Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

I have a relay which I've had forever. I have no instructions for it, just a little diagram that is drawn on the side of the relay. I'm no electronics expert, and I cannot figure out which contact is which. Are all relays generic and the contacts are wired the same inside? I will post a picture of the diagram in about 5 minutes when it uploads

xHypex

iTrader: (1)

Most relays are very simple and generic, but who knows. Give us a picture of the wires, top of the relay, and the connectors (or a list would help). My Relay was as follows
1 / _ 2
3 (coil) 5

The best way to wire it is to understand how the relay works. When the Harlan grounds (3), the potential difference between the ground and the 12v (5) causes the switch to click (you'll hear it) and allow power to get to the device. (1) would be a 12v going into the relay, and (2) would be the 12v going out to the MAP Switch once the Harlan is activated to click the relay.
Sorry for the brief description, but I was involved in an accident today and I'm worn out. Keven can probably give you a better answer :P
-hype

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

Hype, thanks for the explanation I believe I get it now. here is the picture of my relay just to be sure

http://www.cardomain.com/id/relay187

xHypex

iTrader: (1)

30 is the 12v from the battery or elsewhere.
87 is the hot wire that runs to your MAP switch.
86 is from your Harlan.
85 is another 12v from the battery or elsewhere.

Good luck.
-hype

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

In my case, what will I be connecting to 85, if anything. Do I connect it to the same source (I'm going to use a fuse I think) as 30?

PS I'm sorry to be asking so many questions, I just don't want to fry something...

xHypex

iTrader: (1)

If you want to simply test the relay wire 85 and 86 first. When the Harlan kicks in the relay will click. A good way to test the relay and other things is simply to work off the battery. Touch 86 to ground and 85 to the + and the relay should click. If it doesn't then the relay is bad. In actuality 85 and 86 can be switched (i.e. 85 can be ground and 86 can be +), so long as there is a potential difference across the coil.
Once you know the relay works, 30 is the input voltage from the battery which flows to the MAP switch through 87 when the relay clicks.
-hype

sx7r

iTrader: (15)

i'm not in the list


lol

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

So since 86 is going to the Harlan and 85 is going to a 12V.... that means whenever the car is ON, the relay will be in its ON position (I mean it will click once to "activate" when you turn the ignition on). Correct?

Dave B

Please help me because you guys have completely confused me.

Questions for the VI guys:

1) According to the schematic on my 30 amp relay, 30 = 12V out (to Map/Baro), 85 = ground (chassis ground), 86 = on/off switch (from Harlan), 87 = 12V in (from battery power source)

2) Do I need to put a fuse in anywhere?

3) Where did you guys wire in for your power source with the relay and Harlan?

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

This is driving me ****ing insane. I have been working on this for like 3 hours now with no progress. I cannot figure out what is to connect to what.

Harlan: Green to coil. Red to what? black to ground. white to what?

MAP/Baro: + to 87 on RELAY. - to ground.

Relay: 30 to 12V (fuse in fuse box), 85 to 12V (same fuse as 30). 86 to which wire of HARLAN (red or white?). 87 to MAP.

I'm going to go back out to work on it. If anyone has any help to offer PLEASE do so. I'm driving myself insane.

Dave B

Buddy, did you not read the Harlan instructions?

White = to switched ground (the 30 amp relay)
Red = to +12V source
Black = chassis ground
Green = tach/rpm input

ONLY the white wire from the Harlan goes into the relay. The RPM switch is what activates relay to release power to the Map/Baro which in turn opens the vacumm line for the VI.

That's all I can offer until they answer my questions. I think the Hype's wiring isn't right according to the schematic on my relay box from Radio Shack. I hope you figure it out.


Dave

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

I think I've got it now. I've set my RPM switchover point, and at least that works. The LED comes on at the correct RPM to show that it has been activated. Just gotta go test my Map/baro to make sure that works as its supposed to.

It was the relay that was throwing me off, not the Harlan. I knew the white wire was the switched ground, I was just having trouble figuring out which connector on the relay to connect it to.

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

MAP/Baro switch: $5.00.

Harlan RPM Switch: $50.00

MEVI: $520.00.

Power all the way to redline on a VQ30DE: Priceless.

--------------------------------------------------------------

It works. MAP switch switches ports just like its supposed to. The Harlan is programmed. The relay is functioning. Life is good. Neal is tired. I'll pick up my vacuum canister tomorrow morning and have a fully functioning VI by the afternoon (knock on wood).


Thanks for putting up with all my questions guys. I've always hated electrical stuff. I hated the few Electrical Engineering classes I took in college. But thanks to all who helped me out.

Dave B

Neal-

Can you tell me how you did your wiring off the relay?

Where did you wire in your Harlan and relay for power?

Are you running a fuse to the relay?

To test the Map/Baro, simply take some jumper wires and to the battery +/-. You'll hear the switch click and you should only be able to blow air thru one way.

Thanks for figuring all this out prior to my install I've got all my mounting locations figured out so everything looks stock. Vacumm lines have been measured and fitted and the VI is assembled. Tonight I will measure electrical wiring and solder the connectors to the wire. Friday night, the fun will begin.


Dave

Keven97SE

The way a relay works is that you send a signal through the coil (in this case, 12V from #86 to the Harlan switched ground at #85) to throw the switch. The current through the coil actually creates a magnetic field that literally throws the metal switch. This closes the connection between the other two poles (#30 and #87).

Therefore,


Not correct. Because the signal to the Harlan is a SWITCHED ground...that is, it's only a ground from 5000 rpms on...the #86 lead (12V) will not actually cause any current to flow until 5000 rpms. No current means the switch will not be closed between #30 and #87, and #87 will actually not get 12V until 5000 rpms.

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

Where the he// did u get a MAP/BARO for 5 bux? Junk yard?

Keven97SE

Answers:
1) #30 is a 12V feed. #87 goes to the switched ground ("signal") from the Harlan. #86 is another 12V feed. #85 is the signal out to the "MAP/BARO switch" (I hate that term...it's a 3-way solenoid).

2) No fuse is required for the 12V signals to the relay, assuming you pull 12V from a switched 12V source. Those sources are already fused.

3) I'm going to install my Harlan on top of the ECU, so I plan on tapping in the 12V for the Harlan from the main (big red wire) 12V feed line to the ECU. As for 12V to the relay, I'll get that power from one of the switched sources that feeds one of the relays under the hood (like the ignition relay, etc...something that gets 12V only when the keys are in the ignition).

Keven97SE

Yeah, those things are all over the place in junkyards. Find any Nissan car that's under 10 years old and you'll find a 3-way solenoid (ie "MAP/BARO switch) that'll work for this application. Solenoids rarely go bad also, so junked cars are fine.

Dave B

So the relay is not grounded to the chassis by any wire? The Harlan white wire to the relay actually serves as the ground (switched). Finally, #86 IS NOT USED in this application or does #86 need to go to the same 12V source?

Sorry, I'm not an electrical engineer.


Dave

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

Thats what was throw me off too Dave. I was confused by the fact that 2 of the connectors on the RELAY were going to the same place.

30, 86, and the RED wire from the HARLAN are all going to the exact same place in my install (a fuse in my interior fuse box that only gets power when the ignition is on). BTW Keven is this a bad idea to be splicing 3 wires (30, 86 and RED from Harlan) into one thin speaker wire and running it to one of the prongs of a 7.5A fuse in my interior fuse box?

I encountered a slight setback this morning. I turned the car on, and could hear the relay click at my set RPM point, so I figured all was well. However after running an errand, I noticed I could no long hear the relay clicking. When I got home, I left my car running and popped my hood and checked the connections and then the RPM switch. The little red LED on the RPM switch was flashing continuously. I shut the car off, turned it back on, and all was well again. Any idea what would cause this? I have the RPM switch mounted on a coolant line which got pretty cold. Perhaps it was the cold environment that threw it off? (I'm going to move it). Everything seems to be working as it is supposed to now, but I'm worried about the fact that at one point it wasn't. Any thoughts.

Mishmosh

iTrader: (3)

No matter what the numbering scheme used, you are converting a switched ground (Harlan) into a switched 12V line. We have established that the ground of the relay goes to the Harlan switched ground. The switched 12V output of the relay goes to the solenoid. That leaves the relay's switched 12V input and 12V line in -- both you should connect to a 12VDC line (that should be already fused and switched on when the ignition is turned on).

Keven97SE

Correct for the first two sentences and incorrect for the last. The only ground for the relay is the Harlan switched ground, ie "Harlan signal wire". When 5000 rpm hits, the Harlan grounds the coil outlet from the relay and allows current to flow, allowing the other 12V signal to reach the MAP/BARO switch. The MAP/BARO switch is grounded, which allows current to flow through it and thus throws the valve inside and allows vacuum to reach the MEVI.

Again,
#30 is hooked up to a switched 12V source
#87 is hooked up to the BAP/BARO switch
#86 is hooked up to a switched 12V source
#85 is hooked up to the Harlan switched ground "signal wire"

(You need switched 12V power going to both #30 and #86...it's okay for the power to be fed from the same source).

This is how we finally hooked up Hype's MEVI and it worked perfectly.

Keven97SE

Dave and Nealoc, send me an email and I'll send you my electrical schematic. It'll all make sense, or at least you can see it in an easy-to-visualize format.

Dave B

Easy enough Thanks, I just don't want to have to trouble shoot all night long like Neal. I've already got the Harlan shift light. I may tap into the wires from the shiftlight and keep the RPM switch mounted in the fuse box for protection from the elements and heat.


Dave

Mishmosh

iTrader: (3)

The only problem that I encountered was due to my own neglect. I've had the LED continuously on and also no apparent LED at the set point before. However, I forgot about the instructions that says you have to hold the settings button until the LED flashes, otherwise, it can set the parameters randomly. This may not apply to you if you had it working correctly initially and then it didn't work though. For me, I set it and it didn't work right...