It is too bad that all of this Japanese Luxo market has started. (With Lexus) It would be great if the Q45 was sold here as the Nissan Cima...in the same showroom with a Maxima (Cefiro/I30). There is no such thing as an Infiniti in Japan...everything is sold as a Nissan. I'm sure that Nissan has put so much money into Infiniti that it has sacrificed our Nissan service...cutting their own throats?

But no, here in the US someone who makes 100K+ a year doesn't want to buy or servce a car in the same place as someone else who makes 30K. Maybe it is just our own screwed up society that has caused this. Most people that would buy an Infiniti, Lexus, or Acura would never even consider buying a Nissan, Toyota, or Honda here in the US.

Any opinions?

 

 

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I am not saying that I would prefer an I30 over a Maxima. I am saying that it is likely that Nissan's emphasis on Infiniti service has caused the Nissan service to go down.

 

see, when the us government tried to limit the number of japanese vehicles sold in the US, japanese had to come up with a way to keep their margin of profit while selling 'less' cars.
that's why instead of selling a $25,000 maxima, nissan is selling a $32,000 I30 to make up for that loss of units they could bring here from Japan.
but since now, most japanese car manufacturers have a plant here in the US, i guess it's a different story now.

 

A lot of Toyotas and Nissans are now considered domestic vehicles. But they don't like to advertise their products as such.

 

I have an Infiniti, and I have and would purchase a Nissan again. I think that statement is not very true. They cost more, but not that much more. If Nissan has a cool product that infinti didn't, I know many infiniti owners would consider it. Its the product that sells, as just about everyone knows an infiniti is still Nissan.


As far as the Maxima being more sporty, that’s personal taste. To me, the i30t with side skirts, spoiler, and nice rear light treatment, and 17” wheels looks as, if not more sporty, and more European. Most people would say the European Maxima looks much better, and it’s the same as an i30 here. Everywhere else except the US, the Maxima looks like the I30 with a Nissan grill. The Current US Maxima is 100% California, American in styling. Almost muscle car looking from the front.


For the tropic, you are right. Americans are brand and socially conscious. I know Nissan service Sucks, and that’s one reason I didn’t want to do it again, but their products are great. So infiniti is the answer for the best of both worlds. However, the infiniti are not that much more expensive or exclusive where their owners wouldn’t consider a Nissan. Mercedes, probably so.

If you like Nissan. for only a little more, I think infinit is an attractive buy for the service and the refinement and extra features you get. Still a good value.

 

Actually, an used I30 can be a better value. It depreciates slightly faster, so a 2-3 year-old I30 can be bought for just a bit more than a Max. Unfortunately, 5 speed I30s are very hard to find, but not impossible. In my case, I got the Infiniti not so much for the "upscale" image, but because it has VLSD and it was hard to find a Maxima SE with antilock brakes. I don't care for the posh Infiniti service as I do my own maintenance and troubleshooting.

 

The original rationale for the Infiniti/Acura/Lexus nameplates (Mazda also had a luxury marque in the works - I think it was to be called Pegasus, but I may be wrong) was to permit them to establish new dealership networks. In many parts of the county the Japanese brands had dealers with poor reputations and little money, and it was felt this was already hampering sales, and would make a true luxury brand impossible to sell.

BMW had faced similar problems, as they began importing cars into the US almost 70 years after Mercedes, and many of the original BMW dealers in the early 70s were gas stations and mechanics who sold BMWs on the side. Although there are now many high-end BMW dealers, there are many that still fall short of the standards of a typical Chevy dealer, let alone one selling luxury brands.

 

I understand all of this, but I still believe that haveing a luxury brand for Nissan to foster has caused all of the people that buy Nissans today to suffer with bad service. When you look at the difference in the service you get at an Infiniti I30 vs. Maxima...it is easy to see that they are putting a lot more money and emphasis on their luxury marque. If Nissan would have just revamped and sold and serviced all of their vehicles in one place and called them all Nissans...there would be a lot more loyal customers. But, that takes me back to the reality of my earlier post...most people that buy the high end luxury cars do not want to deal with the 'everyday people' in their way at the dealership.

I still think it would be incredable to actually have the Q45 sold here as the Nissan Cima (like in Japan)!

I think that Mazda's flagship division was going to be called Millennia...then they gave it to one of their sedans anyway.

 

Nissan cannot force the dealers to revamp their sales and service operations - that's up to the dealers. A Cima in a Nissan dealership would likely suffer the fate that befell the Mazda 929 (which was bigger than A Q45 - more in line with a Mercedes S-class) - Who wants to buy a true high-end luxury car from a dealership that's not known for having a favorable sales and service reputation?

 

My understanding of the second channel brands is that they are the purely the results of demographics. The baby boomers were starting to enter their peak earning years and Honda, Toyota and Nissan wanted them to continue buying more expensive cars out of their own lines, instead of them moving over to European brands. Why not get someone who was driving a Cressida, and get them into a Lexus as their income raises? There's been good and bad points to all of this. I think the worst has happened to the Maxima, as it has been decontented to distance itself from the I30. When was the last time you could get a Max that had fuzzy trim on the A, B, and C-pillars? That had trunk trim standard? When an SE had the moonroof, bose stereo and power seats standard? But I think things are starting to turn around for Nissan/Infiniti. The upcoming Infiniti's have a more consistent look to them and a more of a defined character.

 

An I30 does not depreciate faster, maybe more, because the original price was more, but its fairly close and in many cases slightly slower then its Maxima counter part as far as average depreciation.

 

I agree.. it's almost as if they're trying to take things out of the Max just to have some differences between the i30 & Max.

Give me a Max body with some of the interior options on the i30, and it would have been all good! I mean things like the electrochromatic mirror, nice frame covers, trunk lid trim, and side airbags should just have been standard on the flagship of the Nissan line.

[Edited by xydavid on 01-16-2001 at 05:37 AM]

 

luxury division was to be called Amati but they felt they could produce a better product at a better price if they left out the expensive badging and showrooms, I guess, they should have stuck w/Amati since the only car from that line the Millenia will be getting the ax. Does anyone know if or when more of the "upscale" features of the Luxury divisions i.e. Navigation Systems, HID lamps, etc will start to filter down to the regular divisions surely some of the luxury items are getting cheaper to produce. I'd love to get a Nav system w/the max and not go the aftermarket route.

 

Speaking of navigation systems, anyone happen to catch a glimpse of the one in the Alpha Truck concept? If you missed it go to Carpoint's coverage of the Detroit auto show and check out their media clip for the Z.