ES FSB bushing information...
11-30-2002, 12:10 PM
#1
ES FSB bushing information...
Hey guys today I ordered my FSB bushings from Bruce @ www.suspension.com. Not only was he a pleasure to order from, but he really knows his suspensions and can explain to your the benfits and disadvantages of the bushings.
Anyays he verified for me that the grease the ES bushings come with (called "Formula 5") is 100% trailor hitch grease you can pick up from Advanced Auto. Not that you'd need to though, because it comes with the bushings anyways.
He also told me to make some grooved inside the bushings, to hold the grease in. He did a test with 2 bushings on his car, one with grooves he made on the inside, and one with a smooth surface like ES sells them. He told me that after 6 months his one without the grooves was squeaking and dry, and the other wasn't. So to those of you who have yet to buy/install these, make some grooves inside (that don't go out to the edges) so the grease won't squirt out.
He also said that ES doesn't make endlink bushings for the Maxima, and the ones Courtesy sells are generic endlink bushings. He advised against them, because although the design is good they cannot take the wear and people have had many problems with them.
Also I don't know if you guys know this, but he said you don't have to take the FSB off to put the midlink bushings on. He said just take the clamp off, cut the old bushing off, and the new eurethane bushing will stretch enough so you can slide is over the bar. Then all you have to do is put the clamp back on and move to the other side.
And finally as a reference, he said DO NOT by any means put the grease on the outside of the bushing. He said it will only make is sqeak more.
Hope this helps somebody,
-Cyrus
Anyays he verified for me that the grease the ES bushings come with (called "Formula 5") is 100% trailor hitch grease you can pick up from Advanced Auto. Not that you'd need to though, because it comes with the bushings anyways.
He also told me to make some grooved inside the bushings, to hold the grease in. He did a test with 2 bushings on his car, one with grooves he made on the inside, and one with a smooth surface like ES sells them. He told me that after 6 months his one without the grooves was squeaking and dry, and the other wasn't. So to those of you who have yet to buy/install these, make some grooves inside (that don't go out to the edges) so the grease won't squirt out.
He also said that ES doesn't make endlink bushings for the Maxima, and the ones Courtesy sells are generic endlink bushings. He advised against them, because although the design is good they cannot take the wear and people have had many problems with them.
Also I don't know if you guys know this, but he said you don't have to take the FSB off to put the midlink bushings on. He said just take the clamp off, cut the old bushing off, and the new eurethane bushing will stretch enough so you can slide is over the bar. Then all you have to do is put the clamp back on and move to the other side.
And finally as a reference, he said DO NOT by any means put the grease on the outside of the bushing. He said it will only make is sqeak more.
Hope this helps somebody,
-Cyrus
11-30-2002, 01:28 PM
#2
Re: ES FSB bushing information...
Originally posted by Vyrus
Hey guys today I ordered my FSB bushings from Bruce @ www.suspension.com. Not only was he a pleasure to order from, but he really knows his suspensions and can explain to your the benfits and disadvantages of the bushings.
Anyays he verified for me that the grease the ES bushings come with (called "Formula 5") is 100% trailor hitch grease you can pick up from Advanced Auto. Not that you'd need to though, because it comes with the bushings anyways.
He also told me to make some grooved inside the bushings, to hold the grease in. He did a test with 2 bushings on his car, one with grooves he made on the inside, and one with a smooth surface like ES sells them. He told me that after 6 months his one without the grooves was squeaking and dry, and the other wasn't. So to those of you who have yet to buy/install these, make some grooves inside (that don't go out to the edges) so the grease won't squirt out.
He also said that ES doesn't make endlink bushings for the Maxima, and the ones Courtesy sells are generic endlink bushings. He advised against them, because although the design is good they cannot take the wear and people have had many problems with them.
Also I don't know if you guys know this, but he said you don't have to take the FSB off to put the midlink bushings on. He said just take the clamp off, cut the old bushing off, and the new eurethane bushing will stretch enough so you can slide is over the bar. Then all you have to do is put the clamp back on and move to the other side.
And finally as a reference, he said DO NOT by any means put the grease on the outside of the bushing. He said it will only make is sqeak more.
Hope this helps somebody,
-Cyrus
Hey guys today I ordered my FSB bushings from Bruce @ www.suspension.com. Not only was he a pleasure to order from, but he really knows his suspensions and can explain to your the benfits and disadvantages of the bushings.
Anyays he verified for me that the grease the ES bushings come with (called "Formula 5") is 100% trailor hitch grease you can pick up from Advanced Auto. Not that you'd need to though, because it comes with the bushings anyways.
He also told me to make some grooved inside the bushings, to hold the grease in. He did a test with 2 bushings on his car, one with grooves he made on the inside, and one with a smooth surface like ES sells them. He told me that after 6 months his one without the grooves was squeaking and dry, and the other wasn't. So to those of you who have yet to buy/install these, make some grooves inside (that don't go out to the edges) so the grease won't squirt out.
He also said that ES doesn't make endlink bushings for the Maxima, and the ones Courtesy sells are generic endlink bushings. He advised against them, because although the design is good they cannot take the wear and people have had many problems with them.
Also I don't know if you guys know this, but he said you don't have to take the FSB off to put the midlink bushings on. He said just take the clamp off, cut the old bushing off, and the new eurethane bushing will stretch enough so you can slide is over the bar. Then all you have to do is put the clamp back on and move to the other side.
And finally as a reference, he said DO NOT by any means put the grease on the outside of the bushing. He said it will only make is sqeak more.
Hope this helps somebody,
-Cyrus
11-30-2002, 06:26 PM
#3
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 387
thanks for the info i am doing mine monday night... as well as lower control arm bushings and even though he advised against it endlink bushings... just cause they are meant for another application thatu ses the same size doesn't mean the material is any different nor the stress on them i don't see how they couldn't handle it.
not that i am saying he is wrong just i don't understand his logic or reasoning.
not that i am saying he is wrong just i don't understand his logic or reasoning.
11-30-2002, 07:09 PM
#4
Originally posted by trinity000
thanks for the info i am doing mine monday night... as well as lower control arm bushings and even though he advised against it endlink bushings... just cause they are meant for another application thatu ses the same size doesn't mean the material is any different nor the stress on them i don't see how they couldn't handle it.
not that i am saying he is wrong just i don't understand his logic or reasoning.
thanks for the info i am doing mine monday night... as well as lower control arm bushings and even though he advised against it endlink bushings... just cause they are meant for another application thatu ses the same size doesn't mean the material is any different nor the stress on them i don't see how they couldn't handle it.
not that i am saying he is wrong just i don't understand his logic or reasoning.
I've got too many sqeaks as it is hehe.-Cyrus
11-30-2002, 07:24 PM
#6
Originally posted by trinity000
lol well i guess i will be on the one to take on the challene of making them quiet.
lol well i guess i will be on the one to take on the challene of making them quiet.
-Cyrus
12-01-2002, 10:09 AM
#8
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,530
I would take his advice on the end link bushings with a grain of salt. When I ordered my bushings from him bout 2 weeks ago, he said that there were no end link bushings. I then told him about the part # courtesy used and he said that was a body mount bushing but it should work and he had none in stock and he had never heard of it used for the maxima like this b4. For the few bucks it cost to do I'd do them.
Good info on the groove though, Ill have to do this when I put mine in.
Good info on the groove though, Ill have to do this when I put mine in.
12-02-2002, 07:34 AM
#10
I have the ES endlink bushings from Courtesy and have had no squeaks since installing them. I greased them, but there isn't really any room to make grooves on them (they're small).
Let us know how the cut/install method works for the FSB bushings. I've been waiting to put mine on because I haven't had time to take the FSB off.
-hype
Let us know how the cut/install method works for the FSB bushings. I've been waiting to put mine on because I haven't had time to take the FSB off.
-hype
12-08-2002, 10:17 AM
#11
FSB Bushings Installed...
Got them in the mail and installed them yesterday. It comes in the little ES box with the grease, bushings, and general instructions.
The grooves are really hard to make since the polyeurethane is hard to cut into. I basically used the tip of a screwdriver to make a few indentation lines in each of the bushings. They're not deep, but deep enough to retain a little grease.
As far as the intall, it took me about 1.5 hours. If you've done it before I wouldn't think it would take more than 1 hour. The bad news: you have to take the endlinks off to put the mid-bar ones on. They are held on too tight to the chassis, but once you remove the endlink they whole bar will spring up (be careful, the nut and upper endlink will spring off fast and hard!) on that side. Now you can easily remove the old bushing and install the new one. The hard part is putting tightening the bar again. The bar will not be easy to bend back onto the endlink, but it can be done. I used a 1-foot wrench to pry it down. Put the upper endlink bushing back on and screw it down. Then put the mid-bar bracket on top of the mid-bar bushing again and you're done. If you're fast you can do it in 30 minutes/side, but I took my time since I had no specific instructions.
So far I've definitely noticed an increase in NVH. I had a minor vibration in the steering wheel I needed to get fixed, and I have noticed it is definitely amplified. They do not squeak though, and the front does feel a little firmer during really hard cornering.
And a question for you suspension gurus, I'm still dissapointed with the handling in the rear of my car. It feels very unstable as if it wants to slide out at any second. As if there's a horrible weight distribution (which there probably is) and the front is weighted down and the rear is not there. What should I do? Currently my rear AGXs are set at 4 (front at 2), and I have an RSB and RSTB (would tightening them help significantly?) Would Stage 1 SFCs help for this?
Thanks,
-Cyrus
The grooves are really hard to make since the polyeurethane is hard to cut into. I basically used the tip of a screwdriver to make a few indentation lines in each of the bushings. They're not deep, but deep enough to retain a little grease.
As far as the intall, it took me about 1.5 hours. If you've done it before I wouldn't think it would take more than 1 hour. The bad news: you have to take the endlinks off to put the mid-bar ones on. They are held on too tight to the chassis, but once you remove the endlink they whole bar will spring up (be careful, the nut and upper endlink will spring off fast and hard!) on that side. Now you can easily remove the old bushing and install the new one. The hard part is putting tightening the bar again. The bar will not be easy to bend back onto the endlink, but it can be done. I used a 1-foot wrench to pry it down. Put the upper endlink bushing back on and screw it down. Then put the mid-bar bracket on top of the mid-bar bushing again and you're done. If you're fast you can do it in 30 minutes/side, but I took my time since I had no specific instructions.
So far I've definitely noticed an increase in NVH. I had a minor vibration in the steering wheel I needed to get fixed, and I have noticed it is definitely amplified. They do not squeak though, and the front does feel a little firmer during really hard cornering.
And a question for you suspension gurus, I'm still dissapointed with the handling in the rear of my car. It feels very unstable as if it wants to slide out at any second. As if there's a horrible weight distribution (which there probably is) and the front is weighted down and the rear is not there. What should I do? Currently my rear AGXs are set at 4 (front at 2), and I have an RSB and RSTB (would tightening them help significantly?) Would Stage 1 SFCs help for this?
Thanks,
-Cyrus
12-08-2002, 12:47 PM
#12
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 387
bit of a coincidence but i just literally finished installing my end link bushings and fsb bushing... i have noticed increased steering strength (i.e it is a tighter feel like the car should be). i only took it around the block at this point cause i have yet to get in the shower..
i had no troubles with things springing up on me but i did mine different... take the endlink nuts off on both sides then the bar bushings. installed lower endlinks and set bar onto them slide on bar bushing and brakets and insert bolts a fwe threads.. put top endlinks on and tighten nuts down a bit... tighten down all bar bolts, then endlinks... simple as pie. and considering it is 15 degrees right now i am glad i had a garage (unheated) to protect me from the wind.
i had no troubles with things springing up on me but i did mine different... take the endlink nuts off on both sides then the bar bushings. installed lower endlinks and set bar onto them slide on bar bushing and brakets and insert bolts a fwe threads.. put top endlinks on and tighten nuts down a bit... tighten down all bar bolts, then endlinks... simple as pie. and considering it is 15 degrees right now i am glad i had a garage (unheated) to protect me from the wind.
12-09-2002, 12:47 PM
#14
Originally posted by 95Max
Vyrus,
Some quick questions. What springs do you have? What tires and what is the tire pressure? When was the last time you alligned the car? I can't speak to the SFC as I do not have them.
Vyrus,
Some quick questions. What springs do you have? What tires and what is the tire pressure? When was the last time you alligned the car? I can't speak to the SFC as I do not have them.
-Cyrus
12-09-2002, 12:58 PM
#15
Re: FSB Bushings Installed...
Originally posted by Vyrus
And a question for you suspension gurus, I'm still dissapointed with the handling in the rear of my car. It feels very unstable as if it wants to slide out at any second. As if there's a horrible weight distribution (which there probably is) and the front is weighted down and the rear is not there. What should I do? Currently my rear AGXs are set at 4 (front at 2), and I have an RSB and RSTB (would tightening them help significantly?) Would Stage 1 SFCs help for this?
Thanks,
-Cyrus
And a question for you suspension gurus, I'm still dissapointed with the handling in the rear of my car. It feels very unstable as if it wants to slide out at any second. As if there's a horrible weight distribution (which there probably is) and the front is weighted down and the rear is not there. What should I do? Currently my rear AGXs are set at 4 (front at 2), and I have an RSB and RSTB (would tightening them help significantly?) Would Stage 1 SFCs help for this?
Thanks,
-Cyrus
12-09-2002, 02:46 PM
#16
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,530
I still havent put mine in yet cause I'm really lazy. I dont like the sound of having increased NVH. Hmmm. And I'm also putting in the control arm ones.
As for the rear, maybe you should try the motivational engineering strut mounts? Or stop modding and wait to get a real car with a real suspension .
As for the rear, maybe you should try the motivational engineering strut mounts? Or stop modding and wait to get a real car with a real suspension .
12-09-2002, 07:05 PM
#17
Originally posted by ericdwong
I still havent put mine in yet cause I'm really lazy. I dont like the sound of having increased NVH.
I still havent put mine in yet cause I'm really lazy. I dont like the sound of having increased NVH.
In my opinion the NVH if definitely worth the trade-off for this alone, because let's face it the Maxima has a wayyy too boaty feel especially through the steering wheel.
Originally posted by ericdwong
Hmmm. And I'm also putting in the control arm ones.
Hmmm. And I'm also putting in the control arm ones.
Have fun.
Originally posted by ericdwong
As for the rear, maybe you should try the motivational engineering strut mounts?
As for the rear, maybe you should try the motivational engineering strut mounts?
Originally posted by ericdwong
Or stop modding and wait to get a real car with a real suspension .
Or stop modding and wait to get a real car with a real suspension .
I wish for once you'd appreciate the Maxima for all it has. But I know that day will never come.-Cyrus
12-09-2002, 07:16 PM
#18
Originally posted by Vyrus
They really aren't hard/time-taking to install. With the amount of work you've done to your car Eric, these should be a snap. But you will definitely feel increased NVH. One awesome thing I noticed after driving 20 miles today, is that the steering wheels feels much heavier and harder to turn (as if power-steering is cranked down a level or two). Much more BMW-like. In my opinion the NVH if definitely worth the trade-off for this alone, because let's face it the Maxima has a wayyy too boaty feel especially through the steering wheel.
They really aren't hard/time-taking to install. With the amount of work you've done to your car Eric, these should be a snap. But you will definitely feel increased NVH. One awesome thing I noticed after driving 20 miles today, is that the steering wheels feels much heavier and harder to turn (as if power-steering is cranked down a level or two). Much more BMW-like.
In my opinion the NVH if definitely worth the trade-off for this alone, because let's face it the Maxima has a wayyy too boaty feel especially through the steering wheel.how bad is NVH? does it sound like an american car @ idle now? or more honda civic like? how $ did shipping cost? u got the front end control arm brushing set for $28 right?
12-09-2002, 07:23 PM
#19
Originally posted by costcowholesale
how bad is NVH? does it sound like an american car @ idle now? or more honda civic like?
how bad is NVH? does it sound like an american car @ idle now? or more honda civic like?
-Cyrus
12-09-2002, 07:26 PM
#20
Originally posted by costcowholesale
u got the front end control arm brushing set for $28 right?
u got the front end control arm brushing set for $28 right?
-Cyrus
12-09-2002, 07:30 PM
#21
Originally posted by Vyrus
Nope I only have the FSB mid-bar bushings. They were like $7 + $5.12 shipping, damn cheap. I need to get the endlinks though, those are an extra $10. The control-arm bushings are too hard for me ton install and honestly I don't feel them necessary. I don't want too much NVH now.
-Cyrus
Nope I only have the FSB mid-bar bushings. They were like $7 + $5.12 shipping, damn cheap. I need to get the endlinks though, those are an extra $10. The control-arm bushings are too hard for me ton install and honestly I don't feel them necessary. I don't want too much NVH now.
-Cyrus
what if I don't get those? so what part do I order here? http://www.suspension.com/nissancars.htm 7-3111?just the fsb mid bar bushing will help steering feel? thats all I want
12-09-2002, 07:35 PM
#23
Originally posted by costcowholesale
DO I need the endlinks? what if I don't get those? so what part do I order here? http://www.suspension.com/nissancars.htm 7-3111?
just the fsb mid bar bushing will help steering feel? thats all I want
DO I need the endlinks?
what if I don't get those? so what part do I order here? http://www.suspension.com/nissancars.htm 7-3111?just the fsb mid bar bushing will help steering feel? thats all I want
-Cyrus
12-09-2002, 07:37 PM
#24
Originally posted by trinity000
i put the endlinks and fsb bushing and have noticed the tighter steering wheel as well... but my wheel is rock solid no vibration AT ALL really...
i put the endlinks and fsb bushing and have noticed the tighter steering wheel as well... but my wheel is rock solid no vibration AT ALL really...
-Cyrus
12-09-2002, 07:40 PM
#25
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 387
stock se suspension.. had eibachs but took them off... awaiting my H&R/AGX combo...
then again even if it vibrates it won't bother me... the rest of my fam is into muscle cars so i am used to it but enjoy the feeling of a soild steering wheel in my car
then again even if it vibrates it won't bother me... the rest of my fam is into muscle cars so i am used to it but enjoy the feeling of a soild steering wheel in my car
12-09-2002, 07:43 PM
#26
Originally posted by trinity000
stock se suspension.. had eibachs but took them off... awaiting my H&R/AGX combo...
then again even if it vibrates it won't bother me... the rest of my fam is into muscle cars so i am used to it but enjoy the feeling of a soild steering wheel in my car
stock se suspension.. had eibachs but took them off... awaiting my H&R/AGX combo...
then again even if it vibrates it won't bother me... the rest of my fam is into muscle cars so i am used to it but enjoy the feeling of a soild steering wheel in my car
I'm really hoping they can fix it, but if not I still won't be dissapointed. The car handles SO well now I really shouldn't complain. -Cyrus
12-10-2002, 09:42 AM
#29
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,530
You're getting all this NVH from ONLY the front sway bar bushings!? Did you change anything else out? Tires, suspesion, rims? Holy cow, I have the front sway bar bushings, the endlinks on order AND the control arm bushings. The control arms have been in my mom's camry for the past 2 weeks. Reason I havent put it in yet is my car is still sitting on jackstands from my blown tranny. Finals week, and its so cold outside I dont feel like working even though i have a kerosene heater in the garage.
12-10-2002, 09:11 PM
#30
Originally posted by 95Max
Vyrus,
The vibration issue...have you had the tires balanced? Have you hit anything. ie large hole, curb... The tire could have a broken belt inside.
Vyrus,
The vibration issue...have you had the tires balanced? Have you hit anything. ie large hole, curb... The tire could have a broken belt inside.
Originally posted by ericdwong
You're getting all this NVH from ONLY the front sway bar bushings!? Did you change anything else out? Tires, suspesion, rims? Holy cow, I have the front sway bar bushings, the endlinks on order AND the control arm bushings. The control arms have been in my mom's camry for the past 2 weeks. Reason I havent put it in yet is my car is still sitting on jackstands from my blown tranny. Finals week, and its so cold outside I dont feel like working even though i have a kerosene heater in the garage.
You're getting all this NVH from ONLY the front sway bar bushings!? Did you change anything else out? Tires, suspesion, rims? Holy cow, I have the front sway bar bushings, the endlinks on order AND the control arm bushings. The control arms have been in my mom's camry for the past 2 weeks. Reason I havent put it in yet is my car is still sitting on jackstands from my blown tranny. Finals week, and its so cold outside I dont feel like working even though i have a kerosene heater in the garage.
-Cyrus
12-10-2002, 11:10 PM
#31
bent wheels suck.
ive been thinking about calling ES and seeing about getting a sponsorship thing setup.. I wouldn't mind having ALL my bushing redone, seeing as how air isnt too forgiving on things and I squeak like a motha.
215/45 may have something to do with high end wheel vibration.. or the wheel weights arent balanced.
ive been thinking about calling ES and seeing about getting a sponsorship thing setup.. I wouldn't mind having ALL my bushing redone, seeing as how air isnt too forgiving on things and I squeak like a motha.
215/45 may have something to do with high end wheel vibration.. or the wheel weights arent balanced.
12-11-2002, 01:19 PM
#33
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,148
Originally posted by MAXIN
um...please someone quickly define these mnemonics(sp)....
NVH = ??
FSB = front sway bar??
ES = energy suspension??
cant search now....must work....must work..
um...please someone quickly define these mnemonics(sp)....
NVH = ??
FSB = front sway bar??
ES = energy suspension??
cant search now....must work....must work..
You are correct on the other two.
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