COChev

check out this auction on ebay
supercharger

would this work on our older vg30e motors? how much would be involved to install? would it fit under the hood?

subs1000w

yes but im not sure your hood would close

and you proboly need a new lower intake maniphold and maybe throttle body off an exterra and then fiugure out how to run a belt to it but it posible

Cliff Clavin

iTrader: (11)

I don't know about that SC on the VG Max, but I know that would fit beautifully on my 00 Infiniti QX4

I wish I had some money, that would be sweet.

BTW, nice to see another local guy. I am in The Dalles. We got about the same kind of snowfall hereand it's FINALLY starting to melt.

COChev

yeah, we are melting off now too. and i have dug the poor max out and finally got the heater to work. i'm new to the foreign car thing (chevy truck guy) but these look pretty fun, and i'm not big on leaving stuff stock.

Maxima-4DSC

iTrader: (1)

supercharger turbocharger yay !

COChev

Aaaaaah, turbos are for diesels!

shoult

iTrader: (1)

Hmmmm... lets see....

Fab up a completely new intake manifold....

Fab up mounting brackets to line up the pulley from the SC with the pulleys already on the engine...

Find room for an intercooler (you aren't considering running without an intercooler are you?)

Fab up all the piping

install new rising rate fuel pressure regulator

install new larger injectors

Probably have to install some black boxes like a SAFC-II or similar to get the engine to run even close to right during closed loop operation.


Being able to close the hood without a hole or bulge probably won't happen. Always fun to dream though.....

And for the guy with the thumbs down for SC units.... for a daily driver I'll take an SC EVERY day of the week over a turbo. I've run both in town and on the track and a SC is MUCH better daily driver. It does a much better imatation of a V8's low end torque then a turbo. Yes I know you'll get better HP numbers from a turbo at higher rpm. But take a look at a roots or lysolms blowers torque curve, err, flatline. Torque broad and wide as the New Mexico desserts. Torque is what gets you off the line or squirts you out of a corner. HP is what gets you the high speed at the end of the quarter.

davebond007

Haha, since you're a local guy, check out nwmaxima.com. We're going to have a meet sometime soon.

COChev

sounds like a pain in the **** for a super charger. bummer. i'll have to go nitrous

Pervis Anathema

iTrader: (8)

Just bolt on a 350 shot and hit the track... You don't even need to upgrade your fuel system ... stock injectors are good to 634.3hp!

subs1000w

there is NO way to incorporate an intercooler into this type of roots blower considering it bolts onto the lower intake manifold

there is also no extra piping needed. it could even use the stock air box

and as far as high torqe off the line = alot of tire spin which you dont want

Matt93SE

iTrader: (44)

Also consider the fact that it doesn't "just bolt up to the lower intake manifold".. look a tthe bolt pattern on it. nowhere near anything on our VG. you'd have to do a LOT of fabbing to make that thing fit.

subs1000w

i would think you could get the low intake off the nissan suv or truck the blower came off of if its a vg3Xe i would think it would go right on the max vg30e

Matt93SE

iTrader: (44)

You THINK it will..

do you have measurements, dimensions, etc?
VG heads and manifolds don't just bolt onto other VG heads/manifolds. it's more complicated than that.

subs1000w

your right i assumed they were all the same but i dont know

nismobaron

Not true - many 18 wheeler tractor units use superchargers - more & more have gone to turbo power due to cost. Thing with superchargers are they're better suited to 6 & 8 cylinder engines which already have good hp & torque figures - turbos are better suited to smaller 4-pots due to the lower weight & much lower power loss (no drive belt) that good 6's & 8's can easily overcome.

Turbos are more economical for manufacturers to incorporate & easier to package in there car design, hence the preference of them over superchargers. And since the early/mid 80s, manufacturers have ironed out the turbo lag & cooling problems with most factory turbo setups. Plus a good setup will give you a reasonably flat torque curve when turbo has spooled up without the lag problems. Driven a SAAB lately?

Truth is, each has their pro's & con's and it depends if you like the linear torque curve & whine of a sc or the infectious boost that only a turbo can give.

VG with SC would make a cool & different mod - provided you've got somewhere to hang it below the hood.

internetautomar

iTrader: (30)

RWD vehicles usually have the air intake at the front of the motor
FWD vehicles usually have the air intake at the rear of the motor

Big problem!

subs1000w

true but if you look at the picture the throttle body bolts onto the side of the blower it would be in a very similar position to the stock vg

shoult

iTrader: (1)

Anytime you either turbo or SC an engine you should make sure you incorporate an intercooler suited to your use. Your loosing HP and potential hp if you don't.

After looking more closely at this unit I don't see a good way to use it on our Maximas.

Without an IC you're probably right, no extra piping. But also limited potential horsepower growth. Without an IC, and with the compression the VE runs you're probably looking at a maxboost of 6psi, maybe 8 if there are no fueling problems and no track days. You might get away with it for drag racing, autocross or street, but running laps on a track is going to melt you some pistons.

Is the only way you know how to launch tp rev to redline and drop the clutch? Come on. You were given an articulated right foot, a brain and a but dyno for a reason! MODULATE! Top Fuel drivers have learned to do it, you can to.

In road racing smooth, consistant application of power is more prized over peaky HP. Listen to F1 drivers talk about the power of the engines. They speak in terms of good engines being more "drivable" meaning the torque band is wider allowing greater choice of shifts.

On the streets, when you decide to pass that car in front of you you come to love the INSTANT on power of an SC powered car rather then ANY lag of even a well enginered turbo.

I've driven many turbos over the last 20 years. They have gotten better, but there is NO comparison in torque curves. Even the Audi TT has perceptible lag. Not bad, but very perceptible.

shoult

iTrader: (1)

Actually it looks like the throttle body is PART of the unit. That's a throttle butterfly in the lower picture on the left.

And I just reread the ebay sale saying it was a Eaton M62. It looks like the 3rd gen M62 with the incorporated ABV. The M62 really seems to be farly small for a 3 liter engine. That's probably why Nissan has such limited gains on their Hardbody SC truck.

90SEBlack

Originally Posted by subs1000w
there is NO way to incorporate an intercooler into this type of roots blower considering it bolts onto the lower intake manifold
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Anytime you either turbo or SC an engine you should make sure you incorporate an intercooler suited to your use. Your loosing HP and potential hp if you don't.

After looking more closely at this unit I don't see a good way to use it on our Maximas.

Quote:
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there is also no extra piping needed. it could even use the stock air box

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Without an IC you're probably right, no extra piping. But also limited potential horsepower growth. Without an IC, and with the compression the VE runs you're probably looking at a maxboost of 6psi, maybe 8 if there are no fueling problems and no track days. You might get away with it for drag racing, autocross or street, but running laps on a track is going to melt you some pistons.










Im confused with what ur saying shoult , Iv never seen an IC on a supercharged engine, im sure its possible but the gains would be very minimal unless ur spraying CO2 on the intercooler. And this supercharger were talkin about is for the VG not VE

mtcookson

iTrader: (2)

wouldn't that little butterfly valve be the recirculation valve thingy that limits boost and whatnot?

you can use an ic on supercharged engines. even with the eaton style. you either have to put the ic right below the supercharger or you can mount the supercharger away from the engine and run piping from it. like this one:

90SEBlack

Ya but the reason for the IC is to cool the air coming off those 2 Turbos that are right above the SC , On just a SC application the use of an IC i think would be pointless unless u are spraying , Am I wrong correct me if i am

shoult

iTrader: (1)

It really doesn't matter whether the SC is for a VG, VE, VQ or a school bus. The principals are the same. Look at my SIG. You'll see one of my cars is producing 207 RWHP (Dynojet 248) out of a 1.6L (100 cubic inches) supercharged engine.

Any time you compress air, it gets heated. So whether you are using a turbo or a supercharger to compress the air your adding heat to the intake charge. The more you compress it (or the higher the boost), the hotter it becomes. The hotter the intake the closer you are to causing detonation (blowing holes in the tops of pistons or bending rods) or just running to hot (melting pistons). A properly designed intercooler reduces the intake charge back down to acceptable levels. I've got tons of experience with turbo and SC engines. Intercoolers ALWAYS make a difference, ALWAYS. A properly cooled intake charge is imperitive to keeping the engine out of detonation or melting pistons.

BTDTGTB&BP

I've gotten a dynoed 18 hp difference betgween an OEM A2A system and a larger custom A2A system. This was the difference between 159 rwhp and 177 rwhp. I can't even imagine how much less no IC would have been.

You can run a vehicle for a long time without an intercooler as long as you keep the boost level low, don't press it to hard, make sure you have no fueling issues (no lean spots EVER) and always use hi octane gas.

But boost is seductive and destructive. If a little makes you go X much faster then alot more will make you go XX much faster. And a little more makes you go XXX faster. Then BOOM!.

With the way this car is layed out a large A2A intercooler in front is impossible with the stock bumper/lip. You might be able to get one in there with a new front bumper/lip. That leaves the use of a nice A2W intercooler. You get to use a very small heat exchanger up front (similar in size and shape to an A/C heat exchanger). Liquid Piping can be 1/2" or so. Then you use an A2W heat exchanger up by the throttle body. You can also use a liquid reseviour located somewhere else if you feel the need for more capacity. With a properly designed A2W IC you can keep the intake charge at abient temps for almost ever or by putting ice in the reseviour you can get it lower then abient for an extended time.

There's alot more to IC design, but those are the basics.

90SEBlack

248hp out of a 1.6 that a hell of alota power coming from that little engine that thing must be built with the best of the best and blueprinted twice to make sure its gunna hold all that power. And wouldnt the supercharger heat the air once it comes into the intake anyway since the air is heated right at the manifold whats the point of puttin an intercooler infront of the SC when its takin in ambient air and trying to cool it with ambient air and its gunna be suckin alota air how effective is the cooling gunna be before it hits the SC.

shoult

iTrader: (1)

207 rwhp (estimated 240 hp flywheel at 15% drive train loss) measured on a Dynojet 248. A torque curve as flat and wide as the Bonneville salt flats...

There is no difference between a SC or a turbo except where they dervie their power from. Turbo is spun by exhaust gases. Supercharger is spun by a belt, normally off the crankshaft. There are no other differences (basically). And again, no matter HOW you compress air, you heat it. The more you compress it the hotter it gets.

You HAVE to get rid of that heat no matter where it came from. There's no arguing whether an IC is effectual on an SC or not. I have dyno proof it does. ANYBODY who has ever had to bypass their IC for one reason or another will tell you the same thing.

mtcookson

iTrader: (2)

you're supposed to use an ic after the supercharger that way it cools the air after it is heated by the compression (that's why the true term for an ic is aftercooler, it cools the air after it is compressed). to do that you would have to mount the s/c somewhere other than right on the intake manifold. to mount it right on the intake manifold and still have an aftercooler you would have to use an air/water aftrcooler that is mounted on the intake right below the supercharger.

MrGone

iTrader: (30)

Talk to me guys....

COChev

(im my best austin powers voise) yeah, baby! does that make you horney?

V8s rock

as long as we're trying to stuff something under a maxima hood, how bout a small block cheby! add a th700r and a 12 bolt rear end. walla, muscle car maxima! LOL!!!!!

Nismo87SE

That SC could be used on a max and it doesn't have to be mounted on the intake manifold. The only thing is that is a M62 eaton SC and it would probably be maxed out around 220-230whp. Where as the bigger M90 model would be the one to get. The SC could be mounted simular to how comptech did it for the V6 accord and CLS, then run a driveshaft to the drive belts.

drakken789

I know this is a little late but Jesus MTCOOKSON,
the pic of that motor is so hot i'm burning my fingers touching the keyboard! (okay i'm done now)

MrGone

iTrader: (30)

I'm more a mopar guy, so I'll take a 318 with a 46RE and a 9.25" trac-lok

but about that supercharger... IIRC, the reason why they dont need IC's is because they produce very little heat right?

mtcookson

iTrader: (2)

lol, could be all the fi it has

now i'm trying to decide what to do since i have it running. i can either build my other engine up to throw in it or i was also thinking of putting my other engine into my old 72 toyota corona mark 2. little rwd sedan with a v6... mmmmm...

(if you're trying to figure out why my post seems out of place its because i thought this was a different thread)

internetautomar

iTrader: (30)

Art carr 200-4r screw that 700 BS or maybe a 4L80E

subs1000w

come on guys you know where the fun is

T56

MrGone

iTrader: (30)

hell yeah!!

mtcookson

iTrader: (2)

i'd be happy with a getrag 6 speed. better yet a quaif sequential shift tranny... 15 grand is a bit high though.

Bryan H

some of you really need to do more research into things before going off and making stupid replies as above.

now for this to work you need the following,
a truck with a vg 30 series or 33 series motor. {you'll see why in a second}

lower i ntake manifold from the s/c nissan's
throttle body, throttle body inlet neck {from tb to blower}
crank pulley
a/c s/c tensioner pulley set {if you look under the hood you will see this}

a new hood or a 3 inch body lift to clear it all.
you'll need the fuel pump, injectors and a boost sensative fpr {1:1 ratio}

how will this work on a max? it won't sorry guys.

and YES you can intercool a roots style blower
hi, ford lightning, o3 cobra anyone?

and for anyone who thinks roots style is only for low end, i would suggest you read more into forced induction, there is a good article in an older hot rod magazine to compares centrifugal, roots, and turbos
you'll be amazed.

mtcookson

iTrader: (2)

roots gives good power down low, very good power, but it also gives extra power up top which seems to not be understood. it's giving boost the entire time until either the engine is shut off, the belt breaks, or you have a clutch system on the pulley to kill the s/c.

internetautomar

iTrader: (30)

You can't use a clutch on a roots supercharger, how do you expect air to get into the engine then?
osmosis?