VE vtc's/vq35 vtc discussion..
12-19-2007, 04:44 PM
#1
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VE vtc's/vq35 vtc discussion..
I picked up my clutch parts from nissan today and asked about VE engine blueprints (seriously), and they gave me a number for nissan's competition department, and said they would be able to send them to me electronically if i wanted. I am trying to figure out a way to keep the oil running properly to the sprocket, indefinately...so that rebuilt VTC's won't die so quickly....or at all.
was going to compare VE blueprints with VQ35 blueprints to find out the difference in oil delivery methods, as the VQ VTC's don't fail like ours...and then try to make some modifications, depending on the layout.
and whosoever may discount this notion.....greenie
......i'm not just talking out of my butt here! my only problem with the VE motor is the VTC failure. diesel FTL.
edit: will continue to post when i have more useful information...i guess?
oh i see where the missing pieces went, wow, i have a personal editor working for me over the wire! FTW!
was going to compare VE blueprints with VQ35 blueprints to find out the difference in oil delivery methods, as the VQ VTC's don't fail like ours...and then try to make some modifications, depending on the layout.
and whosoever may discount this notion.....greenie
......i'm not just talking out of my butt here! my only problem with the VE motor is the VTC failure. diesel FTL.edit: will continue to post when i have more useful information...i guess?
oh i see where the missing pieces went, wow, i have a personal editor working for me over the wire! FTW!
Last edited by ustfdes; 12-19-2007 at 09:59 PM.
12-19-2007, 06:36 PM
#3
12-19-2007, 09:24 PM
#5
erm... can we see what we missed tho? before greenie worked his magic? i do agree with the notion of VTCs being the only legitimate reason to steer away from a VE, which is a big thing coming from a VG owner.. i'm just being honest tho.
12-19-2007, 09:33 PM
#6
12-19-2007, 10:04 PM
#8
12-19-2007, 10:09 PM
#9
12-19-2007, 10:26 PM
#10
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as far as i know, yes...but i have not yet called....so i can't say for sure....he said since the VE especially is a retired motor i shouldn't have a problem, but the VQ35, i dunno....probably some trade secrets there, so i may only be able to get small segments of them -=\
12-19-2007, 11:30 PM
#11
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This sounds interesting, and would be a very useful mod should you figure out a way to do it.
I'm probably going to have mine rebuilt/replaced in the next few months. Im wondering if theres an aftermarket source for a replacement kit. I'm told rebuilt ones usually fail again after a year or so.
There used to be a replacement kit on ebay for about 300, but its no longer there.
I'm probably going to have mine rebuilt/replaced in the next few months. Im wondering if theres an aftermarket source for a replacement kit. I'm told rebuilt ones usually fail again after a year or so.
There used to be a replacement kit on ebay for about 300, but its no longer there.
12-20-2007, 06:11 AM
#13
This sounds interesting, and would be a very useful mod should you figure out a way to do it.
I'm probably going to have mine rebuilt/replaced in the next few months. Im wondering if theres an aftermarket source for a replacement kit. I'm told rebuilt ones usually fail again after a year or so.
There used to be a replacement kit on ebay for about 300, but its no longer there.
I'm probably going to have mine rebuilt/replaced in the next few months. Im wondering if theres an aftermarket source for a replacement kit. I'm told rebuilt ones usually fail again after a year or so.
There used to be a replacement kit on ebay for about 300, but its no longer there.
http://www.courtesyparts.com/betasit...-p-248407.html
You are not understanding how the vtc assembly works,the variable timing cams use oil pressure from the engine oil pumped through small oil gallies cast into the engine block/heads to advance intake timing...Please read the following thread by MrGone,it explains the inner workings/problems/and possible solutions to permanently fix the vtc's
http://forums.maxima.org/showthread.php?t=340565
vtc tsb: http://www.mattblehm.com/faq/VTC_tsb.pdf
12-20-2007, 06:38 AM
#14
see what i done there again?
12-20-2007, 07:34 AM
#15
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someone asked about vtc's, so i responded...maybe with a bit more info than was needed, but still related
Originally Posted by mygreenmax94
i have been looking around for that thing a little bit lately, so thanks go to you sir
Last edited by ustfdes; 12-20-2007 at 07:38 AM.
12-20-2007, 07:39 AM
#18
12-20-2007, 07:40 AM
#19
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well i did a search, found nothing, so i moved on, and figured i would look deeper when i get around to calling them ;x
edit: i love the stickies
editx2: and notice, i removed the "raped" comment right after posting, because i saw what you did there
12-20-2007, 07:43 AM
#20
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Im aware of that, but I'm looking for an aftermarket replacement kit, not a rebuild. I have seen one for sale on ebay in the past, but that was over a year ago and they dont seem to be sold on there anymore.
12-20-2007, 07:44 AM
#22
12-20-2007, 07:46 AM
#23
or a vtc delete kit?<----- no body makes this that i am aware of..
12-20-2007, 09:17 AM
#25
there has been talk of how to remove the VTC from use. but without them the motors won't be much fun IMO.
though those with grounded VTCs wouldn't notice the difference, since they have disabled them anyhow.
though those with grounded VTCs wouldn't notice the difference, since they have disabled them anyhow.
12-20-2007, 09:41 AM
#26
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i have had my VTC's grounded since the manifold stud repair, timing advance, egr block, and HAI mod...and honestly, i have MUCH more power than i ever did before (thank you good for the help/ideas/motivation), but my VTC's are so bad that i did a highway test coming back from atlanta, and with the VTC's GROUNDED, i had better top end power than with them UNGROUNDED......i think that shows how far gone they really are.
I have thought about the deletion process....but i have also since decided that the VTC's are not something i want to do away with, due to their innovation and practicality purposes. This is why i am willing to dig a bit deeper into the problem to find a PERMANENT solution.
While you could probably rebuild your engine and remove ALL the old deposits inside, everywhere by "vatting" it (?) and then run it as new with only synthetic oil, and no additives...i'm sure the galleys wouldn't clog up, or would at least take a LOT longer than conventional motor oil would. But that is a temporary fix....any time you use additives or are forced to use conventional oil for some reason or another, you get deposits and sludge, creating a problem yet again.
I have thought about the deletion process....but i have also since decided that the VTC's are not something i want to do away with, due to their innovation and practicality purposes. This is why i am willing to dig a bit deeper into the problem to find a PERMANENT solution.
While you could probably rebuild your engine and remove ALL the old deposits inside, everywhere by "vatting" it (?) and then run it as new with only synthetic oil, and no additives...i'm sure the galleys wouldn't clog up, or would at least take a LOT longer than conventional motor oil would. But that is a temporary fix....any time you use additives or are forced to use conventional oil for some reason or another, you get deposits and sludge, creating a problem yet again.
12-20-2007, 01:10 PM
#27
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You've got to make sure that it is an oiling problem and not a bad chain tensioner or VTC spring. My problem was the timing chain tensioner, but the cure is to replace the VTC spring that's lost its spring. Badly deposited engines may have a top end oiling problem, but if yours isn't glopped up, perhaps the repair will work. Mines clack free about a year later .
12-20-2007, 01:25 PM
#28
You've got to make sure that it is an oiling problem and not a bad chain tensioner or VTC spring. My problem was the timing chain tensioner, but the cure is to replace the VTC spring that's lost its spring. Badly deposited engines may have a top end oiling problem, but if yours isn't glopped up, perhaps the repair will work. Mines clack free about a year later .
Really though,while you are "in there",there is no sense in not replacing the chain tensioners,like replacing your oil filter when doing an oil change..
12-20-2007, 02:11 PM
#29
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good point about the tensioner....i did not overlook that problem....was just focused on the oil problem in itself....however since your problem seeminglay had nothing to do with the clacking, i will look into that when repairing mine.
So.....as it turns out, Nissan Motorsports doesn't have access to engine blueprints/diagrams....they are all kept by japanese headquarters (unless the plant in Deckard, TN has them) and even they have had to chop engines with band saws to slice a block lengthwise to solve oil routing problems before....and said that it would probably be my best bet. BUT, no thanks.
So.....as it turns out, Nissan Motorsports doesn't have access to engine blueprints/diagrams....they are all kept by japanese headquarters (unless the plant in Deckard, TN has them) and even they have had to chop engines with band saws to slice a block lengthwise to solve oil routing problems before....and said that it would probably be my best bet. BUT, no thanks.
12-20-2007, 05:50 PM
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Actually on mine the chain tensioner WAS the cause of my clacking. As indicated in the Service Bulletin on this problem, the chain tensioners, when loose, sound the same as the VTC clacking, so both must be inspected, and you're right, the tensioners are cheap enough (~$50) to be replaced while you've got this area exposed.
12-20-2007, 08:59 PM
#33
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yeah, the dealer told me each VTC was $595 each......i was like 'wow...'
but yeah, for the longest time i always said the clacking sounded more like a chain slapping a valve cover....as it was much more than just 'clacking'...but it goes away with VTC grounding.....and if i unground them, sometimes it doesnt even come back for a while.
but yeah, for the longest time i always said the clacking sounded more like a chain slapping a valve cover....as it was much more than just 'clacking'...but it goes away with VTC grounding.....and if i unground them, sometimes it doesnt even come back for a while.
12-20-2007, 09:32 PM
#34
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I wonder if just disassembling the engine and hot tanking everything would help and clean out all those oil passages?
I say that like its easy lol. But really its not too bad if you have a little bit of money, an FSM and a clean place to rebuild an engine, and are very meticulous.
~Alex
I say that like its easy lol. But really its not too bad if you have a little bit of money, an FSM and a clean place to rebuild an engine, and are very meticulous.
~Alex
12-20-2007, 10:18 PM
#36
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I wonder if just disassembling the engine and hot tanking everything would help and clean out all those oil passages?
I say that like its easy lol. But really its not too bad if you have a little bit of money, an FSM and a clean place to rebuild an engine, and are very meticulous.
~Alex
I say that like its easy lol. But really its not too bad if you have a little bit of money, an FSM and a clean place to rebuild an engine, and are very meticulous.
~Alex
and john, mother eff A veegee....i'm a VE guy, and won't change that unless i find one for really cheap.
12-20-2007, 11:25 PM
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yeah, the dealer told me each VTC was $595 each......i was like 'wow...'
but yeah, for the longest time i always said the clacking sounded more like a chain slapping a valve cover....as it was much more than just 'clacking'...but it goes away with VTC grounding.....and if i unground them, sometimes it doesnt even come back for a while.
but yeah, for the longest time i always said the clacking sounded more like a chain slapping a valve cover....as it was much more than just 'clacking'...but it goes away with VTC grounding.....and if i unground them, sometimes it doesnt even come back for a while.
