Mazda has something for Nissan
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 1,252
Mazda MP3
2.0L DOHC
140HP
142 lb-ft torque
17" wheels
FSTB
4 wheel independent
280 watt system
4 speaker
Kenwood
agressive styling
Nissan Sentra SE-R V-spec
2.5L DOHC
180HP
180 lb-ft torque
17" wheels
FSTB
front independent, multilink beam rear suspension
280 watt system
9 speaker
Rockford Fosgate
agressive styling
2.0L DOHC
140HP
142 lb-ft torque
17" wheels
FSTB
4 wheel independent
280 watt system
4 speaker
Kenwood
agressive styling
Nissan Sentra SE-R V-spec
2.5L DOHC
180HP
180 lb-ft torque
17" wheels
FSTB
front independent, multilink beam rear suspension
280 watt system
9 speaker
Rockford Fosgate
agressive styling
Guest
Posts: n/a
And some pics:
MP3
<img src="http://www.impreza-across.thepond.com/detroit/dsc01452.jpg">
<img src="http://www.impreza-across.thepond.com/detroit/dsc01451.jpg">
Sentra SE-R again:
<img src="http://www.b15sentra.net/images/NEWZ-SER/b15ser-1.jpg">
<img src="http://www.b15sentra.net/images/NEWZ-SER/b15ser-2.jpg">
I think the Sentra looks much better!
MP3
<img src="http://www.impreza-across.thepond.com/detroit/dsc01452.jpg">
<img src="http://www.impreza-across.thepond.com/detroit/dsc01451.jpg">
Sentra SE-R again:
<img src="http://www.b15sentra.net/images/NEWZ-SER/b15ser-1.jpg">
<img src="http://www.b15sentra.net/images/NEWZ-SER/b15ser-2.jpg">
I think the Sentra looks much better!
Originally posted by VQracer
Mazda MP3
2.0L DOHC
140HP
142 lb-ft torque
17" wheels
FSTB
4 wheel independent
280 watt system
4 speaker
Kenwood
agressive styling
Nissan Sentra SE-R V-spec
2.5L DOHC
180HP
180 lb-ft torque
17" wheels
FSTB
front independent, multilink beam rear suspension
280 watt system
9 speaker
Rockford Fosgate
agressive styling
Mazda MP3
2.0L DOHC
140HP
142 lb-ft torque
17" wheels
FSTB
4 wheel independent
280 watt system
4 speaker
Kenwood
agressive styling
Nissan Sentra SE-R V-spec
2.5L DOHC
180HP
180 lb-ft torque
17" wheels
FSTB
front independent, multilink beam rear suspension
280 watt system
9 speaker
Rockford Fosgate
agressive styling
Senior Member
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,046
well....
In the twisties....both should be very close. The mazda may very well be a better handler but only by a tad. Both cars will show up with large amounts of grip.
In the power department....the se-r will win hands down. 30hp more(40 in V) and 33ft-lbs more(38 in V) will surely cream it. Don't forget Torsen LSD and a six speed
In the power department....the se-r will win hands down. 30hp more(40 in V) and 33ft-lbs more(38 in V) will surely cream it. Don't forget Torsen LSD and a six speed
Senior Member
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,642
Re: MP3?? does it play music??
Yeah ... it's the first North American car to have a MP3 Player built in to the stereo!!!
Dunno how in the world U would trasfer the songs from computer to your car!!!!!
Dunno how in the world U would trasfer the songs from computer to your car!!!!!
Originally posted by BrokenMotor
i think it looks ok, better then all the other Mazda product besides the RX7. front looks good rear is descent but the spoiler "got to" go man!!
i think it looks ok, better then all the other Mazda product besides the RX7. front looks good rear is descent but the spoiler "got to" go man!!
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: well....
Originally posted by Mike S.
In the twisties....both should be very close. The mazda may very well be a better handler but only by a tad. Both cars will show up with large amounts of grip.
In the power department....the se-r will win hands down. 30hp more(40 in V) and 33ft-lbs more(38 in V) will surely cream it. Don't forget Torsen LSD and a six speed
In the twisties....both should be very close. The mazda may very well be a better handler but only by a tad. Both cars will show up with large amounts of grip.
In the power department....the se-r will win hands down. 30hp more(40 in V) and 33ft-lbs more(38 in V) will surely cream it. Don't forget Torsen LSD and a six speed
Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 722
Re: Re: well....
Originally posted by Russ2kSE
How can you say? If that MP3 handles as good as a TYPE-R then maybe, but the SE-R supose to handle better.
Originally posted by Mike S.
In the twisties....both should be very close. The mazda may very well be a better handler but only by a tad. Both cars will show up with large amounts of grip.
In the power department....the se-r will win hands down. 30hp more(40 in V) and 33ft-lbs more(38 in V) will surely cream it. Don't forget Torsen LSD and a six speed
In the twisties....both should be very close. The mazda may very well be a better handler but only by a tad. Both cars will show up with large amounts of grip.
In the power department....the se-r will win hands down. 30hp more(40 in V) and 33ft-lbs more(38 in V) will surely cream it. Don't forget Torsen LSD and a six speed
Dave
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Re: Re: well....
Wrong, Beam axle only bad thing is going over bumps. It will handle as good or even better on SMOOTH surfaces. Gee, alot of solid axle cars have won many many championships. Loren can speak on this one....actually let me find a recent post from him...
Lorens:
I don't agree with this statement. I can say this confidently from
Saleen's perspective. In 1996', they tried their first hand at using
an Independent Rear Suspension over the solid beams. After half a
season of nothing but problems, they switched back to the solid beams.
The only races they won that year were with solid beams. Since
Saleen had an investment from Ford to their race team to develop the
IRS and the class rules changed the next year; the made a go ahead
with it. For several years they planned to release their own IRS as
an option on their street cars, but could not justify it without the
handling advantage.
Here is a second example. Look at Winston Cup cars. No, I am not
talking about those races where they just drive around in a big cirle.
I am talking about the road course events they do at Road Atlanta.
Those Solid axle cars run times even to the best IRS Trans Am series
cars(coincidently it is usually a TA driver who wins those races
driving as a substitute driver). With proper tuning, a solid axle car
can handle as good as and IRS car.
The difference is in ride and how it works on surfaces that are not
flat. This is where the IRS cars have destinct advantages. IRS cars
tuned for sport never ride well or smoothly over bumps. Since each
wheel moves independently, each wheel controls its own motion and
contact to the road. A sudden change in movement to one rear wheel
causes an additional movement to the opposite wheel. The
transmittance of this is place in the cabin. I have felt this first
hand. Although my Maxima is softer than either my Miata or my CRX,
the Miata and the CRX soak up individual bumps better and individual
bumps effect the chassis less.
Lorens:
I don't agree with this statement. I can say this confidently from
Saleen's perspective. In 1996', they tried their first hand at using
an Independent Rear Suspension over the solid beams. After half a
season of nothing but problems, they switched back to the solid beams.
The only races they won that year were with solid beams. Since
Saleen had an investment from Ford to their race team to develop the
IRS and the class rules changed the next year; the made a go ahead
with it. For several years they planned to release their own IRS as
an option on their street cars, but could not justify it without the
handling advantage.
Here is a second example. Look at Winston Cup cars. No, I am not
talking about those races where they just drive around in a big cirle.
I am talking about the road course events they do at Road Atlanta.
Those Solid axle cars run times even to the best IRS Trans Am series
cars(coincidently it is usually a TA driver who wins those races
driving as a substitute driver). With proper tuning, a solid axle car
can handle as good as and IRS car.
The difference is in ride and how it works on surfaces that are not
flat. This is where the IRS cars have destinct advantages. IRS cars
tuned for sport never ride well or smoothly over bumps. Since each
wheel moves independently, each wheel controls its own motion and
contact to the road. A sudden change in movement to one rear wheel
causes an additional movement to the opposite wheel. The
transmittance of this is place in the cabin. I have felt this first
hand. Although my Maxima is softer than either my Miata or my CRX,
the Miata and the CRX soak up individual bumps better and individual
bumps effect the chassis less.
Originally posted by wdave
The beam rear axle in the SE-R will be a handicap - after all, you can only get so much out of a horse buggy suspension. On real roads with bumps that will be as bad as a Max.
Dave
Originally posted by Russ2kSE
How can you say? If that MP3 handles as good as a TYPE-R then maybe, but the SE-R supose to handle better.
Originally posted by Mike S.
In the twisties....both should be very close. The mazda may very well be a better handler but only by a tad. Both cars will show up with large amounts of grip.
In the power department....the se-r will win hands down. 30hp more(40 in V) and 33ft-lbs more(38 in V) will surely cream it. Don't forget Torsen LSD and a six speed
In the twisties....both should be very close. The mazda may very well be a better handler but only by a tad. Both cars will show up with large amounts of grip.
In the power department....the se-r will win hands down. 30hp more(40 in V) and 33ft-lbs more(38 in V) will surely cream it. Don't forget Torsen LSD and a six speed
Dave
$20!
Originally posted by Russ2kSE
Wrong, Beam axle only bad thing is going over bumps. It will handle as good or even better on SMOOTH surfaces. Gee, alot of solid axle cars have won many many championships. Loren can speak on this one....actually let me find a recent post from him...
Lorens:
I don't agree with this statement. I can say this confidently from
Saleen's perspective. In 1996', they tried their first hand at using
an Independent Rear Suspension over the solid beams. After half a
season of nothing but problems, they switched back to the solid beams.
The only races they won that year were with solid beams. Since
Saleen had an investment from Ford to their race team to develop the
IRS and the class rules changed the next year; the made a go ahead
with it. For several years they planned to release their own IRS as
an option on their street cars, but could not justify it without the
handling advantage.
Here is a second example. Look at Winston Cup cars. No, I am not
talking about those races where they just drive around in a big cirle.
I am talking about the road course events they do at Road Atlanta.
Those Solid axle cars run times even to the best IRS Trans Am series
cars(coincidently it is usually a TA driver who wins those races
driving as a substitute driver). With proper tuning, a solid axle car
can handle as good as and IRS car.
The difference is in ride and how it works on surfaces that are not
flat. This is where the IRS cars have destinct advantages. IRS cars
tuned for sport never ride well or smoothly over bumps. Since each
wheel moves independently, each wheel controls its own motion and
contact to the road. A sudden change in movement to one rear wheel
causes an additional movement to the opposite wheel. The
transmittance of this is place in the cabin. I have felt this first
hand. Although my Maxima is softer than either my Miata or my CRX,
the Miata and the CRX soak up individual bumps better and individual
bumps effect the chassis less.
Wrong, Beam axle only bad thing is going over bumps. It will handle as good or even better on SMOOTH surfaces. Gee, alot of solid axle cars have won many many championships. Loren can speak on this one....actually let me find a recent post from him...
Lorens:
I don't agree with this statement. I can say this confidently from
Saleen's perspective. In 1996', they tried their first hand at using
an Independent Rear Suspension over the solid beams. After half a
season of nothing but problems, they switched back to the solid beams.
The only races they won that year were with solid beams. Since
Saleen had an investment from Ford to their race team to develop the
IRS and the class rules changed the next year; the made a go ahead
with it. For several years they planned to release their own IRS as
an option on their street cars, but could not justify it without the
handling advantage.
Here is a second example. Look at Winston Cup cars. No, I am not
talking about those races where they just drive around in a big cirle.
I am talking about the road course events they do at Road Atlanta.
Those Solid axle cars run times even to the best IRS Trans Am series
cars(coincidently it is usually a TA driver who wins those races
driving as a substitute driver). With proper tuning, a solid axle car
can handle as good as and IRS car.
The difference is in ride and how it works on surfaces that are not
flat. This is where the IRS cars have destinct advantages. IRS cars
tuned for sport never ride well or smoothly over bumps. Since each
wheel moves independently, each wheel controls its own motion and
contact to the road. A sudden change in movement to one rear wheel
causes an additional movement to the opposite wheel. The
transmittance of this is place in the cabin. I have felt this first
hand. Although my Maxima is softer than either my Miata or my CRX,
the Miata and the CRX soak up individual bumps better and individual
bumps effect the chassis less.
Originally posted by wdave
The beam rear axle in the SE-R will be a handicap - after all, you can only get so much out of a horse buggy suspension. On real roads with bumps that will be as bad as a Max.
Dave
Originally posted by Russ2kSE
How can you say? If that MP3 handles as good as a TYPE-R then maybe, but the SE-R supose to handle better.
Originally posted by Mike S.
In the twisties....both should be very close. The mazda may very well be a better handler but only by a tad. Both cars will show up with large amounts of grip.
In the power department....the se-r will win hands down. 30hp more(40 in V) and 33ft-lbs more(38 in V) will surely cream it. Don't forget Torsen LSD and a six speed
In the twisties....both should be very close. The mazda may very well be a better handler but only by a tad. Both cars will show up with large amounts of grip.
In the power department....the se-r will win hands down. 30hp more(40 in V) and 33ft-lbs more(38 in V) will surely cream it. Don't forget Torsen LSD and a six speed
Dave
Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 722
to bill99gxe - get real!!!
Saleen is a small outfit - if they can't get a poorly designed irs to work - that doesn't mean irs is not better! In fact the Mustang irs can and has been made to work well look at Motorola Cup GT class.
Your Winston Cup analogy is all wet - Trans Am cars ar also solid axle - by rule. At Watkins Glen they were so much faster (6-9 seconds) that the press releases gave Trans Am times in seconds and Winston (WWF of racing) times in MPH so nobody would notice.
Try a truly good handling car like a BMW and talk about irs not riding well over bumps.
The Max is a great compromise - but it's just that - a compromise.
Dave
Saleen is a small outfit - if they can't get a poorly designed irs to work - that doesn't mean irs is not better! In fact the Mustang irs can and has been made to work well look at Motorola Cup GT class.
Your Winston Cup analogy is all wet - Trans Am cars ar also solid axle - by rule. At Watkins Glen they were so much faster (6-9 seconds) that the press releases gave Trans Am times in seconds and Winston (WWF of racing) times in MPH so nobody would notice.
Try a truly good handling car like a BMW and talk about irs not riding well over bumps.
The Max is a great compromise - but it's just that - a compromise.
Dave
Originally posted by wdave
to bill99gxe - get real!!!
Saleen is a small outfit - if they can't get a poorly designed irs to work - that doesn't mean irs is not better! In fact the Mustang irs can and has been made to work well look at Motorola Cup GT class.
Your Winston Cup analogy is all wet - Trans Am cars ar also solid axle - by rule. At Watkins Glen they were so much faster (6-9 seconds) that the press releases gave Trans Am times in seconds and Winston (WWF of racing) times in MPH so nobody would notice.
Try a truly good handling car like a BMW and talk about irs not riding well over bumps.
The Max is a great compromise - but it's just that - a compromise.
Dave
to bill99gxe - get real!!!
Saleen is a small outfit - if they can't get a poorly designed irs to work - that doesn't mean irs is not better! In fact the Mustang irs can and has been made to work well look at Motorola Cup GT class.
Your Winston Cup analogy is all wet - Trans Am cars ar also solid axle - by rule. At Watkins Glen they were so much faster (6-9 seconds) that the press releases gave Trans Am times in seconds and Winston (WWF of racing) times in MPH so nobody would notice.
Try a truly good handling car like a BMW and talk about irs not riding well over bumps.
The Max is a great compromise - but it's just that - a compromise.
Dave
My musings were about the 3rd gen IRS vs. the 4th gen/5th gen beam. I feel a heckuva lot more confident driving in my 3rd gen around the twisties, especially when I go over so much as a pebble comparted to a 4th gen....It's sad that going over a pebble in the 4th gen makes the rear end feel as loose and free as the Mustangs in the 80s and early 90s.....inexcusable.
[Edited by bill99gxe on 01-16-2001 at 09:16 AM]
Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 722
[
to wdave: I could care less about what Saleen does or Mustangs!
My musings were about the 3rd gen IRS vs. the 4th gen/5th gen beam. I feel a heckuva lot more confident driving in my 3rd gen around the twisties, especially when I go over so much as a pebble comparted to a 4th gen....It's sad that going over a pebble in the 4th gen makes the rear end feel as loose and free as the Mustangs in the 80s and early 90s.....inexcusable.
[/I][/QUOTE]
Sorry Bill - my response should have been to Russ. I absolutely agree that the beam in the max is a shame. I also think the linkage they chose contibutes a lot to the funny feeling, that was their compomise for space saving instead of a Watts link.
Dave
to wdave: I could care less about what Saleen does or Mustangs!
My musings were about the 3rd gen IRS vs. the 4th gen/5th gen beam. I feel a heckuva lot more confident driving in my 3rd gen around the twisties, especially when I go over so much as a pebble comparted to a 4th gen....It's sad that going over a pebble in the 4th gen makes the rear end feel as loose and free as the Mustangs in the 80s and early 90s.....inexcusable.
[/I][/QUOTE]
Sorry Bill - my response should have been to Russ. I absolutely agree that the beam in the max is a shame. I also think the linkage they chose contibutes a lot to the funny feeling, that was their compomise for space saving instead of a Watts link.
Dave
Originally posted by wdave
Sorry Bill - my response should have been to Russ. I absolutely agree that the beam in the max is a shame. I also think the linkage they chose contibutes a lot to the funny feeling, that was their compomise for space saving instead of a Watts link.
Dave [/I]
Sorry Bill - my response should have been to Russ. I absolutely agree that the beam in the max is a shame. I also think the linkage they chose contibutes a lot to the funny feeling, that was their compomise for space saving instead of a Watts link.
Dave [/I]
No problem.....I thought your response to mine was a little out of place......
Makes more sense now that it was directed at Russ......
I edited my response to you to reflect that.
Yeah, a Watts link would have been much better.....I drove a new Mercury Grand Marquis on a business trip a couple of months ago......Having driven Grand Marquis' in the past, I was real impressed with the Watts linkage rear suspension setup. That sucker handled well for such a large car, much better than my mom's 89 Marquis and pre-98 Marquis' that I have driven as well..the rear actually stayed on the road better than my 99 Max!...A good job by Ford on this one!
Not DAVEB the parts guy
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 8,549
Bill-
You do know the 4th gen outhandles the 3rd gen, right?
The only suspension mod to your wife's 99 GXE is a FSTB while your 94 has Eibachs, Toks, and grippier tires. It's really not a fair comparision since you've got a GXE with non performance tires, soft suspension, and soft bushing. My 96 SE was "floaty" before I did anything to the suspension. Don't forget that the 4th gen doesn't truely use a RSB. If you slap on a RSB, sticky tires, springs and struts onto her 99 I'm am sure you will get a much better handling car. After doing springs, struts, wheels and tires, RSB, and FSTB and RSTB my Max handles incredibly well. It is by far the best handling car I've personally driven or owned (prior cars CRX Si, 94 Z28, Accord). The only real problem I see with the Maxima's handling is it's vague and over boosted steering. Having a rear beam isn't exactly hampering the Maxima's handling since the car isn't rear wheel drive. It is about as hightech as rear beams go. It keeps perfect alignment thru the turns and actually takes on a 4WS steering affect in tight corners. The 3rd gens independant rear isn't anything special. It's not a double wishbone setup or anything. It is also heavier.
I have yet to get my Maxima to rotate it's rear uncontrolably like my Z28 could. Even when power wasn't applied thru a tight bumpy turn, the rear could set out wildly. My Maxima has yet to do that. I have gotten the rear to rotate out a little thru a smooth sweeper and the car was completely controlable.
I'm not saying the rear beam on the 4th and 5th gen is the best thing out there, but it is not near as bad as many believe it is. For some reason they see the rear beam as something off a old K-car. If they would have seen how it's designed and how it works, they would see that it does a really good and has very few compromises.
Dave
You do know the 4th gen outhandles the 3rd gen, right?
The only suspension mod to your wife's 99 GXE is a FSTB while your 94 has Eibachs, Toks, and grippier tires. It's really not a fair comparision since you've got a GXE with non performance tires, soft suspension, and soft bushing. My 96 SE was "floaty" before I did anything to the suspension. Don't forget that the 4th gen doesn't truely use a RSB. If you slap on a RSB, sticky tires, springs and struts onto her 99 I'm am sure you will get a much better handling car. After doing springs, struts, wheels and tires, RSB, and FSTB and RSTB my Max handles incredibly well. It is by far the best handling car I've personally driven or owned (prior cars CRX Si, 94 Z28, Accord). The only real problem I see with the Maxima's handling is it's vague and over boosted steering. Having a rear beam isn't exactly hampering the Maxima's handling since the car isn't rear wheel drive. It is about as hightech as rear beams go. It keeps perfect alignment thru the turns and actually takes on a 4WS steering affect in tight corners. The 3rd gens independant rear isn't anything special. It's not a double wishbone setup or anything. It is also heavier.
I have yet to get my Maxima to rotate it's rear uncontrolably like my Z28 could. Even when power wasn't applied thru a tight bumpy turn, the rear could set out wildly. My Maxima has yet to do that. I have gotten the rear to rotate out a little thru a smooth sweeper and the car was completely controlable.
I'm not saying the rear beam on the 4th and 5th gen is the best thing out there, but it is not near as bad as many believe it is. For some reason they see the rear beam as something off a old K-car. If they would have seen how it's designed and how it works, they would see that it does a really good and has very few compromises.
Dave
Sorry.....my comparison is -->
Originally posted by Dave B
Bill-
You do know the 4th gen outhandles the 3rd gen, right?
The only suspension mod to your wife's 99 GXE is a FSTB while your 94 has Eibachs, Toks, and grippier tires. It's really not a fair comparision since you've got a GXE with non performance tires, soft suspension, and soft bushing. My 96 SE was "floaty" before I did anything to the suspension. Don't forget that the 4th gen doesn't truely use a RSB. If you slap on a RSB, sticky tires, springs and struts onto her 99 I'm am sure you will get a much better handling car. After doing springs, struts, wheels and tires, RSB, and FSTB and RSTB my Max handles incredibly well. It is by far the best handling car I've personally driven or owned (prior cars CRX Si, 94 Z28, Accord). The only real problem I see with the Maxima's handling is it's vague and over boosted steering. Having a rear beam isn't exactly hampering the Maxima's handling since the car isn't rear wheel drive. It is about as hightech as rear beams go. It keeps perfect alignment thru the turns and actually takes on a 4WS steering affect in tight corners. The 3rd gens independant rear isn't anything special. It's not a double wishbone setup or anything. It is also heavier.
I have yet to get my Maxima to rotate it's rear uncontrolably like my Z28 could. Even when power wasn't applied thru a tight bumpy turn, the rear could set out wildly. My Maxima has yet to do that. I have gotten the rear to rotate out a little thru a smooth sweeper and the car was completely controlable.
I'm not saying the rear beam on the 4th and 5th gen is the best thing out there, but it is not near as bad as many believe it is. For some reason they see the rear beam as something off a old K-car. If they would have seen how it's designed and how it works, they would see that it does a really good and has very few compromises.
Dave
Bill-
You do know the 4th gen outhandles the 3rd gen, right?
The only suspension mod to your wife's 99 GXE is a FSTB while your 94 has Eibachs, Toks, and grippier tires. It's really not a fair comparision since you've got a GXE with non performance tires, soft suspension, and soft bushing. My 96 SE was "floaty" before I did anything to the suspension. Don't forget that the 4th gen doesn't truely use a RSB. If you slap on a RSB, sticky tires, springs and struts onto her 99 I'm am sure you will get a much better handling car. After doing springs, struts, wheels and tires, RSB, and FSTB and RSTB my Max handles incredibly well. It is by far the best handling car I've personally driven or owned (prior cars CRX Si, 94 Z28, Accord). The only real problem I see with the Maxima's handling is it's vague and over boosted steering. Having a rear beam isn't exactly hampering the Maxima's handling since the car isn't rear wheel drive. It is about as hightech as rear beams go. It keeps perfect alignment thru the turns and actually takes on a 4WS steering affect in tight corners. The 3rd gens independant rear isn't anything special. It's not a double wishbone setup or anything. It is also heavier.
I have yet to get my Maxima to rotate it's rear uncontrolably like my Z28 could. Even when power wasn't applied thru a tight bumpy turn, the rear could set out wildly. My Maxima has yet to do that. I have gotten the rear to rotate out a little thru a smooth sweeper and the car was completely controlable.
I'm not saying the rear beam on the 4th and 5th gen is the best thing out there, but it is not near as bad as many believe it is. For some reason they see the rear beam as something off a old K-car. If they would have seen how it's designed and how it works, they would see that it does a really good and has very few compromises.
Dave
I know once suspension mods are done, the 99 would probably kill my 94 all the way around. But bone stock, I would take my 3rd gen's ride/handling/control anyday...
Seriously, I feel unsafe in the 4th gen when going over gravel, etc..too much freaking hopping around for my taste...Hopefully, some springs and Konis will solve that.....
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