy with them. They suck as a summer tire and are supposedly "all season" tires. Like hell, they are dangerous as hell in the winter.

MaxPerformanceSE

iTrader: (2)

These are stock 97-99 SE Rims. Out the door I paid $489. This included balancing, alignment, and valve stems.

I plan on calling the guy after Christmas and have him order some Dunlop A2's.

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

Did you only buy 3 of them? Because $489/4=122, 489/3=163. If you really paid $163/tire, even out the door with balancing and mounting, you got taken bud.

Here's the price list I found for them at one vendor.

Size Approved Rim Width Price

205/55VR16 5.5-6.5-8.0 100.00
215/55VR16 5.5-6.5-8.0 105.00
225/55VR16 6.0-7.0-9.0 110.00
205/50VR16 5.5-6.5-7.5 95.00
225/50ZR16 6.0-7.0-9.0 95.00
245/50VR16 6.5-7.5-9.5 110.00
205/40ZR16 7.0-8.0-8.5 80.00
215/40ZR16 7.0-7.5-8.5 100.00

I still don't know what size you got, but if you got 3 of them for $489 even WITH mounting, balancing, and stems you got taken. Mounting and balancing shouldn't be any more than $15, maybe $30, for ALL 4 tires, not per tire.

Ramius83

MaxPerformanceSE: It almost sounds like he quoted you for the Toyo Proxes T1-S series tire. I have the T1-S and at that price, you should have gotten what I did. Go back to them and make sure they got everything in correctly.....

DaBoxSE

iTrader: (5)

Hey Chan, how you been?
Randy had the FZ4's on his stock Celica rims and he didnt like them in any kind of weather except dry. I have Yokohama AVS db's and I definitely recommend them if you replace yours. They are great in all weather. I have 225/50WR16s. Check them out.

outkastist

had 'em,
hated 'em,
get new tires!!!!

i now have goodrich scorchers and they are SOOO much better than those POS's.

MaxPerformanceSE

iTrader: (2)

To clear things up I would like to break down some things to show how I ended up with $489.

Tires(4) $115 each = $460
Blanancing Free
Valve Stems Free
Alignment $29 = +$29
-----------

$489


The reason I ask if $162 was reasonable price was because it seemed pretty high for list price.

I woke up this morning and called the guy I dealt with the day before and asked him to order me some Dunlop SP Sport A2's. I was told to call Monday and check to see if they're in.

Yesterday when I pulled out of the tire place, I didn't really notice the difference between the Toyos and the stock Goodyears when it came to ride quality. But I lied to my dad and told him the tires were great when he asked me how I liked them. Sorry I had to since he was the one who paid for the tires. I didn't want to tell him they sucked when he shelled out $500 just for tires.

Let's hope I will be satisfied with the Dunlops.

Max8MyCash

iTrader: (3)

I love my FZ4s.

StygianMax

iTrader: (8)

Why did you get an alignment? It wasn't because of the new tires right?

MaxPerformanceSE

iTrader: (2)

I thought an alignment was needed everytime new tires are put on? Also the car was pulling slightly to the right.

StygianMax

iTrader: (8)

Not necessary
This is good reason for an alignment.

2k1i30

I've had the FZ4s on my car now for approx 8k and I really dont find anything too unbearble with them. The handling of these tires are usually criticized and to be honest, its not all that bad in the rain. The only real compliant I have with the tires is road noise. At 8k im starting to hear it, and from what I've read, it only will get worse.

StygianMax

iTrader: (8)

My complaint about them is their lack of lateral traction in the wet on curves.

DAREN

iTrader: (3)

as every one knows in the world of tires there are retail prices and wholesale/commercial prices. if you went to a firestone store do you think they would just give them to you at the tire rack price? of course not they are gonna try for retail. why sell for less if you can get more money for it. free balace and stems is kinda good. most places charge $10 balance $2-3 for stems ~$1 for disposal. if you want that low tire rack (and others) price buy the tires then go to one of their autorized installers. $18-20 mount and balance, $2-5 for valve stems, $1-3 for disposal $49-69 for an alignment.

my experience with the tires is pretty good. i got 30k on my first set before i had to replace the fronts. dry traction is good and the i really cant complain about the wet traction either. (wet=the road is wet-as apposed to 2 inch puddles in the road) hydroplane resistance is pretty good. my nest set of tire will probably be the Toyo T1-S or the B-stone Potenza S-03.

yes these tires are m+s rated but that only means that the rubber is less likely to freeze and harden up in cold climates. traction in snow is prolly about the same as the original tires. you will have some trouble in snow. as far as the Dunlops go, i have already had 1 customer try to return them because he felt deceived by some magazine article.

my only real complaint is that the tires are a little louder that i would like. as i stated earlier my overall experience with them is pretty good. i use then for the whole year except for between the first and last snow. i run some 235/45zr17 on some 17x8 wheels. lateral response/handling is very good with this combo. also you will only need an alignment if the car is pulling to one side or there are signs of abnormal tire wear due to a bad alignmet. in case you are wondering i dont granny drive either. i poll of hard,brake hard and corner hard, i spend a lot of time testing the limits of car-tires-myself. a word of advice dont expect any tire to remove the maximas gross tendancy to understeer. there people on this board with full suspension that still have this problem. this would be the only time i notice a lack of traction in my car, mediun speed corners with fairly high steering angles in the wet.

i know it was long but that's my 2 cent.

Shadow

iTrader: (15)

I had all 4 FZ4's fail on my car (225/35/19). They have to be one of the worst tires ever made. All 4 had cracked sidewalls. The first tire blew out 6 months after getting them. The sidewalls on both sides had multiple cracks and one of them split. The shop I took it to said it was common with FZ4's. I told them I blew out a sidewall, and they said "you have FZ4's don't you?" before I told them what type of tire I had.

Checked the 3 other tires and they were fine at the time. 7 months after that, second tire has a sidewall blowout due to cracks. The cracks were all on the inside so I never caught it. Notice the other 2 tires also had cracks in the sidewall. Around this time I got into an accident, so I sent my car to the body shop and ordered new tires. The day I picked up my car from the shop, the tread on my driver's side front tire separated (ala Firestone). A 2" section of tread came right off the tire and whipped around my wheelwell cracking my just repainted front bumper. Later on, I get the car home and find out that the 4th Toyo was experiencing tread separation as well. It just had not totally come off yet as the 3rd tire did.

So in 13 months, I had all 4 Toyos fail. 3 of them catastrophically almost causing accidents in all 3 instances. My suspension undergoes regular alignments and all 4 tires were showing no signs of uneven wear up to the point of failure. The shop I get my tires installed at has a stack of Toyo FZ4's that have failed. I think in the past year, they've seen over a dozen sidewall failures with Toyo FZ4's.

Talked to the Toyo reps since I knew them pretty well from shows and stuff, their tech tells me that the tires were underinflated. He told me that this would happen if I didn't keep the pressure over 50 psi, 55 would be ideal. I've since swapped out for Falkens and not one of them has given me any trouble yet even though I've put almost as many miles on them and run them at 42 psi.

StygianMax

iTrader: (8)

Dayum!! For a second there, I smelled a class action lawsuit.

infinitiblast

iTrader: (2)

Wow didnt know anyone else here has the toyos. Well I got them on my 99 but thats only becuase it came used with them. Wet weather sucks like a monkey its a hyrdoplane queen, I dont feel safe taking curves to fast when its even the least bit moist on the road. However in dry they seem ok, but they follow road ruts and the likes allot. I'm also about to order my Dunlop Sport A2's everyone has great reviews on them . One thing now that the toyo's are almost balled up front, it seems they are perfect for drag racing...lower that tire pressure and it stuck pretty well. But I agree with shadow, the sidewall almost look like its dry-roting where it meets the footprint of the tire...very strange. Take them back for sure and enjoy the dunlops.

DAREN

iTrader: (3)

unfortunatly the people that installed the tire and wheel combo on your car did not pay attention to the load index on the tires. your 225/35zr19 FZ4 have a load index of 88W. most tires in your orginal (oem) sizes have a load index of 93H/V or better. any time you buy new wheels /tires for the car you "should" match or exceed the load index of the oem wheel and tire combo. the stress cracks, tread separation and other problems you experienced were because of this oversight. basically the entire time you owned the tires they were overloaded, the guy that told you to run tham at 50 psi, their max, was not doing you a favor. that course of action would only make the tires ride like crap, rock hard and put extra stress on an already overloaded tire. there are some manufactureres that wont/dont make a 225/35ZR19 because of this problem. if you replaced you toyo's with another brand but in the same size look out for the same problems to occur.

a 245/35ZR19 would have been a better choice in size and load index for your car.

Shadow

iTrader: (15)

I would have liked to run a 245 tire, but the wheels are 19 x 7.5 and a 245 is not recommended for that wheel width. It was Toyo's own technician that said I needed to run at over 50 psi.

I'm getting 19x10's pretty soon, so I'll be running a much wider tire then.

DAREN

iTrader: (3)

19x8 or 19x8.5 i could see but if you can get a 19x10 to fit in the wheel wells good luck and big props for doing it.

that rep was wrong. unless the spec on the tire was changed from what is listed on the toyo website, (it's possible) he was wrong. last i checked the info in the toyo product catalog (have at work) and their website says that the maximum psi on that tire in that size is 50psi. i have never recomended to any of my customers that they run max pressure. if you remember, what was the max psi on you toyo's.

FZ4's in a 245/35ZR19 have load index of 93W as do many other tires in that size. regardless of tire choice application is the key.

Shadow

iTrader: (15)

I'm not going to be stuffing them in the factory wheel wells There will be enough room.

At a show, the tech pulled out his book and then told me to run over 50 psi. I never saw what he was looking at.

outkastist

pulling to the right was probly a little torque steer....mine pulls even after alignment. i have heard that max's arent supposed to have much torque steer, but mine does. oh well, just gotta make sure i keep my hands on the wheel.

by the way my friend also had these freakin toyos and we both had bubbles all over the place!!! he thinks they are crap too.

StygianMax

iTrader: (8)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by outkastist i have heard that max's arent supposed to have much torque steer, but mine does. oh well, just gotta make sure i keep my hands on the wheel.[QUOTE]

You're not the only one with torque steer. It a result of the two driftshafts being different lengths.