Matt93SE

iTrader: (44)

after having the stage I and II installed on the car, I started looking at the Auto X rules, just to see where I'd classify..

guess what? PREPARED!

If you add even the stage I subframes, that kicks you into prepared class no matter what else you've done to the car.. that means you're up against full-race cars that have almost zero restrictions on mods.
Of course, the rules are slightly different based on your local clubs and chapters of SCCA, but you get the point.

here's my local rules, just for reference..
http://www.neokla-scca.org/SoloII/Al...ications.shtml


Just thought I'd throw out that bit of info for you in case you were contemplating beatering everyone at your next Auto X after you add the SFCs.

xHypex

iTrader: (1)

That's been mentioned a few times on other threads, but is good advice for the average autocrosser. After reading through the classes I can't even find out where Stage 1 and 2 SFCs would put you. In prepared and mod the two longitudinal SFCs are NOT allowed to have cross braces.
-hype

Bryan H

i know how oyu feel matt, the one time i auto-xed the eclipse {the tech guy knew everything about the car =o(}
i was put in one class below prepared. which i think is what st mod or st prepared, can't remember

took third!
then again there was only three people in the class.

on a brighter note i was only two tenths off a neon with struts, sway bars and springs. {woohoo go stock suspensioned dsm!!!}

last tie i crossed that car. damn wheel bearings.


matt, if they do not check under the car, how do they really know for sure????

Lime

heh...that will definitely throw you into ESP or street prepared. With all the mods I have on my car now, they will try to throw me into street prep or ESP when I get out of novice. :-\

Matt93SE

iTrader: (44)

xHypex, stage I is simply the longitudinal bars. stage II are the cross-braces.

for some classes not allowing the cross braces, you could simply unbolt the stage II section and run without it.

the local rules just state subframe connectors of any sort throw you into prepared. I'm also at the max displacement on a boosted engine (for when I get finished) for anything close to a stock category.


Bryan, on the tech inspection, they're supposed to look under the car for any leaking fluid. if they don't see them, then I'll keep my mouth shut, but I'm sure someone "smart enough" to do the tech inspections will notice them if they stick their head under the car. Of course at that point, I'm screwed anyway because my PS pump has been leaking since I bought the car and I'm not going to replace it until it completely dies. (not much longer).

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

I'm not to worried. I'm a firm believer that in autoX 90% of one's performance rests in the hands of the driver, not the car. Sure I will be fighting an uphill battle, but to me the benefits both on the street and the race track outweigh the class jump for the parking lot racing hehe.

sinewave

You're kidding, right?

theblue

hehe... i'm already in CSP without them.... still not sure if I want to get these

iwannabmw

iTrader: (3)

I agree. That's why I autocross with the BMW CCA. That way I can still have fun, be competitive with certain people there, and transfer what I learn to the track. I don't have to worry about the stupid rules. I set up the car the way I want and learn to drive it the best I can.

hawkdog

I like it here in STS class. I have more power than anyone else in the class. Heh heh. And the looks on the competitors faces when my family car puts down a time faster than 90% of the vettes there is sooo sweet.

Matt93SE

iTrader: (44)

I agree with the fact you're still racing a clock and for fun.. there's a few people out there that would scream that they have to race modded vettes and stuff though, instead of the riced out civics they're used to smashing on the street.

but again, it's all for fun. if you get stuck in a different class than the other maximas there, you can still compare times and retain the bragging rights.

Bryan H

everytime i have auto-xed
here in kc and dallas the car was never looked under. my old max would have been dropped so fast into prepared it wouldn't have been funny if they did look, the celica wasn't looked under {damn they handle good}
neither was my eclipse.
and these were full on points races.

sinewave

I think you misunderstand me. My point is, why would consider cheating? Just because it is likely that you could get away with it? Where is the pride in winning if you didn't win fairly?

"Character is doing the right thing when no one is watching" - James Watts, Rep. OK.

Matt93SE

iTrader: (44)

Aside from the fact that you could have the slowest car out there and get thrown in with a bunch of race-prepped cars simply because you added subframes.....

otherwise, I agree with you.
A Maxima isn't a supercar- nor was it intended to be. you shouldn't have to compete with them simply because you have subframe connectors. Then again, rules are rules, and if you do a mod to the car, you'd better be prepared to run in the class you're assigned because of the mod(s).

Bryan H

you know, thinking of ALL motor sports. there is set rules, classes and other what nots. right???

alright, now look at it again from this point of view,
the same people keep wining. over and over.

why you ask?
partially driver skill
partially knowing rules
and majority of knowing where to bend them and get away with it
this is where you learn to live, drag racing, scca, open wheel, nascar. drag boats. what ever it is. there is someone always cheating because they know where to do it and how much.


a couple years back, funny car guys were sticking sneakin pete nitrous systems IN roll cages.

i have bended rules in drag racing to further help myself. the trick is not getting caught. if you can master this, DO IT!!!!


needless to say people take this and go to far, and get caught. and the guy who knows that the other got caught sits back and smiles. why? because he knew how far to go

make friends in odd places, you never know when you might need them


when i go to the local track, i get out of car, sign the sheet. they look at the car. put the number on the window, and wave me on.

friends in odd places.

bend the rules to your benefit.

sinewave

Your false suppositions are nothing more than a rationalization for your own bad behavior. I challange you to show me ANY published article of someone cheating at any nationally or internationally sanctioned racing event. IMSA, NHRA, IROC, NASCAR.... you pick it.

When you knowingly place your car in the wrong class you aren't "bending the rules", you are cheating. If a trophy is that important to you, just go buy one; they are about the same cost as your entrance fee. You can have 1st place every time.

Bryan H

oh you big ****ing cry baby
WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
i hear the WHAMBULANCE comming for you

i will bet you, that YOU have bent the rules

there is cheating in every ****ing sport known to man. don't believe me? take a closer look sometime.

not everyone runs the same hp, same suspension mods, same motors. they may look the same but there is not one person that has an identical car to another

apparently you're not analytical enough to notice these things. just put your hood back on and think everything is alright

Matt93SE

iTrader: (44)

there was an article a few months ago in a NASCAR magazine talking about exactly that. All the recent fines from all the teams that were caught cheating last year.
Then they interviewed some of the most and least fined crew chiefs.. one of them flat out said (in more or less words) "If another team has something on their car that's not perfectly legal and may work to our benefit, I'm going to keep my mouth shut about them and use it myself and hope neither of us get caught. if/when we do, then we'll change it and move on. If it helps us, great. if it doesn't, then we'll throw it away and find something else that'll work. In this sport, you have to find every 'competitive edge' you can. if it doesn't specifically say NO in the rulebook or if they don't check for it at tech inspection, then I'll use it."

BEJAY1

iTrader: (19)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Matt93SE
[B]after having the stage I and II installed on the car, I started looking at the Auto X rules, just to see where I'd classify..

guess what? PREPARED!

I tried to warn ya.


Now to post the question about backdating VLSDs...

sinewave

I'm not crying, I'm just trying to be nice and not come out directly and call you a f*cking cheat.

Do whatever you want, but I will bet you that you won't be a regular (much less an SCCA member) at your local autocross. A55holes like you just don't seem to hang around long; you never really fit in to the club racing environment.

dmbmaxima2k2

iTrader: (1)

ifigure with all my mods i'm already gonna be in prepared class, shocks, springs, RSB, FSTB, 18's, catback, intake. so i might try out the SFC's esp since they are pretty affordable, maybe even stage II i want to auto X the car and i dont care where i place right away, i just want to compare my tiems to say a stock maxima and have fun and learn.

Matt93SE

iTrader: (44)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by BEJAY1
[B]
I'm not too concerned about it anyway.. I have yet to make it to the local Auto X, as they're always sunday mornings when I'm busy with other things. When I go, I'll go to play and learn, not to compete (especially since I highly doubt there will be another Max there)...

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

Question: I'm getting my SFCs installed this week or next. Does the car's suspension need to be loaded, aka on a lift of sorts that the cars wheels sit on or on a lift that uses the jackpoints of the car so that the suspension is NOT under load.

Matt93SE

iTrader: (44)

As has been stated dozens of times by WSP and others, the car needs to be on a drive-on lift so that the car is resting on all 4 wheels and NOT stressing the frame other than what's already on it while parked on level ground.

Otherwise, you risk not being able to shut the doors once you weld the SFCs on.. i.e. jack up the front left corner of the car using the factory jack point.. now open and close the driver's door. note how it doesn't line up properly?

If you install the sfcs while the car's frame is stressed, it will be that way permanently.

Maximus1000

Its interesting to note how cars are classified at different. I've visited as many regions as I can to get as much practice as possible. With intake and springs/shocks I've been put into STS in some regions and DSP in others.

As for people cheating........it happens. Some regions just take your word on what you have. I recently saw a newer Cougar with intake, catback, springs/shocks running in G-stock. Was I upset or compelled to tell? No. Why? Because he placed last in his own cheating class. People who feel compelled to cheat usually suck anyway.

Lime

HEHEHEHE...Steve's gunna be a cone-muncher!! Remember, Steve, hitting the cones is bad, and makes your time higher.

dmbmaxima2k2

iTrader: (1)

no more hitting anythnig in the 2k2. just trophies when i win them.

Lime

bwaaaahahaha...ok!