on the auto there's a speedo gear and a plug that goes with it. how does the manual pick up speed? is there another connector that i don't see aside from the position switch?

 

Should be approx the same location as where the auto speed sensor would be. Got a pic from the classified and pointed to it.

 

Like he said its in the same spot with one pigtail attached but probably has a different plug. Never payed any attention to verify this.

 

Found the plug...finished the swap and it grinds when i lift off the pedal and the clutch engages. clutch is new...TO bearing is new OEM...wtf is that? input shaft? while it's driving no sound..its right when i lift the pedal at the point the clutch engages. fully engaged no prob...fml.

 

The hydraulics are fully bled of air?

 

That's got to have something to do with your clutch. Maybe alignment or because it's brand new. ISB rumbling is audible whenever the clutch is engaged and the shaft is spinning, what you're describing doesn't sound like it either. I don't know how loud or bad it sounds, but you might as well leave it as is for now. If it doesn't get better, you might have to drop it again.

 

I would rather fix/ check alignment. That grinding noise makes my soul cringe.

 

i checked and the slave and the arm moves ok. does a system with air cause it to grind like this?

 

son of a....

 

Is it actually a "grind" per se as opposed to a shudder or a shaking?

When I think of a "grind" type noise I think of the typical worn synchro type noise, but I've never had a clutch do that type of noise.

If it's a shudder or a shaking, that's not atypical of a brand new clutch.

If you ride the clutch can you influence the grind/shaking/shudder? i.e., if you lift off the clutch pedal very slow does it lessen the noise?

 

if you lift fast you hear it for a very brief second.
if you lift off slow then you hear it longer
if you lift and stop at the spot it will make the noise will be there non stop...that point happens to be the point where the clutch start contacting and the car pulls forward.

i'm n00b w/ manuals so i don't have a dang clue.

 

If its not pushing far/hard enough. (not at its full potential)

 

If it grinds only when you let off the clutch and not with that and changing gears then its obviously an engagement issue. Check your clutch alignment and air in the hydraulic lines.

 

This is a long shot, but did you install the two plates that go between the block and bell housing? Alex V made that mistake on another member's car.. I think it cost him his account

 

I've been thinking about this and I just don't see what could physically cause a grinding noise from the actual clutch area. The only metal to metal contact on the actual clutch would be the TOB to the pressure plate teeth, and I don't see how that could cause a grind noise. I would think if anything it would be a scraping type noise.

And I don't think it can physically really be misaligned once the transmission is mated together. The splines on the clutch disc fit directly with the splines on the input shaft, and if it was misaligned you wouldn't be able to mate the bell-housing flush to the block because the input shaft wouldn't fit through the clutch disc. So I don't see how that could be it.

I wonder if noise is coming from the clutch fork. Did you lube all the contact points on the clutch fork? The teeth that contact the TOB, the little ball on the bellhousing that the clutch fork connects to, the little clip that holds it to said ball, etc?

Any way you could post a sound clip/video?

 

That would help greatly.

 

You're forgetting about the tranny internals. Especially with worn bearings, and overall wear of the shafts, tolerances aren't totally precise in there. The position of the shafts can vary enough to allow for a small misalignment. Which is all it took in the case I mentioned. Although I think the problem had more to do with spacing than it did mounting angle.

I just mentioned it because it's happened before, and the consequence was the flywheel boring a hole through the bell housing. Plus I can see how someone gathering/selling a 5 speed swap could forget about those plates, or leave them out of the kit thinking they would already be on an automatic, which they're not. At least not the bottom half.

 

hmmm...i'll double check and bleed it again.

 

i have the spacer plates installed between the transmission and block.

 

i'll get a clip later today.

 

But wouldn't play in the input shaft become moot once the (from a clutch alignment standpoint at least) tranny is mated to the block? The end of the input shaft sits into the center bearing on the fywheel.

Nonetheless I guess anything is possible.

Maybe there was/is some debris on the friction disc and/or on the pressure plate?

 

With my recent engine swap, I found that when it came time to install the clutch, there was a spacer in the spot where the pilot bearing and input shaft mated to the engine. The new engine was mated to an auto. In my case I had to knock out that spacer and install a pilot bearing so the manual would work. I dont know if that helps, but i ran into this issue.

 

that grinding noise. shifter is in N...you hear it quick in the beginning but towards the end i get the pedal right at the sweet spot and i can keep the noise/sound going. i'm pretty sure you hear it in every gear...definitely N and 1st.

 

Well that does sound similar to a broken ISB. Are you sure the sound goes away when the clutch is fully engaged? Here's an old vid I made, compare the audio.

 

yup...that's the sound...mother_____....yah i'm pissed.

thanks kzoosho

 

The good news is you can drive on it for awhile. The chances of doing more damage are slim. But it will eventually lock the selector out of either 1-2 or 5-R, and in my case started blowing the eng. control fuse when I would move the shifter from debris shorting the position switch. I put about 10k on the car until that started happening and I was forced to fix it. You can tear it down without removing the transmission, but that's probably not a great idea if you haven't done it before.

 

I had the same experience as Hectic with mine. I drove it for a while, then it started locking into 2 and I was fighting to get it out. After that, it was Reverse. After that, I just put in a different trans and figured I would put a new ISB in the original later. So far, it has been like 5 years and it's still in my garage collecting dust.

 

hmmm...since i hate doing the work twice i might just go with it for a little while. i don't drive it much anyway. i also need to tune it so i'll use that time to get a semi ok tune so it'll run better.

the transmission is so light (compared to the auto) and there's sooo much room now i'm pretty sure i can drop it in a driveway and either swap the bearing or just have a shop rebuild it since god know what else might we wrong with it.

thanks gents for your help on this.

 

I believe Autos have the wrong pilot shaft bushing in the block. I remember having to pop out the automatic pilot shaft bearing on the auto VE motor that I swapped in.

 

Off topic.
That ending to Hectic video made me laugh... Totally unexpected.

On topic
What is "ISB"?

Edit
Nevermind!!!!

 

I see you Hectic rockin the corduroys

 

Yeah but I think I was wearing that stuff because I was about to work on the car. Those clothes have been retired a long time. When I work on the car I don't wear coveralls, I wear old clothes I don't care about anymore In fact I once got some coveralls for Christmas and returned them.

 

Lol?

 

I agree with you on it being light and the added space. Hell I've time where I didn't feel like leaning in so I sat in the engine bay (where the batt would be but is now relocated to the trunk). I'm 6'1". Lol freaks everyone out that sees me.

 

I've been known to squat inside the engine bay while tearing into it. This is only on junkyard cars though, not my own.

 

Pleased to hear you've go it all put together! I would recommend a rebuild if you plan to keep the car for a good while. Or maybe source another, rebuild it and then just swap them out. I imagine you could have it swapped out in 4-5 hours (taking your time with beer and smokes) and be on the road sooner that way.

BTW, still planning a j/y run if you need anything.

 

It's not strictly speaking "required" to swap it (since the input shaft doesn't have a machined tip that would have to fit into the bushing like the Z31 trannies do), and even with removing the AT bushing and installing the MT bushing, I found the alignment tool to be inadequate to get the clutch lined up precisely enough that I could slide the tranny on in less than 30 minutes worth of trying.

Instead I just put the PP bolts in finger tight (so the clutch disc can still slide within the confines of the PP) then temporarily install the trans to align the clutch perfectly. Then I tighten the PP bolts through the starter hole (rotating crank to get the bolts evenly) until the disc is immobile, remove the trans, torque the PP bolts to spec, and reinstall the trans again. If it were heavier I might not do it, but it's manageable enough so I've stuck with that method.

Also am i missing something or is the "quick reply" box at the bottom of the page... gone?

 

definitely the sound a bad input shaft bearing or bearings make. kind of odd that it's only at a certain pedal position, but the bearings must just be wearing in a certain way that they kind of go quiet when the pedal is all the way out (if I understood correctly that you had to "position" the pedal at a certain point to get the noise to stay present.)

 

well... when the pedal is fully pushed in, the input shaft will be stopped. no noise due to no motion, despite supporting weight.

when the pedal is partially pushed, the input shaft will be spinning some, and the weight of the clutch disc/input shaft will be resting partly on the input shaft bearing while it's spinning, partly on the clamp load of the FW/PP. Noise due to motion and supporting weight.

When the pedal is fully out, the weight of the clutch disc is supported by clamping load of the FW/PP, and the splines of the clutch disc can support the weight of the input shaft. No noise due to not supporting any weight, despite there being motion.

Plausible?

 

So Dan, you've had a VG turbo with an autotragic trans this whole time, and are just now swapping to a 5spd? If so, how did it hold up this long?