Engine Swap Idea
11-27-2004, 09:31 PM
#1
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Engine Swap Idea
This idea just popped into my head of puting a U13 Bluebird SR20DET motor into a 3rd gen. I think that there is some people here that want alot more power in their 3rd gen and from what I've seen, it seems like that a swap like this would be much better than triying to make a "ve30det" or "vg30det." I think this engine makes something like 205 hp stock and weighs ALOT less than our V-6's. Also, there is alot of upgrade potential. You could probably get 400 hp out of this engine. The swap would be VERY difficult to do but, I'm sure it could be done.
Ebay Front Clip Picture and Price
I am not really interested in doing a swap like this but, I thought I might give you guys some ideas and maybe someone could make a fast/reliable 3rd gen.
Ebay Front Clip Picture and Price
I am not really interested in doing a swap like this but, I thought I might give you guys some ideas and maybe someone could make a fast/reliable 3rd gen.
11-27-2004, 10:30 PM
#4
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Originally Posted by nubiannupe
Hold on... isn't that for an AWD Sunny or something like that???
Originally Posted by MrGone
this thread makes me cry 
11-27-2004, 10:58 PM
#7
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I agree but, there isn't a whole lot of potential in our v-6. You could make ve or vg turbo but, why. All of the turbo set-ups I've seen look very inefficient, don't produce that much power, and usually have alot of problems(I'm mostly talking about the ve). There really isn't enough room under the hood to do a good turbo set-up.
I really like my ve just the way it is but, other people might not.
It's just an idea.
I really like my ve just the way it is but, other people might not.
It's just an idea.
11-27-2004, 11:07 PM
#8
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Originally Posted by nubiannupe
I was looking at the Ebay link and saw:
Now, I ask you... WHAT is wrong with that sentence??
Now, I ask you... WHAT is wrong with that sentence??
11-27-2004, 11:07 PM
#9
I believe that particular engine came from an Bluebird Attessa, which is an Altima (not the current style) that has AWD. That engine in that configuration (for awd, usuable for front wheel drive) can also be found in the Pulsar GTi-R, which I believe is also called the Sunny.
Pulsar GTi-R
I would guess that the engine would fit in the engine bay, but you would probably have to custom make engine mounts. I would also wonder about how things match up, as far as axles, tranny, etc. Of course, you would need to redo the wiring and the ECU, too. Like any kind of "exotic" engine swap, it would take hundreds of hours and probably thousands of dollars to get all of the bugs worked out and everything working halfway right.
Pulsar GTi-R
I would guess that the engine would fit in the engine bay, but you would probably have to custom make engine mounts. I would also wonder about how things match up, as far as axles, tranny, etc. Of course, you would need to redo the wiring and the ECU, too. Like any kind of "exotic" engine swap, it would take hundreds of hours and probably thousands of dollars to get all of the bugs worked out and everything working halfway right.
11-27-2004, 11:49 PM
#10
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I'd like to point out one oversight here, Power to weight ratio. Yeah the SR20 puts out alot of HP, but it falls short on torque. You can boost it to give the extra power required, but it just doesn't have the squeeze required for the higher speeds that the VG and VE motors can put out.
11-28-2004, 12:21 AM
#11
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Engine Code: VE30DE
Actual Capacity: 2960
Engine Type: V6, DOHC, 4 valves per cylinder
Max.power, kw/rpm: 142kw/5600rpmMax.torque, N*m/rpm: 258N*m/4000rpm
Compression ratio: 10.0
Bore, mm: 93
Stroke, mm: 73.3
Head Material: Aluminium
Block material: Iron
Example of cars engine was found in: 1992-1994 Maxima SE
SR20DET
Type: 1998cc EFI DOHC 16 valve 4cyl turbo
Power: 153kW @ 6000rpm (S13), 164kW @ 6000rpm (S15), 172kW
@ 6400rpm (Pulsar GTi-R)
Torque: 274Nm @ 4000rpm (S13), 274Nm @ 4800rpm (S15), 284Nm
@ 4800rpm (Pulsar GTi-R)
Gearboxes: RWD 5-Speed and 4-Speed Auto (1993-on Silvia and 180SX)
4WD east-west 5-Speed (GTi-R)
Source: Silvia K's and 180SX after 1993, 1991-92 Pulsar GTi-R 4WD
I couldn't find the specs listed for lb/ft but, you can compare the two.
Nissan Engine Specs
Actual Capacity: 2960
Engine Type: V6, DOHC, 4 valves per cylinder
Max.power, kw/rpm: 142kw/5600rpmMax.torque, N*m/rpm: 258N*m/4000rpm
Compression ratio: 10.0
Bore, mm: 93
Stroke, mm: 73.3
Head Material: Aluminium
Block material: Iron
Example of cars engine was found in: 1992-1994 Maxima SE
SR20DET
Type: 1998cc EFI DOHC 16 valve 4cyl turbo
Power: 153kW @ 6000rpm (S13), 164kW @ 6000rpm (S15), 172kW
@ 6400rpm (Pulsar GTi-R)
Torque: 274Nm @ 4000rpm (S13), 274Nm @ 4800rpm (S15), 284Nm
@ 4800rpm (Pulsar GTi-R)
Gearboxes: RWD 5-Speed and 4-Speed Auto (1993-on Silvia and 180SX)
4WD east-west 5-Speed (GTi-R)
Source: Silvia K's and 180SX after 1993, 1991-92 Pulsar GTi-R 4WD
I couldn't find the specs listed for lb/ft but, you can compare the two.
Nissan Engine Specs
11-28-2004, 12:38 AM
#12
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Posts: 3,194
It's great you have your dream, if you do it, that's awesome. Something original, but I see it as this. Yeah you start off with more, with a few more possible goodies. But with work those 2 extra cylinders that add weight could bring out more power.
Honda's have to nitro there little rice burners, along with the usual intake, exhaust, and possible header upgrades. Just to keep up with a V6 only having a half *** intake, custom exhaust and upgraded ignition wires.
Hows that for some power comparison. If you want to swap, go for it, it's a great learning experience. And I'm not joking. But I have too many projects right now, along with having to come over here to the desert.
Don't mean to rag, but I have fallen to the slump with some of the other members of pulling down people's ideas. For that I am sorry. If you got the money, go for it, I'd love to see it.
Honda's have to nitro there little rice burners, along with the usual intake, exhaust, and possible header upgrades. Just to keep up with a V6 only having a half *** intake, custom exhaust and upgraded ignition wires.
Hows that for some power comparison. If you want to swap, go for it, it's a great learning experience. And I'm not joking. But I have too many projects right now, along with having to come over here to the desert.
Don't mean to rag, but I have fallen to the slump with some of the other members of pulling down people's ideas. For that I am sorry. If you got the money, go for it, I'd love to see it.
11-28-2004, 04:24 AM
#13
Originally Posted by 505max94se
there isn't a whole lot of potential in our v-6.
Originally Posted by 505max94se
You could make ve or vg turbo but, why. All of the turbo set-ups I've seen look very inefficient, don't produce that much power, and usually have alot of problems(I'm mostly talking about the ve).
) build a turbo setup for a VE, it is actually pretty much done, just some very minor details to make the install/uninstall easier. It is a low boost setup but it will come on earily and be realitively safe. Hell the oxygen sensor in my car (and transmission and half the other crap) came off of a boosted VE.
Originally Posted by 505max94se
There really isn't enough room under the hood to do a good turbo set-up.
11-28-2004, 07:15 AM
#17
well, considering the VG30DETT is known to make over 600whp in modded form, and the VE is the bastard child with the valve angles smashed in to make it fit in theMaxima engine bay, then I would say it's safe to believe that a built VE could easily do that as well.
Guess what it will cost to turbo it and build one for boost and put out 500+hp? LESS than what it would cost to swap in an SR20.. Hell, you're going to pay $3500 before the parts even get to your door for the SR, then hundreds of hours of custom work and a new wiring harness and nightmares like that. sounds like fun to me.
OR... you could take the VE.. tear it apart.. drop some forged VG30DETT pistons in it (the VE uses the same connecting rods and already has a forged crank), so all you need to do is drop in the new pistons and replace the bearings on the bottom end. voila! good for 500+hp and you've spent less than $1000 so far..
Now go pick up a T3/T4 turbo, or just a T4 if you want.. ($400-1500) it'll have roughly the same lag characteristics as an SR20 running a T3.. pick up a TiAL 35mm wastegate ($300), BOV of your choice ($50-300), some bigger injectors (about $150) spend a few days welding up pipes ($300 in flanges and pipe materials), an intercooler ($50-1500, depending on size and source), get a fuel pressure regulator that's got adjustable curves and base pressure ($200), and a walbro 255 high pressure fuel pump, $150.
at that point, you're looking at easily 300 wheel hp if not more, and you've spent $$3000 and haven't had to touch the computer at all. your car *should* still be able to pass inspection since it's the original engine, and you've still got soem semblance of pride because you didn't submit to the SR20 bandwagon.
Guess what it will cost to turbo it and build one for boost and put out 500+hp? LESS than what it would cost to swap in an SR20.. Hell, you're going to pay $3500 before the parts even get to your door for the SR, then hundreds of hours of custom work and a new wiring harness and nightmares like that. sounds like fun to me.
OR... you could take the VE.. tear it apart.. drop some forged VG30DETT pistons in it (the VE uses the same connecting rods and already has a forged crank), so all you need to do is drop in the new pistons and replace the bearings on the bottom end. voila! good for 500+hp and you've spent less than $1000 so far..
Now go pick up a T3/T4 turbo, or just a T4 if you want.. ($400-1500) it'll have roughly the same lag characteristics as an SR20 running a T3.. pick up a TiAL 35mm wastegate ($300), BOV of your choice ($50-300), some bigger injectors (about $150) spend a few days welding up pipes ($300 in flanges and pipe materials), an intercooler ($50-1500, depending on size and source), get a fuel pressure regulator that's got adjustable curves and base pressure ($200), and a walbro 255 high pressure fuel pump, $150.
at that point, you're looking at easily 300 wheel hp if not more, and you've spent $$3000 and haven't had to touch the computer at all. your car *should* still be able to pass inspection since it's the original engine, and you've still got soem semblance of pride because you didn't submit to the SR20 bandwagon.
11-28-2004, 09:16 AM
#18
Originally Posted by Matt93SE
OR... you could take the VE.. tear it apart.. drop some forged VG30DETT pistons in it (the VE uses the same connecting rods and already has a forged crank), so all you need to do is drop in the new pistons and replace the bearings on the bottom end. voila! good for 500+hp and you've spent less than $1000 so far..
Now go pick up a T3/T4 turbo, or just a T4 if you want.. ($400-1500) it'll have roughly the same lag characteristics as an SR20 running a T3.. pick up a TiAL 35mm wastegate ($300), BOV of your choice ($50-300), some bigger injectors (about $150) spend a few days welding up pipes ($300 in flanges and pipe materials), an intercooler ($50-1500, depending on size and source), get a fuel pressure regulator that's got adjustable curves and base pressure ($200), and a walbro 255 high pressure fuel pump, $150.
at that point, you're looking at easily 300 wheel hp if not more, and you've spent $$3000 and haven't had to touch the computer at all. your car *should* still be able to pass inspection since it's the original engine, and you've still got soem semblance of pride because you didn't submit to the SR20 bandwagon.
Now go pick up a T3/T4 turbo, or just a T4 if you want.. ($400-1500) it'll have roughly the same lag characteristics as an SR20 running a T3.. pick up a TiAL 35mm wastegate ($300), BOV of your choice ($50-300), some bigger injectors (about $150) spend a few days welding up pipes ($300 in flanges and pipe materials), an intercooler ($50-1500, depending on size and source), get a fuel pressure regulator that's got adjustable curves and base pressure ($200), and a walbro 255 high pressure fuel pump, $150.
at that point, you're looking at easily 300 wheel hp if not more, and you've spent $$3000 and haven't had to touch the computer at all. your car *should* still be able to pass inspection since it's the original engine, and you've still got soem semblance of pride because you didn't submit to the SR20 bandwagon.
11-28-2004, 09:46 AM
#19
Originally Posted by MrGone
putting a 4 cylinder motor into a car that came with a V6.
11-28-2004, 10:25 AM
#23
I agree with matt and some of the strongest motor that have been built for performance is the vg's. Its all in what you know not what everone is doing. but hey post pics when your done.
11-29-2004, 10:31 AM
#24
Originally Posted by 505max94se
I agree with most of you guys and I guess I just want to see someone make a 400+ hp 3rd gen whether it is a ve30det, vg30det, or sr20det. 
the only thing that i believe is really holding us back is our ****ting transmissions. these engines have tons of potential and can make some awesome power. where it will all fail is in the tranny.
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