Well, i was watching phmors ECU video and noticed he left his adjustment screw turned COUNTER-CLOCK wise when he was done resetting it. It struck me as odd because i always left it at Clock-wise when finished resetting. I went out, cleared the ecu of codes, and left it in CCW, and the car wouldnt start. it cracked but no engine start. Then i smelled something funny...

I went to put it back how I normally did it, Clock wise, after another ECU reset, and the fcker starts but dies right away now! I pulled codes 1402 . I searched and its the damn immobilizer. Im pissed...car was running fine 30 min ago.



Im going to try my spare key...hopefully its not the car unit itself.

Does anyone know if 99's ECU are diff. in the adjustment screw? leave it at CCW or Clock wise after a reset?

 

idle speed huh?

I dont know why its just dying now. I set it back to normal like i always had it.




Cant be immobilizer...the starter works but it wont crank in the CCW position. In the CW position, it starts but dies right away now.

 

Always turn the screw fully to the left, CCW...

 

Its just weird cuz it always ran on CW...


Anyways, I get 1401 and 1402...
HOw much is this immobilizer going to cost me? Im broke and i need to drive to school. God damnit nissan...god damn

 

What do you mean? The immobilizer has nothing to do with the starter.

Is the security light on with the key in the ON or start positions? If so, immobilizer.

No way to bypass it, that's the entire point of NATS.

You'll need a tow to the dealer, assuming you're not in lock mode.

 

isnt there a reset procedure? I dont understand how a key can erase its data just like that.


What if i am in lock mode?

 

Yes, there is a 'reset' procedure. That's why you tow your car to the dealer, so they can do the reprogram. Yes, you can do it yourself, you just need to spend a little money, say, $5k on a CONSULT-II.

The key itself doesn't lose any data, it's a read-only chip. The NATS IMMU loses the programming for the key. Why? '99s just fail

If you're in lock mode, then you clear lock mode.

 

Yes, the red light is on...


I tried that procedure with both keys, didnt work. Im screwed. How much $$$ am i looking at here?




Is there anyway to disable nats and wire the fuel pump to something else?

 

Can i just take them my ECU...? This is going to hurt me bad.

 

Again, you can't disable NATS. That is the ENTIRE point of the system, to prevent the car from starting.

Price, who knows. That depends on their hourly labor charge and how many hours they charge for doing it. You need to call them to find out.

And no, the fuel pump is irrelevant. NATS kills the injectors. Unless you can find a way to control all of the injectors properly, you're out of luck.

No. Well, yes, if you also bring the NATS IMMU, NATS antenna amp, the keys, the ignition switch, and rig up a wiring harness to power them all. Otherwise, no.

 

thanks phmor, sorry to be a so helpless, im just panicking because of school and all.


Anyways, i called the local nissan 5 miles away and they said they can do it...but they wont give me a price quote until tomorrow.

Do non-nissan mechanics also carry consult II devices? maybe they're cheaper..

 

Not many that I've seen. They're supposed to be Nissan only diagnostic devices, it's not often other people manage to get a hold of them.

 

Meh, some people on the org have them. I just wish they lived near me.

 

A personal CONSULT-II? Highly unlikely.

Sure you're not referring to Conzult or similar?

 

I think DJ420 has one. I was searching through threads.

http://forums.maxima.org/6308330-post17.html

 

awkward and tiny ECU screw on 99 = buy a scanner

 

I can turn the screw fine. Its a philips head. Not the problem here.





So can someone explain why the ecu suddenly "loses" its programing to the NATS/Keys? I dont understand why it isnt programmed into a non-erasable format unless its to force us to give nissan money. Why would it immobilize in the first place if the correct key is being used? A simple 24/hour lock mode would suffice the anti theft purpose of the system.

****s ridiculous.

 

If its in Lock mode, there's no way a Lock smith who programs keys can help me out right?

 

If it's in lock mode, refer to post #7. Didn't you just wire in a VAFC? Seems like a pretty suspicious variable . . .

 

Any advice what/how to talk to the tech? I know they're going to try and play me for a fool by over charging me for a 15 min job.


Tried that. Failed.

VAFC2 has been wired for over 2 months.

 

I'd just call a couple dealers and get quotes - it should be a fixed rate, usually somewhere between $75-100. From what I've read, if its happened a few times, they'll try to sell you a new ECU.

 

I went to one near my school and he gave me the 105$ for diagnosis bull**** so i told him, why are you going to diagnoss it if i already told you the problem? He was like, okay fine, ill program the keys for you but it will be 52$.

Its not the keys though, its the ECM. Is there a different procedure for programming the keys into the ECU rather than the ECU to the keys?

 

What do you mean? Those mean the same thing.

And generally it's the NATS IMMU that loses the programming, not the ECU itself.

 

Why does it lose its programming though? This is what i cant understand. Does it erase it due to the IMMU "thinking" someones stealing the car?

I want to know what causes it so i dont do it again in the future when clearing my codes.

 

It seems to happen at random, there's no precise activity that can be attributed to every or even most cases.

 

Im assuming there's no TSB or recall for it? Bunch of bull man.

The service manager had the nerve to tell me He's never seen a case of the immobilizer losing its programming in the 6 years he's worked there. I told him to not bull**** me because i have tons of first hand accounts who state other wise.

 

55$ Seems to be a flat rate at nissan.

I asked how much it would be, he said 105$ for diagnosis. I said, "I dont need a diag. i already told you the problem, so how much to reset the ECM, because the keys are not at fault seeing how the spare didnt work. "

"well, i dont know, either from 50-100$"

I knew he was bull****ting because they dont even have a price for resetting the ECM, its just by ear. I told him the nissan in gardena quoted me 52$ and while he was doing paper work he put 55$ "estimate".

He told me to sit down, so i went out to my car and sat in it, waiting for the tech. Tech comes in with consult-II and plugs it in. Didn't even know how to work it, he had to try 5 times to get it in sync with the car. Once sync'd he tried bull****ing me how these things rarely happen and when they do, they need a ECU replacement. I laughed and said the ECU is fine, and he continued to convince me its usually a dead ecu. I told him to simply reset the ECM, he did, and both keys worked without any programing.

His Labor description was "Found security key lost memory, Found ECU chain of Command code, Recoded System, Customer declined Diag. of concern. no warranty on reset."

I refuse to believe he recoded the keys themselves because only one key was in the ignition, and when he turned off the car to try the other spare key, it worked. Is it possible to reprogram the keys that fast? He didnt even push anything on the Consult, after he restarted the ECM. I was looking over his shoulder the entire time reading the screen.


They still charged me the 55$ even though "MY" (or the maxima.orgs) diagnosis was right. They gave me no warranty since i declined the diagnosis for 105$. He also had the nerve to sell me a car wash...

Anyways, im happy my car works again but they'll be hearing from me for the bull they try to force on me.

 

I've never had a dealership car wash... was it any better than your average wash?

 

As I've said multiple times, the keys are read only. Of course he didn't 'recode' the keys, you can't.

What do you mean 'restarted the ECM'? If you were all up on him while he was doing his job (which is extremely annoying, by the way), then what exactly did he do with the CONSULT?

Is your spare a clone of the original, or is it the second key from Nissan?

 

I really don't care if it was annoying. I was there to make sure he did all I asked and not give me some bull on how I need a new ECU, which he was trying to do. Saying its "what usually happens when the system goes off"...after telling me he's rarely seen the NATS system randomly fail when i asked how often it happens.

The key is a clone. Two exact same keys.


He didnt do much really, he pushed a couple menu buttons, turned the key, and it worked. He turned off the car, tried the other key, it worked. All he seemed to have done was "unlock" the car. There wasn't any waiting time of the device loading to reset the ECU/ECM, whatever. It was quick as soon as he got it synced.

Don't you think it would take a while to reset something? instead of just unlocking it?

 

If it is indeed a cloned key, why would you think he'd need to program in both? A cloned key has an identical transponder signal, hence 'clone'.

No, it doesn't have to 'take a while'.

 

Well, for 10 minutes of service I still feel extorted. If you think its fine, so be it. But im not satisfied by the way they treat customers trying to fool us into buying **** we dont need. And by telling me it "rarely" happens with the NATS system is insulting.

Unfair business practices. Period.

 

your "what"?

 

A CKPS issue will not keep the engine from cranking.

Your post is irrelevant to this thread anyway, as the OP's issue was not with cranking.

 

I'm having the SAME issue.

My Maxima dropped it's programming to both my keys (I have a chip in my keys). Looks like only the Nissan dealer and a lock smith can get this fixed or tell me if my ECU somehow died. All of the Nissan dealers I've called are closed today...wtf? Either that or they just don't answer their phones. The locksmiths I've called wanted like $200 to do this. Is that good?

Basically...the car just cranks and cranks. The other night when I got home and was closing my windows (all four at the same time), my navigation rebooted and the interior lights flashed (car stayed running though). The following morning, my car would not start. A couple of days before that, my security light was on while driving. So anyway, I got a new battery and alternator and put those in yesterday (battery was more preventive maintenance and alternator was the likely cause the other night). Before I put them in, I tried cranking the car to see if I could get into the garage. It started 3 times, but each time it only ran for a second or two before stalling. After that, it just cranked and cranked...so I went ahead and swapped the parts. Now, it also just cranks and cranks.

My brother-in-law told me to spray starter fluid inside my intake manifold while cranking and if the car starts it means either my ECU is toast or my keys need to be reprogrammed. I did that and the car did start, but again, stalled.

My fuel pump is priming, all of my fuses are good. My fuel filter is relatively new. ALL of the electronics in my car are operating normally.

Is it definitely my NATS/Immobilizer?

 

what was the point of that? If my car wouldn't start and I sprayed starter fluid in the intake it also would start and then stall when the fluid burned up. Of course I don't have chipped keys, my ECU is fine and it was just bad grounds. What your bro told you is irrelevant...
If your security light is solid when the key is turned to on or acc, I think, then yes,

 

It turns on about a second after being in ACC or ON and stays solid.

Is that a tell-tale sign that my memory got wiped? Or is it supposed to turn solid immediately when the key is in ACC or ON?

I just tried the 'unlock' procedure above...and I managed to get my car to start once (it died obviously). Now, when I crank...I don't 'feel' the engine cranking if that makes sense. I hear the starter trying, but don't feel the engine.

Now what?

 

yep, wiped. Same happened to GFs 99. Drove the car, went inside for 10 minutes, came back out and it was wiped. Solid red light and had to have it towed and reprogrammed...

 

From what I understand, if it doesnt start once, A.K.A turns on and turns off right away, and your try to turn it on again 2 more times, the car enters LOCK MODE....which can only be unlocked by the dealer.

If your security light is on, your in lock mode. And according to pmhor, the Keys dont lose their memory, the NATS system clears itself when in lock mode to prevent "theft".


Go to your dealer, tell them you want the car unlocked out of Lock Mode because your NATS system malfunction. When they say its 105$ for diagnosis, tell them, "No, i dont need a diagnosis, i already told you the problem, just unlock it (and reprogram the NATS master code)". Tell them another dealership your talked to on your way home from work quoted your 52$.

It should take them less than 10 minutes to do it. Only reason mine took 10 minutes is because to stupid tech was blindly connecting the Consult-II device to my car cuz he was too fat to squat down and look at the fuse box under the dash. That took him like 5 minutes.

 

So your pretty sure my issue is just this BS NATS thing?

My light only turns on/stays on after I'm in ACC or ON for 2 or 3 seconds.

But what about my starter noise/lack of engine feel? It doesn't seem like the engine itself is turning over...just the starter. This happened after I tried starting it again today.