Pilot Bushing - VG AT -> MT swap

Subscribe
Jul 14, 2008 | 07:22 PM
  #1  
I'm in the middle of this swap and about to mount the MT to the VG. I've done some searching for this and haven't found a clear answer to the question if I need this or not. It looks like most guys don't use it without any apparent problems, although it comes with most clutch kits. Maybe because the MT input shaft doesn't go that far into the engine is why it's not an issue? I don't know. Any insight would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!
Reply
Jul 14, 2008 | 09:54 PM
  #2  
Quote: I'm in the middle of this swap and about to mount the MT to the VG. I've done some searching for this and haven't found a clear answer to the question if I need this or not. It looks like most guys don't use it without any apparent problems, although it comes with most clutch kits. Maybe because the MT input shaft doesn't go that far into the engine is why it's not an issue? I don't know. Any insight would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!
you only need it for clutch alignment. BUT you have to get the chunky a/t bushing out before the m/t bushing will go in. the other way to do it is to use the tool to hold the clutch up there, but to put the pressure plate on and finger-tighten the bolts such that the clutch disc still moves around inside there, mount the m/t and attach the top 2 bolts, tighten the PP bolts in as much of a star pattern as you can remember via the starter hole while turning the engine with a 27mm socket... but don't tighten them completely. then de-mount the tranny again, use a breaker bar on that 27mm to hold the engine still, torque the PP bolts down to spec, then remount the tranny and finish the install. it sounds long and drawn out but it took me about 15 minutes to do that when i replaced my clutch (replaced the clutch 3 months after the swap itself, did it that way both times)
Reply
Jul 14, 2008 | 09:59 PM
  #3  
Quote: you only need it for clutch alignment. BUT you have to get the chunky a/t bushing out before the m/t bushing will go in...
So, the input shaft of the MT won't wobble around if the bushing is not there? And how would you remove the AT bushing?
Reply
Jul 14, 2008 | 10:01 PM
  #4  
Quote: So, the input shaft of the MT won't wobble around if the bushing is not there? And how would you remove the AT bushing?
1) nope. no contact whatsoever is necessary.. there's no nub for it to fit in anyhow
2) been there, tried it, failed at it, so i dunno.
Reply
Jul 15, 2008 | 10:22 AM
  #5  
Pry it out with one leg of a pulley puller. I've detailed in in my JDM engine swap thread.
Reply
Jul 15, 2008 | 10:34 AM
  #6  
Quote: Pry it out with one leg of a pulley puller. I've detailed in in my JDM engine swap thread.
o... i tried a pilot bushing puller tool. we'll see what happens when i have the motor out in a month or two.
Reply
Jul 15, 2008 | 11:34 AM
  #7  
When I did the 5-speed swap, I tried to remove the auto pilot bushing with a pilot bushing puller to no avail. I left it in there, and no problems thus far.

I used capedcadaver's method for torquing the pressure plate.
Reply
Jul 15, 2008 | 11:39 AM
  #8  
Interestingly enough, there was not a pilot bushing present when I did my swap...Go figure.
Reply
Jul 15, 2008 | 12:00 PM
  #9  
Quote: Interestingly enough, there was not a pilot bushing present when I did my swap...Go figure.
the a/t bushing is BIG and FAT. it doesn't look like a typical pilot bushing.. but when i saw my parts car there was a big indention where the a/t bushing would go. here you see the a/t bushing on my GXE motor on the left. the Rustima's engine is on the right... you see the little pilot bushing, then the wide open space of where the a/t bushing would have gone:
_

here you see the breaker bar apparatus to hold the engine from rotating while torquing the PP:
Reply
Jul 15, 2008 | 09:14 PM
  #10  
I guess the consensus is that it is not needed. I'll try pulling the AT one out, but if it's too difficult I'll do the capedcadaver method (the pilot bushing + alignment tool would be much easier, though). But before that I'm going to replace the rear seal. Thanks for the replies!
Reply
Jul 15, 2008 | 09:39 PM
  #11  
Quote: Pry it out with one leg of a pulley puller. I've detailed in in my JDM engine swap thread.
I went back and read that...thanks.
lots of .org comradery, back in the day
Reply
Jul 16, 2008 | 09:00 PM
  #12  
Quote: the a/t bushing is BIG and FAT. it doesn't look like a typical pilot bushing.. but when i saw my parts car there was a big indention where the a/t bushing would go. here you see the a/t bushing on my GXE motor on the left. the Rustima's engine is on the right... you see the little pilot bushing, then the wide open space of where the a/t bushing would have gone:
_

here you see the breaker bar apparatus to hold the engine from rotating while torquing the PP:
Here is a pic from when I swapped my vg M/T for a VLSD unit a few months ago.



I guess I left the A/T bushing in place. No issues in the 35,000 miles my car has been manual. What would the benefit be from removing it and/or replacing it with a M/T bushing? I really don't see any need to mess with it.
Reply
Jul 16, 2008 | 09:14 PM
  #13  
Quote: Here is a pic from when I swapped my vg M/T for a VLSD unit a few months ago.



I guess I left the A/T bushing in place. No issues in the 35,000 miles my car has been manual. What would the benefit be from removing it and/or replacing it with a M/T bushing? I really don't see any need to mess with it.
yep the a/t bushing is still there. the only reason to remove it is to put in a m/t bushing to align the clutch if you don't want to put the tranny up twice and tighten the bolts through the starter hole.
Reply
Jul 16, 2008 | 10:18 PM
  #14  
I don't get how the bushing is needed to align the clutch...You put the disc under the pressure plate, use the alignment tool, and lighten everything down. Then you line up the input shaft and bolt up the tranny.
Reply
Jul 16, 2008 | 10:36 PM
  #15  
Quote: I don't get how the bushing is needed to align the clutch...You put the disc under the pressure plate, use the alignment tool, and lighten everything down. Then you line up the input shaft and bolt up the tranny.
there is freeplay at the end of the alignment tool if you don't have a proper pilot bushing in there. enough freeplay to where you may have a hard time putting the tranny up. my clutch tool didn't align it properly b/c i had no bushing in there, and when i tried to fit the tranny up it would go into the clutch disc, but the tranny was too low to get onto the dowels. so i had to loosen it to let the clutch disc slide, so i could bolt it up.
Reply
Jul 17, 2008 | 03:15 PM
  #16  
i didn't have this problem at all. i didn't even notice if there was a bushing after i removed the A/T off my car. once i installed my clutch kit with the alignment tool i just didn't bother installing that pilot bushing while doing the M/T swap. everything lined up without that little thing and the 5-speed tranny went in fine. no problems since i did it back in '05.
Reply
Jul 17, 2008 | 09:39 PM
  #17  
Quote: i didn't have this problem at all. i didn't even notice if there was a bushing after i removed the A/T off my car. once i installed my clutch kit with the alignment tool i just didn't bother installing that pilot bushing while doing the M/T swap. everything lined up without that little thing and the 5-speed tranny went in fine. no problems since i did it back in '05.
Reply
Jul 17, 2008 | 10:21 PM
  #18  
Quote:
he got lucky.. i guess he just lined it up right on luck. mine was a hair off, so i said screw it and did it the other way.
Reply
Jul 20, 2008 | 07:16 AM
  #19  
I actually cut off the end of the alignment tool which eliminated any play.
Reply
Subscribe