I was told that the midpipe would cure the low-end powers loss attributed to cone intakes, but I feel that there is a still some low-end loss despite what others say. anyone else have that feeling?

Kevin

How do you know you are loosing low end? Just by feel?

Yeah basically. It doesn't feel like it did off the line before. I don't know maybe it's in my head.

butt dynos!
perhaps your knock sensor is bad
perhaps your tires are not gripping
perhaps it's hot out

These posts are not informative at all.

Don't mind her, she's not been feeling well this week.




Hi Erica

all he was doing was whining! I mean, like your thread was about gaining power and questioning CA/Fed emmissions...at least it was productive to soome extent lol.

Sorry, man. There are SO MANY FACTORS for "power loss," pluss you're talking about a butt dyno anyway.

Jeez, what's your problem? was it something I said?

ok instead of "power loss" how about I can't peel the freaking tires off the line anymore? only difference in my car was the intake.

Kevin, I agree with you too! I had recently installed the frankencar and I felt a big loss on low end. I can no longer punch the car in a roll from 1st gear and chirp. In this case I trust my butt dyno.
I may later install the factory intake and see if there is some basis to my "feelings". Also looking into the Injen but I want to see what other people say about the switch!

Boo

if it's gotten warmer out then that would do it. if your tires were new/semi new when you had the stock intake and now you have a few miles on them that would do it. if you were taking off at a stoplight on the white line before and aren't now that would do it. if you were on asphault before and are now on concrete that would do it. if your fuel filter is dirty that would do it. if you switched gas ratings that would do it. should i go on? lime is right, there are ALOT of factors. the only way to be sure is to put your stok airbox back in, drive around for a few minutes, come back, install the frankencar and drive around again.

Yeah, I was thinking of putting the stock stuff back in and test it. I'm almost positive that the Midpipe does nothing for low-end power like people are saying.

Kevin

OK,

what about with all things being equal, road conditions tires etc,etc.??

I guess what I was getting at is that the the Franken Car doesn't seem to help low end vs a regular cone intake and stock midpipe/resonator. I'm most likely going to try your suggestion, dirve the car, put stock airbox on and drive again. I'll keep the one that feels better to me on.

Kevin

BS. I can tell you when I installed it and took it for a test run, it screamed, and that was back when I had no traction.

Sorry, man, maybe you installed it incorrectly.

oh and check out steve's original tests...look them up. It was doneon the VQ35, but it's comparable.

well, I put the Cattman combo basically the Frankencar on my SE and I "felt" that all power ranges improved, I didn't have any impressions that any power was lost

Hey all,

There's definitely a low-end loss with any WAI. I changed my intake about 5 times between the stock and the wai. I get a lot more pleasure driving with the stock intake because the car is much more willing. Try taking out the small pipe that goes to the resonator underneath the battery. I felt that this gave me most of the high-end back that I gained with the WAI without the loss of the low-end of the WAI.

Peace.

I think that people think the midpipe give them more power b/c its louder. It didn't do jack for me. I just have to watch out for cops whenever i floor it b/c its so damn loud!

that would be pretty moronic...but then people are pretty stupid. I was a test monkey for 4g's with FCP, so mine isn't powdercoated. It seems to get rid of some of the lag I got with the JWT, and Steve's runs indicated a decent increase in power. I am using different couplers than they are giving out now too...hm, I wonder....

I'm pretty sure there is no way that I installed it incorrectly. I'll probably double check the hoses and the couplings and everything to make sure. It may have screamed but did it feel better off the line vs just the cone? Just curious have you gone back to a stock airbox since having your intake? I remeber the first time I took off the cone and went back to stock there was a very immedaite and noticable difference off the line.

Kevin

My setup is custom everything, except for the JWT, and I notice it very much, I can chirp my tires from a stop, with the JWT alone, I couldn't do that. No, I'm not sticking up for Frankencar because I have a"mutt" hybrid, meaning I bought the tube from a performance store round here, couplers from the same store, cut the tube so that it would fit on my car, and put it all together, and yea, it's hella louder, and also when flooring it around town, my tires slip on painted surfaces, i.e, white lines, shyt like that on city roads. So I believe in the hybrid, no low end loss, and great hi-end. Definate gain throughout the powerband.

2KxSEx what exactly are you running? Is it the stock intake minus the resonator under the battery and the factory midpipe or the franken midpipe? I've been debating putting my old factory intake back on, especially when I get my VI. I was wondering if the stock air box was best for low end and that the smoother midpipe helped w/ high end It could also just act differently on different cars. One last thing, you say you felt a difference when you went back to stock; did you reset the ECU and if not has you impression changed with time? Thanks.

Toolrocks,

I'm running with the stock midpipe, however I too was thinking about replacing the stock midpipe with a franken midpipe. Most likely the franken midpipe will not give us any hp gains, it will make the intake louder that's about it. I didn't reset the ecu after I switched back to stock intake, however the car feels stronger everday I think the stock airbox minus the resonator under the battery with a k&n drop in is better than any WAI. Plus, with the WAI my gas milage went down the drain, because I had to apply more gas to get the car up and going.

Peace.

Hey Lime,

The intake was dynoed on a 3.5L engine not the 3L engine in the 4th gen. .5L of displacement is a big difference. I don't think that a 10hp gain on the 3.5L can be transfered to a 10hp gain on the 3L.

Peace.

I've actually done EXTENSIVE butt dyno testing with the stock air box vs. JWT.

In an auto, I can say that a stock air box feels more jumpy and responsive. Throttle is crisp and low end is there from the start. With a JWT on an auto, you can tell the car breathes better, but since there is so much more surface area of air that is available, it doesn't feel as powerful off the line.

In a manual, it is a different story. The JWT drastically makes a power difference (both true hp and butt dyno) over the stock air box. I set up a OSCAI for testing to see if the 5-speed would take it as well as the auto did (I got the 5-speed Max w/ a JWT already in it) but to my complete surprise, it didn't. The car seemed to run out of breath at the high ends, and provided no "boost" of power at the low ends.

Anyway, think of the Frankencar midpipe, or any other midpipe section as this: a RESONATOR REMOVER Basically, that's all it is. It may smooth up airflow a bit, but its main purpose & source of power gain is from the removal of the stock resonator, aka restriction.

Think of a regular Y-pipe compared to an aftermarket one. It works the same way. And BTW, you can pretty much guarantee that you will have HP gains with a midpipe than a setup without one. I don't think a 1/4 mile run will show it clearly enough, but a dyno probably would.

After reading this whole post all i can say is every car is different. SO what works for some may not work for others. Also I don't know how you could not properly install a midpipe. Either its there or your car is gonna be breathin the dust off your tranny. Either way I would definetly say that intakes can effect your low end. Seen it with my setup as well. Either change intakes or add some more low end mods.

I'm gonna try my stock intake box and the midpipe just for *fun*. Besides, I have nothing else to do anyway

3.5 vs 3.0 INTAKE is similar...shouldn't be that different. The power curves of 4g and 5g aren't that drastically different.

Had some time so I swapped my Franken intake back to the all stock intake.

Car drove just as I remembered! Lots of pull again. First gear pulls hard enough to squeal on a roll. Second gear once again chirps with no problems and I feel no loss when shifting to second now. I tested the car up to redline in third as I did with the Franken and (butt dyno I know isn’t the best) it felt just the same. I was able to hit 97mph in third with stock intake same as Franken. Since I love the low end and that’s where I do most of my driving I'm going to keep this setup for a while and see how much I like it.

I wish I had the time to hit the track with both setups. But I'm thinking that the extra power down low may hurt my times due to excessive wheel spin off the line.
I'll probably get a chance to this winter!

I do miss the sweet purr/roar of the engine under WOT with the Franken!

Boo

Boo,

Did you try the Mip-pipe + Stock Airbox ? That might be something worth trying, free up the air restrictions after the MAF to the Throttle Body...

And take out that small pipe that connects to the resonator under the battery. This will give an extra source of incoming air, and you car will roar a little too.

Later.

i have yoru setup and i got back low end ....a lot better power

Haven't read a post by you in a while. What set up is that exactly? I was thinking when I get my VI I may go w/ stock ram, filter box, and a $15 upper intake piece (between MAF and Throttle Body). Oh yeah, the ram would be minus the resonator.

I did take out the resonator!!
I wondered about this, would leaving the hole open allow air to escape that is coming in from the scoop or would it bring more air in due to the suction?

Haven't tried this yet. I will have to buy one and make it my next project. I am truly enjoying having the stock intake back on. I know I may be missing some of the top end but I love the pull just after shifts!!

thanks for the info,

Boo

I feel that the opening brings more air in under acceleration. I stuck my hand under the hole while revving the engine a little and felt a sucsion.

Make sure your hoses are hooked up right. I have the intake and feel no loss whatsoever.

This is all very nice but no one except Steve has done dyno tests or 1/4 runs. DOn't post "it feels better" because it's called: self-fulfilling prophecy. If you don't know what that is, look it up. These are not blind tests, your biases are going to effect your "butt dyno," so don't even bother with posting how you think it feels until you have data to back it up. I would do it byt my stock airbox isn't stock.

Very nice, but when I drive a car I drive it because I like the feel of it not because of data! If it was about data then why would I ever need to test drive a car, simply pick the one with the most HP and that’s the one I buy. I am not claiming any more HP than with other intakes but if I like my car with the stock intake then I'm going to post my opinion about how much I do like it!! Not trying to argue stock is better; I just wish I could have the best of both ends!!

I believe that’s what Kevin is saying also.

Boo

Yeah I checked that out, all hoses were connected correctly. I did notice however that the one hose supplied by frankencar is a tad too long and gets very slightly pinched. I'll see if I can trim that down and get rid of that pinch.

Kevin

Then why would you get an intake in the first place, Boo?

I recommended some changes in the way the intake was designed due to the pinched hose syndrome. I added longer hose to get rid of one of the pinched hoses. Just make sure the air is able to flow freely.