I didnt know it was "fully functional" ?? (besides the rev limiter)...Im really not conserned about that, I really just want a good tune

-matt

 

There are a few things that still don't work or more like haven't been proven to work, however NOTHING crucial for FI guys.

You can retard timing, adjust fuel via MAF or directly via injector pulsewidth, and control bigger injectors, which is about all you need right? What else are you needing/wanting?

The logging and WB02 tuning alone would make me buy it again, however being NA, I'd really like to be able to advance timing, which may still be possible to a point even without the VQ30 crank sensor update.

 

Ill need the:

1) Emanage Ultimate Unit
2) Harness ?
3) Support Tool ?

Anything else I will need ?

I was looking here http://www.mohdparts.com/emanage/ind...-MANAGE%20blue ..$499, harness $89, and support tool I guess is just the USB cable?

What are those Diods I saw you and Dandymax install in your ECU ?? Did you get those at Radio shack and how hard are they to install ??

-matt

 

Damn...the one I just saw on the 350Z board sold for $450 including harness. There is another for $500 including the harness though, so maybe you can talk him down to $450. If not, it's still a good deal, since I paid $560 for mine.

The support tool is included with the unit, however you'll need to steal a USB 2.0 cable from your computer or buy one for like $7-$8 at Wally-World. You'll also need the $20 E01 pressure sensor harness to link your WB02.

Since you're SC'd and your boost is linear with RPM, I wouldn't buy the pressure sensor/harness unless you want it for just logging to make sure you're getting all your boost.

 

As for the diodes, yes you can get those at RadioShack, however you may not need them. See if you get the code, first.

 

Dont buy the pressure sensor just like he said unless you want to monitor that. Not needed with the SCer IMO. If you had a turbo, the Greddy E-01 EBC comes w/ the pressure sensor. If you have a Zetronix Id get it to be used to monitor your boost. Basically a boost gauge.

Jaime

 

Well wont I need the pressure sensor to link my WB02 ??

ICE "You'll also need the $20 E01 pressure sensor harness to link your WB02"

-matt

 

No, you just use the harness. Look on Mohads site and you'll see.

 

I PMed you !


-matt

 

Sharrif from my350Z.com said " With your new larger MAF, you dont need the pressure sensor. But even on a SC'ed car with linear boost response, you still need a pressure reference that is accurate all the way to redline. The SC will max out the stock MAF sensor, but it will occur closer to redline...depending on the boost and pulley you are running."

Now do I need the pressure sensor and harness when I order the Emange ?

-matt

 

Why not use the Z32 MAF? Problem solved.

 

You rang!

Glad you got it fugured out! Enjoy the ride!

 

You don't NEED the pressure sensor, however it seems to make tuning/setup much easier.

Instead of guesstimating what 1psi, 2psi, 3psi, etc. is in MAF voltages, you can setup your fuel/timing maps for vaccum/boost.

IMO, you can get away without it, however if you have the extra $100 or so, it would make your life easier tuning.

 

So Ice, say you have a Z32 MAF based JWT ECU with a Emanage piggy back. You run the Z32 MAF out of its voltage range How do you cross over from the MAFv to the pressure sensor. I would guess that if at 19psi boost you roll off the MAF then at 20psi youd want to add injector duty cycle on the EM pressure sensor MAP. at that point. I woudl assume you could use the duty cycle increase from 18-19 psi as an example of what the 20psi duty cycle should be. This has allways intimidated/confused me abit. I would not want to screw this up and lean out a 20psi.

 

I'm not sure Mardi...you need to talk with others on the 350Z board about how they have done this.

IMO, you can't add fuel beyond the MAF limits, since the BLUE Emanage only adds fuel via MAF conditioning, ie increases MAF voltage further to add fuel. Therefore, once you've hit 5.x volts, the emanage can't add anymore fuel.

So, the only bandaids I can think of for more headroom(All will require serious retuning) so the correction lowers the MAF voltage and then add it back via the fuel map are larger injectors, hacked MAF, raising fuel pressure, running a dual airfilter setup with dummy MAF, or having JWT burn you an EPROM for a Cobra MAF.

 

So what have the few whou run A32 MAFs on boosted set ups done. For sure they pass the max flow of the A32 MAF.

 

FMU or they run way bigger injectors then then need so they are pulling MAF voltage to give more headroom(bandaid), I guess.

 

Mardi: another option is eliminating the MAF altogether and running off the MAP. The EU can do this.

Ice: are you back in the game with the EU yet? Now that my car's in storage I can't do anymore testing until April or so ... if Greddy ever gets the fix done in the meantime someone in a warmer climate could test it...

Also, are you sure you could retard and advance timing already without the crank input? Using coil inputs it didn't seem to work for me, either retard or advance. I'm starting to wonder if I've got a defective unit...

 

He knows...I've been trying to convert him in other threads.

Hopefully soon...I'm looking for a laptop. If they come out with a new firmware, I'll beg/borrow/steal one if I have too.

No, however it "should" be able to retard timing the same as the blue emanage.

 

Haha ok I'll leave the "converting of Mardi" to you then. lol

But it's starting to bother me, this timing thing. DOes it not work without the crank input? Or is it possible my EU has been defective all along? It would not retard for me using coil inputs... I may not have tried using the tach input, can't remember.

If/when you get a laptop let me know, I'd like you to try a different hookup that Greddy instructed me to use. But it didn't work for me. Yet another reason why I'm starting to wonder if my EU is defective. Wouldn't that be something.

Also, from what they're saying so far it won't be just a firmware but a hardware upgrade required.

 

No, don't leave it to just me...he needs all the convincing he can get. I'd really like to see how far he could push the envelope with the EU.

I believe the blue emanage used the tach output from the ECU for ignition timing, so I'd assume the EU could do the same. I don't trust the ignition pulse "learning" of the EU, since it seems to always be in learn mode. I wouldn't start thinking your EU is defective, the ignition retard could very well not work. However, from the manuals and how similar the blue/EU ignition circuits are, I don't see why they wouldn't unless the EU firmware is the problem. How did you test/verify the ignition timing changes?

I don't like the sound of a hardware upgrade~!

 

Well here's the thing. Greddy asked me to try this latest setup (using crank inputs), and they said it was working on their DET in terms of picking up the signals but they had problems with the car stalling, perhaps because of the coil driver circuits or the crank signal processing, I'm not sure. To rectify the problem they said they were developing an add-on module that would need to be put on the EU board (ie a hardware upgrade, not just firmware).

But when I tried their setup instructions on my car it didn't seem to work, I couldn't see rpms and timing properly and my car didn't stall. So that more than anything has got me wondering about whether my unit is working properly, as this was using crank signals, not coils, and I still didn't get the same result they did.

In the past testing ignition advance or retard (using coil inputs) I could easily verify with a Consult port scanner. Now I wish I'd tried the tach, but I'm not sure what would be so different if the coil input worked fine to determine rpms and set fuel tables etc.

What is this learning mode you refer to? I didn't know there was such a mode.. unless you just mean that the EU has to calculate the rpm based on the time between firings rather than simply reading the voltage level off the tach wire..

 

What was the crank input setup?

What timing values does your Consult port scanner show, base timing(15-25degrees) or dynamic advance(15-40+degrees)?

Yes, the slow flashing of the Interaction LED both you and I have when using the ignition inputs. Manual calls it "confirming engine rpm".

 

Ice they wanted me to use both crank sensors and ditch the cam.

The Consult scanner reads real-time total timing (ie base plus whatever).

As for the LED, all it says in the manual is a slow flash "when confirming engine rpm". It doesn't say it should only do that for the coil inputs. I just kind of figured it would flash using the tach and crank methods too, as long as it was picking up the rpms properly. In other words, I never thought of it as a learning mode per se, just simply a blink to let you know it was receiving the signal properly, whether via coils, tach, or crank.

Have you seen it blink using the tach input?

 

POS to C#33 and REF to C#39? Any jumpers need changed?

Did you log some 3rd gear open-loop runs before/after? How much of a change did you put in the maps? Retard or advance?

Probably true...I just figured it wasn't "normal" or should quit after awhile instead of always flashing.

I don't believe so, but it might have been the crank hookup. I tried a few combinations/crank types, so I'm not sure.

 

You can add fuel after you max out the MAF using MAP with emanage blue. I have two ways of adding fuel that I use, the throttle position table, and MAP.

 

You must be reducing the MAF voltage via Injector size change setting or something else then and then adding it back in your MAP table.

Once the MAF hits 5.x volts, the injectors are at 100% duty cycle. Once that happens no more fuel no matter if you add more voltage, duty cycle, or pulsewidth.

I forgot about the Sub Injector Map, so Mardi can add aux injectors to get more fuel.

 

You can also add fuel on the blue via the "Additional Injection Map." It can lengthen injector pulsewidth, but not shorten it.

 

I am using the sub injector map because I have two additional injectors, but like chief brody said the exact same thing can be done with the additional injector map. Just because your maf is maxed out doesn't mean your injectors are maxed out. If I had 1000cc injectors and a z32 maf, the maf would max out long before my 1000cc injectors maxed out. Maxed out maf just means that you can't add any more fuel based on maf voltage, because the maf voltage won't go any higher. But if you are controlling the injectors via MAP you can add more.

 

Up until the MAF hit's 100%, but once it does, the injectors are at 100% duty cycle, so increasing the pulsewidth won't work anymore.

 

If your MAF voltage is peaked, your injectors no matter what size will be open 100% of the time and therefore can't be opened any longer.

 

Then what is the point of the additional injector table being MAP based and not MAF based?

 

I thought the MAP could be used on any table?

 

Sorry, I assumed that larger injectors were being run with the correction factor lowering the MAP voltage the appropriate amount.

 

Every one except the Airflow Adjustment table.

This is also directly related to this discussion I think. Guys with the APS TT setup on 350Zs max out their MAF, but they use MAP to provide more fuel after they max out their maf. At least that's what I've been told by a couple APS guys. I haven't researched the unichip at all personally.

 

No, good point...that's exactly what Mardi has to do, ie scale back the MAF voltage say 50%(if possible), and then use the Additional Injection map to add pulsewidth to keep AFRs where he needs.

That should buy him more psi before the MAF is max'd.

 

Try de-selecting the "Pressure Sensor" option under the Parameter Setting drop down.

It shows MAF and MAP on mine for the ADD map.

 

It allows you to choose MAF Voltage on the Additional Injection Table with the pressure sensor option checked and unchecked.

Icy I don't think I'm understanding this correctly. Here's my current setup. I have 6 370cc injectors, and two extra 750cc injectors. I use throttle position on my Airflow Adjustment map, and I use Relative Pressure (kPa) on my Sub Injector map. I max out my 370s at about 5000rpm at 12psi, with the Airflow Adjustment map set to its highest values, +50% across the board at Wide Open Throttle.

Also, I am hitting 4.9x volts on the Z32 maf on just 12psi at like 5000rpm. Are you saying that when I get my new setup in, which is going to be just Deatschwerks 650s, and no extra injectors (unlike what I have now) that even though I'm not even using MAF voltage for any of my adjustments, I am still not going to be able to add any fuel once my MAF hits 5.1V (or whatever the maximum MAF voltage is?) Regardless of the fact that I'm not even using the MAF voltage to add additional fuel? Because if that's the case then I have to start looking for a larger MAF if I want to start pushing 14, 16, 18psi next spring, without having these additional two injectors anymore.

 

not sure if I'm reaidng corectly into your question....but with properly sized injectors your MAF voltage should drop into the high 3's low 4s. I know after installing the 590s in Redmax's car along with the Z32 MAF, I never saw MAF voltage over mid 4v during hard acceleration and that was at 14-16 pounds of boost. and this was with a BS table we threw together and put into the AF table, the injector table was 0'd out and timing was pulled 2-4* above 11-12lbs

EDIT: and never broke 3.7v at WOT at 10lbs!!!
http://forums.maxima.org/showpost.ph...8&postcount=20

 

Exactly, when you put in the 650cc injectors and set your Injector Change from 260cc-->370cc = CF ~0.7 to 260cc-->650cc = CF ~0.4, your MAF voltage the stock/JWT ECU sees will be scaled back even further.