I30tMikeD

iTrader: (8)

Finally finished installing the PF TB. Took me a long time, but every project I do takes 3X longer than it's supposed to.

1. Had a voltmeter problem. Ended up buying a new one

2.Could not find the right bit to use for the intake manifold porting. Spent 5 hrs grinding with the wrong type bit and when I finally got the right one it took me half in hour to finish it. That was 3 trips to Sears

3. Lost my custom made gasket twice. Ended up having to make three of them.

4. Set the TPS closed throttle voltage too high which gave me a 1500 rpm idle. Had to pull take everything back out to readjust the TPS to give me the right idle. I ended up with .39 volts at close throttle and 4.1 volts at WOT.

Big thanks to Krismax and Stephen Max for all the help. Those two guys are pioneers and valuable to this community.

I will post pics tomorrow along with a review of my butt dyno. I do plan on dyno comparing the stock TB and the PF TB. Keep an eye out for the results.

ManualMaxima

iTrader: (10)

what is the end resultes in power can you feel it? i was htining of doign this but then seeing all you had to go thorough i am forgetting baout it. i thought it was a simple thing with alittle bit of work...guess i was terrabley wrong.

I30tMikeD

iTrader: (8)

It's not that bad, I just make things harder than what they are. If I had to do it again I could do the whole thing in a afternoon.

phatmax95

iTrader: (29)

How much did it cost?

I30tMikeD

iTrader: (8)

Adapter plate $50, But I don't think anyone is making them anymore

Pathfinder Throttle body, $120 shipped

I had to purchase a new multimeter, $30

Various grinding bits, $15

Gasket material, $10

3"silicone coupler. $5

PF TB gasket, $4

....So a little more than $200. It could be done for less if I had not needed to get the new voltmeter. The hard part is finding a used PF TB for less than $200. I kept an eye out for months until I found one for $120 shipped.

ohannon7

iTrader: (5)

haha, sounds like you had fun. cant wait to see how it all works out......

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

Glad to hear you got it installed!

A two inch diameter medium grit sanding drum and high speed drill is the way to go for porting out the intake throat. You can get a bag of sanding drum from sears for less than $5.

By the way I have a Pathfinder TB and adapter plate kit for sale, if anyone is interested. Check the link in my sig.

nupe500

iTrader: (13)

ok...has anyone dynoed with it? what are the gains?

Thanks

Jeff92se

iTrader: (82)

Nice work guys! Mike, I think you will like the part throttle response along with the wot!
Stephen, at wot, does the engine run any leaner?

Brudaddy

iTrader: (2)

What exactly does this benefit?
What does it do to give gains....just curious in case I want to do it coming up.

Capital15

iTrader: (45)

Pics and numbers please.

I30tMikeD

iTrader: (8)

Got a chance to do some driving last night

First, I felt no negative side effects at all. Car idles and drives perfectly! I was worried it would be too touchy and combined with my lightend flywheel make fist gear unbearable. Not the case at all. For regular driving I could not really tell a difference. Of course I have yet to be stuck in stop and go Chicago with the PF TB, but from my first impression it does not seem that it would be a problem.

Before the install I was worried about the TPS voltage. From what I have read, the ECU needs 4.0 volts at WOT for open loop mode, Stephan Max was only able to get like 3.75 or so with out messing up his idle. I was able to get over 4 volts at WOT and have a normal idle. I was very pleased with that.

Gains? Man, I hate to claim gains without proof. I do plan getting to the dyno soon. I wanted some baseline numbers for the header comparison this summer and since the changing back to the stock TB would only take 15-20 minutes (assuming I don't have to adjust the TPS) I might as well do a TB comparison while I am at it. Kill two birds with one stone.

It **feels** like the car pulls harder after 6K rpm's. I would also like to say it feels a tad stronger through the whole rpm band, but that I don't want to claim. Too much of a chance that could just be in my head. I do feel pretty confident that there are gains past my VI activation point.



......But who knows for sure. Hell I could have really lost power for all I know.

I am pleased with the results so far.

I30tMikeD

iTrader: (8)

I will get right on that for ya.

I30tMikeD

iTrader: (8)

Hope these show up. Imagestation has been giving me problems

I30tMikeD

iTrader: (8)

I need to get a bent style midpipe. The battery is in the way and I had to remove the battery tie down to get the intake to fit. Before I was using the stock accordian section between the TB and midpipe which allowed me to get the angle I needed to fit everything.

The midpipe is slightly at an angle against the TB and I don't like that. I was thinking about moving the battery to the trunk which would give me plenty of room and may allow for more fresh air to flow by the filter.

nismos14

iTrader: (56)

sound like a good idea to relocate the battery, looking forward to seeing numbers

Spaniard

iTrader: (1)

Congrats I30tMikeD on getting it done! And thanks in advance for helping the community to figure out how much of a plus it is! This is one mod that I am really curious about.

Cumalot

iTrader: (8)

Dang...I just paid $300 for one. The adapter plate is included, but maybe I paid too much for it? Oh well...anyone got instruction on how to install it?

I30tMikeD

iTrader: (8)

I got my adapter plate in December or January....and did not find a PF TB for less than $200 until May. So don't feel so bad. Most I found were $250.

endus

iTrader: (1)

In my otherwise completely stock engine bay I have had problems even with the angled midpipe. It may be a funcion of the way-too-huge K&N tht Frankencar is shipping with their midpipes by now, but the reducer never quite got on there right. It was sealed, but you could tell that it was having to bend a bit to get the K&N in there. I am currently running the stock accordian and resonator without the midpipe and am much happier with the fit. I'm not sure if I'll ever put the midpipe back on without some kind of flexible connection...those reducers seem real sketchy to me. It might be completely different with your setup, but just FYI.

Congrats on the TB!

mymaxlvsattn

just curious,

did you use the Pathfinder TPS or the maximas?

krismax

iTrader: (15)

Yeah I never dynoed the pathy setup ,cant wait to see what gains you get. I felt it the most on top end also.
Mike if you get a angled midpipe Ill buy your straight one off you

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

As far as I can tell, the PF and Maxima TPS are identical in form and function.

mymaxlvsattn

interesting, i suppose since they are both VQ based it shouldnt be that much difference
http://www.freshalloy.com/site/featu...nes/home.shtml

now would the TB from a VH/VK45DE be too big in comparison to the intake runners and valves? assuming one could get it lined up?

I do realize that bigger is not necessarily better and you have to look at whole pictures..but its always fun to tinker!

maximus_pr

iTrader: (3)

looking for some info on tb spacers i found this it might be helpful to you since you just did the swap is made for the pf heres more info
http://www.airaid.com/520-505_nissan.asp

|Bijan|

iTrader: (12)

damn! nice work

Ceasars Chariot

iTrader: (16)

sounds great !!

Tatanko

iTrader: (34)

I believe that TB was like 80mm or something. I think the reason no one ever used it was because the intake manifold could never be ported big enough to even begin to take advantage of that size. In fact, I don't think the manifold can be ported to completely take advantage of the 70mm Pathfinder TB.

I30tMikeD

iTrader: (8)

I run the apexi filter which is small in diameter but it's long since I have to use the Frankencar adapter. That adapter adds an extra 2"-3" to the whole intake length. I think it would be cheaper just to relocate the battery to the trunk, but then that is putting weight where I don't want it. Maybe a smaller lightweight battery would work? I don't want to buy another midpipe if it's not going to solve my problem. I am already on my second midpipe. I am going to do something because I don't like how my midpipe butts up against the TB at an angle.

Went by a local dyno shop. I have never had a car dynoed so I don't have any expierience with any of these places. There is one shop about 5 miles from me with a dynopack dyno. It's an all wheel and two wheel drive dyno. They want $100 an hour. Seems a bit high from what I know. Should an hour should be enough time to get two pulls on the PF TB, swap back to stock, then 2 pull on the stock TB? I would think so. I will call a couple other places to see if I can find a dynojet dyno. From what I have been told a dynopack will dyno lower than other types of dynos. It's kind important where I get my first dyno because that is where I would go back for future dynos.

Spent over an hour in stop and go Chicago traffic this morning. Did not get out of 2nd gear for 20 miles!! The PF TB caused no issues at all. I don't really know why it would, I just know that was one concern of the PF TB that I had seen posted about.

DAVE Sz

iTrader: (2)

If you buy that it looks like you'd still need to drill and tap another 4 holes for the second set of bolts. The spacer is on crooked so that the 4 holes line up with the original manifold holes and then you need to drill 4 holes for the TB to hook up.

Mike it looks like your cruise control cable is a tiny BIT loose. Also, I thought the TPS voltage is supposed to be 5v for WOT. There is a place that has a dynojet in chicago, they're on Califoria I believe. About your mid-pipe, why not make one or ask someone to make one for you.

I30tMikeD

iTrader: (8)

No, it's 4v at WOT. I confirmed that from a few sources.

Any dynos closer the western burbs...Aurora, Naperville, downers Grove area?

Making a straight midpipe is easy. I have made one before, but I don't know about making one with a bend in it.

Cruise is fine, does not need to be real tight anyhow. I have already used it a few times since the install. It also looks that way because the cable has to angle upwards since the TB is in a different position than stock.

DAVE Sz

iTrader: (2)

My bad about the TPS voltage. 5v is the sigan it sends to the ECU when you turn on the car.

Here http://www.dynojet.com/maps/autodynos/il.htm

Taken2DaMax

iTrader: (5)

great going mike. Can't wait to see some numbas.

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

I ported mine out to 68 mm in the vertical direction. I think I could have removed another mm or so according to wall thickness measurements I made with a micrometer, but I didn't want to chance it. In the horizontal direction, however, you can go way beyond 70 mm, so you can definitely get the same cross-sectional area if you port an elliptical shape into the IM throat.

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

The ecu sends a 5V signal to the TPS. The TPS should be set to send a maximum 4V signal to the ecu.

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

That spacer does not look big enough to accept the additional 4 holes needed. But it also does not look like a spacer for a Pathfinder. The PF TB bolt pattern is not rectangular, and that looks like it is. Hard to tell, though.

Dave B

I'll be curious to see the dynos. PLEASE dyno on a Dynojet if possible and preferably not the one Neal went too because their's seems to read really low. The problem with the Dynapack is that it reads about 8-10whp higher than a Dynojet. Of course if you're going to swap the TBs and dyno between the two, at least we'll get an idea of the gains/losses.

Personally I think that the 70mm RF TB is too large for our 3.0 engines, but I've been wrong (a lot) in the past. The reason I think 70mm is probably overkill is that the 96-04 Mustang 4.6 2V uses a 65mm as stock. This motor displaces over 50% more cubes than the 3.0 VQ. A 70mm TB for the 4.6 2V is considered ideal assuming the buyer purchases a new TB to manifold plenum. The LS1 uses a single 75mm unit as stock and that's considered ideal for any LS1 application (boost, cam, heads, etc). The LS1 displaces a whopping 90% more cubes than 3.0 VQ. The 3.0 VQs 60mm TB is actually the same size as the Ford 5.0 pushrod TB. 70mm is a crapload more volume for such a small engine, IMO. I can see how throttle response is greatly improved simply because at every increment of throttle postion with the 70mm TB, the ECU thinks stock 60mm blade is being cracked open nearly 20% more than it really is. From my experience with the GM's LT1 (93-97 F-Bodies), a larger TB did very little unless the owner had added a cam, heads, or SC. The addition of a larger TB on a heavily modded LT1 resulted in about 8whp/10wtq. Ideally for an NA 3.0 VQ with the MEVI/ECU, I think a 64-65mm TB would be about the maximum you'd want to go. Of course getting a 64-65mm TB is basically impossible.

Like someone pointed out earlier, larger isn't always better. The overly large carburator example was perfect.

Mike,
Your cruise control works with no problems? That's good to hear.


Dave

Ceasars Chariot

iTrader: (16)

well someone talk to bbk about making us one, lol !

Tatanko

iTrader: (34)

Interesting, that's about what I thought it was. How would you go about porting it in that shape though? I forgot the area was a rectangular shape instead of just a square.

stephenlc

iTrader: (1)

The stock throttlebody from a del sol in japan is 63 mm.