JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

Hello, I have a 98 SE 5spd with 81k miles. My problem started on the way home from school. I was driving and it started driving rough and then it jerked, then engine check light came on. I got home and it wouldnt turn back on after I turned it off, it cranked fine and the rpms would bounce up very little but it just wouldnt go. I checked the code and it was Cylinder 3 Misfire. I coudnt get any new codes because it wouldnt turn on, so swapping the ignition coils wouldnt do much. I checked the resistance on my crankshaft sensors and they were fine. I put in NGK Coppers and still nothing. Then I went on to fuel. I got a can of starting fluid and sprayed it up at the filter while my friend cranked and it started right up. The car always starts up on its own now but its rough. It was pretty smooth when I let it idle for about 5min but I got code Cylinder 1 Misfire. I reset it and took a ride around the block, was smooth for a little while, but then the it was jerky and rough and the engine didnt sound right at all. I checked the code when I got back and it was Multiple Cylinder Misfire. I was suggested to change the fuel filter and it didnt help any at all. I got the Multiple Cylinder Misfire code again and the rpms were constant at 900, the car wasnt warmed up yet. The engine does not sound right at all and the exhaust sounds horrible, it makes a put, put noise. Im not sure what the problem can be now. Im still thinking its somthing with the fuel system since the starter fuild got the car started. I dont think all the injectors would just go bad so that leaves the fuel pump. My friend said that it might be my cat might be clogged since the exhaust was making a putting noise. Would it be ok if I drive the car to the repair shop or can I cause some really bad damage to my engine? I would still like to fix it myself but If I cant, I have to take it somewhere. Anyone have any ideas? Thanks in advance.

fisher01

iTrader: (1)

JeEve, after switching the coil pack from 3 to 1 are you getting a misfire code from 1 now? If so, thats confirms the coil pack is bad.

You can probably get one at a salvage yard for $25.

fisher01

iTrader: (1)

Another suggestion, check the camshaft sensor.

fisher01

iTrader: (1)

I wouldn't drive the car with multiple cylinders misfiring. May damage internals.

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

I got Cylinder 1 Misfire once, I think the ecu just picked that up first and the others were misfiring also. Now, the only code I get is Multiple Cylinder Misfire.

izzydig

Put put noise? I have an opened exhaust, and know the sound of a cylinder that doesn't fire. I can only explain it as a cylinder that just sounds like it is pushing air...no combustion. It sounded and felt like c rap.

I got a cyl #1 misfire...replaced coil pack for $30. Didn't help ( it got rid of CEL tho). Lifted intake manifold replaced injector for $30 (junkyard), and she purred.

I also checked for fire on cyl #1, and got a good jolt of electricity, and saw a good blue electric arc on spark plug (ouch..was accidentle, coulda had a heart attack...don't try...use ground rod to engine). She sparked well after coil pack replacement.

Maybe the failing fuel injectors don't want to inject well/at-all after the environment gets cold, happened to me. Check injectors for ohm readings. That's how I finally diagnosed fuel injector failure (after replacing coil pack).

-Isaac

fisher01

iTrader: (1)

Agree, test both electrical sensors and fuel injectors. There is a post here on the board on how to test the ohm readings on the fuel injectors. The front three are easy to test, however the back 3 one has to use the main harness connector.

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

I was able to check the resistance on the front injectors and they were all around 11.5 ohms which is where they are suppose to be. I turned the car on and check to see if the front ones where making the clicking noise and they were. Can it be the fuel pump going? I still have to check the crankshaft position sensor (POS), I checked the camshaft position sensor instead thinking it was the crankshaft postions sensor (POS). I recorded some short clips with my digital camera of the car running. You cant see much but it will give an idea of how it sounds.

idle...
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/jeeve76/max_idle.avi
engine...
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/jeeve76/max_engine.avi
exhaust...
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/jeeve76/max_exhaust.avi

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

bump 12345

izzydig

Have you checked the crankshaft position sensor yet? I mentioned the fuel injectors because it happened to me, but since they appear to be fine...well I dunno.

Bump bump

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

Thanks for the bump. I didnt check the other crankshaft postion sensor yet, it rained today. Ill tommarrow if I get a chance. Im going to get a fuel pressure gauge and see if the fuel is the problem, I think the fuel pump is going. Thanks for everyones help.

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

Today I was looking for the crankshaft position sensor (POS) and I was having some trouble finding it. I took of the right plastic cover under the front bumper. The Haynes manual says it on the transaxle bellhousing. I dont really know what that is but from the pic it looks like its somewhere near the oil pan. I found some type of sensor but it dosnt look like the one in the manual. It was in front of some metal thing which I think is the transaxle bellhousing, it was toward the front of the car. The plug came out from the side, not down from what the picture in the manual shows. The other part of it has a thin wire that looks like in the metal thing right where a pulley is. I unpluged it to see if it will give me an crankshaft sensor code but it didnt give me anything and i didnt notice any different while the car was running. Where the is crankshaft sensor (POS)? Now back to my misfiring problem. I let the car idle for 5-10min untill it heated up and I noticed the exhaust had water dripping out, im not sure if its normal but it looked it was a lot. Heres a pic where it was dripping on the floor.


Is that normal? Is it possible I got water in my muffler or something? The day my problem started it had rained the night before.

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

I think im getting somewhere this time. I got home from school early so I was able to mess with it. I checked the ignition coils by pulling one out at a time and checked the spark on the plug while the car was running, it seemed fine but Im gonna recheck everything in the morning. I unpluged each coil pack at a time to see if I can figure out which cylinders might be misfiring. Unplugging cylinder 3, 5, 4 made no difference, the car ran the same. Unplugging the others made the car run worse, it had a very low idle and sounded like it was going to stall. I swapped the coil pack and it made no difference. It seems like the fuel injectors are bad or clogged. Any other ideas?

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

Today before work I took out the crankshaft sensor (POS) and it really dirty. I cleaned it off but I didnt get a chance to check the voltage. I was having trouble backprobing it so it just put it back in. I tried to start up but I need to push the gas pedal in to get it started. I let it idle until it warmed up. The engine light didnt come on, the exhaust was still making the putting noise and the rpms were around 600. After reving the engine the rpms would drop really low, around 400 and then back around 600. The steering wheel and the shift **** noticable shake. What other things can i try? I think i might have to go to the stealership

outsider

clog fuel injector or maybe a lazy one.

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

Today I checked the fuel injectors. Before when I unplugged cylinder 4 coil pack, the idle didnt change. I switched fuel injector 4 with 2 a few days ago. Today I pulled out cylinder 2 and it made no difference in idle, pulling out 4 and 6 made is run worse. So that must mean the injector is no good. I changed the bad injector which is on 2 now to 6. I started the car and I noticed that there was a lot of white smoke coming from the exhaust so I turned the car off. I started it back up and it seemed like it was running better, I tried unplugging the front cylinder coil packs again, one at a time and now they all make a difference in idle, it gets worse. I drove around for a few min and it took a while for the Multiple Cylinder Misfire code to come back up. The car feels like it drives a little better now. Unplugging cylinder 3 and 5 does not change the idle at all. The injector on the front bank might have just been clogged and it cleaned itself out somehow. Cylinder 3 and 5 injectors are under the manifold so its not going to be easy for me. Can a take off the manifold?

fisher01

iTrader: (1)

May want to try a bottle of Techron to clear those injectors. Maybe that first cleaner you used loosened the dirt but didn't clean it all out.

Good Luck and keep us posted on your progress. Would like to see you solve this problem without going to stealership.

Oh did you check the resistance on the injectors under the manifold. There is a right up here on the org on how to do that by using the main connector on side. Just a matter of placing your probes on the right pins. If you can't find under the search just post and I'll see if I can located my copy.

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

I can try some Techron but it might not help. The tank is still full and I think there is still some Redline injector cleaner in there. The problem started about 2-3 days after filling the tank (91 octane) with redline. I found the write up, ill try this in the morning. If the two injectors are bad, how hard is removing the upper intake manifold? Just unbolt, and will I need to replace the gasket? Thanks for your replies.

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

I put some Chevron in there today, should I just let the car idle for a while and see if it cleans them out or is that not safe since 2 cylinders are misfiring?

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

Today I went to take my car to a shop. It was about 3-4 miles away and half way there the car started to drive smooth again. At the shop I checked my exhaust and it was making no putting noise at all, it was completely smooth. I drover around for about 15-20 mins and it started to feel like it misfired a little, not as much as before. I checked the exhuast and it was making the putting noise again. I cleared the code when I got home and and took it for another drive, the code came back after driving for about 3 min. Should I keep driving because the injectors are still clogged?

Edit: I went to start it and it woulding go. I sprayed some starter fuild in the intake and it started up. The steering wheel, shift **** and doors shake again and the exhaust makes the putting noise. What is causing it to not start at all?

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

I decided to clean the throttle body out for the hell of it and I sprayed the tb cleaner in while it was running to get some of the carbon out of the manifold. After that it still was misfiring but only felt like it was one cylinder. I checked to see which one it was by unplugging each coil pack at a time and it seemed like it was cylinder 3. I just let it idle for 15min and then took it for a drive, after a little while it stopped misfiring and it was completely smooth. Drove for about an hour and its still good. I turned it off and started it up a few times and its good and no more engine check light. Im so happy!! I hope it doenst get messed up again.

Shift_Power

Did you replace the coil? If you didn't, I highly doubt your problem is solved. I had the same problem, hesitation basically, I replaced cylinder 5 and month or two later, #3 cylinder coil pack. So far (after the #3) the max really likes me, but its only been two days so far....we'll see. Also, I heard that if you put electrical tape around the bottom of the coil pack (the rubber) it may solve the problem too....Just a thought.

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

I started it up after the let the car cool off and it still misses. Maybe it is the coilpacks but wouldnt they still keep missing even after driving for a while? It stops missing after driving for a little bit and its fine but when I let the car sit for a while and I go to start it, it misses. Should I just replace all the coilpacks?

Shift_Power

No, don't replace them all unless you have lots of money. If you can eliminate to one or two cylinders just do those. Do you get hesitation as well while driving?
My biggest problem was hesitation while driving, idle was a little off, but not too bad. If you're not having any trouble with hesitation, its possible its not your coil packs....I've heard things like perhaps checking your EGR and your PCV valve?

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

I switched the coil packs around before but it didnt make much of a difference. Twice before the car wouldnt start at all. I sprayed starter fluid in the intake which is like gas and it started up. Ill have to the check the ERG and I already got a PCV valve from pepboys but i didnt put it in yet. Thanks for the replies.

SamMan23

when was the last time you changed your fuel filter?

fisher01

iTrader: (1)

After re-reading the thread, I think the clue here is that after spraying intake with starting fluid, you can get the car to start. This leads me to believe your problem is fuel related. First i would change fuel filter, next I would check your fuel pressure. Chapter 4 of the haynes manual has the procedure on how to check. You may need to change your fuel pressure regulator. Troubleshooting can be frustrating, esp. with your problem.

gabex

iTrader: (2)

WOW. I am having pretty much the EXACT same problems as you are having.

I took my car to a shop to have my 2k2 Muffler installed (cut&weld) along with my Budget B Pipe and Magnaflow Resonator. Later that day, my car was running vary rough. I just got a misfire in cylinder #6. I changed all of my spark plugs. Still misfiring. I checked to make sure that there was even sparks coming from the 6th cylinder...and there was. So with that, I ruled out spark plugs and coil packs.

Now, on to the injectors. I switched #2 with #4 (i am calling them #2 and #4 with perspective to the spark plugs) to see if that was the problem. Now I have a multiple cylinder misfire. Also, there is gas (i am assuming its gas, it smells and looks like gas) leaking in the weld that the shop did on my muffler to make it fit.

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

I have already changed the fuel filter, did that after the plugs. This morning when going to the school, the car started up and it was not missing at all, it was running perfect. After school it was good too. Only problem is that when I started the car up its a little rough, the rpms shoot up to just under 2k and it slowly goes down to 900, is it normal for it to go that high? Hopefully it doesnt start to miss again.

izzydig

Long post but...

I was reading the post, and got confused. Have you replaced one of the fuel injectors yet with a new or junkyard one yet? Considering ( I think ) one of your failing injectors is in the front bank, I would save some frustration and guesswork, and get a used fuel injector from a good engine at a junkyard. If that doesn't work, you're out of $30 and have a spare fuel injector. That's cheaper than the dealership, and with luck, it might just be the injectors. When I tried moving stuff around (coil packs), I couldn't get a really good fix on this type of problem.

I'd also recommend you replace the o-rings (upper and lower) on the fuel injector with new ones (when you replace the injector), which will cost $1.50 for both or less from the dealership. Good insurance against fuel leaking onto the engine from old seals.

When you seat in the fuel injector with new o-rings, it's best to apply a little bit of light oil to the o-rings. I couldn't get the dry o-rings in without potentially cracking the plastic on the fuel injector. They were fairly easy to get out though (fuel injector). Yes, lube the dry injectors, sounds funny. hehe.

As for the rear bank of injectors, I'd say it's very doable, but you have to be patient. The two hardest bolts to remove are on the intake manifold support brackets (near the firewall). Putting the bolts back on is even trickier, but again be patient (its good to have a magnectic pickup tool handy for when you drop bolts). The vacuum and fuel lines are somewhat of a bear, but you just have to keep in mind, what side of the vacuum hoses are easier to remove. When I did my rear fuel injector, I didn't completely remove the manifold. I bent the manifold out of the way with most bolts and vacuum lines disconnected, but not all. Also be careful when you bend things (including the cruise control thing). If you break or crack the cruise control thing, you have to replace or you'll have no cruise control.

Did you ever check the fuel pressure? I thought you said you were going to at one time.

Concering the startup issue: I couldn't tell you on that one. Maybe you have compounded issues here, and if so, try getting the car stabilized when it does run. White smoke is either coolant burning or too much fuel/rich (and in this case, I think some fuel spilled into the cylinder when you move injectors around).

Again my advice is a $30 try with a used fuel injector and see if misfires stop on that particular cyl. And yes, the fuel filter should be replaced periodically to keep the fuel pressure at maximum, and of course to keep your fuel clean. I can imagine lower fuel pressure on a lazy injector wouldn't help.

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

Thanks izzydig. I think the front injectors are good, There injector on cylinder 3 seems like the only bad or clogged one now. When the car misses, I pulled out each coil pack and cylinder 3 is the only one that makes no difference in idle. I just took the car out and when I started it up it was missing again. I drove for a little bit and it just went away on its own and it drives frine for the rest of the time. Im going to the junkyard with some friends on Saturday, which cars and yrs can I use injectors from? If I have to ill take off the manifold, im just a little scared that I might mess something up. Im new to most of this stuff its my first car, but I learned a lot of stuff in these past 2-3 weeks. I dont dont think its going to be too hard for me but I read somewhere its a 4-6hr job taking the manifold off. I still havent checked the fuel pressure yet, I went to pepboys and there was a kit there for about $40, is there anywhere else I can get it a bit cheaper? Thanks.

Edit: Had to go out again and when I started up it was missing, and driving more didnt make it go away . When i got back I tryed pulling each coil pack again to see which one might be missing and unpluggin cylinder 1 made no difference this time so 3 wasnt missing anymore but 1 is. I didnt check the front 3 through. Can this be caused my low fuel pressure?

gabex

iTrader: (2)

JeEvE - could you check and see if the liquid coming out of your exhaust is water or gas? I'm pretty sure mine was gas..

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

The liquid coming out was water, I wiped it up with a napkin and it was clear and didnt smell like anything. I dont think that much water comes out anymore, it was only when my misfiring was really bad.

izzydig

I've never checked the fuel pressure on this maxima, yet, so I don't know the symptoms on this. Of course a clogged/low-pressure fuel rail and/or system could cause some issues, but just based on some guess work from recent misfire issues from a bunch of org members (since the weather went cold), I'd guess the fuel injector or coil packs.

Also, I was able to narrow down to my fuel injector problem because I initially tried a junkyard coil pack and when that didn't solve it, I used an ohm meter and saw a fuel injector completely dead. I shoulda checked with an ohm meter first, but I just couldn't find it at the time.

I used a 98 I30 fuel injector on my 95 maxima. It was made by the same mfg, but looked a lil different but still worked. I think the 95-99 max/i30 motor fuel injectors will work interchangably. Tho, I believe I read that the 97-99 coil packs are prone to failure.

You know what sucks tho? The used fuel injector I got isn't perfect, so I ordered a brand new one from courtesy nissan. The used one I got ran perfect for 2 days, then decided to sometimes hiccup occasionally when in drive(rpm's below 700). If I wasn't going to drive 4000 miles during christmas, I'd wait (possibly a year or more or never) till it dies, but don't want to risk having a crappy ride on the trip. I have to take off the intake manifold again anyway, because my valve cover is leaking, so the redo-labor frustration is at a minimum.

fisher01

iTrader: (1)

Have u checked the ohms for the rear fuel injectors? You don't have to take off intake manifold to do this. You can test them through the main harness connector on right side. If you need instructions, let me know and I'll post them for you.

gabex

iTrader: (2)

Ill take instructions plz

Ladzio

iTrader: (8)

ok, spent some time here reading the thread. Really usefull discussion. My car started jerking yesterday. I figured must be coil pack because I had ssame problem 2 months ago.

Now 2 questions:
1. When you were checking coilpacks for sparks and injectors did you unplug those just when engine was running (stupid question, you vividly said you did, I was just concerned being electricuted)
Could you give please more directions what to unplug (whole coilpack or just the connector?)
I did this yesterday but I unpluggued/started engine/stopped engine/plugged back in but could not really tell which coilpack was defective

2. Could you please post the link that describes to how to check resistance of rear bank injectors.

Thank you guys.

gabex

iTrader: (2)

When I checked the coilpacks, I would pull one out, put the spark plug in the coilpack, and have someone start my car. I would then turn the lights off in my garage and check for sparks.

My problems are only getting worse...

Ladzio

iTrader: (8)

Allright, my car started backfiring yesterday night, so today after two hours of testing and probing I have come to the following, guys please help me to figure out if my conclusions are correct:

First I tested for resistence coil packs and injectors, everything looked within specs. Started the engine, listened carefully to every injector for clicking noise - looked fine as well. Then while the engine was running I pulled out in turn each coil pack, the spark could be visible but the engine would run worse. So front bank looks good.

Moved to the rear. Ckecked each coil pack for resistance - various readings, so I wasn't sure. Disconnected big 8 pin connector on the Engine Control Harness. Got readings of resistence from injectors 3 and 6 (within specs), but could not get any from 1. Started engine, there it was more difficult to listen for clicking noise since injectors are under IM so I proceeded to pulling coil packs out one by one. Spark was in every cylinder. When I pulled coil pack from cylinder 1 though, engine would run the same. So I switched coil packs and same result.

My conclusion: injector in cylinder 1 is not working. It's kinda obvious, but I am still a to the engines, so just wanted to make sure.

JeEvE

iTrader: (10)

My car works great now, doesnt miss at all. None of my injectors were bad, they were just clogged and they needed some of the injector cleaner to get through.

Vlad, seems like it is definitly the injector. You can try to get an injector cheap from a junkyard, I think its somewhere around $80 online. Taking off the manifold might be a problem, Im happy I didnt have to do it because im a . Good luck, hope you can get this fixed.