Redmax

iTrader: (20)

Can they be used with the stock ecu?

DA-MAX

iTrader: (10)

nope, won't work

Redmax

iTrader: (20)

So then how can i get my car to recognize the extra air coming through? I know the question has probably been answered many times before, but at what pressure does the stock maf stop reading air? Imean at how much boost or HP?

DA-MAX

iTrader: (10)

everyone else is saying Emanage will allow for this...how I don't know, I don't follow the Emanage mail list to closely anymore...sx7r might know

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

According to JWT, the A32 maf is good for 350 bhp. That is, it can measure up to a flowrate that can accomodate 350 bhp, if you are going with a flowrate based fuel control system.

If you are doing what most people do and go with a boost pressure referenced system (i.e. fmu) then the question is moot. With an fmu you use the maf only for NA operation and provide extra fuel when boosting by increasing the fuel pressure. In such cases the maf is maxed out, or pretty close to it.

A Z32 maf can measure flowrate good for 420 bhp. Z32 owners making more than that who want to keep a flowrate based system do things like split the intake air into two paths with two filters, and a maf in one tract and a dummy maf in the other. So they are measuring half the flowrate, and their ecu is programmed to double that number when calculating injector pulse width.

stephenlc

iTrader: (1)

Can't you get rid of the need for a MAF sensor totally with E-manage and you can also change MAF with the e-manage.??? I thought I was reading about that.

ivelweyz

The z32 MAF is good for 500HP. They had this in SCC, they put it in a s13 drift car. It was between the cobra MAF, 350hp and the 300zx maf. REDMAX please reduce your sig pic. It's too damn big and if there was something good to look at it would be fine, but...

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

Which issue of SCC was that - I'd like to read it.

ivelweyz

Are you really interested or are you calling BS on what I said? The issue is in my car, I'll get it if you want. It's from earlier this year...

ivelweyz

OK here you go, june 2003 issue, page 218 and I quote
"The stock airflow meter(sr20) is only capable of 280 flywheel hp before it reaches its maximum voltage. JIM WOLF TECHNOLOGY can substitute either a FORD MUSTAN COBRA meter for up to 350hp, or a 300ZX meter for more than 500hp."...

[maxi-overdose]

iTrader: (3)

chill out man.....Stephen is a really cool guy

and very technical too.....he just needs to know where you get that information....nothing personal.

slimer

iTrader: (13)

i still have the article too

ivelweyz

I have nothing but respect for him and I know he's cool/smart. I've been through a lot of *****ing lately by the nOObs it got under the skin a bit...

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

No, I believe you, I am genuinely interested in what they did and how they tested it.

The 420 bhp number was quoted to me by JWT, but that may be based on 370 cc/min injectors maxed out at a 100% duty cycle, and not a cfm limit imposed by the Z32 maf. That's what I'm trying to figure out.

DA-MAX

iTrader: (10)

well they are using flywheel measurements in that quote so it would technically be possible for ~500 flywheel on the Z MAF, but I doubt much over at all...especially with only 370s

MardiGrasMax

iTrader: (14)

Im looking for ~ 540bhp off the Z-MAF, JWT ECU, 516cc injectors, 95%duty cycle, .60bsfc. But i guess 500bhp would be ok too its been 15 weeks now waiting on JWT, they have a problem with the large injector cold start up porgram, it runs like crap till it warms up. According to JWT only two others have the 555cc program and they both have the same problem, thanks to Loren and Ferhan (I think) for working this out.

stephenlc

iTrader: (1)

What car has 516cc injectors? Is this on the 3.5 swap. Are you keeping the 3.0 block and throwing some of the internals from the 3.5 in your engine?

MardiGrasMax

iTrader: (14)

BTW, Z-maf can meter 520bhp MAX according to Ben.

MardiGrasMax

iTrader: (14)

I bought them off e-bay JDM, they are were advertised as 550cc, but when JWT flowed them for me they only flowed 516cc at 43.5psi (3bar). They are a new injector design with a better spray pattern than the 555cc injectors. The 4th gen plug wont fit them but the 3.5L plug will with a little modification.

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

Huh. It was Ben that gave me the 420 hp number. He must have been talking about maxed out 370 cc/min injectors, not the maf. Or maybe he did say 520 and I heard 420. Or he said 420 and meant 520.

Anyway, that makes more sense, since I dyno'd last week at 285 hp and the safc said that the maf flow was at about 55%. 285/.55 = 518 hp, so there ya go.

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

Ooops. Except that 285 was fwhp and the 520 number is power at the flywheel, no doubt.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

You're planning on running more then 3bar of fuel pressure then, right?

At 3bar:
516/10.5*0.95/0.60*6=~467bhp

For 540bhp, you'd need:
540*0.60/6/0.95*10.5=~597cc

So, to get 597cc from injectors that flow 516cc@3bar, you'd need:
(597/516)^2*43.5=~59.2psi

You're going to have to run a boost reference setup w/JWT ECU to supply the necessary fuel, since the JWT ECU "cold start up" program definitely couldn't handle the larger injectors when running at 60psi fuel pressure.

MardiGrasMax

iTrader: (14)

DURRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Dumba** the factory FPR is 1:1

nismology

iTrader: (8)

Why doesn't someone just come up with a MAP conversion kit and be done with it??

DA-MAX

iTrader: (10)

there are...many of the high end standalones like Haltech and I think TecII switch to MAP setups....but truthfully though there no point since most of the boosted Maximas here are only making power well in the operating range of the Z32 MAF(450-500hp).

desertmaxima

iTrader: (5)

Oh darn 500hp so what am I gonna do when I start my engine buildup on my maxima cause with all the stuff I have im looking at probably 600hp. How about a Q45 MAF. Cause im not even gonna mess with standalone. Well maybe I can try something with the greddy.

DA-MAX

iTrader: (10)

IMO shoot for 450-500hp...cause you'll probably be disapointed when you don't hit 600(cause I doubt you will)

desertmaxima

iTrader: (5)

I think I can with this motor and internals I just bought from on_alert. Seeing that it is arias 9:1 pistons and eagle rods, just gotta do some balancing of the parts and address the fuel system and some right tuning im sure I can pump about 20psi into the motor and get 600 out of it. Shoot if Hal can get his 500hp out of what he is running with a stock block im sure a built motor can pump more out. We will see

MardiGrasMax

iTrader: (14)

boost + juice

desertmaxima

iTrader: (5)

Yea since im gonna be in Iraq longer now I can go ahead and get a wet setup when I get home and sell the dry thats on it now then just use that when I finish the motor. And thank uncle sam for keeping me in the army just that much longer so now I can finish the motor sooner than I thought yes I just love this place

slimer

iTrader: (13)

so how do you get online there. i mean, i dont mean to go ot on the z32 maf thread, but where do you go to post?

when you get home from iraq, your max will be soooooo fast.

steve

Redmax

iTrader: (20)

well the issue for me is that since i have a 99 I can not go witht the jwt setup which will allow for the z32 maf. So i will need something to meter the amount of air that the turbo is putting out. the way it is done with the emanage is through using a map signal which will be better used for our cars. I am trying to use the things that i currently have(safcII) without having to go out and buy the emanage.


Oh and Ively wise Kiss my a s s!!!

DA-MAX

iTrader: (10)

IMO and the concensus you'll find around the net...if you're going for big power you can pretty much toss the AFC idea...it'll only go so far "safely"...you better start reading up on Emanage cause that looks like your only option.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Man...what a d!ck(like usual).

Hmmmmnnn...didn't know that, since I posted about the Holley 1:1 FPR and someone else posted about the Aeromotive 1:1 FPR without anyone mentioning it.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

That's what I *THINK* Mardi is saying and if you check my NEW thread, I posted a website that agrees.

Sounds like we're the ONLY two "dumbass" that don't know that.

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

Dang! I tried to delete my post before anybody quoted it, but it was too late. I just talked to Ben at JWT, he said the oem fpr does indeed respond to boost, too.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Don't you see that on your Fuel Pressure gauge under boost?

You should see it rise from 43.5psi-->~54+psi at redline, right?

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

You know, I don't think I have ever checked because I'm too busy looking at EGT and boost gauges while trying to keep one eye on the tach and a third eye on the road ahead, all the while with my fuel injector duty cycle meter trying to distract me with all the green and amber LEDs. I just assumed the fuel pressure stayed at 43 psi. I'm going to have to take a copilot along to read the fuel pressure gauge.

Of course, it is an easy matter to just connect the fpr to the pressure side of a Mityvac. I'll do that tonight.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Buwahahahaha....too much fun.

Good idea on the Mityvac.

Also, do you have a MM that measures duty cycle? If so, I'd like to see if you can verify your DC meter is measuring the same thing.

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

No, I don't. The only benchmark I have is that the most I've seen is 80% from the DC meter, which corresponds pretty well with the 286 fwhp I got from the dyno run. The injectors are good for 420 bhp at 100% DC assuming a BSFC of .5, so at 80% duty cycle they're good for ~340 bhp. Converting bhp to fwhp: 340*.83 = 282 fwhp.

Back when I had the 240 cc/min injectors and A32 maf I saw the duty cycle go up to 90-100%, which is consistent with the air flow going above what the maf could handle.